at the oven, economist and senior researcher at the institute of economic research at the national autonomy university of mexico professional growth, which is great to talk to you. thank you very much for your time. give up for the station. now you began questioning the conventional framework for understanding international economy a long time ago, but i wonder if the last 5 years starting with the current conducting and culminating in the recent changes triggered by the ukrainian crisis. i wonder if they have surprised you in any way in terms of how things played out. no, this was, this was a thought was going into action. and now we've been around. thanks. i think when we speak over for men to go by the say show we are saying something that is very clear, that is the west is protecting it. industries is led by china is promoting food trade and promoting its technology.

so what you have now is a world speaking true and it is clearly more deeply split into with this new emerging. so the facts, china, after the replacement of attacks america and that of the fact that it said that a waste we're, we meant between this child ravia. now the conversations of china with new grain to try to finish the war. so i have any pressure on that? yes, we are having, i think we're emerging in the new world where it is chinese economic mike, that is my, that is giving him a while. but still all of its current need to suppress the development of others. it comes and goes a last century,

2 centuries in this case. it has lastly century, it has lasted the after world war 2. so around a year, 2000 part of it has to do with i got an impression. there are problems inside the states made this thing, no guns and the killings of children. this thing having the record number with me or call me and them it. and right now what happened with tucker carson, because he thought he was lying on the newest, consistently, when they are supposed to be the example of truth. so what happened here is of the truce apparently is no longer the term. and apparently the power that he's sending the truce for me or whatever that is, it gave them. that's what's the last in the road. nobody billings very much in what

the carols that is coming out to washington. now speaking about this truth coming out of washington, you just mentioned that economic theory presupposes that the centers of a can make my shifting, you know, and nothing is permanent. and there are many economists in the united states. so i assume they are familiar with that theory as well. why do you think the americans are still stubborn in trying to preserve that had gemini, both in economic and political terms, while all the signs that are that it is slipping away? why aren't they instead trying to create the most beneficial, transitory conditions for themselves? ah, which one is nobody likes to do? that's clear every new british loss because he had a war. essentially, they won the war but lost the empire. the u. s. net lost its imperial power yet,

but it is way. imperial power is raining and you read you read different articles and if you're not clear that there, they are aware that there are powers lee, but they don't want to do that. and what is also clear is that there is a lack of understanding on what's going on. i wrote a charge mrs. yellows remarks the other day on the international court. i'm in china and i was a bit surprised to see that she thinks the u. s. center they now make a comment. when for all of us, it is clear that they are walking into recession and that they are finding on from the us dollar at the instrument of global trouble. but let me put it a question by others. so i think, i think there's

a lack of gladly dick, i think there are new, seen what has been their stroke boy, which was thick. and what appears to be showing up now is again to start as ease. there are far more strong gravity and i, i fear product. now, you've written before that the united states has declared a cold war against china and a cold war, such a broad metaphor. what do you understand as the main means and the goals of that war? and can it be decisively won by either of the sides? no, no, that's so that's a no win situation. the, the reason is the technological competition, the us has lost its technological edge. and the president intense something like 10 years ago, they should not quit producing chips,

but he said it but the decision was let's quit. let's make chicks in china. and for us it's the software that matters. and what happened was, the chinese have this learn very pretty how to produce or they build to produce. and they said it's faster and better. and that's the problem because the funny part is that the sign comes on the us or lacking comes from kalia. they were barking together very well until the us said, wait a minute. they are when they're when and that's why this war stocks and they have the nobody, nobody can we because they have to work together, whatever. now, if i understand your idea correctly, you believe that the idea that globalization is over a doesn't reflect the true global reality. and it may be over for the united states, because it's up to you know,

for import substitution policies. but for china and other asian power houses it's, it's continuing there pursuing it eagerly. i wonder if the flavor, if the character, if the means of the east ladder globalization are any in any way different from the ones we observed as led by the west. where i am studying better lives, i want to, i want to write on a larger book or something because they're meant to go by the sation meetings, the different protection and the one side or the other side. what is an expansion? i think spanish and mystery trade rules imposed by son and the big of enter africa in other significant way. there entered africa in the working in the energy bill. both are fossil fuel out renewable energy or an

it and m they are, they have helped. according to the voice of america re book, they got helped with the debt situation of the african countries in europe, consultant of bunkie talk. so they seem to be promoting a globalization, let bowden with their own rules on there and of course, as a reflection on their own interest. so it has yes and as a different logic. the logic that i see coming out on tying up a that's a working road i would speak now here in a rock rats position where there were there seems to be looking at is a renewable energy leadership, which i am trying to place that in the work they are deep manufacture, the 1st step or 4 major chain by the chains of religious solar way, c and trego,

the tricity. and they all suddenly either in they seem to be leaning in distribution of electricity. they seem to be buying up this electric distribution. the firms around the world, but basically africa duck in america and south america. well, the russian to, i mean, they're buying a lot of far russian energy sources. now, seeing other russia, even before that the addition of economic sanctions against russia over the ukrainian operation became the opportunity of a lifetime for china in terms of consolidating it's a is cern, financial i architecture. and it's hard to believe that the use policy makers would not have foreseen these type of secondary consequences, which are so detrimental to their own, their privilege. why do you think they still move? they had and did it in such a blank way? they didn't see that there are 2 things lately,

patsy in 2005. they did not see that shifting research and development into china was going to give the chinese an edge onto willard. they thought they were holy methodology and they did not understand. it. chang lease capacity to absorb knowledge and transformer to deborah that was 2000, but they did not tear. and now these will, they burst good. the sanctions on the lang. and then they could assertion minnesota and nothing much appeared to show up. and i think they believed they had really cornered those hunters. they knew nothing there star that maybe there was somebody someplace that was going to say, look, i have

a currency, i have a central park, i can invent a payment system that they did not. and did not see when, when garage invent that each payment since the burger will ever many countries, glo, conscious, they did not see them. also, they could not imagine the chinese were going to do the same, nor the speed with which they are changing. so don't live with you. look at what's happened with china is with it's international finance architecture. they've constructed a complete one any 70 years that you go so i mean, the wis took 50 years. i have to tell you, professor accreditation that we have, we can take no more delays. we have to take a very short break right now, just like the chinese, but we will be back in just a few moments. stay tuned. ah, mm. mm hm.

some nations may be able to turn a blind eye to atrocities in other countries. the united states of america is different. wearable people long to be free. they will find a friend in the united states. ah, a human being about 80 golds. anybody basie, sincerely, city. if you draw the look at the book, they incentives and the cigarette a few color revolutions is one among several of means to reach the goal of conquering foreign lands and bringing them onto the help of u. s. west economic interests. people been sad it, i didn't that he did what i grew by the democrats. yeah. new trinity coral activate

sol, suite best, se, loaded softball, whatever you can. the final goal of these thing revolutions is to ensure that there are no independent players in the world anymore. oh, a the me i welcome back to the 4th 5th, oscar to chapter economist senior researcher at the institute of economic research at the national autonomy university of mexico. professor regard titian just before

the break you, you mentioned the, the speed at which the chinese have been building their financial infrastructure. you also mentioned before the they seem to be building it parallel commodities market that would be operating in the u on. and that is serving gas, oil, grains, metals, etc. how much more china has to do to become truly immune to western pressure and perhaps even all for that immunity to those who are sick of that. having bruce and they can now offer nearly the to western measures, what they can further is hiring a very large shipping peach where they can also do is to broaden their international assurance or firms which they can go very quickly. i mean, they have the, are 5 largest bands in the world so they can do the same thing. sure. and with that,

they have a complete international commercial. you also mentioned that efforts in consolidating the asian high oil market and the length to which they went in discussing this issue with middle eastern power is some of which are still putative american allies . i understand why the chinese would be doing that by what do you think is the arab interest, what is the interest of saudi arabia in joining hands with china openly? well, we have several in the middle east with there are several programs. the 1st one was iraq. we also were happy with our clue us. no neat to do that work. in the 2nd things we have all seen your experience and wear a black ascent. and so i think for the middle leave, so conference they are taking their association with a us with

a pinch of song. they were promised something with neither invasion on with yard sleep and was come out. there's something slow, but that is so there we have a major issue. the 2nd major issues, the u. s. s. and that relies. so the failure i think will the right results with only with this seeing or because shogi murder in turkey. and then after that then it said well, but that will need you to raise the oil price. and so garrison? oh yes. and you have and i will nicely allenwood wizard. okay. were you not long enough for that long thing? the 2nd for the, the supposed mistake. the 2nd thing is, are the homes and mistakes with it, or they have pushed, you know, they have agreed with it out. they had broken their deals with it and, and the u. s. guess, shown us the world. it does not have

a stable policy. the policies change with the put it with there. they agree. they wish this nuclear agreement, they broke that in agreement. they put further, oh ah retaliation some then always dns bowls eat on. and so the radio for one be so or the other, we're more inclined to have an agreement brokerage by china. does the same equipment, brokerage bergen, yours, and thus what happens on china? got it. so i like to my loyal, are both conduce, then it has. it's flowed line boil, and russia, ah, it classic globe minute ago from senior. so it's pretty much a walk in terms of oil supply and having built our commodities market engine i

was, i was thinking and i might be, whoa, is it? maybe the chinese are going to begin to refine oil and extort we fido, in which case it would become the competition of the us, whose leading expert good is provide low spot. so that's what it looks like. i don't know, douglas. well, why should they stop at the, and dealing with raw materials? now, you mentioned the technological ads that china has developed than and how the americans were not able to for, foresee it. and i don't know if you would agree with me. i'm maybe i'm biased here, but i think the, the science that used to come out of the united states technological science was not necessarily purely american. i mean for, for many take as the united states attracted their, the global, technological talent with the promise of the american dream with money,

with values, with prestige. what have you, do you think china heller to all for o, perhaps even to top the american offers? my question is that so far? if this child needs and least scientists do a little over the probably was yes. technician of the european economy. it is possible that you will get your peons value to china to work and what we are now seeing in middle sturdy, indiana, and pakistan east side is work in the us and they can work anywhere. so i think back i'm at now, let's talk about how these giants and by that i mean the united states in china positioned themselves. because if we just just oppose their official slogans of what washington and beijing offered to the world. the former talks about itself as

a shining city on the hill, whereas the latter refers to humanity as a community of common destiny. and i think it has a very telling difference of focus me versus we. and i wonder if you think that the china can truly stay true to this plan of common destiny, to refrain from using its increasing power too much and too much to its own advantage. i'm not sure if it will mature into that then so far what they appear to be doing is securing its flush and that is secure with a state she then it's me and i anybody to organize the world around

so far, though, that's really just mature for a while we maybe it's a matter of time, i don't know. or maybe it's a matter of, i don't know, but that will be made to be seen. but what's the navigable? either the shift is happening and we cannot deny that there is a ship going on. and that we might not share a few things of the chinese, but we don't see a few things on the american site. so we look for people. maybe that's the way the world is making a very good fit for learning and analyzing other countries history because i know that they were very good students of the soviet system. and they managed to take some of the good things that even the soviet have not been able to use to the best way possible. so perhaps the chinese could learn the american history as well. and the abuses of the american economic system and political system for their own advantage, because after all, it's a win win the true when,

when that can make the system sustainable. and, you know, i'm a couple to anyone in the world for the next china to happen when they start to become blogs, user friendly till that drove us out. they build a must become user friendly. so everybody must see them or not. natalie is a main trading partner. not only is the main vendor, not only the head of the global gene, a logical change, but they must see them as a friend. and so far i brush or they are rather more senior partners than suppressed that that at that shipped. but a matter of maturity. can i also care couple of questions about the american system which used to be a global dream. and as we discussed, it's in a deep crisis, not only internationally, but also domestically. when we look at the level of public dad,

the state of infrastructure, social welfare, the level of crime, the level of addictions, what would it take if not, reform done at least to bring it to some sort of self sufficiency and the balanced level? well, there are a couple of things. first, i finger economy cannot run me on an external deficit of 6 percent of gdp continuous. that's one thing. secondly, they need to produce more. yes. they need to produce more. they need to trade more . but that means racing. the levels of reliability richness, reducing the ent prizes of their goods given to buy an apple telephone that it costs twice. when the chinese cell phone cost,

well clearly are under by a chinese. so they've been utilizing look better what they have to do seeing on the cost of producing and look better for how they're going to we buy once their economy is still to net complete gap and the cost to the rest of the world. so that it is out of balance is that we are on adjusting with her growing international reserves to buy the treasury bonds, to finance of deficit, which is ridiculous. we should be growing more and world growth should be more balanced. and right now we are very, very biased, very bias we should, we should have a more equitable welders. yes,

absolutely. and i think it's biased not only to the rest of the world, but also to many americans. i'm sure you have many american acquaintances, and i think many americans don't feel that our system is treating them them fairly . now, given that we are entering the next presidential season right now, do you see any real potential in the system actually reforming and solve given the candidates that have put the, put the personalities on stage so far? and do you see any understanding of what things really are within the american economy? well, the democrats believe they have a very dynamic economy. and that's the way they look at the world. and if they think that china is an unfair competitor, they have a serious phone. so, and that has not changed. i don't think i think that was the ellen's point the

other day. and that was like out it's point inc or talk and the counselor relations . so no, i don't see get any change. an exchange trumps isolationism. won't lead them anywhere. it has not let them anywhere so far, but yeah. so repeat from is responsible for the largest growth in us that in history. well, the democrats also not far behind, but as you said before, you know, then the rest of the world has to mind its own business. and it seems that for the 1st time in many decades, we have alternatives. um, how do leave and let leave and hopefully that will remain his professor. this has been great pleasure and great honor for me to talk to you. thank you very much for that. our troops the gilbert and thank you for watching hope to see her again on the worlds apart. ah

with mm hm. mm. mm. hungary, it has been a member of the european union and nato since 1999 during the 1st post soviet wave of nato's eastwood expansion number. be silica love. yes, the my logo thanks is de leon montgomery that i see like by the quantity e. so me to me, if so would you like a sure zap bud lumiere? to avoid the brochure dream? yeah. still more gina beach grass here,

but i see australia bosh roy mug woochie strongly in the early ninety's hungry was a country with a worst view of russia due to historical disagreements left over from the soviet union. and you, someone like yours or what i see if you wrote a political more than as what i see is great. and i did it at the political 0 most with tell you a forward to talking to you all that technology should work for people. a robot must obey the orders given by human beings, except where such order that conflict with the 1st law show your identification. we should be very careful about personal intelligence at that point, obviously is to great trust, rather than fear with take on various jobs with artificial intelligence,

real summoning with obama protect its own existence with a with hello and welcome to cross stock where all things are considered i'm peter lavelle, the term strategic autonomy sounds good. the word strategic conjures up a sense of importance and autonomy presents a sense of independence. but when you consider the french president.