hey, the international relations institute as my specialization is international relations, again to weekly. i've been involved with this region for now many decades and i have been working and my research is focusing mainly on the street region. so i have some sort of understanding and clarity of the present situation and why it is today like this and why it appears, whatever it is today. because this is as the old or does it not a one day or 2 day conflict. this has been going on for many years and as i mentioned that i have lived there, i don't this 2 countries. people are very much of connected with each other, their culture to see they're very similar to each other. and do you have relatives as well as it, within their family, either father or mother or grandfather and grandmother, somebody is that belongs to either from russia or from you,

but it doesn't get accounted can. i say stop here for a 2nd because this is a very important point for both you and many other experts described russia, ukraine as not the same. but similar, you know, there are certain sort of cultural and ethnic substance that we have in common. and yet when we talk to the ukrainians, especially the, you know, political leadership of your cream, they presented as there are, there could be no more different countries and no more different people than the russians and the ukrainians. and in fact, part of that political paradigm is to present ukraine as the very antidote of russia, and that was only political thing. ok, that's their choice. but they, as you know, i'm sure, very well, even before the outbreak of this culture, there was a widespread discrimination or suppression of russian language of russian culture of russian way of being. even i think that the down is not that much different from

the ukrainian. how do you explain all that? resentment is, is it just like the natural pains of separation, or do you think that's? that's deliberate. you know, in the ukraine they had done some sort of a feeling that they did not get there right share during the soviet times and their language, the literature did not get that much opportunity as, as the russian language. so that was one of the reasons another reason they were very keen to be part of the you would lead to community and then felt that they are more of a european then or towards the russia. so that is another reason. so we have seen this ethnic problems and the problem so specifically face to by those people who are living in the eastern part of russia. we're mainly russian speaking and russian origin. people as well. we have seen in some parts of central and southern part

what best buy was a little different. and this united nation and the language a popularity popularizing the language that we can very, very common and very, very, very prominent. then older publications, a newspaper started coming out in a new plane in that language. the schools who was medium was actually earlier russian language. this stuff stop that. and they started teaching only in the plain language and also, and all of us monday was coming to engage people to write and come out to it more euclidean propaganda and ukrainian nation. and i must tell you that external powers also had a lot of hand in igniting this kind of feelings. because this clearly divided the internal domestic probably ition. and we know that

there were a lot of photos and yields at that time. where in the, initially it was based in a p and other parts of you played and the dealer funding to encourage this kind of i to do that movement which was definitely painful to see. but yes, that's kind of the nice ation started from the very beginning and they wanted to very deliberately will always though they knew that the rush is very important for them. but still, they did this kind of being followed this, the move you mentioned this sort of grievance. the perception that the ukrainian language or ukraine as a republic didn't get announced my attention are enough respectful, the soviet floor it is. and as somebody who actually study in soviet national policy, national and asked me both is i can attest to the fact that if i'm not mistaken, but i think i'm pretty close to the truth. ukraine was the largest recipient of all

of your funding and absolute terms and the same goals for you know, the support and the language to support them. the culture infrastructure. what have you in georgia, by the way, i think was the largest the recipient in per capita terms. and again, those 2 republics have developed this very strong resentment. despite we have a much more than ethnic russians or many other people that may dog the former soviet union. it's fascinating to me, but one question i wanted to ask you is, why do you think the georgia war of 2008 was so much different from the ukrainian calls like that is still ongoing because back down menu of the sort of dynamics preceding the war were similar in western funding, you know, national governments, et cetera. but russia didn't go all the way to, to occupy any of the territories of georgia and it stopped short, all absorbing,

breakaway republics into itself. why do you think the russian rationale has changed this time? around well, when you are comparing the euclidean war with georgia, that is, that debate has been going on for since the initial work started. so then i lot of similarities that we can see like in, in the ukraine on. so does that evolution feeling starting from the orange revolution funded by western nations in georgia? also, we have seen the rules of illusion, which was heavily funded by the western nations. they also had on weston affiliated leaders and also because it really was the same way in georgia. so there were a lot of similarities in the also georgia also wanted to be part of the data. and you can also a want to be part of europe in your crime literature. political leadership wants to be part of maybe it's not so clear whether it's the case when you look at the pause . yes, yes. well, i was writing this book and sitting in your grade,

and during that time i interviewed in a different age group people, i mean people are millennial, so then people in the, in the middle it as well as old age people. so i found that younger generation, they were very, very much enthusiastic to get affiliated with the european union because they get a part that will open the gateway and they will become more western and they can gets a lot of facilities, whether the middle aged people, they understood that the n affiliation with russia, they're linkage with russia is very important to sustain the stability in the country and maintain, and whatever the relationship they have. and i want to be very much in favorable to maintain the relation with russia. but what is the difference here when i, 1st and foremost, i would like to mention that actual war which started it around 2008. that time it was totally different to russia today or russian leader has got

a much more understanding about how to tackle this, this type of issues. and they understand that what is the, what is the best option here and, and that was definitely of relocating from with the site. i'm backbone to dive in georgia and i see a war was going on that day that she was also facing a problem with its own people. i can say there was judges about feeling. also, the neighboring felt caucasians like as of a general mania, was having problem. then south asia, a was trying to merge with federation and, and they were having the field also spill back to the notice asia. so those kind of things went also on there. and so that is why a doctor war lasted for a very long period. and at the same time, i would also say that this one is more of an information war. like here we see a lot of this information or social media lot of in done it,

is giving and spreading out the information, which is also confusing much more to the general population creating more complex situation. and here also another problem i would like to mention that international community is much more involved in a different way, which was not there at the time of the georgia war. now doctrine, even if i can seize upon your statement that the russia between 20082022 has changed dramatically, including the thinking of the russian leadership. and i think one of the most popular explanations in the west war, they turn around in the russian position is put into personal grandeur that he became older, is that he became perhaps more delusional. started imagining himself as this new russian emperor said on conquering, if not the world done, at least, you know, the space of the former soviet union. do you by that explanation?

well, definitely not to, i mean, it is a russian leader is totally differently than what it was earlier. and at last has got some kind of a love. i'm in more forming their own perception that even, and he'll like they are putting the president zelinski as a hero and bringing him in every evans fear of her life. but they are giving him the opportunity to share his views, not only in forums and summits, but also in the universities to the younger people. i was making a president or put in as a villain, but that is definitely not the case. and of you know, that he understands what is good for their nation, which is good for its people. and if you see russian military doctrine, of course, you know very well that in the, by russian military doctor,

in the her mention that if there is any kind of a threat to the russian speaking population or russian citizens living in the former soviet states then and i sure can go to the extent of using force to predict that the national event have been doing this, similar to what it was mentioned in the agreements. and you know, that means flew and been sco. one means today, well, there is agreements but also not valid. so just of having a blend in order or just a demonizing, somebody does not really a song, but they show which is actually a different. and this kind of provocation will definitely not make much sense of it . or what makes sense right now is taking a very short break, but maybe we'll be back to this fascinating discussion in just a few moments that you end ah,

at this hour, american and coalition forces are in the early stages of military operations to disarm iraq, to free its people and to defend the world from great with we will bring to the iraqi people, food, and medicines, and supplies, and sleep with ah

ah, awe every spring and summer, the melting optic snow reveals abandoned machinery, millions of rusty barrels and the detritus left by human expansion into this most inaccessible of territories. yep. and you have to move. so take a look at the post to begin as an issue. all intents from clean

optic travel to ice island home to the biggest polar station on the french, joseph land archipelago. via the asking you, but i was and i was or more yeah to the should. so it means it's evelyn yahoo aimlessly. nasa manuel. i'm but somebody with a some stay on the oil stuff. looks like you feel like you are a marriage from a serial number 0 membership, one year of catherine dom cyril know, boys the middle of these chico me at that of the optic pioneers. main objective was to explore and conquer these harsh lands. they had no time to think about waste management now and legacy could remain for centuries. my choice of thought with some of this going to plenty of scope with deal to fish. ah,

i welcome back to world department induct condo senior researcher at york university and author of several books on relations within india and countries of the former soviet union. dr. ethan before the break, we were talking about this extreme personalization or set of money key. i'm thinking of dividing the world into the forces of good in the forces of evil and one other feature or western analysis that is so very surprising and striking to me is that a pretension that structural reasons don't exist. i mean, when you listen to western policymakers, they go to extreme lengths to, with everything on the russia pretending as if native, for example, and russia, security concerns over nature don't exist. they also for some reason for many here

is turn blind eyes not only to ethnic discrimination, but they only support a non just national is but only a fallback. 4th is in not only in the grain, but also in many other countries of the former soviet union. for example, the baltic states wouldn't be an exaggeration on my part to suggest that when it comes to russia, everything goes that the one that was doesn't feel bound by its own supposed that norms. well, you are very correct in saying so because so list feels that whatever they are doing and whatever they want to do that has been going on for quite some time. so that has become kind of a practice. and i know that what they do that is correct. and what are those are thinking and doing at this point that that thing is definitely not correct. so you have probably noticed that this is

a very much of this shorter that how india deferred from the west in taking a number of decisions related to ukraine, russia relations. because so with a media western propaganda as well such that one of the ways to thinking that is, that is correct and that should be agreed of. it is definitely not today's wireless change. today's a globalized world. people has got different thought process and a when they talk about the human rights violation. so are they looking into the human rights violation in their own nations? and what are they doing for that? are they really actively was working for that and protecting the people? i know we don't see that always. so when did he say others and when the dog about to other nations and other people? because what my understanding is, every country understands the national interest,

if they're thinking their national interest and their concern about their security issues. that you saw that how are the balloon issue, the one that was concerned about the security concern and that's what it was a shot back so. so definitely, every country is concerned about this for me is to be here for to, for just for a 2nd to further discussion. i think my perception of covering geopolitics for many years is that it's not only that need to understand that on a national interest, but they usually understand the national interest of their partners on that, poland. and they try genuinely, try to find some midway. that is considered to be the basis of balance, the basis of peace. why do you think the west has very little respect for this structure of international politics that it's not only them who kind of interest, you know, other countries in the world, by nature, by their very nature have something some security concerns,

some national imperative that they have to protect, regardless of whether they're west, approve of it or not. absolutely. you're absolutely great because that is what has been happening and that probably they have the idea that it will go on like that. but when it deferred, then they have a problem and then they try to push it in a different way. at this point of time, i would definitely say that all the international community, global global community should come together instead of sending heavy arms and are deliveries and then so they should sit together and think through that how the 2 nations can come to the table and the door does a bilateral relations that through bilateral exchanges and talks, they have to decide but, but the international community has to come together instead of igniting that. they should understand that how peace should be prevailed and how the, you know,

some people off for these countries who are suffering this them suffering can be reduced. and i must say that this one has not only affected this 2 nations this war has affected the whole world. and one has to really understand that how a situation is worsening because we just came out of the pandemic and this war started. and we are now that the problems are continually the inflation. that is you so much of a problem energy, the concerns of supply chain management concerns everything. so everything is linked to it. so one has something that instead of supplying the munition, they should sit and think how the police can pretty well. so them some example, since you mentioned piece, let's try to see how it could be sort of realized because in job holes exact as i'm sure you know,

a piece is not an abstract concept. it's actually a very practical calculation. when all the protagonist or antagonists decide that you know that interest and better serve by stopping facilities rather than continuing them. and when it comes to russia, ukraine, they're bleeding profusely, both of this country. but what about the west? do you think the west has had or has sustained enough losses in this proxy war to actually be an advocate and genuine advocate and will wish for peace as i just to mention this a war? of course, it's extremely painful to see that how profusely the donations people are suffering and reading and how the younger generation id lot with the younger generation, i see that they don't even see how their future is going to be. and if you see today's so you create even if today the piece of prevails and the situation normalizes. and then also i 20 go many your student going back to the room

a normal situation. so they have to think of all these. and today, when we talk about the piece that is not really essential for this particular region, also it is very important for the whole one, se, europe's you see how europe is suffering. they are breaking with data, having so many problems within their own nations. they're having problems with in europe in union, they're having problems with but inclinations and dad are not in consensus with them or decisions because their own people are suffering their something we have seen that how defense minister of germany resigned. because as you go, no nobody on a whatever was demanding by the natal, the common people are suffering the political lead does that they do a lot of think thinking of their own benefit a lot of time and they don't see how the nation really will benefit and how the

common people who is a benefit or what sufferings are happening even in the, in atlantic. so you see that how inflation has grown, how the energy prices have gone up, and everything is not really in normal ship today. so that is why the important a grandmother is very important, although i think those people who are making decisions or perhaps not the filling the pension just as intensely as their words in their folks. that's why they can we go on out with pretending that ukraine and the supply of weapons is going to solve the problem. speaking of which you are joining us from canada, which is not only has a very large western ukrainian diaspora but also what i would call a diable, diabolically and to russian government. because canada, deputy prime minister, krisha freeland, who is also western ukrainian de, sad last year that there was democracies, can be safe only once,

the russian tyrant and his armies are entirely bank wish. now the words vanquished . this is a very interesting choice of words in the russian context, because russia has one of the largest military into world. how do you interpret that thing and how do you see a country like canada vanquishing russia? a civilian unfortunate that this type of woods have been used to one of the important leader of the country. but to yes and there is a huge, a euclidean dias, a living in different parts of canada. and they are, of course, are, they are contributing a lot for the canadian economy. but as in see green, russia was started, we have seen this year and, and pro ukraine propaganda pro euclid agenda and are being more popular. and of course, we have seen that of course,

that you train in flags almost in every building in every car. and also a russian had faced a number of times this kind of for discrimination that, that was definitely not there earlier, but they started facing. so here that is also very important to say though they are contributing. but one has to understand that what is the best option for them and how the country like canada should treat both the communities. so that is one thing i must say, but another way, of course, you know that the political leadership day, i tried to use the term for the wants of a favorable for them for bank. so and canada is going for the election in 191 and a half years time within the canada. also, the facing lot of problems will spend damage repair related to panoramic issues. their problem related to health care issues,

they're facing problems are related to indigenous population and they're trying to bring them in the mainstream and they have a lot of issues earlier, which they're trying to resolve it. so it's a lot of time political leaders they use for such a downs to divert the attention of the domestic population from the domestic problems to the other problems. but i mean, extremely cynical because it's one thing to support the ukrainian people and put out the ukraine. lack of another thing to indoors. the idea that you should fight with russia a country that holds a very nuclear capabilities until the very end. i mean, aren't ukrainians the ukrainians in ukraine, the ones who will be paying for this political ambitions of the supposed ukrainian supporters and canada? yes, i mean if it, if somebody is not understanding the russian military bower and beverly do that is, or,

i mean that is really unfortunate because the whole lot sort of she and mil do bowers and give it is of course, if you will say india, india has been a bigger one of the best partners, the offer russia for last 60 to 65 years. and their defense corporation is going very strong. a deal did earlier, it was almost 70 percent of the defense equipment, which is to come from russia. and even today we see almost 50 percent of the russian equipments are being used by india. so i mean that our share is definitely a military power. and we have also seen in this recent war that how or russia manager in the world run and, and, and there's no doubt on back if somebody is speaking on that, then we should not take them very seriously. they have some other intentions probably to focus on. well doctor, it unfortunately we have to live there. thank you very much for being with us today . thank you. thank you. and thank you for watching hope to hear again on, well,

the part ah mm ah, today and this is new and never done before. we trigger the general cape club. that means national government can pump into the economy as much as a demo for natalie. rented to be in about a month to get it to us on to the movies there. my son he died. did the mean

outdoor messy. the sick get sick with diarrhea. i'm on the, the fragile do the, this is a for me, i need to turn this this and he said, i got me for the reset your phone. go out shamefully from lam. i'm not really sure, but i'll likely to give you a few minutes to resume this will be to all i want. you're probably my chima. it blocked the model, received by not recovery. went up with the door last last, you know, what we've got to do is identify the threats that we have. it's crazy confrontation, let it be an arms race is on, often very dramatic development. only personally and getting to resist. i don't see how that strategy will be successful, very difficult time to sit down and talk

with the head of russia. it's not going to groups that is fine because they've taken they don't. yes, we're public village of class and i got a key foot whole also moment, also known as moose, which the ukrainians have been basically defending them up over $30000.00 confirms dead also catastrophic earthquake pit on syria poll continues to rise of both countries that struggle to coach to support the bombshell report find a award winning american journalist, the letter u. s. involvement, the sabotaging of news stream gas pipe.