oh i ah hello and welcome to cross stock where all things are considered. i'm peter lavelle . how will the conflict in ukraine and to cease fire armesis frozen conflict or defeat for either ukraine or russia? this is the question so called being tanks all across the western world are asking the problem with this approach did it lacks intellectual and moral honesty. we must

address why this conflict started in the 1st place with cross sucking war in peace. i'm joined by my guest, john brawley in new york. he is a political analyst, as well as a former foreign correspondent in russia. in washington, we have nick bronner. he is the chair of the people's party of the united states and in north florida. we have tom longo, he is to publish a gold goats in guns blog and newsletter i dylan cross, eyebrows. the fact that music and jumping in time you want i always appreciated. let me, let me go to i john in new york 1st. you know, john, i mean i've, i watch all these think tanks, you know, responsible state craft, you know, the american conservative anti war dot com, which i, i have, you know, basically positive attitudes towards in general. but very specifically, the way they approach that, how this conflict in ukraine is going to and they, they, they're not very interest interested in contextualizing how we got here in the 1st

place. because i would posit, and i have ever since the complex started that the ending, well has to take into account how it all started. and it western leads and really be where the foreign policy blob is that we're just doesn't want to go there. because there's a lot of culpability there. go ahead in new york, the roots of this kind of sex are protecting the rights to the ethnic russians in dunbar in crimea. and absolutely nobody in the west was to address that issue. they don't even want to talk about it. in fact, i was recently on a atlantic council webinar, atlanta counselor, as you know, with the think tank, basing for the pentagon from the ca for the national security state. and they deny the fact that there are ethnic russians who are native residents of crimea, and they deny this fact general wesley court clark claims that the russians living crimea are migrate. they just came in the past few years, right? moscow sent them to crimea in order to stick

a claim to crime. here in the past few years. wesley clark, you know, top general, the pentagon actually believes as lies as this information. then there was a former defense ministry from ukraine and he said the people crimea, although ukrainians they claim the russians, but there are fact ukrainians, they just don't know their ukrainians, and we're going to help them to remember that they're your koreans, which of course, what does this, say nato and ukraine. they have a plan of ethnic cleansing, murder executions at the cleansing. that is their plan. that is their vision for crimea for done. but if they succeed, and this is why russia's fighting so hard because it has to protect those 7000000 people have to pick to protect the rights their lives, their property. so russia is going to fight to the bitter in the residence of those regions. i'm going to fight to the bitter end to protect themselves from what would be a mass, horrible crime, a mass murder, if nato and ukraine, when? well, john, i'm glad you brought that up. tom, there was a,

a media expert. apparently, i'm not going to user name a ukrainian woman that went on twitter and said she basically wanted the extermination of all russians from the destruction of russia. and it's still there . i mean, people, i mean they, they're promoting ethnic cleansing here. and i'm really glad that john went through the litany of things that he talked about here because we don't take these issues into account. you can't understand why this conflicts started and certainly not how it's going to end. because just to take one thing that john just said, i mean rush is never going to allow ethnic cleansing of, of russians, no matter where. ok, that's a starting point here. that is not an accepted point in the west. go ahead tom. no, i, i agree with all that, and i think there's also the, the roots of this conflict are also much deeper than that as well in terms of the big geopolitical game board as well. so you have to take into account the great power struggle that's happening here. we have a we have a failing western financial system which we know is failing and is being challenged

now by the global south led by russia, china and 2 of us rec center, ron. and that ended the big shift of energy east versus having followed. having fought west previously, i think that in a sense all of this is kind of, that's the real backdrop here. and the people whose lives are being snuffed out over this are in the, they're ultimately dest collateral damage. it's like, yeah, i don't see anything different from the western leaders that i saw from madeline albright about the us invasion of iraq. you know, 505-0000 data, rocky children will go, you know, little their sacrifice will been worth it or whatever. she said it was just, it's there's, these are psychopaths and, and they don't really see the human cost of this and they don't really care about the human cost of it. so there is no basis for negotiation from my,

from my perspective. well, you're jumping ahead of me because i essentially believe the same thing. you know, nick, you know, living in the u. s. and, you know, and i've been watching way before february 24th of last year. is that there is no conflict contextualization of what was going on at the time. and i watch american media right now and everything about ukraine without nothing about ukraine without ukraine, but they don't even really talk about the nature of the regime in kev whatsoever. okay. and the, the barrel and ethnic nationalism that is propagated by that regime which the united states is supporting with over a $100000000000.00. and who know it's kevin mccarthy might not be able to resist in another 100000000000 will come their way. not even the nature of the regime is portrayed correctly with a few exceptions like tucker carlson. go ahead. nick, you're absolutely right. the zalinski regime, the regime are propping up in ukraine, is an ultra nationalist regime infested with nazi elements. it is

a dictatorship, essentially, it has band opposition parties. it has consolidated the media and band, the free press into one national entity. it has band trade unions and collective bargaining. and so these are all supposedly values that the liberal west, the united states in europe celebrate. and yet there are holding this dictatorship . i think that you have to go back to the promised not to expand nato, one inch to the east to contextualize this conflict. and to answer your original question as well as to where, how this conflict well, and i think that one of the possibilities that you didn't raise that there is an increasing likelihood with each passing day. is nuclear war. good point. because the neocons in this country in the united states, they have so invested them yourself in a victory over russia. they've openly declared their intent to break russia up,

in fact, to balkanized that into multiple different countries. that that becomes more and more likely as gen salt and berg said, just a couple of months ago. he said that this is, this war is risking becoming a direct war between the united states and russia or world war. and in fact, the ukrainian foreign minister just admitted the events minister just admitted that in fact, they are fighting on behalf of nato. so the pretext has completely fallen off this war. it is a nato war against russia. it is a world war and you have a computer like spelt a birthday saying, but we're not part of the conflict. we're not a co belligerent. i mean the guys is a lunatic. absolute luna take care. john. i had my producers send out all 3 of you, an article from responsible, statecraft. and the reason why i did it, it was imbedded in the questions that i also sent out is that the u. s. is, has all these ideas about how to end the conflict? well, it's almost kind of inviting an arsonist to put out a fire. i mean, it,

it is really quite a, it's a, it's on the lunatic fringe. the country that is instigated it is the one that's going to determine it's outcome. what hubris is that go ahead job. so it's very clear that they can only be one man standing. this is a fight to the death. if either russia wins or nato slash while the u. s. slash nato wins. so let's have no allusion is going to be no peace talks. there's going to be no negotiations. there could be truth, temporary truth, that's possible, but then it will just heat up again, 6 months. and at the end of the day there has to be one victor at the us. yes. has made it very clear that they want destruction of russia. no officials come out and officially said that, but all the nato journalists, all the american journalists, think tanks and so called experts, they've all said that, which makes it clear that's the policy of the white house. so russia cannot,

obviously, is not going to accept this and think about it, a war being fought right on russian border. who has the group has the advantage simply logistically, geographically russia is a huge advantage. and by the way, i'm going to point, i'm going to say that i think ukrainian trout, i think it's tough for nato and nato might think it's true for russia. no, no, no. well, the traveler john, for me, i think it's a trap. they, what they did was they created a trap for russia. russia took into a went in to protect its ethnic russians. but the ultimate trap is the destruction of nato. and i'm looking forward to that tom, go before we go to the break, go ahead. yeah, i would say that this is the been my read on the situation as well, from the beginning as well. peter, i went back to the, at the beginning of the conflict. i thought that the, i asked the question, who's cauldron, is this anyway? you're out referencing russian encirclement military strategy is like and it and has very clearly it will talk about the roots of the conflicts been fighting a war of attrition, economic, political attrition against the west,

not just the states, but also europe for over 8 years now. and it's, and it's a multi front war, it's part of the strategy and syria. we could bring in the other, the burdening piece talks between syria and turkey as a nother front in this war. and we also can talk about the, for the fight in the financial sectors as well over, you know, of the price of oil and oil and gas and everything else. those are all part of this is, is not just a kinetic war between the nato back ukrainian armed forces and russian forces. this is a multi block of a better term. multi polar or multi theater war is financial, its size is simple magic. it's political and it. and it's going to continue until as i think, as the other said, i, which i agree with, which is confusion, had to be one clear victor. and at this point, we're not sure who that's going to be. why and nick on the 20th, on the day. no hint, depending on the, the cod dominion that the we for you october 22nd before anything nick,

we want to react to that before we go to the bank. 20 seconds. it's absolutely correct. then that's what i was saying and saying that the pre text has fallen off . this is a world war right now. it is clear that and, and, and russia correctly regards this as a world war as a nato war against against russia. all right, gentlemen, i'm going to jump in here. we're going to go to a hard break. and after that hard break will continue our discussion on war in pete, stay with ah, ah,

what is this week across a community? i don't know. i'm with the diesel superscript with them. yeah. kids get physically more visit with best. they can. i'm just a big toe shoe, so she may necessarily bandanna gushing. that coupon that this with

so this fun heel or the the the welcome back to cross stock where all things are considered. i'm peter a bell to remind you we're discussing war and peace. the news. okay, go back to john in new york. again, i read all of these think tank papers and, and all this is not a whole lot of thinking going on in these places. unfortunately, john, i mean,

the way i look at it, and i think it's already been said here on this program, is it? well, why would russia get involved in any negotiations with france, with germany, with the united states? i mean, what happened with the minister records? ok? they've all admitted that they were lying. they were deceitful. i mean, russia doesn't have an interlocutor, it's certainly not going to talk to the, the regime in care of. i mean, they pass laws what you can talk to the russians. and that was always, but by the behest of the united states. mean they, they talk of a cease fire and armistice. it's ridiculous because russia, i can, might the way my reading of it is they don't want to do this again in 5 years, 10 years, 15 years now, they want a resolution to it. and that resolution is respecting russia, security demands, which were not taken seriously in december of 2021 john in new york. yeah. but there's also a bigger context here. we know the whole world pretty much the whole world except

for those countries that are allied with the united states or under american domination. so most of the world, they're just sick and tired of american hedging money. they're sick and tired of american peerless. let's forget the, let's not forget the context 2020 years of war against the islamic world. invasions and massacres and genocide and horrible balmy. we can even go back, we can go back to serbia as well. so the world is sick of it because in a lot of the world, a silently cheering on russia supporting russia because they know that of russia goes over next. they can be american gunboats off their shores, or american plains or their skies at any moment. so many countries, especially in africa, middle east middle east of course. 2 southeast asia, they really support russia because they want to see a new world order. a world water that is based on mutual respect between countries where there is not a dominant headman was always invading and bombing, and threatening, inch, and destroying. people want to have a new world order in russia is leading it together, china with india,

and that this is a really golden opportunity in world history. we have a chance to build a new world order based on mutual respect based on the original principles of the united nations. i'm american and i'm really sad. i would make it clear, very sad to say all this. i'm really, really set up to say this. i grew up in the american government system, you know, my family has been serving a sam for 60 years. i disagree with it. well, and i don't, you know, john, i'm an american to ok. and i've seen with this foreign policy is done to working people middle class people. they're the ones that always have to pick up the pick up that that they have to shed their blood to ok. and in these mandarins, they go from one air condition to office to another, to start another war. and they never are held to account. ok, sorry for my little speech right there. tom is, has already been brought up here and i think it's really important here. rush is isolated, russia has no friends, it's just a reverse. the west is isolating itself, and i would even go further and i don't want to step on next toes here, but it's

a cultural thing too. it's anthropological. the woke ism, the ma, postmodernism, most of the world is not interested in any of that whatsoever. the west is isolating itself and the u. s. this destroying its most powerful tool, the dollar. go ahead. huh. yeah, i agree with all that and i and i share the sentiment of the other speaker about about having, you know, the criticisms i have in my government are deep and abiding and, and virulent. i just always want to remind everybody as well that like we, we learned that from some, some other people and they're there and they live in europe, especially. we learn to from the brits who have also been the of subjugating the arab world and the sub continent for a 150 years or a couple 100 years. and, you know, we're now just there with are just the tip of their sphere. they're inheritors of this so and it's it and the so the whole system yes, does need to be torn down. and the interesting part about this is that, and this is where i think everybody should kind of take

a step back and really start to look at what's i think actually happening in the under, in the undercurrents of the political drama that's playing out. which is everybody where the brain is going, we're, we're like, slouching towards world war 3 is really what we want. and what i'm spinning to see as the, the beginnings and the servings of a counter revolution at the top of the political us structure in the united states . i really do believe that i think that on a number of the new york banks, i've looked at the situation, the federal reserve has looked at the situation. so this is unsustainable. this is what we can do to bring the to bring the an effect, bring the empire home. i made the point the other day i was talking to somebody and twitter and somebody said, well, they're always been behind. all the friggin wars with the bankers behind were one and we're, we're to us it. yeah. but there's no blood to be gotten from the little class anymore. you you, the banks don't care where they land. dolan domestic to rebuild the us as we come home. again, look at turkey and look at the situation, syria and iraq,

very carefully, because the, the u. s. is going to have to come home and ignore many people, both of those places. and the sentiment here in the us is yes, let's get those people how well much they tried to sell us a more in ukraine. well, nick, this is a perfect segue for people like yourself that are looking for a 3rd way looking for an alternative because i, i tend to think you're probably more on the progressive side. i'm on the conservative side, but here we are both of us together here. there's a lot of commonalities right here, and this is what the powers that be don't want. they don't want people like you and i did talk because we might agree on a few things. go ahead, nick. that's right, peter. that's exactly right. because people understand after decades and decades of these endless wars, that these are as much a war, a deep state wall street see a military industrial complex war against the american people as it is a war against iraq, libya, syria, russia, ukraine. these wars are, our freedoms are being liquidated in the united states,

in the name of the wars our freedom of speech, we found out through the twitter fi, our revelations recently that the read that the pentagon and the f b i. c, a are involved in actually curtailing free speech. the 1st amendment were being master veiled in this country. the 4th amendment has essentially been nullified. so we're sacrificing our freedoms both parties that we have major parties that we have in this country. our war party, the democratic, and the republican party, the democrat party, is actually leading the charge or war. now, more than a 100000000000, authorized for ukraine in weapons and military aid by both parties. that's on top of the $858000000000.00 military budget that we have. and you're absolutely right. peter, people are finally rising up against these wars in the united states. in fact, as the people's party, we've come together with a party that we have many disagreements with the libertarian party and many others

. the peace in ukraine coalition world beyond war. many other organizations to actually host a rally and a march against these wars on february 19th at the lincoln memorial. it is rage against the war machine. thousands of people are going to come to washington d. c. and we are saying we have had enough with these wars that are costing our freedoms costing our tax dollars and killing people abroad in the name of this delusional objective of maintaining american hegemony in the 2000 and for century. what you know, john did the sad thing about it. i mean, i think a lot of my viewers long time ago realize that i was banned from you tube here. i've never seen such a camp propaganda campaign against alternative idea. i mean, saying, well, i don't really agree, there's a, because you, you know, russia, you live here. how do you see the characterization of this conflict and russia in

western media since you're in the belly of the beast? go ahead as, as you mentioned, as you know, i worked with the major media 15 years of foreign correspondents. so i still have many contacts and friends. there are no way i should say i had because because of this issue with ukraine, we have parted ways. i've had very heated conversations with them. i'm outright called them liars because they are liars. they are fabricating false narrative, the promoting false narrative, the pentagon narratives. right? do you remember there was a time when, if you were a journalist now you had to be wherever the pentagon said was bad and you will always automatically opposition to whatever, whatever the pentagon said and, and now today the opposite. you have to be, you, you curry favor with the pentagon, you immediately say yes, yes, yes. let's go with the pentagon narrative, i mean, journalists, american journalists, british as well. so this is really strange journalism. well, it's not journalism quite as she is pure, pure war propaganda. it's a real,

obviously very painful topic for me because i did work so many years in the major media and i have so many friends over this issue, but nothing's going to change. i don't see anything changing. my colleague who just spokes is more optimistic. i'm more pessimistic. i don't see that people are really rising up. i don't see any changes in the mass media, but for some people to rise up, there's going to have to be a revolution inside the mass media because of the mass media such enormous power over how americans see the world. because they don't have time to do research or that what's really happening ukraine, they just repeat the talking points out in the c, cnn new york times. so it has really want to change something. it's got to start by changing something inside the american media. yeah, well i mean one thing you can do is what i do a lot is i turned it off. i mean i'm just, i don't want to participate not participating in. ok. i think chomsky said something like that. tom, how does is, where do we go from here? because i don't see any reason in the world why russia is going to refrain from what it's doing. it's going to,

it doesn't care what the german chancellor says. sergeant shoulds or whoever's the for minister in pet? no, they don't care about these things. i mean, jake sullivan, you care what he has to say. i don't. ok. and that unfortunately, i do well what my point is, a lot of more and more people around the world, what's called the global south. i called the global majority because that's what it is. the global majority, they're taking the west less and less areas. they're not as afraid of the west as they used to, and they certainly don't respect that anymore. what last minute, go to you, tom. go ahead. sure. i would say that the following. peter, which is that? yes, we are the, i think the part of this, this exercise is to dealer jeremiah the united states a certain level, this of, of kind of fundamental weird thing that's happening here, where it's almost like where the is that the u. s. is being pushed into the role of being the evil bad guy that is create that this creating the conflicts

around the world and trying to get a self involved in a couple of world wars that it clearly cannot fight from a logistical perspective. and this is where we look at what we'll get to the war material production numbers and what not there. there's no way that the united states could fight those a multi front war against russian china. so that's, that's a non starter. she got to say, well that's the case and then then why are they doing this? yeah, well i think what we're going to do is what we're having all, i think all of us would agree in our audience to there is a reckoning in front of us right now. and i started out by saying, you know, happy new year to all you guys and, and i'm, i was convinced that this will be a better year. i'm not, unfortunately, it's going to be another turbulent year. that's all the time we have, gentlemen. i want to thank my guests in washington, new york, and in north florida. and i want to thank our viewers for watching us here at r t c. and next time, remember across sectors ah

ah, and it will be, i'm so glad i shall graphic it. what is the best time you want to like the idea about them? this is a little bit of a lady with what i see school of a car. what report backwards are something something that might scheme importantly cut order, the status of a national krinski part of the stairwell, which it is said to jeff. so, i mean, i mean you're the one that you that you can be comma. listen, go and be a communist. somebody mp community that they've got a really lovely knob is all like it's supposed to start out. like you sort of affected door only out of that too. i did meet it with us. that's a disclaimer, but i was thinking it wouldn't the spoken to me. you're right. nobody for what your

thoughts is looking at them during the summer because i see a reason why we should show capital much but we're can i lot, chris was it was the case, but those are the new big us over for you that they sure i see that i think it's an open up and that were still a win win of over love. and i think it's enough of a wrong one. i just don't know if he has to figure out his name becomes the advocate and engagement. it was the trail. when so many find themselves worlds apart, we used to look for common ground. ah,

with business and you with that was chosen. yeah. americans great you. when you wrote, you got to really just such an article and i was hearing it for you was just such a short in was names of the different student info with you to throw in the word them in the pony and you're still with us. we are both in the study she was on the porch of to watch. so it was a community off or thought it which, which no longer it was just in the new social, not political push to just a moment because or leaders new or your boss, or do school. of course, i don't know who stevie i know for the don't know is that just to begin

with who used to play in finances come on both with going to say use lou to you is now completely following the american dictates. europe has lost its independence to serve american interest in the geopolitical containment of russia and china rockers far better to get a lot of you, if a solo, a us and is conducting a proxy war against russia in ukraine, with beijing blame is washington for stealing oil from syria saying 60 tankers, full of serious talk resources have been looted by us soldiers just this month. and a recent survey shows that people in india.