the me or i hello, welcome to the party 3 years ago at this time of the year and the world was living if last care, 3 days before and damage unprecedented in what times would paralyze to global economy and watching the global population under warranty. and why we covered night, you know, low the command, the same fear and fewer if used to is it still capable of causing widespread damage? well, to discuss that, i'm now joined by the way director of the center for public health research acknowledging university medical school in china. dr. with a great to talk to thank you very much for your time. around 3 years ago, i called it a team was already impacting its 1st patients in china, giving the country's authorities enough reason to notify the world health

organization of a potential global outbreak. when you look at the events of those initial weeks and months in high time, do you think the response to the threat was added with given what was known and what was not known at that time? yeah, actually be sent back to almost 3 years ago. it was the, you know, complete the ticket because we didn't know what the virus was and it was transmitted. well, it kind of consequently because you've got to be individuals. so i think that that time you put it in a couple months, we were completely in the blank. so of course, you know, that particular circumstances, the only thing is they're trying to complete the transmission and that's the best we could do. i think if you look back 3 years ago, it was the correct the decision to if something similar were to appear again.

would you recommend the same course of action, or would you have something modified? well being, you know, 1st days on likely the same scenario will happen again of ours, because now we know a lot of them are the scars by the muted the chance needs and what kinds of medical problems will cost. so the situation is completely different by saying, i think, you know, we have much more experience in getting was there that we know how to control the contain the to limit the number of people getting infected or the mobilized medical services in the resources to deal with it, and the other thing is that we know we have that same data change the landscape go differently. so i think that you know, that happens again, we're probably much better prepared to deal with it. now we here is to go

in those 1st chaotic weeks and months, the countries essentially emulated one another. everybody going for the district as possible, log down even when they didn't have enough resources to sustain it. and i think over time, national strategies have become more self sustaining and south driven, when you analyze national responses at this point of time, can you think, allowed any countries you particularly like the way that they responded and, you know, some nation that perhaps could be justifiably criticized for the action that they took or didn't take, why, you know, it's hard to georgia other countries because the public information and the response to the movie and probably healthy using much influence the all determine the by the, the count his own, that go capacity there. is no uniform,

the wheel beginning was in the bar, all the brake like the cooked pension. but when they look back to the response, there's different countries to get this balance. i think the, you know, in the complete the blank theory, the people did not know anything about the virus. the best way is restrict movement because we know that the movement is one of the key you see which helps us to trust me the wrong way in the video to another individual. so that's, you know, usually we mobilize resources. we put in some sort of room and the mobility, i mean i see that it was quite effective in dealing with the, the nature of the so we know anything about the house. so i think this is very critical. you're just doing a there as usual. and you just go around, we are not going to and the thing, give us the patient, the freedoms,

and that people get contracts. so we don't have that thing. so we don't have them that people right now is definitely the way they approach that china to we have to admit, it's now one of the richest countries per capita. and they have the resources to afford this kind of policy. would you recommend the same approach to some of the poorest countries where people have to stay under the log down without, you know, having any means to, to survive a lot just to, you know, healing or medical treatment. but the bear survival. i'm talking about food, energy, etc. yeah. you're, is there a good question? i don't think that the chinese model is, can be applied to 2 other kinds of countries, which are you develop to have limited resources because of time. the

model number of the facts for us has to be a very strong sense for us because it could remove them all the lines, resources, and the basically one when the epidemic or what happened or the on the break happening in a particular region. very serious overwhelm it's a health care system. then the government could move around the results from a different jurisdictions to, to keep the support. so this requires a tremendous amount of federal government authority called the nation and the cooperation. so, the 1st thing, you know, from this point of view, i mean, this mazda is hardly easily applied to other countries. it's called the, the, is that you are in the past, that's the normal development trying to give out. and then the very,

very close to network which as we go over the all committees such as a full deliberate and the your life support the system, whatever you know, you could simply purchase your living stop from the internet and deliver to your doorstep. so those are things that he was sufficient to support the infrastructure, not just their support to the wrong approach. without those you can do it. now throughout this condemning, we also heard from various experts that is better to be safe than, sorry, although this mantra didn't fully account for, you know, all the damage and the death toll that indirectly occurred. that for example, you know, people suffering from chronic diseases whose treatment was put on hold because all the attention was centered on the occur on the patients. i wonder if this been damaged changed

a way the medical community approaches the treatment of chronic versus infectious diseases. are these 2 fields to feel separated as they used to be? well, i think in the we change the way, you know, patients to health care workers to deal with the big is the and the to the infection. i will be 19, i mean, the other way else we you can see. so thank you. have the on the basis as you just mentioned, because those in the house care facilities have to pry because they are the, are the world in control of our dealing with the effects of the individuals. so you can see that because in part of the time that when that happens, when the patients into a hospital, then somebody has to do with the patients. and you have to go through the, you know,

the chat and the medical examination before you go. so dead in effect to the patients the patient with clinical visits. so there is a very complex i think this is something that's really will then begin to pass the 3 year several will have to develop the more more effective and the patient we're dealing with this kind of situation that if i'm not mistaken, as cold in medical community that's called the problem of tree, that the doctor is always have to, well, they, they would aspire to treat everybody, but they have to make very hard choices about has better chances of, of survival. and you know, that raises a lot of very, very, very hard ethical questions about the elderly, about the children about the economy, et cetera. have 3 here is on how we started going through that

with some sort of honest analysis. or is it still something that humanity has to come to terms with you see, that's an interesting question. the idea is very much in a preface in western countries, particularly european countries. basically you can see the similar although it was a practice meeting in britain and then about the trying we was not or is not widely accepted in the medical community. what do you see is, and i me to someone with the hospital, you know, pick up the chinese and i mean, some of those was just overwhelmed by it could be 900 patients. so that's why the reason why that i'm going to treat tremendous results of the build up of those mixed up the huskiness. and so the patient was severely affected and they were

transferred to those the mitchell hospitals to, to get the medical treatment. so really with the traditional hospital medical care facilities for patients with what you have well, you know, i'll be emergency conditions or chronic diseases. so i think this is a good model in a way because the culture, it is not happening everywhere and everyday it sometimes happens when you have some emergency midship hospital. get to take that. that would be a tremendous help. interesting, you know, here in russia, the traditional chinese medicine is associated with what we call holistic approach . and i think this is one manifestation of nationalistic approach that you try to treat every member of your society regardless of age, survive ability chances. now another thing i wanted to ask you is that it's clear that the patients prognosis with called the dependent

a great deal on his or her house status and his or her health condition. again, a chronic diseases and the proceeding lifestyle. what have you, do you think there are any lessons for all of us to be learned about how to sort of leave our lives truly and hopefully in order not to be so susceptible to academics pandemic like this one? well, that's a good question because if you look the, you know, from the chinese a prospective one on a break and it happens, you know, it's been trying to get to the one that i'm going to call the for. so will restrain ok. now, you know, and then do not go to the boy that went into probably the place it's, it's, you know, avoidable. well, your face mask and there, you know, have some good in the house. self care. good. happy. so basically you can see that

from the individual level, many people are actually doing pretty well. you see that people have a so called salary lines and the big pig health into the end society when the president can happen when there is a shortage of madison. the shock is a, we'll close you, then you also is your 1st responsibility for your own house. so this is something that is that a critical for, for good health. basically, the 1st thing is, when you have a back vaccines are say, and particularly when you have some basic conditions, when you are a old age, particularly people, you know,

7080. and we know that clinical feed about those people are honest about the virus and they tend to give out some more to be your compensation. so this is a clinical, that's why you know this people would come out and they should, they need to take vaccines because of the adequacy back is basically minimal when you compare with the advocacy. so this is the 2 lessons with wines of restraint. you're healthy in your own hands. the 2nd is that rely on the well bailable medical approach protected. so i said, well doctor, we have to take a very short break right now, but we will be back in just a few moments. h n a

hey ah ah, welcome back to worlds apart with would you wait director of the center for public

health research at managing university medical school in china? dr. was before the break. you said that there's a lot of things that we now understand about covered they didn't, but they're also plenty of things that we don't know. what would you say? i still some of the biggest mr. is that puzzle you, when you wake up at night about this particular virus? well, you know, 1st thing is ebby. there's no science, it's ok. it's a very interesting the previous chrome of ours. we knew the huge didn't just continuously team the population and the going through individual to individual and wonder when the weather warms out. usually it goes away. when his coach tomorrow's comes back and so basically it causes little true right?

because symptoms this, this viruses a soft cobra, 2 is called a different that's why you may surely you, you know, to southern 20. many of us mistake would thought that the virus would, would ago, we were the ones. but it didn't. so apparently edition said highly persist in barrels, it keeps going, human, human, and mutating as well. it's interesting to see you lucian, if you look at the early they see in the year to solve the viruses, today's of ours, we have many different virus attempts relation, you know, becoming highly, trust me as well and infectious, but it's a passive pass on. it is a presser, genesee's sick neighbor, compromise. it's no longer cause of severe disease. the all the bible. so once again, your body goes right into your loan. i'm calling to be information so that it often

is called the fever. but the new virus only chrome since this year when it's a starting. so cleaning, spreading around. what do we finally is that the virus mostly just the respirator track. it doesn't go into your home. so that's why the symptom is relatively minor . and mine usually does not cause to be a disease. it's so this is something a lot for them instead of hours and the why and so much compromise needs with cognitive abilities. now i think for the most of the layman, lay people know the scientists, the biggest and most controversial enigma surrounding comb with 19 is its origin. do you think we have we will ever be 100 percent. sure. how it came about to that we, we, we could be 100 percent. sure. but i don't think it's likely because history is

good. and if you look at the history, when we come back to the hours you're trying to find the origin. most of them, and we only give you a roots, you almost level, we never will find an absolute answer because particularly in the case load, chroma, barrels, barrels, that the, basically, all mammals with viruses such a broad hoops that then it's also almost impossible to find the so called the origin, i know that you're personally, i don't believe that this virus could have escaped from the lap as some people in some statement have speculated how would you respond them to your colleagues who answers that the virus with such a complicated genetic makeup, particularly in the doubles did you g sequence, which makes the call it 900 pathogen,

so contagious it could have evolved naturally how. how would you respond to that? i don't think, you know, stay them and is actually reflecting the balance basically is that the borrower has been identified in bads the animals. and if you look at the sequences times of the research, not only you try it, but also in your countries as well. i think the best the research was bio scientists and them and the basically the, the backing now the other parts of the china sequence look at the bars. this current of motion. and his conclusion is that it's more likely the powers actually from baths and the tents. me into a memo, and then what, eventually you bought them, trust me to you. because this is,

this is more kinds of robust evidence. so, you know, that can be simpler simply because this is such a complex, that's the ability you, human beings, it is more likely that the bars is evolving in a mammal and becoming more depth in the environment. and we do have especially about now, as we've discussed before, china was among the 1st countries to introduce low downs and among the last to relax them. and i heard you say that the 0 tolerance approach has been working fairly well for your country. and yet, can you believe that it's not sustainable much longer? why is that? they would have to be in a different perspective. there's viruses,

transmission people years will. so the 21 and the year 2021 because there is different in the early days that the virus is much more is causing as much mortgage is causing ability when people are contracted about the development of the human deaths. so overall, if you look at the facts and population b, b o case percentage is was much higher than the bars on the chrome since early this year when the only holding in china. so the severe cases very few and that's the case is also very low, but there be a balance transfer to so quickly. so the 0 clearance, the clearance policy was designed to deal with the virus which trans me, the not just law, but it causes a much more severe visits. so when,

when policy were implemented during the 1st 2 years, it was the very best. i mean, you can talk about spreading from large populations. so that's why will i times counsel system was still capable of dealing with the population. but once we step into year to some pointed to when i was the major there in the shortly being trying to trust me to so fast. so the, the, on the policy, the 0 clearance policy will be able to contain the bars. if you look at the, the, on the breaks in this year, there are basically it's all the trying all of the relatively small skills. but that people also clean the teacher that you can't really control. now correct me if i'm mistaken here, but from what i understand, it's not that the, the chinese authorities are lifting all restrictions altogether. the impact of patients still have to be core and him,

they can be warranted at home rather than in safe facilities. but it is still pretty severe by some standards measures, i mean more severe than in other countries. and with roughly, i think 90 percent of the chinese population vaccinated. why do you need such treatment measures to continue once the once the goal of that was the purpose. okay . the overall creepy, the vaccination in the chinese population is over 90 percent is a very. but if you look at the population, 65 years, all the particular the population a to ab, about in this particular population, the national average vaccination, which is only 67 percent. so basically means that you will have one that's saying that people are not full of action is on the one normal action. so when you and

then the number is a huge number, you try me. so you, but this is the infected i'm calling is whether you this particular population was on the destination. is that, is it a high risk of a city? a disease is an even better. so that's, i think while the reason why the, probably the emptiness only partially open, if you want infected, you still need to be and receive kind of restrictions. i think this is a sense approach. she by minimizing the impact on it, highly vulnerable probation that was picking about other segments of the population . this announcement about moderating the chinese policy came after a series of protests in china, which some of your western parts there's took with quite a bit of delight. do you think the decision to adjust the policy a little bit? was it taken purely on medical grounds or do you think the chinese authorities to

have to be mindful of social frustration, building social frustration because chinese people and people to and they have all the emotions that come with being human being and do they have to take into account also the eagerness with which some of your neighbors or perhaps were an actors react to as social protest. i think you're absolutely right. you know, i think that the major factor is open the progress of medical and comical reason. but my personal, my feeling is that the general population of frustration, anger, also the pay of somebody in the rooms performance. now, i'm so frustrated because you go, well, you know, you have to show your, your, your, your, your cooking code the, and the screen screen things and also present your,

you can actually pass the results. it's just the hassle. it's ok. welcome. yes, 9. the particular one, you know, that the viruses badly, i'm by you, i want to die. but when you see that there's about the shape, okay? when you, when you watch tv and people young, you seem to be move up freely and you see, you know, soccer teams or soccer games or people to another. well, you know, as soon as other people, naturally we, we don't express the frustration while we need to, you know, still need to be restricted. so i think those definitely will play a part in making but my gut feeling isn't there. the key, the reason is the medical raising and the, and the community. you can look at the car on the open policy. it's basically you can see that the design maybe mine's the disruption with people who have a lot. but still, if you know, you did, you need to be you need to be restrained and that there are,

there are certain policies basically, you know, you, you, you have a and to minimize the impact on others as well to where we have to live there. thank you very much for being with us today. okay, thank you. go by and thank you for watching hope to see her again on was apart. ah with mm ah, a

mouse mother while you while div easy while furnace us. ah. here for unit one slide yet if south. yeah. rational a south with a new dock. awesome for years now, which done up all me at that. i'll pull up. my pizza is emiliano full. grady of sure. sure. let me just kim's room. sure. thoughtfully. it's safe to watch the ela a yes, my thought watching in that again, do you watch in pre op my, be a lot about this morning if there's just a natural ah,

with buddy may, putin emphasizes that the west left to russia no choice but to intervene unprotected, so national interests out in the box goes, opponents are still pending to come to the negotiating table. with john as top diplomat says that russia, china relations are unshakable. after the recent visit of russia's deputy security had to meet the chinese leader shooting thing. i'm 70 years after the mama rebellion kenyans are holding on the british government to compensate locals. the crimes that they committed by the military or parents greatly suffered.