cause moto, if he is managing, editor of covert action magazine, and in washington state, we cross to under a month the on the he is a writer as well as a military and political analyst. all right, cross rules in effect, that means you can jump anytime you want, and i always appreciate it. okay, want to start with andre in washington state. andre, can you, can you clear up a misunderstanding? i keep hearing about them. i thought the russia had no more ammunition, didn't have any missiles. they were relying upon china to, to re replenish stocks and they need rainy and drones and then all of a sudden yesterday and today happen. can you explain this to me on today? first, it's matter to you because they need to from all this matter to washing backwards, you know, bringing your people who are going to be destroyed because of their lack of mcdonalds and i falls in several stages and it's in my books, it's everywhere i write about it for years now is the fact that they don't study

the country as our state of the military and economic re what have whatever the aspect of their state are. they simply don't know. those who know goes on all down, walk out. and that's why we want, you know, some kind of the informational bible on bar and that's what it is. i mean, no matter how you try to reason those people can reasonably understand that they go to tom tom because this is a big surprise. you know, they, you know, we always have to point out in this program is that when you have a bad narrative, you get bad results. ok, and this is result of this narrative. the interesting question is going to be is what will kill with the backing of the us continue with the sabotage events like

the nord stream, like the cried me in bridge because you now they know what the reaction of the russians is going to be the question i want to ask all of you before the program is up. why didn't this happen or after february 24th, but maybe that's a moot point. tom, go ahead. well, when i say peter, is that they've opened up a can of worms that they are, that now is, is very dangerous right now. civilian infrastructure in international waters is open is fair game they've gotten, i think they, i'll be honest with you. i think the u. s, i think it's more the brits and the polls than it is the u. s. is probably a mixture of all of them with the u. s. having plausible deniability or least factions within the u. s. having plausible deniability where we're behind all the stuff and like to me it's very clear that they want the war. they want to an a wider war. but they're not sure on what terms they want that wider, where they just want to be able to get to eat. and the russians to over react to whatever provocation, you know, they keep punching the rushes in the face and they keep hoping that the rushes as

they are i us enough. and we're just an interview which then gives us the though the west gives them the moral high ground to say ok. now assigned to take a rush. well, it by tom that, that, that works under the assumption that, you know, i've been playing with this. who's got the time and who's got the clocks. oh and, and, and again, they keep showing that the russians have both jeremy, i mean, it's really quite remarkable. yeah. okay. maybe the britain may be the poles. of course the americans know about it. but isn't it kind of pathetic when you think about it? is it ok, let's do another sabotage event, but it's not the u. k. that sabotage. it's not poland, it's appetite. it's not the you, it's ukraine. i mean with these kind of friends, ukraine is good to run out of people and land. very, very quickly. jeremy jump in. well, yeah, i think ultimately grained and buying their own destruction. and you know, they, you know, they have carried out massive atrocities and terrorist activities. car bombings

within russia. busy i think us intelligence admitted that ukraine was behind, that somehow they're able to sustain some kind of moral high ground. that's one thing that i like to see people waving ukrainian flags and have the cranium flag in their house when it's a. busy government that was voted one of the most corrupt in europe is not the world that carries a brazen terrorist activities. and that basically. busy so that's interest as a country to these foreign powers who have a very pernicious agenda playing a very dangerous game as the other 2 guess pointed out, because it has nothing to do with ukraine and all has to do about somehow degrading rushes power, humiliating, and miss we have seen this playbook for 30 years since the end of the cold war on the is the special military operation in play? is it special military operation? plus, i mean it's very clear to me because we have the partial mobilization how and then we had these barrage of attacks over the course of 2 days. it's the same military

strategy and play. go ahead. yeah. oh absolutely, absolutely. don't forget that the county goes north jobs on line, you have to develop the decision $31.00 plan la reparations, and or if you'll forward it to reject area or the combined and especially united states or got that will be more and more ration. cedar and the russians have to basically dial to be autoclaved. and after it's all the partial novelization, basically, as you do, the joplin strapped a job which got on for the last 48 hours and it will continue. so once you have your domain name from a nation, it's relatively easy if you look at it from the point of view of the nation, all the state will basically come back to our operation to meet your political apes . and political kings of russia per day is basically all united states are from

there. you're asian go country now, hong mass a full year. all you do is place and it's working just miracles so far. so it's not just new to people or something. yeah. yeah. we have a lot of your political issue, and this is actually issue that when they're, if they're all these, i will be defeated, which is happening as we speak. or i should walk up or, you know, walk. so it's not for our background has enough means it'll still base regular severe you know, it's a time later when the special military operation was announced that the, the 2 goals were denied vacation demilitarization. i think as a result of the last couple of days we can throw in de electric causation as well. i mean, basically turning out the lights, which of it showed to be quite easy to do at very low cost and low cost in lives as well. tom, yeah, and i, this is this further what andre was saying, i agree,

and that this is an economic war as much as is a military war. and it's very clear that as it's political war as well. and i've been saying to be any of this that it's always was meant to be a, a war of attrition on both sides and that their shock and awe on, on both sides of the. so we had little shocking off from the russians yesterday with a massive missile attack. we had shocking off in the americans and europeans with sanctions attacks back february, march. and now the question is, who's you know, who's political will asked andrea, which pointed out who's political will at home, whose photo um support at home is going to run out 1st is are going to be the west was, is going to be prudent. my bet is that it's going to be the west. i agree with that terry logical because jeremy mean um, this is not of any real strategic value to the united states, even to even to western europe. i mean, but it is russia's back yard or front porch, whatever you want to put it, it is of great national importance that are defense. and so that's why i think that

they would have much longer resolved. and i think over the last 2 days we've seen that's the most important word that comes to my mind is resolved this thing. so this phase started on the 24th of february and it will be continued till completion, jeremy 1000000000. i think you also look at the economic situation in europe. i mean, the sabotage and stream pipeline adversely affects europe with the sky rocketing gas prices and heating crisis, heading into the winter and tearing economic conditions. i think you're going to see, you know, potential. busy unrest in europe and already there, i think divisions, you know, we see that in germany. gerhard schroeder, been strongly against a lot of the german policies, more toward cooperation with russia and against the war. so i think we're already seeing a break in europe, especially related to the tearing or turing economic situation. and it's really not in the interest of the public whether in europe or the united states. where is the

russia's fighting a life or death struggle and has tangible security interest. busy so i think the publics are going to wake up soon and have been so much deception in western governments about this conflict that just like a rack. i mean, we're just waiting for the bubble burst and more people to acknowledge the hollow of deception at play. you know, under, if it's so curious who are watching politicians in europe react to all what's going on. i mean, we had a french energy official coming out and saying the americans, we look at, they're charging us for, for liquid, for natural gas, you know, but they're not talking about capping american energy, but, but only russian. and then you have german officials coming up. we're facing the industrialization, but they're all still in lock step, like zombies with this policy, it's insane watching it. go ahead tom. i'm sorry andre andre, go ahead. go ahead. andre. well, it's pretty simple. that's what many people don't understand. russia has written

europe off. europe is locked in, you more important for sure. you i don't believe a garage, bay doors, asia will you and it's actually speaking off to base as will be it. so in this particular case, if europe wants to go commit suicide, would you be needing to speak so well? so be it. and again, as i read you stayed, or people were planning down as usual game is called later because a real economy and certainly not competent issues of real war for you get all yeah for all of our operational planning when your basic or whole career and what our 30 years, why them base read back or really, or is all, all together, some guy, the insurgency, the samples with a saudi war,

and they are how you deal with something which america you look at, for example, in college, are since actually since korea and he will dam carriers, and i know, you know, i know that i had to jump in here gentlemen, we're going to go to a short break. and after that show break, we'll continue our discussion on flipping the scripts today. ah ah

ah louis gorda with the old honorable national falls apart, stuck in wisconsin. the last a deal is with sprung from hours from noon to login, to do it in bt machine, you could keep the way in the pony teachers kills a dodge on the bro naisha or was to live in. i'm done with this in a little bolcom in the crucial chest middle school. it was all sweetness with the modem is not, but it's good. p t d still not off with the leukemia. well they do, they won't live up, shoot any video picks. that will be a good way to go with this. but nonetheless, he should be missed. they need to the middle sophomore, and you can give us his name but duties and that'll sort of miss dempsy. this material, but in this phone, even in the supply unit,

should update those slight elvis. you still owe me. it doesn't help with me. she go, she returns. ah, yes, please. and you'll have to renew miss mattie utsa to mucho as you mama shuttle specially to renew with these to those up linking. it'll give you a little bit of doing. please give me a welcome back across like where all things are considered. i'm peter labelle dramatically. we're discussing flipping the script with let's go back to tom in north florida. tom. one of the things i find very disturbing. i mean, after the, the, the barrage of the last couple of days biden was on the phone with zalinski. no

surprise. and, and, you know, a continuing promising support in every a shape or form. is that an issue of moral hazard? i mean, there's a lensky gang has every reason to keep this going on as long as possible. okay. not for the sake of the ukrainian people or whatever will at be and become a ukraine, but for their own personal gains and goals. i mean, if you got the swift number as seen when they send the money, i mean, that is something, you know, that's a once in a lifetime gig and how many people would walk away from it. considering that the zelinski government is shown up a patently very little interest in the lives of their own soldiers in the field. go ahead tom. i yeah, i would, i would. yeah, that is a very important. i think the, there's a, there's a bigger thing here than that, and that is that, that the, the by the ministration is to, is, is, is, is continuing this because that has been policy this, but this binders been on the shelf to turn ukraine into

a war zone to bleed the russians white, and this has been up on the shelf at rand corporation or where for 20 years 30 years. i mean, this has been in the are conservatives green. assume it to get this? it's a you are never and if you will get all biden's nations fury into this like this here to council there all the, the classic, you know, hawks of either the hawkers or the hawks. so this isn't going to end until they finally get the message that it's either you go nuclear, you go home and i want it. and i and as far zalinski concerned, you know, he was placed in this position to do exactly that by other people. and in a no different than our civil bond, or i know different joe biden or anybody else. so, you know, the, the worst part about this is that the people who are doing this, it's all puppet shop in and, and where all the ones caught in the crossfire, especially the ukranian people, which the for them. finally, this war became really real. and it's unfortunate a jeremy,

one of the things i think, people miss all the pundits tree and what not, is that the, it'll be over this will be over number one, when the russians decide it's over. and number 2 in the russians have decided been better security interest been met. so we have to go all the way back to december 17th, which is a, from the history for both people on cable and in the broad sheets. but it was laid out very clearly what russia expected and, and then we had the, the, the, the page of the operation because this has been going on for 8 years now, not just 8 months. and russia will say, because they don't, nobody in the west wants to negotiate. ok, they made that decision, burrell made that decision. and so when russia will say, well, we're done because we have our security interests have been met. nobody in the west seems to be thinking in those terms. go ahead, jeremy. well, yeah, i think tom, but clearly that the neoconservative want to bleed the russians. and they have this

dream that they've been dreaming up for a long time. so they want this to go on indefinitely and they're going to continue arming the ukrainians. and they'll, even if it's over, they're going to carry out low intensity warfare of some kind and continued to try and probably, you know, attack or. busy sabotaged eastern ukraine or even territories, even if they're incorporated into russia, i mean we see what they're doing out crimea and the land bridge. so i don't know this could gone for a long, long time, given those. busy interest tom pointed to yeah, but i mean on that i like think about what jeremy just said they're, i mean they're just certain a certain number of ukrainians. ok. there's a certain number amount of infrastructure. i mean, if they want to continue this on, i suppose, you know, the rush will have to respond to it, but i mean that this is diminishing returns, ok diminish. and at one point, and if the west, the collective west wants to continue doing this. they also will be considered an

official co belligerent, and that's when we go down the, the path of, of a true destruction for everyone involved. go ahead, andre. well, when you have to also give their cognizant of the fact that while your phones are very hawkish and basically what i, why it is their administration of badness, nutrition that results for me, that for us, you do not forget that a lot of things which russia is doing right now, they're very much of dined tool for they need trumps or is already strong car and so to speak in the u. s. policy would, for example, republicans, many of them i'm not talking about the right as such needs are grandma, you know, on cotton by many people don't want to do this anymore. so if we are cause why in all of themselves, they cannot build this, they need to have the access to the lee of ours of power. but on the warranty,

if united states, as long as strong air combined west is more strongly agree on a new day, it is military and trophy. is there stream, or there was actually despite money as a ha boynton this out actually was diminished, not increasing because united states simply has nothing more to deal, so to speak. and it will continue. yes, is diminishing return and in day and it's oper, rush will decide when and will conditions. she wants to finish it. and a statement of 3 days are long about unconditional garbage. lation willow walked differently, the claims honor and tom it met. we are, and we heard the andre mentioned the mid terms here. i mean, it seems to me such a no brainer. i mean, this is biden's war because it was something that, you know,

the obama people started. and obama people, i'm, the biting people have continued. this is a no brainer to say, this is biden's war. it's very, very expensive. we're getting negative returns here. but the, the, it still remains very bipartisan on an elite level. but if you further you go down most, you know, j d back to saying, you know, i don't care about ukraine. i lot of people feel that way in the united states. a lot of people feel that way. ok, i mean if, if, if a conservative a cause i hate the g o p. but if conservatives, i want to make a statement here and say this is not our wor, it's a we has nothing to do with us. we don't gain anything, we only lose thing and it's the arms dealers to do best. what's wrong with that? because that's a strategy. go ahead tom. it's some, it's, it's part of the strategy. at this point the, the democrats are on autopilot. they understand that they're there, they're acting like a party that they know they're going to lose the midterm as desperately. if you want my, my scariest prediction, it's that they're now really feeling the heat of all of their mistakes while since

by this taken office. and again, it goes back to the point i made earlier that someone desperately wants this war escalated in order to upset in order to change fundamentally the entire apple cart of the, the west. and i'm, and what i mean by that is we're headed towards a financial crisis where also at the same time, they need a war to cover their insolvency and their political losses. good point. and so the russians won't give it to them. the russians keep responding for, in effect, proportionally by not expanding this war in any way be on their borders and continue to wait. and if it and then and causing that, the crazies, i think in for a and m, i 62, and to continue to intensify the number, the, the, the, the, the punches on the mouth that they're willing to give the russians in order to try and force printing to do something he doesn't want to do and very patiently saying, no, we're just not going to give you the where you want. and he's i think,

holding off until after the midterm elections because it would be, it would be dumb for him to do that. given what's going to have given the, the political situation, you can read the polls in the united states that there is no consensus for war with ukraine. but if you gives us a reason for it, right, a chasm ally then the, the whole game board changes. it's clearly that's the strategy right now by the ministration, whitehall, brussels, and everybody. jeremy, it's so short sighted because andres already pointed out our program is that i see a real breach, a breach that will not be mended with russia in europe. it's. it's is over that the peter, the great dream of working with europe is finally the 300 year journey is finally come to an end because it's just one big headache. okay. you sign agreements, he don't honor them. you know, men, yes, we agree and all of this, you know, we want the pipeline north stream and then, you know, one of your friends blows it up, ok. what these people are paid in the neck. ok. and without cheap russian energy,

their productivity is worthless. why do you want to deal with these people, jeremy? go ahead. i mean, i think we're seeing a major power shift gets in earlier point about this kind of back for further on the worse, because yeah, russia is 40, very strong block with east with china. and a lot of countries are joining around. there's now involved with this lions raking economic deals and you know, china, one belt, one road initiative is really helped a lot of countries. so we're seeing in the east is growing much stronger. and this is kind of the nightmare of the neo conservatives and anyways. busy the senior china allies with russia, it's becoming a very strong alliance. and the power really is shifting in their direction because of the. busy follies of us and western policies over generations now and a self destructive nature of those all is so i think the world is starting to look a lot different. yeah, it's absolutely folly andre, you know,

the way western median pundents always like to describe that russia is isolated and it has no friends. and, you know, it's really interesting on the rest of the world sees this. they see the following . russia is taking on entire collective west and it's not losing. and it will, it is most likely, very likely, i'm sure it will when russia took on the entire collector. but the entire post colonial power is and you know what, this, the global south is in all. and the chinese are watching very, very carefully. well, i guess area or all in my 1st book few years ago. and i'm running their small stop since 2014, and our early 2015 are old. that united states getting in the wall in your brain a lot the war. now it's standard defeat. dollar d like will dig down, was that what will be the shape of this the bottom right now already can see that.

and there's so much read that it's difficult to explain or elaborate for several hours from there. but it is clear that, yes, world, all this respected power and russia demonstrates the power and result. and that's what people see, including those wonderful or pictures of the heart. and i will get your flying in from there all hate russia. and that's very simple. most people are except reality visuals and they can see it. it will be interesting as the wesley why once they export woke as him. but russia gives an example of a of power and resume and resolute determination. right? gentlemen, that's all the time we have on it. and get thank my guests in north florida, tulsa, and in washington state. and i want to thank our viewers for watching us here at ortiz. see you next time. remember cross talking with

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ah, today i'm authorizing the additional strong sanction foreign companies quitting russia, numbers on to on thank you. this client atm card. so blantan banks disconnected from the international payment system, the social puppy, juvenile, donna, and euro. the exchange rates followed minneapolis sellable up article. the more social carbon would know what the committee met, the bulk of the bill. that's, that is a good. can you say it? sure. c, m a. j. a little much volume in russian business overcome this song. see i bought enough to handle huge, tremendously just me, don't pres, voice, bullshit, national, productive notches steel, osh, a mere bull. what i see that put back on cell when you go when you with a cost to get

a group. when you on yesterday with a little bit. you know the motion with your your, your, your ah you with a ah you sonya on september 2022 and now go down. the ukrainian military shells the city, cecily targeting as our rogia a nuclear power plant, residential buildings.