the oh the ah, hello, i'm manila chan you are tuned into modus operandi. this week we'll head to central america where one country is resisting us pressure and going their own way in foreign policy. after a history of meddling from the americans, president daniel ortega of nicaragua stands his ground as the united states takes aim at their gold industry. we'll get you all the details straight ahead. all right, let's get into the low. the me. the former us national security advisor under donald trump, john bolton,

called at the troika of tyranny, referring to cuba, venezuela and nicaragua. now for most of the 20th century, the u. s. has had frosty relations with cuba does say the least in the 21st century . the u. s. and a few of its allies anointed one, why doe, as their chosen president for venezuela move some 80 percent of the world rejected . and now the u. s. has its sites set on nicaragua, again under the biden administration. so what do these 3 latin american countries have in common while they're all run by left us government resist us, influence and exploitation by the west. so to talk more about nicaragua in the crosshairs, we'll bring in a man who's had 1st hand experience with its president. is dan co valid? he is an author and professor of international human rights at the university of

pittsburgh school of law. his newest book is called nicaragua, a history of intervention and resistance. dan, thanks for joining us. first i'd like to address the us state department framing of nicaragua. if you go to their website, to see their remarks on the country, they describe it as having descended into this sort of dest opie, a nightmare run by an authoritarian bonnie and clyde. in this case, daniel ortega and his 1st lady rosario, mario also serving as in the capacity of vice president. how fair is the state department depiction and how might you characterize the nicaraguan leaders? i would say that characterization characterization of the state department is incredibly unfair. and i find that very rich and very hypocritical, the us that supported a brutal dictatorship. in some moser and his 2 sons from 934 to

1979. i must, you know, remind people, if they don't know that the 3rd, simone said, killed 50000 nicaraguans in the last year of his reign between 19721979 fully supported by the united states. and by the way, those numbers are staggering, giving that time nicaragua had about 2 and a half 1000000 people in todo. my characterization now is that nicaragua has a popular leader in daniel ortega, who lead was one of the key leaders of the sandinista revolution. again, this is a dictatorship back by the us, right? ah, his popularity numbers are huge. the last poll i saw showed him it about

70 percent of room. the 2nd most popular president in the americans, 2nd only to the president of el salvador. meanwhile, very much more popular amongst his people than the president of the united states show by um, who's, you know, hovering around 30 or 40 percent. so i think this characterization, the state department is incredibly unfair. by the way. i've been in nicaragua 3 times this year and i traveled throughout nicaragua and a bus seen a lot of it. i've been going to nicaragua since 1987. and i've seen the incredible development since that. ah. and it's nothing like it used to be. i mean, there are kids living in rags any more. there are these beggars on the street. you

see, it's a very prosperous country compared to what he used to be. and i got italian so a lot more prosperous in many ways than i see on the streets of pittsburgh, pennsylvania. ah, where we have, you know, tense cities long as people and huge crime rate. so no, this, this is not if they're characterization. so part of the state department page on nicaragua, points to a crippled economy. they addressed us sanctions on the country, but neglect to link the 2 things. now the bite it administration has its site set on nicaragua was gold industry and stripping up to $500.00 government workers of their us visas. how much of this move has to do with their security cooperation with russia? does the state department merely try to punish states economically? who won't jump when the us says? so?

yeah, well 1st of all, let me your say yes, the sanctions are going to hurt nicaragua up till now the sanctions and there's been about 3 different sanctions, regina against nicaragua in the last 4 years. but nicaragua is whether those, well, i think there are g m, p has been about 5 percent every year since that time. i think this year it's going to be 5 to 70 percent. so 1st of all, their economy is doing bar at the moment. it's the same time. what i understand is that the sanctions on the gold war, her garage very bad and as usual, these sanctions are going to hurt individuals poor nicaraguans the most. and that is the sad part of it. ah, nicaragua is done so much for its people, particularly the poor, giving them free education,

free housing. i'm building free a. how free housing for the poor for free medical care building since 2007 when daniel ortega was, had been re elected for the 1st time. they've built 26 hospitals in the country, paved and built new roads throughout the country. so the government is doing a lot for its people. but these sanctions, especially in this new round sanctions, is going to hurt the average nicaragua, greatly. and that's what, what is intended to do. let me be clear that the sanctions are not targeted dirt. the nicaraguan government, their tar in it, it hurt the nicaragua, people with the hope that the nicaragua people will rise up against their government. right. and that's 20 sanctions are always hard to do on. and i

find a completely despicable but that's, that's the reality. now for nick, i was part, according to the u. s. c. b p than border protection. they say they've had more than a $164000.00 nicaraguan migrants at the southern border this year. that is up 3 times from 2021. what is driving these people out of their home country? yeah, well 1st of all, let me say, and i've just written a book on that rock by the way. that as of recently, very recently, nicaragua was not in sending very migrants the border that when they talk about the voc migrants from central america buying large, they will not from nicaragua because the country is doing very well. i do think that this new wave of immigration is being spurred on by the sanctions which are starting to take you know, have an impact on that society,

on the economy and slowly, you know, taking away jobs for and the garage when people. so i think that that's a big part of it. also people have to also realize in there's a lot of detailed or be talked about this, but in 2018 there was a very violent insurrection against the government that the u. s. ready supported with millions of dollars was very violent about $200.00 or so people were killed during that violence. many public buildings were destroyed. so many police more chilled during that time was a very difficult time in nicaragua. it did hurt the economy, particularly for the annual year. 2018. um,

and i think that led to this increase in migration. but again, a lot of that was spurred on by the united states, which, you know, was pretty open ended support for these vinyl insurrection, as in 2018. so, the point is, up to, very recently the u. s. was bidding their wall 100. so salvador, in watermarks and environments the u. s. nicaragua was not. but then the us supported of ireland qu, attempted to a 1018 then, you know, initiated at least 3 rounds of sanctions, economic sanctions, against the country. and yeah, so that has hurt the country and led to this increase in migration. could we call that some sort of a blowback? well, in a sense, yeah, in the truth is all this migration from central america's blowback. right,

i mean let's, let's face it, the you are supported right wing dictatorships and how, salvador, that killed 75000 people in guatemala, the kill 200000 people in honduras, they killed thousands of people. and yeah, the free, the, that was born by that is this huge migrations. the u. s. has destroyed these societies in these countries. nicaragua has been one country as a weather that storm because frankly, the good governance of the saturdays just but you know, the us is doing everything you can to undermine data. com that's siding and yes, that will lead to more migration. so yeah, i think it's fair to say all this is the product of blow back. all right, dan called alec. we've got a lot more to unpack,

so stay with us. coming up next. the u. s. isn't the only superpower with its sites set on nicaragua? find out why this central american country is abandoning taiwan and now backing china, we'll discuss it when we return, sit tight. the ammo will be right back with a ah needs to come to the russian state. little narrative. i've stayed as i'm phoning most landscaping, divest jingles, house lamps, and up for a group in a 50 babble disable keys on my knees to bargain speedy. when else calls with we will ban in the european

union the kremlin. yup. machine estate aunt, rush up to date and school r t spoke neck, given our video agency, roughly all band on you to send me to school with mm ah ah

ah ah, welcome back to b m o i am manila chan author and faster. dan kovak was kind enough to stay with us . dan, thanks for sticking around. all right, let's go back to the summer of 2022 biden hosted what has been described now my words described as a botched summit of the americas. he deliberately left off the invite list, cuba, nicaragua, and belatoya by not inviting those leaders to a summit that is supposedly aimed at open dialogue among countries in the western

hemisphere. widen was then snubbed by a number of other latin leaders, most notably mexico's under manuel lopez open door now. and lo, made it a point to say that if these guys weren't invited, that he was just why don't not going to come. the uninvited countries are led by left this leaders. we just saw lula win back his seat as president in brazil. another left us am lo is a left us as well, but he made the list. i'm curious as to know why. and if this is somehow abide and pushed back against the left, this swing in latin america, how might he respond to brazil's return leader? well, i great concerns about brazil right now. i mean, there are some earmarks that both dinero may be planning a military coup. and he was very player, he did not rule out the possibility of the loss. and there have been some truckers

blocking roads and whatnot, which by the way, looks like chilly in 1973. when salvador allende was overthrown without the united states. yeah, i do fear the u. s. is going to react very, very negatively towards lula being elected. i mean, really with the new little as the president of brazil, which is one biggest economies in amas, fear, ah, we almost have a clean sweep of landmark, right? having progressive, less winning or less leaning a president, so the us is going to react to that at the same time, i think the shows in many ways that the u. s. is become powerless in preventing that and i hope that's true. um, but yeah, i mean, this is assign, the latin america is really as, as

a group reject in the united states intervention, rejecting the monroe doctrine of 1823 on which gives me a lot of hope. i mean, probably years, i get more of that aladdin, latin american than any other region in the world. but yes, the u. s. is going to try unsure to overturn some of these governments. but, you know, here's the problem. the u. s. s. a can't. is a hero, is as strong as it is a it, you can't control every country on the globe, right? it tries to but i can't, you know, once there's a critical mass of country saying, boston, you know, no more. i think the us, you know, just can't do it. yeah. they're focused on ukraine right now, sending billions of dollars to ukraine to fight russia. by the way, i am in moscow,

russia out. um, you know, and in the breach, i think latin america is rising. so, you know, i have great hopes, but yeah, we have to be vigilant for sure. only grandma has recently re established diplomatic ties with china. it's a, it's a pivot from their previous diplomatic ties with taiwan. why? and what does this do to the balance of power in the western hemisphere? yes. so let me explain a little bit about that. first of all. so under somoza from 1934, 219. well really, i mean it well the to the 940304949. let's put that out from 949 to 979. so most are recognized. right. and not the people's republic of china. after the sandinista had the revolution in 1979,

they recognized people's republic of china because they were allowed to start up. but after the sandinista were voted out of office in 1990, the new government then recognized taiwan again. and withdrew recognition from the people's republic of china. and in that interim period from 1990 to 2007. when daniel ortega of the sand and he's just becomes president again, i taiwan did how nicaragua, a lot economical built all these factories and then the keela door zones. um and so when the sandinista came back to power in 2007, they were very reluctant to just tell taiwan hague though what right, because they were employ hundreds of thousands of able so for years they were,

you know, of continuing to recognize taiwan, even as they were at the united nations boating with the people's republic of china on pretty much every vote. right. and then as 2010, i think 21 came. 202021. danny ortega became very concerned with how one, how taiwan was acting, was feeling like they were really collaborating with the us to antagonize the people's republic of china, which he didn't like. but also he was feeling that, you know, his attempts to have to talk with the u. s. were coming to nothing, you know, with the 2018 to attempt with all the sanctions. so with all this, he finally decided, okay, forget, you know, our hardest people's republic. we've been playing ball the taiwanese because

they're given us jobs, but we don't like with taiwanese or doing the u. s. is now against us again. ah, so we're just going to recognize people's republic. that's what app. and so, um, now they're getting development now from the people's republic. and of course are now getting close. should russia, you know, again, danny, our tag and the president was reluctant to do those things. he wanted to get along with the u. s. the always but the u. s. has constantly, you know, every time he puts his hand out, they slap it down. so finally said, oh, you know, fine, we'll go with china. we'll go with russia and forget to timelines, you know, and i think what, he, in fact, what he did, he kept the taiwanese out of their embassy and gave it to the people's republic. so

there, yeah. and what do you make of the deepening ties between nicaragua and russia in recent years? i mean, this really began to develop back in 2008, but has since gotten to the place where nicaragua is actually allowing from military cooperation between the 2 countries. this is obviously gonna cause some major red flags and concerns for the u. s. y, in russia, nicaragua, relationship. what will turn it back to the future now? right. i mean, 1st of all, again, let's go over some history. after the sandinista is over through the us back dictator armstrong here, somoza in 1979. and they didn't align with cuba, but they, you know, fidel castro told any ortega said, you know, you be slow in aligning with so even in because one the u. s. will go after you for that and to, you know, you want your independence, not just from the us,

but from the soviet union. so you know, go very gently with so but then the u. s. is early is 1981. so 2 years argued sam, mrs. po, power began supporting these counter terrorist events, nicaragua, so what happened naturally nicaragua returned to the soviets, right. right. the russians at that time was so union and got a lot of support from so union from east germany, from other eastern bar countries. and then of course the sandinista road voted. 6 out of power 1990 and the soviet union collapsed in 1991. so that pretty much ended that closed bond. it came to be between. 4 nicaragua and soviet union, ah, in russia, ah, but then now, again,

daniel ortega is elected again 2006, takes governance in 2007. and again, he tries again to play ball with the you us, why you us is close to him, wants to trade with them. culturally, nicaragua is closer to the u. s. than russia. no one in, in nicaragua speaks english. many people there's, i'm sorry, none of them speak russian. many of them do speak english. ah, culturally they like the us, they play based on nicaragua. they don't like soccer's march, right? their main sport is baseball which they adopted from the us, right. so they were half interplay ball the last, but in the end, the u. s. would not play ball with the sandinista govern. so they been forced, again, as they were after 979 to line with russia. so they've gone back to their old ally. ah, to get support in,

in the face of continued opposition from the us. so, i mean, the lesson is that, that the u. s. and by the way, he mentioned no chance king, we can mention him again. would all you say? and he said this during the old cold war with the soviet union, but it still app today. he said what, what the u. s. would, would do is force or contrary to align with the soviet union, you know, through violence and economic breads and then blame them for wanting with the. so you'd write that would be a pretext then for more belligerents. and that's exactly what we're seeing today, right? the u. s. bullies the country like nicaragua, freezes him out economically, and then forces them to align with china to align with russia, and then blamed them for doing. and that's what has happened. president ortega is

now being described as something of a firebrand in the west after his 2022 u. n. g. a appearance where he ripped into fellow latin american liter president gabrielle boric of chili, calling him an american lap dog. how board is self described as a left wing politician. so why the mudslinging there? well, brock is not bad. progressive is the truth. in fact, he's been very repressive against his own indigenous population. even when he was elected a lot from, shall i were saying he's not that progress. and i think that or take a saw that too. but also i me just say something. i don't see ortega is a virus, right. i've actually met ortega a few times and i've been in his presence a number of times list a new speeches. the truth is, he's not much of

a firebrand. he ease. the truth is he's a pretty shy softspoken burden. ah. he feels more comfortable in the presence of, you know, working people in peasants and he does with intellectuals even though he's illegitimate. intellectual unself. ah. and the fact is, most of his support comes from workers and peasants. right? so, but he's not, you know, i've also heard fidel castro speak in person. i've heard you chavez speak in person, and he doesn't have that kind of bombastic way about him that they do. you know, he speaks in a very, a calm tone in kind of almost like an educator talks very story, etc. so i really kind of balk at that idea that he's

a firebrand. i i think it nice guy use the truth. so human rights attorney, professor and author dan cove. alec, thank you so much for sharing this very candid insight with us. all right, that's going to do it for this weeks episode of modus operandi there show that dig deep into foreign policy. i'm your host manila. chad. thank you for tuning and we'll see you again next week to figure out the ammo. ah ah. in the 1950s the u. s. used former nazis against the soviet union in the 21st century. they engineer dakota, the page, the former soviet republic into, on confrontation with moscow will certainly if the united states and the u. k. and

the rest of the western world had not engaged in conflict with the ukraine and with the soviet union and its successor of the russian federation. we would not have the horrible situation we have today. i think that if the american stopped, we would be at peace and the role would be a lot better place. and the economy, the world will function considerably better than is doing now. now when i was shown seemed wrong. when all, please, just don't hold any you. yes to feed out. this thing becomes the advocate and engagement equals betrayal. when so many find themselves worlds

apart, we choose to look for common ground. ah, has the center of done? yes. comes under shelling by ukrainian troop party visits, a temporary refugee camp in the republic to speak to those who fled the relentless with them. we were in the 2nd entrance to the building. the nazis were in the next one. they told us to write our initials on our hands with the red market because they were going to bury us that the ukrainians doggett range right in front of our house. there were 3 or 4 such structure, small street turned out that was the frontline. a lot of session with pushing you crazy tornado to compress rush. that's the admission coming from former you.