the french light, in the case of c, b c's, that we're discussing. now, those nodes are, those computer systems are centralized. are you, they belong to the, in this case of the central bank of russia. so they can make sure that there's no nefarious activity happening when those transactions approach to understood. i think a lot of the, the current c, maxima lists may not like where this is going. however, you know, this is a technology that is developing and evolving all the time. we want more and more. we want adoption. we know people are that, you know, unfortunately i think in order for more people to use things you are going to be the support of government and government are going to need to have more oversight as to how these transactions, the difference. bring me going with my debit card and paying for things, but with a digital river, what is the plan difference? yes, so really absolutely nothing to you is to use the union. but the fundamental difference, if you are not going to have these, these cumbersome payment networks involved. so for the w debit card, if we're, if we're talking to all of us in the west, they'll be using mastercard and visa, mastercard and visa. but we taking

a chunk of the fee in order to process that transaction this way, that transaction happens directly from russia, central bank to the merchant, or the shop, or wherever you're buying your, your kids. so that middle man is essentially cut out. understood, okay. in terms then of benefits, will people be able to use these digital roubles when a network connection is all available? you know, that could be issues like that, right? yes. so, so reading the, the white paper from the russia center, but they're saying yes, you can now how they actually do that. we'll have to see when they, they come up with more color. but i imagine it would be the same way if you've ever been on an airplane and you paid something on your cars, that transaction isn't actually process because you're in the ad, there's no internet connection to actually process that. so what happens is when the plane lands that transaction is then processed by machines, it will probably be a similar mechanism. chris, other countries, are they planning similar, is russia to the oven guard of this? are they climbing in the box or somebody else, piggybacking? well, the rush is pretty far ahead. the fact that they've said they're implementing how the china was the 1st neva, the back in april 2021,

which is around the same time. russia saying, april 2023. april 2021. china conducted what they called beth public pilots. and now in china, the digital women b is used quite widely across china. so it's not the 1st, but it's definitely a bridesmaid. and also the bank of japan announced today that they're also going to launch the digital chinese one at the same time, the roster bits. so i think we're probably going to see a whole vast array of countries not moving in this direction. but if you'd like to delve deeper into any of those stories, may i recommend r t dot com as a solid jumping off point, all was fresh content, lively discussions to be fine there. good bye. ah, with

ah ah ah hello and welcome to cross stack were all things are considered. i'm peter lavelle

. the west presentation of the ukraine conflict is always been muddled and confusing. remember the phrase, as long as it takes that is not a strategic goal now or presented with as long as it takes pertains to the amount of conflict. it doesn't pertain to the amount of assistance. do you understand what that means? ah, cross talking, changing narratives. i'm joined by my guess, karen krakowski and mount jackson. she's retired united states air force and can colonel, having served both an essay and the office of secretary events in washington. we have andre mm. on the, on up he is a writer as well as a military and political analysts. and at berlin we have the cavort. i'll mass young. he is founder of seriana analysis or a cross sac rules and the fact that means you can jump any time you want. and i always appreciate, i'm a, let me go to you. i me, i already mentioned it in the introduction. so tell me, i mean, i know english isn't your 1st language here,

but maybe you have special powers that i don't, as long as it takes pertains the to complete. that doesn't pertain to the amount of assistance. does that, does that make any sense to you? it's a native speaker of english. it doesn't make any sense to me at all. go ahead. andre . yeah, it doesn't make any sense. and any point of view from strategic, operational or logistical for that matter. so it's basically a political statement designed for the internal construction assumption in later in, in the united states. and it has no descript followers whatsoever. and we'll all, harley, it goes with the powers that be especially when you look at the lakers. there's not also makes sense. what's going on, karen? it's got to you amount. jackson, it's very interesting to me we, we went from as long as it takes nothing about ukraine without ukraine, ukraine. it becomes completely dependent economically and militarily on the united

states. but ukraine has to decide its own terms and conditions and sit down with negotiations. i mean, you can go at this at any kind of trajectory you want, and it all is very, very confusing. now the reality in the ground is made it that way, but their, their policy adjustments don't keep up with reality, but it's the problem and the public is picking up on it as well. karen? yes, certainly. i think i can manage information it around the world available about what's really happening in ukraine and also why, why these things are happening. it's getting out there and they can't even keep it away from the limited interest in limited li, interested americans who aren't really that interested except that we have a terrible budget deficit. and americans are suffering economically and they see this money flowing into ukraine. so they're starting to ask and that information now is widely available to people that are interested. they had a very difficult time controlling the narrative. here it said controlling the

narrative kevorkian. let me go to you in berlin. i mean i, we had the revelation from seymour hersh about the destruction of the north stream pipelines. what has been the reaction of the german political elite in the media? because apparently i didn't know this. sy, hersh is this crazy old man. that's all he is. i thought he was one of the greatest living journalists of our time. what's the german response? the german official respond is that seymour hersh is a blogger, is not a journalist, is, is not an investigative journalist, isn't blogger, sitting behind his laptop and just try think some illusion. well, i'm with joseph morale, just the blogger, as well. i mean, we have old logos in david in the eyes and anything outside of the ocean at the hit in germany is abashed, is a smeared, and he has been downgraded, and the media has a very strong influence over to public opinion in germany. and they're able to

project is hija mani intellectual. that jim went over to people, right? the only, in my opinion, 2 political parties in germany that spoke about the seymour hersh article is the left wing party, the linker, and the if the other, i think parties arrest the for other political parties. and especially the triple tickled parties who formed the coalition. david, the coast, the article of seymour hersh because there is a war of narratives, right? this is also information work edge. so at the beginning, few for a few weeks, 2 months, 3 months, probably one year. they can manipulate the people. but after one year it's very difficult for the really information not to be surfaced and for the people to be educated about the and now you can see even germans, they're speaking very quietly with each other because they are afraid to speak publicly and loud in their surroundings about these cases and whether or not germany should continuing its policy towards ukraine and to be embedded with the united states in disregard. so at the beginning, in my opinion,

the vast majority of organ supportive up your brain, but the support is now diminishing because the people can carry also the burden economically on their shoulder. right? exactly. and what against the, their own self interest here, you know, and the biggest problem and all of this. and you and i have talked about this before, is the framing of this is good versus evil. when you have that kind of framing and can make you feel good, particularly if it doesn't impact you ok. just virtue signaling, but it is covered just told us here. now the impact is being felt. you know, the virtual signaling kind of fades away here. and when you do it, when you frame it is good versus evil, context doesn't matter. and geopolitical reality is no matter. and that's why this narrative is fumbling. it's been, it's been fumbling from the very, from the get go, go ahead. andre. are in the last a week or 2. we have a dramatic change in the wood, in narrative, across the mainstream media into united states. for example. as you can also know,

is there a dis off for training, for, as for example. and if there was a dramatic change, and i would have wall street journal new york, i'm sure meeting that yeah. garage. and despite the fact losing of 1000000 groups, are they still out on offensive? begin the ground, the digging their down, sam villages. and it was like, switch was believed and it has a very rational explanation to it. yeah. and you can all lie only for so long before they're out and begins to sac in, especially in the was on the world when there is still, there are still many alternative sources of information and people who have their own a very good demand. very interesting job. politics and i'm going to be begin to, well, you know, are all these are, those are blogger, school count, walk life cycle, and then they begin boss,

portions let alone about professional school can point out immediately. his scare more though desperation really at fault in the way and the i spoke about it. yes, there again, their article you have to take a look at their latest e. sure. all the so called our intellectual magazine such as the foreign affairs, which is their rag old, their neil, we've got on here and you get a bull article bar article there. you assume you're out there, how desperate they are and what not on shondae that the point is here, you're out. you're absolutely right. yeah. let me go to karen right now. i mean from the get go, this has been an elite project. ok. that's what it's all about. and i'm glad that on that i brought up foreign affairs. this has nothing to do with ukraine. it's about american hegemony. it's about taking russia out 1st to focus their attention on china. that's always what it's always been. and oh, by the way,

make sure germany and russia don't have any kind of economic relationship, because that's what major germany prospers and it would make germany think twice about how it feels about ukraine and the united states. you. this is only an elite project that has been from that way since to start karen, go ahead. that's absolutely true. and if you can see it that way, we can understand more about about how things have unfolded. but you know, it occurs to me that dumb is a lensky, a former comedian, and he's been very public with all of his, you know, he is ukraine for 2 americans who know nothing about ukraine. zelinski is all that we know. and increasingly, he is becoming more of a comedian and i think americans are not really warming to him as much as he might think. and certainly not as much as congress is. i know the democratic congress in particular, you know, he received a, you know, he addressed the congress, you know, let not too long ago, and they were standing ovation. i am in a cranium flag. have you ever seen a foreign flag on the?

well, the congress keep going to know that. yeah, i mean it's, it's crazy, but i think the americans who see this and of course, you know, we're, we're a very short attention span american slip channels. we stream our news or whatever . we don't even watch news, but when we see zalinski, he is not someone who inspires americans. i have no idea. he inspires ukrainians, but he does not inspire americans in the things that he gets publicity for here often is that his lack of a respect his, you know, he, he dresses is if you would have read, why can't he's a panhandler, that's what he is. give me any family. he's an ungrateful panhandle and i've noticed guide a suggestion of that. he's a trend user. he may not be, but he certainly appears. can we not mark. okay. okay, karen? i don't want to get in that. i don't want to go down that path. let me just say to you, in our audience, there was

a lot of lot known about zelinski in ukraine and in russia before he got the headline. so i'll leave it at that. okay. okay. cuz i can let me go to you. i would like to jump in. i don't have champion, please do go ahead de style of addressing from the ukrainian side to the wish. and we're just very disrespected, for example, zalinski demands ukraine, demands the former ambassador of ukraine in gym, and he was a worshipper bandito and he was a yeah, polishing bonded i in the, in the gym and media, she the mans, the gym and side was sent submarines now, for your client, he demands gemini to sent f 16 to ukraine. they're not even addressing their of so called allies in a respectful way. therefore, i think even among the popular base here in germany, the people are questioning whether they should really the delivery of this type of weapon said to ukraine. and especially that the information is sir facing. now choose a social media platforms that show clearly the neo nazi seen in ukraine,

right? so imagine there are photographers for the f, b for directors, and the rest. they are really suffering to publish a photo where debbie is no spastic or davies, and you're not see a logos into what those they are doing. really, they have a lot of work in their hands to hide this photos. and despite that, today, the 8th be posted a v as posted a video in which we can see one of the screenshots, one of the officers, he's wearing an ice, his flag on his a shoulder. it's crazy, i got a guy, i pull my what little hair i have out when i tried to explain this to people. they did say it's propaganda. it's not true. that's what we're facing here. folks. i'm going to jump in here. we're going to go to walk short break, and after that short break, we'll continue our discussion on changing narrative state with our team. ah, ah,

pohden is the aggressor today, i'm authorizing the additional strong sanctions. today russia is the country with the most sanctions imposed against it. and um, but as constantly growing, i figure which of the problem was to call sure, as we speak on the bill in your senior, mostly mine them or wish you were banding all imports of russian oil and gas fuji. i mean, i know they said key with the literature when you have regarding joe, by imposing these sanctions on russia has destroyed the american economy. you. so there's your boomerang self with

welcome back. across stock. were all things are considered on peter bell to remind you we're discussing changing narratives with okay, let's go back to andre in washington state. i'm sorry i, you probably know as well as you probably feel the same way i do in watching what's been going on in ukraine, not since the beginning of last year, but all the way back to 2014. and you know what i'm getting out here, what i find really frustrating is the lack of context. there's so little context. if i say to, when i'm question, you know, where you, peter, why are you so passionate about this? i always say, because this was inevitable, considering the, the west ignored the antecedents of how we got here the minsk accords. this whole problem that the whole,

the entire push to put ukraine into nato and all of it. and you say you show them well, this is what ca, director william burns, had to say. i can, i can go on for hours and hours and they just their eyes to glass over because they have never given the context of this. the remember, unprovoked, unprovoked, unprovoked. this was the most provoked war in modern history. andre. yeah, decker decks. the zation of the whole affair is the main math of the actual propaganda and shape in narrative. and when you're on the stand off, they don't think they are good at, and i will say the necessary they're good at it either about the only thing they can do actually in any practical terms is that the are, are sending off. and then there are to, basically when you look at the american, the western politics. it is primarily it's a narrative. i'm wondering. it is a little brock to go thanks which applicable to situation. and what do you want to

issue or supplying your brain with arms and money? you're going to see yourself, how foolish you know this all people themselves who, who are the american longest and decision makers, especially within the beltway, they have no clue what they are dealing with. they have no clue what they have the week because they don't have i go down to south, i'm go, i don't know, oregon physical and intellectual how to learn how to program to handle information and then what, what comes down to them. they have the block again, they don't have one, b, c, d o m, and don't think they know is, know how to count the letter to you all and guns and purposes. when you look at this, you will american generals who domain name, mainstream media

b at general key and general contract there, whatever those think things on people who are view senior, yours, they're there unless you don't understand what one or more for you. well, andre, and considering the generals, you just mentioned what, what can what success can they personally point to? they can't. yeah. karen, karen? i mean, i wouldn't, i thought was really painful me for me. i mean, i've, i'm blacklisted. i can't go to ukraine for obvious reasons. but i before i, before 2014 and a little bit after i went there many times. okay. and what really pisses painful for me is that i've mentioned this before on this program, is it? the more the west helps ukraine, the smaller it gets geographically and it's population not to speak of g d p. and these other things here. i mean, it's a failed state and who wants it failed state. you have all this arms flowing in there. no one really knows what to go except for the people that are commandeering

it. they know where it's going here. i mean, you've, you worked in the military and i'm not asking you to speak for the military. but i mean, that the level of cynicism here it's, it's grotesque. karen, and i think actually within even the military today, not the spokespeople and not the retired generals like betray us, but in the military to day, i think they're extremely aware of the stupidity and insanity of, of the u. s. policy here. and the reason i say that is, we know this is about russians is about us versus russia to contain control, destroy russia, in some way. we can russia, we have the, we have the rand documents to show that that's the objective. but the military understands. well, the u. s. military today knows, well that they can't take on russia. we, a nato understands the nato officers understand they cannot take on russia. so this, this is kind of a fantasy that they're all kind of the, you know, the emperor has no clothes and everyone is nodding oh buddy, so beautifully,

so powerful, you know, but i think they understand the reality. but the problem for me is the concern that i haven't, i think people should have is that because this is an emotional, ideological kind of conflict on the american side and among nato and great britain and even ukraine. that winning a war may not be well winning a worse winning the war on their site. that's not possible, but damaging russia causing the amount of chaos that we don't even want to talk about. obviously, chemical nuclear major destruction of human beings of human life. that is still possible for us, nato and ukraine. less so ukraine, probably the u. s. in nato, to, to conduct an operation like that to cause gross damage and then say, well, we're done, we're done. we, we've heard, and this is, this is a desperate move, like you said. the desperation that we see in the western media mouthpiece is

foreign. foreign affairs, for example, supposed to be the intellectual gaia on the very desperate and desperation in a dying empire. and we, the united states are that dying empire. that's not a good thing. it's dangerous. and so, you know, kind of to keep our fingers crossed a little bit. yeah. makes sent everything that the problem with the, the part of the problem is here is it in, i've talked about this here for almost a solid year. every single program is on this topic. there's no learning curve here, and that's what we're all terrified of. ok. b, and because it's being become so emotional, clark and, and, and berlin, i want to ask you a very simple question and i'm not saying you represent the german people. but what is germany getting out of this? ok, i mean you're industrial, as your industrial base is being severely damaged. okay. the, the wonderful success of postwar germany was it's prosperity. ok. that is being challenged right now. and it's, and all the talk about ukrainian sovereignty. what is the u. s. done to german

sovereignty, go head in berlin. peter, the biggest loser of this war will be ukraine and the 2nd biggest loser of this, or will be germany and germany will be she severely but in the economy or in an economic sector. and i think when i make means, we all know that the nato's goal in germany sued the industrialized country. we all know that the goal is to cut the economic integration between the russian at the german side. because a good relations between germany and russia means that is stronger asia and this people of the vision they will never needs nato again. so the goal is to weaken germany, to make it dependent on the united states. security was an economic wise, and unfortunately they are politicians here in germany and they, they follow the american, the, it's, i the update the gym as it didn't want to send the yoghurt. thanks. but you know, how much pressure there was on the gym and a government on olaf shows him, said, i'm not saying i'm not giving him a like a justification. but there was

a huge pressure from the media from the political scene and from the elliots here in germany, arnold of shows to send the sierra thanks. and i suspect that in a few years, jim and he will be weakened into extent, that they will depend only on their agricultural sector. and they will import the guys from the nightstands 3 times higher g d o fisher price. when they, when they used to buy from russia and therefore the industry was the mice. yep. it came to launch we had on away from providing or you know, history as well as i do, i it. some of our viewers may know that, you know, at, towards the end of the 2nd world war, the, the was the morgenthau plan to d and gesture class. he's gentlemen who would have thought they were going to implemented in 2023. i to amazing. okay. andre, how does nato equate himself itself in this conflict right now? i think it's, it's very existence is in play right now because he was never designed to 5. i fight appear conventional conflict. they didn't have a plan b,

as you pointed out here, what cents worth, i mean it, it was, i don't what i was going up. it was a supper club. okay. do you have to join? you're never gonna have to fight. you could have the american umbrella, and this is the, the biggest gross miscalculation ears because russia said, you know, we will find of nato expansion intolerable. and we will react, and they did andre, future of nato on there without the boat back, 2000 when you want the sandbar and saw what the russian ultimate on, which was the liberal, eastern level. and we're all remember one of the key points of this all to make own while it was basically least of that man's door or all back need. but still there bought us on 990. so i will hold my friend on all of the central office of russian different speed. the state was the one who stated that we know the most aware

evolved european particles need. so name or, or mostly it's lovely to call a good paper tiger, but logically it is tool is will not be able to come back a large combined arms operation design will defeat the peer irrational. which ease appear, in fact, sometimes in some field sense, a bonded p r a level as carol nailed it directly, there is a desperation dash and they are the stand of the very existence of nago, which for the last 30 years as they wanted to say was in to search over mission, and they couldn't find good enough enemy, they have the animal. now, what's the problem with the fact that they are saying is or is all to address? so just before existence date, you know why this enemy and there's a desire to at back you can capture it and do something bad about

l. s or to hear mistakes already there were existence of made that isn't staying here. and we can see already how both european union is beginning to wash o. c s cracks and labor will fall. so alicia, then let me get the last the last 50 seconds to karen. karen, i have a prediction here. russia will parrell on the battlefield. it will dictate its terms, but you know what western leads and there pliant media will say, well, they didn't make it to the english channel. we won. okay, that's what they're going to do. that's what they're gonna do. leg 40 seconds. go ahead. well, i think, i think that given we have an election, a presidential election cycle and starting in 2024, we have elections in 2024 biden says he wants to run again. that means the bite and team blank. and all these neocons, they need a victory, so they will create one and they will call it one. and i think your proposal there is fine. they didn't make it to the english channel. so we want this whole thing is

about narrative management. i think that they are frustrated in d. c right now because they are trying to figure out how to make it work. how to say what they think needs to be said. the problem is we sacrificed all the people, the people, the human beings in ukraine. yeah. the german economy, reputation of nato, never will be. i would even say the reputation of the west in the eyes of the global majority, the global south that time. so one of the biggest, absolutely, that's all the time we have fascinating discussion. i want to thank my guess in berlin, mount jackson, and in washington state. and thanks to our viewers for watching us here at ortiz, see you next time remember, crossed up ah with

ah ah, there is no trusted you with your incompetence instead, us, you created analyses narrow borders that just don't the situation rushes you in and boy takes aim out leaders in the west for undermining say that 2015 minutes peace agreements claiming their disregard for the accord lead to the counselor. when you break, nato unveils plans to create a fleet of spying satellites, to boost the block to military mission. russia responded, it will view the probes of lawful targets if they're used to help new crane on the battlefield. also ahead this news, our main goal with the 10 detroit naval exercise.