roodick nature of hot springs has been proved scientifically tight and for this serene has a number of hot mineral springs, 200 to 500 meters away from each other. but their characteristics are different. there is a variation of color and chemical composition as well as unique therapeutic features . for example, this spot can treat rheumatism and similar diseases about lying just 30 kilometers away from iran's border with azerbaijan. serene is one of the closest tourist destinations in iran to the c r. yes. countries as to juan is opening up more than ever to the c i. s region. and on top of it, russia, the number of visitors from this region has witnessed us teddy wise in the past months. speaking to reporters, it was minister of cultural heritage, tourism and handicraft, as that allows that ami said he has plans to transform the tourism industry in places like serena. the policies include the removal of visa for tourists coming from russia and other c r. yes, country. the ministry of tourism is paying an increasing attention to tourism in

northwest iran due to its vicinity to the c r. yes. region and serene as it was on rivals ha, will be on top of the list, is supposedly r t, from this point, town of santa ana. do live up myself. now, how this cia cripple developing nations with debt to keep the monro washington's control that's outlined next, right from the horses much going underground, gets going and i, i, it

time absent and see. and you're watching going underground, rural, ga, single, around the world for dubai in the heart of the middle east. and if you've been watching the show since we started, we've been charging the end of the good cop bad cop. well, bank. i am f consensus that washington has leverage around the world, arguably conflicts over ukraine and i, one and our slamming the doors shot on the post. 1945 era of economic hitman that comprise ne donation lenders, corporations, the cia, and those who foster global war debt and famine. one of the hitman and someone who blew the whistle on them is john perkins. he allegedly advised the will bank the m f, u. s. treasury department, fortune 500, that corporations, governments around the world, his best selling confessions of an economic hit man is now in the 2023 updated 3rd edition. he's on bainbridge island of the water from seattle in washington state. thank you so much for coming back on going underground. john, i've got to say a, it's a very different, very update to full of new information. if anyone thinks it's just the old confessions of economic hit, man, just remind us before we before we start,

why it became required reading in the global south to be able amongst a elite stephen to understand what happened in the global south that these past few decades where famine and war and vulnerability has been rife, a seemingly in nature nation media blamed on those people's living in those countries rather than that. something else? well yes, i think as soon as it's great to be with your dns and that way, um and you know, people in the global south like i get so many messages from them. and when i go in and visit and speak and places in south america and, and, and elsewhere, i hear that they knew the sort of thing was going on. but to actually have it be exposed in writing a by someone who was there on the ground doing these nefarious things, which,

which i did and, and asked them what to admit to doing them and, and, and, and, and i'll spend the rest of his life trying to turn that around is very gratifying to love. so the book is very, very popular. it's been, i think, 38 languages now, sold over 2000000 copies. it's and people in many, many countries a say, you know, the united states needs to be called to recognize on this. and now of course, this no workers deals with china's economic hit men who are doing pretty much the same thing. they, they've got a different story to tell. they've got a new marketing technique which is very, very effective. but it's basically the same story, their economic hitman learn from our failures and our successes, and they're doing out of much more efficient job than we ever did. and you expect that to me, attacked by a mission in laden, they should media press or do they, will they like this one? because you do attack china, which is a kind of trope,

many people doubt the we good story of people can see are, is few with a we as an, as another story designed by the kinds of forces that you've described for decades to destabilize countries. how do you expect li response to this i updated edition or to some instruction manual, how to destroy developing well countries to others? i to save them. well, my hope is that people will really look at what i think is the major theme of the book. and that is the economic hit man strategy in china. and the united states is taking us of the precipice and self destruction of the world. as we know it and life as we know on this planet it, you know, we can talk about climate change in income inequality and species extension both problems, but they're not the problem. they are symptoms of this death economy that's based on short term maximization of profit period and it's not working. it trickle down

economics does not work. and so, you know, in the book is about how to we've created life economy that pays people to clean up pollution to regenerate destroyed environments, to recycle, to develop technologies like wind and solar and, and, and non good, non carbon emitting forms. and i, i don't, i mean the end of the book, you're there, exercise the things for schools or education. how do you expect this stuff to, to happen given if you reach any level of power based on the rest of the text in the book. you may be killed, overthrown, if you get a democratic mandate, or of they will print stories against you. they will use all these. i mean, you, you got one side saying whatever you try, they will destroy you. and the other one saying, try for better world. well, you know, i realize i'm studying probability, but history is based on,

on people who fought probability successfully, you know, and, and, and 1774. and the concept in the united states in america was me. and i say check was that the british were in the sense that were in the feasible, they were invincible. they couldn't be beaten. and you know, george washington sounds that before the continental congress and says, remembers how 20 years earlier, he was at the battle monongahela during the french and indian war, where the biggest, most powerful british army was wiped out. and its general braddock was killed. and all the alternator officers were killed by a handful of french and indians. and washington says, what was less and they're not invincible. all we gotta do is hide behind trees. go against probability. come up with a new system. i'm. my hope is that we, yes, the probability is that we're going to go on doing this and we're going to create, continue to create a problems more severe, hurricanes, more severe climate change, et cetera. but i believe that we can go against probability and

a cause history is written by people who oppose ability and do something come up with a new idea, a new perception, a new approach. and that's what this book is about. an option as how we can all come together, you know, think about it, it says with china, nice days can never agree to do something like this to fight, to fight climate change, et cetera. but if there was a u. f. o hovering above us and aliens were threatening to attack us. what would chime in the united states do? they probably come together. and history would say that they would come together. it does say in, i'm not saying you're a complete to clairvoyant, but this is a direct quote from the updated edition presumably written in the early days of the grand conflict. in the long run, rushes invasion of ukraine may strengthen china's position as the leader in the movement to reduce the u. s. is insolence, says he, who is saying directly that a china and russia would move closer together or after what happened in

ukraine? are we seeing that now? is the chinese balloon story, an emblem of this fact? well, yes, and of course, where else is in india and turkey and much of the lower and middle income countries . if not siding with russia completely, at least not starting with, with the nato and united states either they're, they're, they're, they're not going against russia, they're. and so yes, we're saying that china is, is being strengthened in this process. but the fact of the matter is china had already taken over much of the war income countries their, their investments in the last year years have in these countries the a that they've given. if you want to call an aide, the loans are greater than the loans of all other countries, including the united states combined. and they've been making huge headway. and, and i think the, for the pleasure to allergic reaction,

is that we need to be aware of both countries that both countries, united states and china are in a competition or race toward disaster. you know, they're taking us into a what i crawled and were a lot of common us. i had death economy, an economic system that is consuming and polluting itself into extinction. i mean, you talk about indonesia, you're one of the hit man after the great don't align movement ideas of chicago, or before perhaps a 1000000, perhaps more were killed at the behest of a lead, coo, coo, they're in a sense that, that reflects that non alignment album, it's different now there are cycles to these things in the book you talk about cycles. i don't know what you thought of seymour hersh we interviewed on this program and his report on the nord stream attack. so there are times when washington will use death as an instrument of war that with the address payments, impoverishing the developing will countries. and then there are kinetic times like

vietnam will iraq. just tell us a bit about these cycles and whether the crane situation is a, is a kinetic one or is a, is something that the will to be technocratic and to do with debt. some people say of the whole of western europe to u. s. gas liquid natural, natural gas. well, yeah, you know, so, so after the failure war in vietnam failure from united states standpoint, at least strategically speaking, it wasn't a failure here. happened. oh, how to be a major investor in military industrial industries that they saw over as quite a success actually in a lot of money, in other words, but it was a failure strategically. after that, it was decided that military might, wasn't the way to go. and that we needed to go with economic hitman, we needed to essentially control countries through debt rather than the military.

and this was, this went on for many years and a particularly ramped up after 991 when the soviet union dissolved. when the united states was the only world superpower, but during this period of time, those involved in what we call the military industrial complex. the ones who make the weapons that big companies, that maker, they make the airplane, the lockheed martin's, and boeing's and so on. and so forth, they were not happy with that situation and they put a lot of pressure on, on the carter administration. and so in 911 happened, we went back into that cycle. this was a tremendously great excuse to rev up the military side of our, of our economy. and that's what happened after $911.00. and in some respects said, you can't ukraine wars giving us the opportunity to read that up even even more. and it's certainly happening. eyes were going in that direction and they way, you know, i've tried it and i know you've had great palace and seem,

or hers and others on this program who were very good investigative reporters. it seems to be impossible to find out how much of this aid that we're giving to ukraine is actually in the form of debt. that can't be any doubt that some of it, at least probably a lot of it is in the form of death. but it's hard to tell because what the american people with the world has told us that we're getting all this aid to ukraine. the one thing we do know isn't that isn't, is providing a lot of profits to military industries in the united states. as there's no question that they're making a lot of money out this. who oh is that money remains to be seen. i mean, given that you were working with these institutions, whitby corporations, you don't sometimes have nightmares thinking the people are reading your work, including the new updated edition and reversing it. and they had to use it as an investment strategy, strategic bible, and therefore pick out what to make money off that whilst the corpse is pile up in

ukraine. thousands, hundreds of thousands mill. yeah. and well, yeah, yeah, there's a lot. i love his peer there, said all we gotta do is look at religions to see how the, the word of a jesus, or mohammed or, or any other in a world edge, the prophets, the guiding principles behind religions, how their words have been used to fight wars to incite wars and, and, and use to, to make money. okay. but we're not comparing you directly to them. i'm going to have a. yeah. yeah, let's make background a bit of a exactly. what you seem are hers are, are great house or wherever you are, as you write these things. yeah. yeah. i very aware that these things can be turned around and, and, and, and used against me or even used against the united states. and that's certainly

not my intent, but my intent always has to support democracy. and i think democracy requires that we have a very critical analysis of everything that we're doing and always try to strive to get better. and right now we know we've got a system in the salience is climate change is income inequality globally? that's it. but you know where we are on the brink of of the major change and what it means to be humans on this planet. the question is, are we going to change? is, is the planet gonna change us because we're abusing our system? because we're over emphasizing materials to consumption and short term profits. or can we turn this around and transform the death economy into a life economy, john perkins, i'll stop you. the more from the author of the best selling confessions of an economic had been up to this break. ah,

ah ah ah, welcome back to going underground. i'm still here with the bestselling confessions of an economic hit man author and former economic hit man himself john perkins. you know, although the media restrictions are as bad, where i'm speaking to you from

a if i tell you and remind you what the world bank standard statements are, the world bank promotes long term economic development and poverty reduction. so there's an answer to that one. the i m f, promotes global macro economic and financial stability and provides policy advice again and again. and you haven't changed since the 1st edition of you just say the well back of the i m f. don't, don't do that. i mean, you have state department perkins, the claims the us national security agency recruited them to be an economic hip and it appears to be a total fabrication that's from the us state department and 20 or 6. what. how do you respond diary these have been so many years of this that you've given up or that now? well, you know, wanting to near to the major article or that they're looking at that exactly what the state department said and you know, totally disagree with the state department. it was interesting to me and i was

a website, the state department put up and i was the only person on the website. it was called the misinformation pro site and it sold a lot of books for me to say, and i always wondered, so why are they saying this kid is obviously not true. they said the only job of the, of the national security agencies to encode and decode message as well. we know as a huge agency, the probably the biggest buy agency in the united states, maybe in the world. it does a lot more than encoding and decoding messages. and everybody knew that. and i had a television producer who came to united states several times to interview me. he was from athens, you did a program in athens, it was like 60 minutes of greece. i was told and he at one point he asked me said, do you know how the state department did this? and i said, i have no idea selling a lot of books and it's obviously a fabrication. he said, well, i know i said after i did the 1st program with you, the us ambassador and athens called me into the office and, and to me and said,

you know, you put me in a very, very difficult position because now all these people are reading this book, other diplomats and they're coming into my house and say, is it true? what's the, what's your position on his book? and he said, i go back to the state department and asked him, what is our position on this book? and he said, i'm sure diplomats around the world and we're having the same problem. and so the state department had to come up with a statement sort of been there. diplomats, i could just say, well, i don't have a comment on it personally, but here's what, here's our official response. and it was really interesting to me because it did so a lot of accomplish the opposite of what they wanted to accomplish. you quote from wiki leaks. i mean julian assigns has been on this show general michael flynn. he's been on this show and i've got to say assange of lin virtually annihilated after they talked about what was really going on or away from the press releases the state department away from arguable lies in their so called mainstream corporate

meteor. sons', of course, arguably being tortured according to the u. n. reporter in london at the moment. this updated edition. and people must be wondering and p boss the question, and you address it in this edition. how is it you are alive, given that you've blown the whistle on? some of the most horrific crimes that in a way are emblematic of west crimes. and you say in the book as one country after another in africa, that in america or in asia, is impoverished deliberately as strategy by the united states. in this book, you say you were targeted a, perhaps your health, perhaps to stop you at the u. n. and you have fears for your family. well, yes. so when i 1st started to write the mark a long time ago, i contacted other people who had jobs like mine in the jackals. the people who go in, if, if the economic hit men are unsuccessful and overthrow governmental explores, the supervise, the overthrow of governments,

and sometimes even assassinate their leaders is what happened to re and a and chilly and are dishonest people. and immediately i received anonymous phone calls, threatening my life, threatening the life of my infant daughter. so, and at the same time, i was offered a very lucrative consulting job with it, with stone, webster, and engineering company. and then major competitor, my, when i was chief economist at that, that the chelsea main and i'd, i'd, i'd quit that job was writing this book and they offered me an extremely lucrative consulting position. i provided, i didn't write the book. they knew i was working on the book, so i stopped. but then after 911 i, i knew i had to write the book and i'm not saying there's any direct connection here at all that there isn't but, but when i went to ground 0 and looked down on that smoldering pit, i knew i had to come clean on what i had done, and i decided this to me wouldn't tell anybody it wouldn't contact anyone else. i would write a personal a confession. i wrote the whole thing in secret and then get it in the hands of the

good new york agent who got it in the hands of publishing houses. and at that point, i figured it's my, my security, it's my insurance policy. because you know, anyone who might not like what i wrote at, particularly in the, in the government. i would know that if something strange happened to me, the book would sell a lot more copies than the 2000000 term did sell that. and so let's, i went forward and did that. so as regards jackals and economic kept men, then, um, what do you think the strategy is based on all your experience as regards opec? it was widely reported. the saudi arabia, or in the united arab emirates, didn't answer biden's phone call. when after what happened in ukraine, they were, as per usual, some might say in is in your book, you imply which all the look increase output reduce the prices of global prices of crude. and they didn't do it. will they be?

and will it be easy for them to have another jackal economic hit man strategy against a mom admin, salman and, and be said of the way. now it won't be is your day because of china and. and because the world has changed so much, i, among other things, the day, many of the moslem countries are very upset of us or what we did in afghanistan and iraq. they don't see us as, as, as, as friendly to moslem countries. and china has, has become the major power. and so much of the world that no longer are we looked at us as the right protector of these countries. now that we can't protect them against china, they know that we can't, that even russia at this point though, despite what we're doing in ukraine, this threat is very real and they're saying that the united states is, is over extended. so for him away, does that mean the jackal john? so he has no economic hint. when does that mean the jackal i'm speaking to you from dubai or there, but the americans coming for us?

i think at this point it's, it's less likely than in the past, but certainly least people mount have some pretty good ways to protect themselves against jackals that you know in the jackals have been notoriously good at taking out governments in countries that have fairly weak governments they're not so good at taking out countries where you have a very strong government, like saudi arabia. and you know, the middle east of this point is, is, is a very different place from what it was back when i helped strike that deal in the early and mid 19 seventy's. well, world is one place. well, what about back back home in the united states? cuz jr, widen talks a lot about things that are happening abroad. back in the united states, the big story for a while, was this balloon. and then belatedly, i think it was to public pressure. arguably. people started talking about

infrastructure. the ohio rel disaster. i know you say that the ukraine war, again, is diverting us from strengthening relationships with global partners. but at the same time, why is infrastructure in the state that it is in the united states is and how is it related to this economic global economic hitman jackal strategy from washington? well, because united states and corporations can't make nearly as much money off doing infrastructure projects in the united states as they can make up during infrastructure projects in other countries. so when an economic hit man goes in and convinces the president of, of a latin american or an african country to take a huge loan from the world bank that they have to use to hire a u. s. corporations to bill infrastructure projects in their country. the company that builds the infrastructure project, the u. s. corporation makes a huge profits. and of course,

the military industrial complex. it does not benefit from infrastructure projects in the united states. the way that they benefit from what goes on in other countries. so there's a lot of pressure at the various highest levels of our government through lobbyist and consultants and advisors to expand all of our overseas efforts. and the other side of that is that as we expand these oversee efforts, we are also lining ourselves with countries who have resources that are corporations, want oil, copper, cobalt. today we're looking to dig, do you know, to take better control of lithium, which is, you know, so important to, to, to the green economy. and china has essentially, i think they control just about 90 percent of the living in the world. naval and watch our louise, asa interview president of bolivia, didn't work out so well for washington when after eva morales where lithium is of course in bolivia, we don't really have a much time to be able to talk about noriega,

who surprisingly comes out nicer than what might expect in the new updated edition, given the demonize ation or specific demonize ation of him in panama. but when it comes to panama, we know zalinski was named in the panama papers. that's doesn't seem to be talked about much nowadays. you say in this book that says since the 1st edition, he becomes shocked by a blatant defiant and merciless they donation the banks. these big banks of the nato nations. are you talk about the corrupt a lab or interest rate setting? and you don't think much of the 10000000000 fine on j. p. morgan chase barclays bank of scotland u b. s. freight is guilty deutscher bank to an off with the fact that all these banks were corrupt. admittedly sure up they got to me on that one isn't satisfied with the vine. when levels of fi they paid their dues. oh well, isn't it funny that base get fine, but based on don't commit crimes. banks don't get put in at banks. don't you know,

they could find, but the people that actually committed the crimes, the ones who made the decisions, they go scott free and those are the c e o said that, you know, people high positions and these banks i, i think that's horrific that corporations in the united states have the rights of individuals, but they don't have the responsibilities and they don't have to answer to the same laws. it's not the way a democracy should operate. jump against. thank you. and the 3rd and latest addition of confessions of an economic hip and is that now if you're thinking of taking out and i am f alone, that's it for the final show. this season will be back with a brand new episode on saturday. the 13th of may, but until then we'll be broadcasting some of your favorite shows all the series. meanwhile, and keep in touch, if i will, a social media. if it's not sense it in your country and had to watch out going underground tv on rumbled, i'll come to watch new and old episodes of going undergrads here very soon with

blue . ah, ah ah headline stories this hour i must of delays or rep. sell an oil chapel in crimea with local authority. seeing a drone strike could be the cause of the fire. a warning disturbing images ahead. wreckage on the streets of su dunn's capital, including the bodies strewn across them. the gruesome scenes are being witness this fight agreed upon truce the militarized conflict there now into it's 3rd week.

north korea accuses washington. um, so all of this stabilizing the korean peninsula, after the 2 allies on available on to.