ah, a part jokingly dismissed or shamefully suppressed. i'm the last a very complex and very complex phenomena revealing something hidden, both about its consumers and societies at large. like any collective preoccupation, it gratified and punishes, and it's old and exhaust, exposes and misrepresent. with points i still joined the chunk of internet traffic . what makes point such a symbol of desire guys discussed that i'm now doing by georgia to try to call a clinical psychologist from house with an author. all law got

a kaleidoscope on orange, georgia. it's great to talk to you. thank you very much for your time and congratulations on this amazing book. thank you very much. thank you. now, as i said, you're joining us for i've been live here in russia. it is a subject of many lurid and politically incorrect jokes about the hot finish, man coupled with the data. you're citing your book that 9 out of 10 finish man up consumers of 4. and i wondering if there's something in the house and error that not only spark your interest, but also gave you the sort of the scientific courage to explore a subject like that. no, i don't think you'd speak with him and i am from you. i moved here to be 13 years ago. actually the interesting such a topic and you're writing something start to go. as they started reading many books form that i could find. and then i came to the conclusion that

leasing the union field and there was nothing written about it. and in general, the 2nd environment is always addressed new logic on sides. and i thought it was missing kind of the exploration of the old form itself. and what about the current site guys? like you said? so this started long you for my coming to see him. and by the way, yes, in the book i mention this data about foreign consumers. i quoted this very interesting research because it was a very long research talking, 970 and they're willing wiring many dimensions are trying to be off to the present time. but i know that other research is in countries in the west, but they said basically this one results. so it's not the only thing the folks are

actually everywhere in western countries. there is this kind of a result like 9 men on 10 and maybe nowadays 767, we've been over 10 or you go on consumer. so i don't know hawks ladies disrespected us many jokes about the temperament of the spanish people here in russia. in your book, you show very elegantly how for one from an obscure, somewhat, the latest fascinations to a mass phenomena. and i think 50 years for starting with live nation in denmark and done in the united states in the 970. and i was surprised to learn that the collapse of the soviet union in the country where i was born and also needed a major contribution to the industry in what way. well, developed for many, let's say for a 100 years, probably in

a very nice or style for just accessible by few people in the taking the western countries like you mentioned. it's only by the end of the sixties and the beginning of the seventy's born or production and distribution was allowed just by goals in some companies, starting with denmark in the us down front seat of the many other countries. so my book is about mass form. so we have mostly to the last few years and especially dedicated to $24.00 men, the sexual men. this is important to say the phenomenon to say why nowadays, so i tried to focus on what is still the mainstream for an hour and during the seventy's and the former was a kind of side, the industry to film industry. and actually there were unions in many countries and

movies they were trying to structure their work as any other work. but when, so if you didn't call out there was a massive amount so many years and women basically we need to do anything in order to, to earn some money. which of course, into the western world. so to say, and these change completely the landscape for an industry because it went towards a more can anybody with their camera would feel my new something and then the internet was mostly during the ninety's. so basically, these 2 factors together created a new landscape where all the unions and also the rules of the previous to see were swept away by using, you know, so yes, the coming from, especially you ukraine,

barrows and russia actresses. so to say, change the landscape, correct? me if i'm wrong, but from what i heard you say in other engineers, it's not just about the nature of oregon, how actress is paid and how they're protected. but also about the style should have been the aim of the product itself. because i heard you say before the back in the seventy's and the eighty's was much more about the mutual pleasure, but damage shifted to formal violence and dominating kind of genre g. you attribute that to a cultural influx of women from before somebody union or is it just the nature of time itself or the nature of male sexuality that has changed the word farm? this is a very interesting question. well, i would say that and the availability of women willing to do anything went

well together with, with the increasing going towards the extreme that was already present in the seventy's and eighty's. but it was more somehow regulated and especially in the seventy's since the previous decade, a in the west of b changes social changes, there was a movement and all the movements. so in that moment the, the fact that was representing sexuality as a joyful and disconnected from procreation as a pleasure for women, it was a very b u. c. element in that moment. so, so it was already extreme during the seventies and eighties. i mean, we can find extreme back them too, but i can see are much different from the current form, which is very much about using

a woman for me. it pleasure. i wouldn't dare to say that there was a cultural contribution from the side of the women. i think a teacher was already there. and the idea that actually we could exploit all these women are willing to do anything just a markets advantage. so now one of the essential ideas in your book is that technological invention will demonstrate how important is a logical invention or not national tools. they don't just satisfy our needs, but they form and shape them sometimes that pre approval is an insidious a. i wonder how do you start trying to maintain, if not autonomy, then sound, think me of no dependency on on those technological tools, forums and anything out there. why is interest in

question? in a way human beings have always be technology goes on the very 1st time when somebody created the container to bring the water from the river to the cavern, probably already baffled technology. coming you mention something out of the nature of the last 100 years saw a dramatic change in our landscape to the point that the knology according to the us, that there was a lot in the book became the subject of history and actually premium we as human beings are on the co, historical to technology. so definitely will even if acknowledged a word that is just one of the manual technology. but all of this objects that surround us. and that is not only a tool in our hands and depends on how we use bad. this is, are kind of nice for me to anders, he's claims that actually we should be worried about how technology use us. which

is a reverse perspective where technology actually can change deeply our human, our emotions and the way we are in the world. it's just a little that technology is the current word. so i don't think we can, we can imagine a word without it. it's a very, very difficult processed balance, our relationship with technology within that there knology for work. i think that the starting point is to question seriously our technology, the landscape. and i, i mean, i try to do is even though the topic is much wider than or you're mental under the german industrial. the last of our who in many ways was ahead of time for telling the dangers of being played by technology. so i saw that his 2nd book of athletes was titled the app. ma'am,

i know that you don't like judging or moralizing in any way, but do you think by and large, 40 years after the publication of this book we have come to, you don't be in for kind of being proven that people are not all of them, but by and large losing touch not only with the free period in them or but also the bodies. because when you look at both these fear this disinvited in the same time as a change union of all the union without union. yes, yes. you're right. yeah, i personally, i think the word is 5 by now present. i really wonder how he would consider the current needs and words, for example, under wiley t and so on because many sections were based on radio and g,

it's great. you're mazing, she was 14, are really much more talking about the current. although he died i think the agents so before the ancient. yeah, i do believe that she is the soap in word is, is present in this moment. i know that there are many other seems, there's that much more positive about technology. and they believe there is just a, the normal developmental human consciousness going towards that. i am closer to this worries, so to say and the responsibility to discuss. i am worried that the more well interestingly that despite human beings so much ahead of his time, he is not widely published in english. you know that, that is, you know,

what, we usually think of the western world as the, and the driver of both the 3rd and the 4th industrial revolution. and yet they are very few translations of his work that mostly on. when i mature in nature, i wonder if that is just an unfortunate happenstance to you, or if you think it's that are a form of deliver, it will actually ostracizing. yeah, well as an analyst it's hard enough to think of that. those in this regression on this work issue to this or a finally published in english. i found out this year there is a big word. i think it's published in america about around this war works. in general. it's some 500 pages book. so they have now finally translated to something and spoken to him. it's interesting because his 1st book was published, the end of the 2nd world war 248, i think the 2nd one, the eighty's,

or 99. a, sam, i could find a translation and it was already existing since the sixty's, but in the true word. so to say it's funny, last year maybe august, so i see it as a little bit of a regression because it was a very rich boys, especially for him. and he was also contemporary of young. and i think union ideas are also seeing a bit of a revival, so maybe it's synchronistic around it in a way that we're coming back to prominence anyway, you're do we have to take a very short break right now. we'll be back in just a few moments they can a, ah

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welcome back to will support the article, a clinical psychologist from finland and also law got a kaleidoscope on foreign georgia before the briefly touched on this very central idea in your book as well as in the work of good there on. there's that logical inventions are not natural tools. they not only satisfy our needs, but also shape and foster them. and sometimes they even create our needs. and you provide a very interesting example of coca cola as something that for many people actually managed to hijack that basic need for 30 stand by claiming to satisfy it actually increases it. and i think that's a very common thing within the big industry as well as within the big pharma industry because they are very a lot of very obnoxious images there. if you look at the most prevalent disease is metabolic disease, right now be diabetes, dementia, a, b,

c. many of them would be tracy. people are being hooked on certain foods or on certain, as i think one is perhaps recreating of the same dynamic and certain populations that could be very helpful to some very imagine just to some but in many people it also creates addiction. and i understand it's a very complex question. i had to say you don't like passing judgments, but where do you think we should start in terms of both assigning responsibility? because you know how budgets are something that we are all concerned about is the public good and also helping people develop a helpful and put a regionally respectful relationship with technology and new intervention and the industries that produce them? yes. yeah. your questions are always very interesting or big. they would

require a lot of time to, to reflect on the questions. well, i would say that the taking the example foreigner and the name of my book was to show different sides of it, which is something that i didn't find many books. i called the book a kaleidoscope for that every chapter should have been a color and all the colors together. they were for me to come to school so that the reader can turn the book. so do say and see maybe some configurations or others in order to where she need that when a phenomenon is a complex form is having the ability to see many colors and, and embrace this complexity is the 1st step we have to do before doing what you are asking the same about technology. technology is

a very complex topic and why is lots of reflections. and so to say deepening here many ask before we, we can decide something about what can we do in order not to be just addicted. so i thought it was me too many books or was this complexity there were only focusing on some aspect, for example, addiction or a logical version. but form is, is a very complex object that actually is just a good seymour, many other phenomena of our work. so what you asked requires 1st of all to know much better, so much a deeper level and then we can try to understand what can we do about it. well, we can invite out to get your book and reflect on it, but i can tell you from

a personal perspective that one of the very simple but for some reason, very insightful ideas for me. it was that, that, that mean not just leave it in our bodies, but we are the body and the desiring bodies and your book demonstrates in a very interesting way. and there is actually, i think, a huge difference in perceiving yourself. ringback living in the body and actually imagining your sound that same body. i can you, can you speak about that a little bit? yes, this is, this is an important point. because for example, and experience technology can get to a screen basically where nowadays or videos or features. how technology invites kind of splits with the bobby. because we look at some checks and

performance and the only senses that we are using in that moment our baby decides and hearing because there is but actually sex as a real experience as an important experience or would be much more involved in the office. and she's like, days, smell, and most of all very interesting how, like you said before, lose are trying to me nation of opposite or is this sexual thing. but actually it doesn't have anything to do with the sexual, embody experience because we're just sitting in front of a screen. there's nothing a physical there. there are some physical things mightily, physical people not just watch they, i think use the imagination. and sometimes that happens to all that, i mean there is not the an embodied experience with the people,

but it's not the same thing as a real sexual kid can actually ask you about them. because i think this is a fascinating question and sexuality is one of the sort of 5 basic things that's calling an identified. and i think more than others, it requires the presence of the other, you know. yeah. and you unions like to talk about the the benefits of living imagination. but i was perhaps a downside to that. as a clinical psychologist. what are some of the dangers of living out too much of your sexuality and imagine their reality. yes, this is also a very important topic to, i believe that the union, but all of the secretary work, let's say it's very much leaning on the verbal side. and we can to not to get too much attention to the body, but there are movements. so to say in the 2nd or the words that are trying to

improve the body level much more. and there are very interesting crossovers between, for example, you theory and authentic move manager or dance therapy and other teams that more of the body. so yeah, there is always nice to disconnect from the girl and body experience. there is a need to keep pull out together like the imagination but. ready also the body level, so important to technology object being vice discrete from the body experience in a way. and this is one example. i mean this is happening a lot. with that we can disconnect from the body. we can disconnect from the emotions. we can disconnect even from ethics because we just watch a video with our responsibility, what's going on and maybe some violent video or something at the speaker will that

we wouldn't, we would never duly reality. still, we are enjoying something which is violent. so there's a lot of questions that are poor by these things, and definitely try to reconnect to body and mind that much more. also in the union, the theory put out the wrong because if we're look at the data, despite these very wide availability of the people around the developed world, having less tax their having it's later in their lives. it's also less creative, not only because of their birth control, but also because of b precipitously falling prone cones. in many of the man, if you step outside the corn for a while, what do you think is happening with human sexuality in general? within this larger view of technology and the 4th industrial revolution that we're about to enter. yeah, well, on one hand,

there are many signs of crisis like you were mentioning on the other. i'm reading so many interesting books that are address and sexuality in new ways and they're interested in ways i, her mind a speech, the authors female authors. but i am reading a lot of books about sexuality and couple relationship already emory and many you. let's say development, so really sex. so like you said in the beginning there was some opposite phenomena happening at the same time. there is a crisis of the previous way, maybe sexuality, the patriot prizes, investing, also the way to try. it has always be tended and hopefully you know you elements that are starting to circulate, you will change the landscape in the future. so i hope that we will have all better

sex and better relationship. and yeah, well perhaps a better relationship with reality, which i think is the goal of any psychological school, but especially in psychology, seen as want to be allowed reality to really real gone like magic to mere mortals. since you have the word, goddesses in the title, what do they have to do with i can base activity asked for and yeah, i know we have a very short time left to so i just try to make a huge about maybe, maybe the listen. i will be curious to see in the, in the more expensive way. and i had the idea, i would say the hypotheses that a factor of fascination for form that should be found also outside the usual logical explanations is definitely fascinating for the majority of men and women

around the world, including one other genders. and i believe that's a reducing everything to a g b to narrowing. so my hypothesis is that actually porno, poor. it's possible to find some change to what are the heroes was connected to the sake of a big talk. you know, the years the said there was a place in a place beyond the bad a place or place of the got the place of the human being. so in a very strange way, or somehow something has to do with the under certain shade. and i explain it in the book, but it's really along their topic now. and so the reason i say that the form that

there is some hint to the secret that, that actually is fascinating because we live in the surprise. we're a statement that is dad, can say that the secret has disappeared as a you know, any union of what they have replied to you. that what can a, whether he's called the not the, the guys are still present it. it's a matter of seeing and perceiving them and having a right relationship with them today. i have to leave it there. i wish i could have more time to discuss fascinating book, and i invite our readers to, to get it that you have an advantage over russians. i think it's still available around the world on amazon. so to take a chance on that. thank you very much. on this possibility to talk. thank you. what you hope to hear again next week, all the part ah

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