[000:00:00;00] a with a part jokingly dismissed or shamefully suppressed. i'm the last a very complex and a very complex phenomenon revealing something hidden, both about as consumers and societies at large. like any collective preoccupation, it gratified and punishes a goals and exhaust, exposes and misrepresent. with points i still joined the chunk of internet traffic

. what makes point such a symbol of desire guys discussed that i'm now joined by georgia to try to call a clinical psychologist from help with an overall law. got a kaleidoscope on orange. georgia is great to talk to you. thank you very much for your time and congratulations on this amazing book. thank you very much. thank you . now, as i said, you're joining us for i've been live here in russia. it is a subject of many lurid and politically incorrect jokes about the hot finish, ma'am, coupled with the data you're citing your book that 9 out of 10 finish man up consumers of 4. and i wondering if there's something in the house and error that not only spark your interest, but also gave you the sort of the scientific courage to explore a subject like that. no, i don't think you'd speak with amanda. i am from you. i moved here to be 13 years ago,

actually the interest in such as don't be any writing something started long ago. and they started reading many books about form that i could find. and then i came to the conclusion that leasing the union and there was nothing written about it. and in general, in the 2nd environment or is always addressed for logical sides. and i thought it was missing a kind of exploration of the old form itself. and one of our current guys so this started long before my coming to see me. and by the way, yes, in the book i mention this data about schumer's i, i quoted this very interesting research because it was a very long the research is talking 1970 and they're willing wiring many dimensions

. i'm trying to be off to the present time. but i know that other research is in different countries in the west. they say basic results. so it's not the only thing the folks are actually everywhere in western countries. there is this kind of a result like 9 man on 10 and maybe nowadays 767 we went over 10 years ago on consumer. so i don't know hawks plays disrespected object of many jokes about the temperament of the finish, nor the boy here in russia. in your book, you show very elegantly how for one from an obscure, somewhat, the latest fascinations to amass phenomena in i think 50 years for starting with the lives ation in denmark and done in the united states in the 1970s. and i was surprised to learn that the collapse of the soviet union be in the country where i

was born. also major contribution to the industry in what way are well developed for many or let's say for a 100 years, probably in a very nice style. just accessible by few people in the taking the western countries like you mentioned, it's only by the end of the sixties and the beginning of the seventy's born or production and distribution was allowed just by goals in some companies starting with denmark in the us down front seat of the many other countries. so my book is about mass form so mostly to the period of the last few years and especially dedicated to boarding 24 men the sexual men. this is important to say the phenomenon to say why nowadays, so i tried to focus on what is still the mainstream for an hour. and during the

7 days, and the former was a kind of side, the industry to film industry. and actually there were unions in many countries and actors, movies they were trying to structure their work as any other work. but when so with the union call out, there was a massive amounts of women most of all years and women basically we need to do anything in order to earn some money which cord into the. ready western world, so to say, and these change completely the landscape for industry because it went towards a more can anybody with their camera would feel my news something and then also during the ninety's. so basically these 2 factors together

created a new landscape where all the unions and also the, all of the previous to see, were swept away by using, you know, so yes, the coming from, especially you, ukraine, better rose on the and russia axis. so to say change the landscape, correct me if i'm wrong, but from what i heard you say in other engineers, it's not just about the the nature of oregon, how actress is paid and how they're protected. but also about the style should have been the aim of the product itself, because i heard you say before the back in the seventy's and the eighty's was much more about the neutral pleasure. but damage shifted to with formal violence and dominating kind of genre g. you attribute that to a cultural influx of women from before somebody union or is it just been the nature of time itself, or the nature of male sexuality that has changed the words are this is

a very interesting question. well, i would say that the availability of women willing to do anything went well together with the, with the increasing they're going to work the stream was already present in the seventy's in ages. but it was more somehow regulated and especially in the seventy's since the previous decade, the $64.00 in the west would be changes. so from changes there was feminist movements and movements. and so in that moment the fact that was representing female sexuality as a joy, fool, and disconnected from procreation. as a pleasure for women, it was a new thing, adamant in that moment. so it was already extreme during the seventy's name. i mean,

we can find the extreme back them to but that was much different from the current form, which is very much about using a woman for me at pleasure. i wouldn't dare to say that there was a cultural contribution from the side of the women. i think patriot was already there and the idea that actually we could exploit all these, we're going to do anything just was market advantage. so now one of the essential ideas in your book is that technological inventions, in your demonstrate how point is a logical invention. i'm not national tools, they don't just satisfy me, but they form and shave them from times with pretty malicious, insidious motives. i wonder how do you, yourself try to maintain it's not an autonomy and done some degree of no dependence

the on on those technological forms and anything out there. the why is interesting question in a way human beings have always been. technology goes from the very 1st time when somebody created the container to bring water from the river to the cavern, which already baffled technology. coming you mention something out of the nature of the last 100 years saw dramatic change in our landscape to the point that technology according to the us that they bought a lot in the book became the subject of history and actually use a premium we as human beings are on the co 2 story go to technology. so definitely we live in a technology we're that is just one of the manual objects technology. but all of this objects that surround us. and that is not only

a tool in our hands and depends on how we use bad. this is, are kind of nice position according to anders. he's claims that actually we should be worried about how technology use us. which is the reverse perspective, where technology actually can change deeply our in our emotions and the way we are in the work. it's just a little that technology is the current word. so i don't think that we can, we can imagine a word without it. it's a very, very difficult processed balance, our relationship with technology with them as their knowledge. we're. i think that the starting point is to question seriously our technology, the landscape. and i, i mean, i try to do is even just looking for the topic is much wider than or your mentor under the german industrial. the last of our who in many ways was ahead of his time

for telling the dangers of being inflamed by technology. so much so that his 2nd book of athletes was titled the apple man. i know that you don't like judging moralizing in any way, but do you think by and large, 40 years after the publication of this book we have come to don't be in for kind of being proven that people are not all of them, but by and large losing touch, not only with the free period in them or but also the bodies because when you look at war and it's both the fear, this disinvited in the same time as a change union of all the union without union. yes, yes. you're right. yeah, i personally,

i think the word is 5 by now present. i really wonder how he would ever consider the current needs and words for example and so on because many sections were based on radio and g. it's pretty amazing. she was 14 talking to are really much more talking about the current. although he died i think the agents so before the ancient. yeah, i do believe that the word is, is present in this moment. i know that there are many other seems there's that much more positive about ecology and they believe that it's just a, the normal developmental human consciousness going toward that i am closer to this worries. so to say, and i am worried that the more

well interestingly that the human being so much ahead of his time. he is not widely published in english. you know that, that is, you know, what, we usually think of the western world as the, and the driver of both the 3rd and the 4th industrial revolution. and yet they are very few translations of his work that mostly on i, when i mature in nature, i wonder if that is just an unfortunate happenstance to you or the things that are a form of deliver, it will actually ostracizing. yeah, well as an analyst, it's hard enough to see that those of me in this regression are on this work industry to this for a whole book as being finally published in english. i found out this year there is a big word. i think it's published in america about around this war works in

general. it's some 500 pages book. so they have now finally translated to something and spoken to him. it's interesting because his 1st thought was published. the end of the 2nd world war 248, i think the 2nd one, the eighty's, or 99. a sam, i could find a translation and it was already existing since the sixty's. but in the true word. so to say it's funny. last year, maybe august, so i see it as a little bit of a regression because it was a very quick voice, especially for him. and he was also contemporary of young. and i think union ideas are also seeing a bit of a revival. so maybe it's synchronistic, it went in a way that we're coming back to prominence anyway there. do we have to take a very short break right now? we'll be back in just

a few moments they can ah, ah ah ah. oh oh oh oh, a ah. what we've got to do is identify the threats that we have. it's crazy confrontation,

let it be an arms. race is often very dramatic and development only personally, i'm going to resist. i don't see how that strategy will be successful, very critical. i'm time to sit down and talk ah welcome back to will support a clinical psychologist from finland and also law got assist a kaleidoscope on foreign georgia before the briefly touched on this very central idea in your book as well as in the work of good there on there's that now logical inventions are not natural tools. they not only satisfy our needs but also shape and foster them. and sometimes they even create our needs and you provide

a very interesting example of coca cola is something that for many people socially managed to hijack that basic need for 30 stand by claiming to satisfy it actually increases it. and i think that's a very sort of common thing within the big industry as well as within the big pharma industry because they're very, a lot of very obnoxious images there. if you look at the most prevalent disease is metabolic dizziness right now be diabetes dementia, a, b, c. many of them would be tracy. people are being hooked on certain foods or on certain habits. and i think one is that perhaps already creating the same dynamic in certain populations. it could be very helpful to some or very imaginative to some, but in many people, it also addiction. and i'm going to, it's a very complex question. i had to send the you don't like passing judgments, but where do you think we should start in terms of both assigning responsibility?

because you know how budgets are something that we are all concerned about? it is the public good and also helping people develop a helpful and put a regionally respectful relationship with technology and new intervention. and the industry that produced down. yes, your questions are always very interesting for big. they will require a lot of time to, to reflect on the questions. well, i would say that the taking the example foreigner and the name of my book was to show different sides of it, which is something that i didn't find many books. i called the book a kaleidoscope for that every chapter should have been a color and all the colors together. they were for me to come to school so that the

reader can turn the book so to say and see maybe some configurations or others i saw from these by the way, she mean that when a phenomenon is a complex form is having the ability to see many colors and, and embrace this complexity is the 1st step we have to do before doing what you are asking. the same about technology technology is a very complex topic and why is lots of reflections. and so to say deepening here many ask before we, we can decide something about what can we do in order not to be just addicted. so i thought it was me too many books or was this complexity. there were only focusing on some aspects, for example, addiction or

a logical version of the form is, is a very complex object that actually is just a good seymour, many other phenomena of our work. so what you asked, that requires 1st of all to know much better and so much a deeper level. and then we can try to understand what can we do about it. well, we can invite out to get your book and reflect on it, but i can tell you from a personal perspective that one of the very simple but for some reason, very insightful ideas for me. it was that, that, that mean not just leave it in our bodies, but we are the body and the desiring bodies and your book demonstrates it in a, in a very interesting way. and there is actually, i think, a huge difference in perceiving yourself as living in the body and actually

imagining your sound that same body. i can you, can you speak about that a little bit? yes, this is, this is an important point. because for, for example, and experience technology can get to a screen basically where speaking nowadays or videos or features. how technology invites kind of splits with the bobby. because we look at some checks and sex performance. and the only changes that we are using in that moment are basically sides and hearing because there is but actually sex as a real experience as an important experience or would be much more involved in the office like days to smell in parchments, to war. very interesting how, like you said before, lose are trying to work with the nation of all because it's like why is this sexual thing, but actually doesn't have anything to do with the sexual,

embody experience because we're just sitting in front of the screen. there's nothing a physical there, there are some things, i mean mightily, physical people not just watch they, i think use the imagination. and sometimes that happens to that. i mean, there is not the an embodied experience with the people or shouts, but it's not the same thing. as a real sexual kid can actually ask you about them because i think this is a fascinating question on sexuality is one of the sort of 5 basic things that's calling an identified. and i think more than others, it requires the presence of the other, you know. yeah. and you unions like to talk about the the benefits of living and imagination and perhaps a downside to that, to

a clinical psychologist. what are some of the dangers of living out too much of your sexuality in this imaginary reality? yes. oh yes. this is also a very important topic to, i believe that the union, but all of the secretary work, let's say it's very much leaning on the verbal side. and we can to not to get too much attention to the body. but there are movements. so to say in the words that are trying to improve the body level much more. and there are very interesting crossovers between, for example, you theory and authentic movement or dance therapy and other things, the more the body. so yeah, there is always nice to disconnect from the physical body to experience. there is a need to keep it together like the imagination,

but also the body level. so important to technology object being vice discrete from the body experience in a way. and this is one example, i mean this is happening a lot with ecology that we can disconnect from the body. we can disconnect from the emotions. we can disconnect even from ethics. because we just watch a video with our responsibility, what's going on and maybe some violent video or something at the speaker that we wouldn't, we would never do reality. but still we are enjoying something which is violent. so there's a lot of questions that are poor by these things, and definitely try to reconnect to body and mind that much more. also in the union, the theory put out the wrong because if you look at the data, despite these very wide availability of the people around the developed world,

a having less tax their having it's later in their lives. it's also less creative, not only because of their birth control, but also because of the precipitously falling pro pounds. in many of the man, if you step outside the point for a while, what do you think is happening with human sexuality in general? within this larger your technology and the, the 4th industrial revolution that we're about to enter. yeah. well on one hand, there are many signs of crisis like you were mentioning on the other. i'm reading so many interesting books that are address and sexuality new ways and they're interested in ways i her mind a speech the authors fema authors. but i am reading a lot of books about sexuality and couple relationship already emory and many you,

let's say development. so really sex. so like you said in the beginning there was some opposite phenomena happening at the same time. there is a crisis of the previous way, maybe sexuality, the patriot prizes, investing also the way 6, right? it has always be tended. and hopefully, you know, you elements that are starting circulate, you will change the landscape in the future. so i hope that we will have all better sex and better relationship with them. yeah, well and perhaps a better relationship with reality, which i think is the goal of any psychological school, but especially in psychology, seen as want to be allowed reality to really real gone like magic to mere mortals. since you have the word, goddesses in the title, what do they have to do with base activity asked for?

and yeah, i know we have a very short time left to so i just try to make a huge about maybe, maybe the listen. i will be curious to see in the, in the more expensive way. and i had the idea that say, the hypotheses that a factor of fascination for form that should be found also outside the usual logical explanations is definitely fascinating for the majority of men and women around the world, including one other genders. and i believe that reducing everything to g is a bit too narrowing. so my hypothesis is that actually porno, poor. it's possible to find some change to what are the heroes was connected to the sake of a be talking you know, the years the say there was a place,

a place beyond the bad a place or place of the got the place of the human being. so in a very strange way, or somehow something has to do with the under certain shade. and i explain it in the book, but it's really along their topic now. and so the reason i say that the form that there is some hint to the secret that actually is fascinating because we live in the surprise, we're a statement that is dead. and we can say that the secret has disappeared as a, you know, any union of what they have replied to you. that what kind of a, whether he's called the non they got a still present it. it's a matter of seeing and perceiving them and having a right relationship with them to,

to have to leave it there. i wish i could have more time to discuss fascinating book, and i invite our readers to, to get it that you have an advantage over russians. i think it's still available around the world on amazon. so to take a chance on that. thank you very much. on this possibility to talk. thank you. what you hope to hear again next week. all the fire ah ah,

with ah ah absorb this, our naughty international. 3 civilians are reportedly killed and a true power plaza taking damage and the ukranian shelling all gone back. they're all current fears. more people could be dropped under the rubble, the capture of leak documents reported by the great news outlet shows how british intelligence spies on russian forces on behalf of you cried quote, a violation of free speech on the rights of john. that's how russia's foreign ministry describes the attention of the regional director of the sputnik use agency