how do you react to this is orient list, be abuse that the arab countries don't decide you're able to get in nature nation media? look, i think it's a short answer. would be all of the above. it's a bit of, even though it's, it's a bit of oriented it's, it's, it's a bit oriented isn't. it's a bit of agendas, but mostly i would like to go to winston churchill who said, you know, the americans will do the right thing after they've tried everything else. the number of meetings, or re, things that i've been, you know, attending, or seen or heard of. and the amount of advice that has been given to washington and back from the barrack obama. these, you know, we told them, you know, you cannot appease a monster, be it run nuclear, a threat is that clear and present danger, but it's not the only danger when you know inject cache into the 3 team, you're instigating the other line activities and what was the response of the, of the whole, the school as you know, are supported by it on the attack,

the u. s. navy, 3 times in the last 4 months of the obama and the u. s. navy, which i'm sure was very humiliating for many of the generals. and many of the many, 3 men and women in service, they did not respond because the administration at the time did not want anything to interfere with the run. okay. we don't wanna sound like an old term broadcast, because that is what the drum says for the time. what about the shadow of a rock? because of in britain, in the united states, those policy makers who supported the destruction of a rock. they there well in with the political firmament, whether it be in the clinton or advisors to the people involved in the george bush junior, george w bush at junior administration. what is the shadow of a rod? because uh, in a donation, same kind of forgotten. uh, absolutely. um, and i just want to tell you this with the last answer that i given iraq was another

example. where'd we'd desperately tried to advise the us? not to do it in 2003, and people who cover the what, remember what the position of so the be the leadership at the time. so this coming sold them is management. there was no question that us was going to in the war, but how are you going to manage the, the to and we were proven a right when speaking we spoke about the shuttle asset and the seed in region. when president obama said that the using chemical weapons is a red line and then the that's really the awkward youtube and we gave them advice, but there were no chemical weapons used by the bus or our last at the administration. when i have my a difference of anything and i mean why the long and there's a lot to be in read about that. but the what you know, what it, what i do know is after i, i know you, i know that you don't want this to sound like a president trump. uh interesting. but what i can use back in control, but uh, but i do know is when trump strikes against us. uh, there were no reports whether people choose to believe them or not. uh, there were no um, further reports about using chemical weapons. face will have somebody that will offer me the editor in chief of our musing editorial board member of our a. be

a news general off of this break the the

the, the welcome back to going underground. i'm still here with the editor in chief of our of news face. a lot of us. the reason i said the shadow of the rock, because we had the ex advisor to lensky is commander in chief on this show just the other day. and he's a us veteran speaking to me from west point. he said the iraq war was worth it, and they're gonna use this kind of

a rock was strategy against russia and ukraine. how widely held is the view in the world away from here into these the believes iraq was worth it to the and then if you complain about the casualties and the 10s of millions killed window displays by all those was it's kind of going through old history or not recognizing american supremacy and i own that the united states did the right thing, you know, a big sign of poles and that's a driven during that isn't so and i would hate to speak on behalf of the arb street . that's a very complicated question, but um, what i can safely say is people judged by the outcome and what is the outcome? did iraq become better or worse? iraq became far worse and i have complete understanding and i have my own criticisms and issues of up to some of them seem preaching. this is not the criticism of this have done this. i think all of us would be critically based

without what i mean. it's hardly not to write that, but what i'm talking about is the mismanagement of the day to of, of, of the iraq which has led to you can argue really say the creation of the dash, etc, etc. so people don't judge by the outcome and the outcome in this instance wasn't positive now to the kinds of propaganda against the outer world. how, how do you counter of the nation ation propaganda against the outer world in, in general, not just from your experiences, presumably at conferences and international for how to journalists who work for you at our news. do that because presumably in the news room, they can see with narrative being constructed and propagated for various reasons. i mean, look, we are not without our shortcomings and not without our own mistakes. we work hard to tell, reflect the most accurate story we, we, we can, there has been instances where we've corrected stories of a and, you know, challenged newspapers like the new york times and we were proven. right. and so if

you know not every story that is published is wrong or inaccurate, but by then you call contracting. the kind of propaganda when i find in the field. so we do, uh, you know, with very cautious that we are not the ministry of media, of, of so the be aware and use paper and you know, there are limits to, to be done. and we cannot do. i'm on the record saying this on another occasion is we as a country as a whole and need to do a better job in telling the amazing progress. and i, i do honestly think, and i know people watching this interview would expect me to say this. here's a german, it's from saudi arabia. he's of course, going to kind of a lawyer and build his own horn and say nice things, but the, the, the, the sheer amount of, of the she magnitude of change that has, happens over the past 6 years is unbelievable. i, you know, if i were to go back 6 years and a half when i started doing, and i wouldn't ask again, not only would i do this job again,

i would actually pay for it because it is remarkable to be there when women started driving, when cinemas, re open when for the 1st time in at least the last 40 years, the religious police where uh, you know, the powers of the industries were finally put in in check and you don't see them anymore. and i don't think people get, we give enough credit for that single. yeah, i understand that they have that information and some of it is even coming out into major nation media. but do you think that the, the nato nations who have a desire to control saudi arabia, not only how production saudi arabia, but arguably, control elements of geo politically. which views out here, maybe it takes because it's a superpower, this region. do you think we'll just go? yeah, things about what i mean. what are your tricks of this leave next to try and destroy it. you must have witnessed it as a try and destroys ad uribe as reputation around the world. the media. i know they always talk about you being state of control. arguably,

i think you probably can see how state control need to a nation media or is what, what are you expecting the latest fluids and defamation against that, are you ready to look in? if there is, isn't that driven media interest, you can't really blame them because there isn't that driven what you really surprises me sometimes is how know you've some of the people are receiving media is it's not really that hard to fact check these days. it's not really hard to find another source and, and compare, compare notes and see what, what is actually happening. you know, if i want to go and i know this stuff is not hard now that over 50 countries can come without a visa to, to solve the review. it's not hard to come and check for yourselves. and there's been an inflow of a lot of journalists from, you know, all the way from tokyo to toronto coming to saudi arabia to find and, you know, i, you know, with a few exceptions, i cannot think of one person who didn't see with the positive impression not because we're putting on a show or propaganda, but because the, the, the,

the misconception is so grief outside and i get it's, we've been across country for a very long time. we've done wrong things for a very long time. but i just do think the audience needs to approach this with the, with an open mind. and, you know, if there isn't, isn't that driven during that isn't? there's a lot of ways they can check check. do you think you're increasing? are you going to look at double standards? has visualization, media criticizes of uribe? i know your coverage with julian is anjanette news. i've noticed that the kinds of, uh, we're now in a stage where our media is beginning to realize that the kind of a colonial mentality of the great to west and the ideas of freedom are not quite as they were doing is obviously the most famous john is in the world, is in jail in love, look not we're going to, it's not like we're going to start. we've already started then i'll give you a very quick example. around 2 years ago. the who sees burnt 40. if you open refugees life and you know this was coming of the heels of the globe or black lives

matters movement. i saw the news. i did not see it on any international. when most international media outlets didn't cover it. what i expected is, you know, if the introduction media and i'm here to say old lives matter every life. innocent life loss is a life too many. but if you're going to do all of that media coverage for flights, and may he rest in peace within, i expect 40 more. 40 much as much coverage for the 44 if you will be, and refugees who would birth a life. but by the who with these, you know, what we did, we started contacting newspapers in britain and the u. k. one by one and sending them email and footage and say, are you going to cover it? only one of them replied. the main black lives matter movements in america didn't reply. there was a splinter organization of it that the team and shame them for not doing that. and you know, it will always be those who would fees would deny that that happens. i think i remember in that, in that case, but today it's not just

a matter of ignoring your let's, is a holler at me a roof of which your remember i, on the editorial board like fox news like, or t like, i don't know how many on the television stations, i don't even bothering to get their off, go on go. you can give them incense a license. why? why would that be a cause a, do you don't care about being broadcast in britain for you to ask? i'm sure if you ask the management of a lot of the of the will give you a more up to date uh, answer on that seem to navigate press really well look. i mean, i've been asked this question in the u. k. and you know, it's very easy to come with kind of a stiff upper lip and accuse us of all sorts of things. but you know, we are with, we are, we don't have the 1st amendment in, in indiana, but we have to work in very tough condition. i'm talking about no, but, but let me pull the code for you to really don't need to know. i mean, i'm, but i'm getting to that point so we don't have it. so by default, that means when we do something, could they just when we do something profession,

we should be uploaded? not the other way around. there's nothing special about the new york times or the washington post doing what they're supposed to be doing, given that their legal framework protects them to do it. but as you mentioned, who was perfect. you know, i was on a bbc review interview and saying, you know, you're, you're asking people for protesting or tweeting. and i say, did you not watch the controls coordination? you know, and the 1st time we know when people are being arrested latrice for having blank posters. so, you know, i think everybody needs to have a deep look insight before throwing bricks at other people you mentioned visually on a song? sure. i still remember when you know, a brute to security forces, read the offices of the guardian and force during the rest of the story, laptops and computers and hard disk. you know, that is only less than 10 years old. so nobody's perfect to you. you'd expect at any time the saudis security forces coming into the arab news and faxing a laptop in front of you. you know, you wouldn't be, you'd be surprised if it's a god in the british. i seen, you'd be surprised that i'm seeing this,

but i am more comfortable in working as a journalist in saudi arabia. and as i know how this sounds, but i'm more comfortable working as a journalist in saudi arabia. then having to deal with companies like cart the rock in, in the u. k. which is the level of capital of the, whether the be the cause or rock would deny what you're saying. know how that agency is. we want to keep going under trials, right? and you know, this is not encouraging. you does nothing wrong. it's not a, you know, encouraging the abuse or going after people unfairly. but you know, the laws in the u. k. are pretty trick on you. so i feel much more comfortable working in cell gave you a knowing that the way we're headed with the vision 2030 we're it has to happen that we're going to have more transparency because this is a whole and vision that is based on accountability, transparency setting targets for and keep the eyes for ministers and government officials. we're not there yet, but i'm sure we're going to get there. what happens though, and i have to say, i feel more comfortable here clearly because i moved from london over here. and we

had the united nation special rep or do i talk about torture of juliet assigned you in london. but what about so the fact that a lot of arab journalists in this reach maybe an educated american universities and british universe, because i'm going to inherit some of these orient list ideas. no fully understanding that the world is a apology. we reckon with now along with breaks look, i'm my, my thing is i always see everybody. and i mean everybody needs a system update on what the article is, particularly the gcc, it has become. and there, there are many outdated, unfortunately, sometimes even by our own people who maybe have spent a long time abroad. but this is as the tagline of our newspaper says, this is a changing region. it has changed dramatically in the last few years. with regards to, you know, the, you know, western media and told me about a lead glass arabs. we don't realize that actually you don't need to count to west of foreign policy. look, we wouldn't do what is in our interest,

i think is the message. and we would make sure that our interest doesn't harm your interest, which i think is a, is a fair game. but if anybody, i believe that if anybody is expecting a free ride, that doesn't happen anymore and breaks. if you did, that's a variety of inside the radio is going to absorb rusher and once it to join the brakes, you expect that here may be a to be bought of brakes. and i mean, it's a very complicated negotiations. what i do know is there's a friends of bricks meeting happening in south africa beginning of june, where so the idea is invited. i know there is serious talks to invite the leadership to come to the summit in august. how that materializes, i don't know, and it's too early to judge. but, you know, the kingdom has signaled in recent years that it's wants to consider alliances with all sorts of blocks in the world, in a way that serves its own interest, regional interest and international interest. and there is no reason why we

shouldn't talk to, um, you know, the bricks group and see if we can align or interest with their so well as the american se. so you do, you know, like china dual is american innovation, there's nothing we are. well, in the global south avenue, it's full of innovation in that kind of know how that the americans in the west, the opinions can just tell me what you thought about the astronauts. but i, i'm always saying it ironically tell me, by the way, your thoughts with you as even though it says, i think you might have to explain it because internationally, maybe it's not known. well as you know. so during the, it was the 1st out of country it to send an out of the most of them to space. this was in 1985, it was a prince, some funding settlement. and now there's a whole program as the so the space program and we want to catch up with our brother's here in the u. e. in other signal that the whole region is, is rising. so a few days ago to us or not. so the 1st ever female. so the us or not,

went through the international uh, you know, by the way, yes. the, and from the you a, the yeah, but he was there, he was there a few months. they've asked me to scan the americans. another thing, i don't think it should scare anybody, they are going there to do research, but it's a signal that, you know, we want to be part of and you know, this was launched from the us. we also just signed a really, it almost yes. and we also just signed as a country $37000000000.00 of boeing planes that are on the $121.00 to supply the new airlines that we're building for a 40 on. so again, people, you know, see one part of the story, but don't see the other part of the story. if we were so anti american or want to break up with the america, why would we launch? there are other countries that we can launch a to space from, and there are other countries that can, that make equally good uh, airplanes. so i think there is this view to try to simplify things and look at it from one perspective, but not to look at the whole story. right. so thank you. you'll have to go on an

update just as far as changing region continues. that's over the show will be back on monday would be for the goldman sachs economy, is declining the acronym break below jim o'neil to talk about the rising breaks. and it's the challenge of the g 7. but until then, you give a judge my role as social media. if it's not sensitive and you'll country and had to watch, i'm going on the run tv. hon. don't come to watch new and old episodes of going underground. see monday the the, the, the

weight. hi everybody, so i am going to lean to again. and i've come you in, so it's a large glade but with the supplies. so it was found. let's go find them big. so in the mid to indeed century in a small above and english don't do of can yonah is discovered and always got it as it turned out belong to one of the see boys which are banned against the british and the 19th century. they even managed to find out his fate. the boy's name was item beat and he was executed after the suppression of the rebellion and his head was brought back to bitten by a british officer. this was a common practice among the english at the time. the woods indians who opened the what was understood the all right guys,

i think we might have found it. i think the light i've just found as it is the blue building. you see that he used to be the law type of where it's listed by you scott, it was about when i brought the topic of the item, big gun that was found in, in uh, in the, in the above. she was a van of it. i have a boat with me use uh who is now the one of the uh, the base. uh and. yeah. so the, you know, about the history of this business. we uh, my husbands mine both the uh, the bill doing a trips with the 9 years ago. um, once we lived in, we were told at some point. but as somebody mentioned to us that the driver had a history then apart from them use makes. and that because of the name somebody had backend the way, way back in history and the on the days that the pub, hutch,

bruce presented the landlord ways. the scarlet oven bag, who was involved in the indian mutilate, and was close and published by being fired from a kind of the ad fullest. she was very hesitant to give an interview and the reason that she told me was that his business days ago and is the past, it's dead, but it happened. and it's, it's, it happened, nobody can change it. so why discuss about that? why talk about that? i think there's a lot of a media in, in the beginning go to it about of the colonial bonds. they have, they was a continuous stream of an armstrong, a violent and a very bloody on struggle as well. right from what was known in the 1st uprising in 1857. the 1946 when we had a naval and an army mutiny. so throughout this entire stream,

there were lots of people who would know who would that ever use these? and then we use the movement in india, the, the, the, this month, like i might be, you might be best bite with them on the,

as you can see, it's quite too is the, a lot of people come here. when i even do the bit, there's museums in the museum. i didn't see people were really bad to loan anything they were just data in my opinion. do um, as students do just just see in the different sections of the countries, what kind of artifacts are made because they have different styles. i don't see a point of the artifacts that belong to us became dead. and in, in london, a bit in as an excuse for 4 people, you know, in history. oh, i think we are in front of the most controversial narrative act, in my opinion,

in the british museum, which is the sword. and the rings in both fume of the was of done is it, is it reminders of the colonialism that a good in india queued if you, if you read these a descriptions, you will find that they have very explicit needed in that disorder. and that the link was actually taken from his dead body after he was candid ancestors protected these objects without a blood they lost their lives for it. um, you know, they, they've been trained to give them the respect to these object. the 1st entities, the least we can do, is convince all the nations to give these off to expect to us. at the time of my grandparent's test, they had said, well, now the search for this or it is, is your duty. i've been looking for the source for quite some time. and it was in

this, in october of 2018. there was a time when the hindus believe the ancestors come back to visit for a 2 week period. i saw that there was an announcement for an auction, and it was the auction of general, which is never metals. but in the story was a piece of information saying that in fact, he had kept this particular sort. it'd passed on in the family. and one of his defendants and 1965 had donated it to the round archery institution. the i contacted throughout much henry and said you have the sword. and they took about 3 months and they finally confirm that they, they have it and they were able to locations. and it was in a, in a case that hadn't been opened. it seems for a very long time. and uh, anyway,

they confirmed that they had it, they sent me some, some photographs the so what is important for my family and this sort? there is a concept in hinduism called pittsbur dish. this is the idea that your ancestors may have done something bad for something bad. may have been done to them, but you is just sentence, carry the comma of those events and those acts. and so there is a disturbance that enters into the family. in other words, it's like a collective traumatic consequence of events. and in order to put those things to rest, you need to either perform certain ceremonies, or in this case,

the return of the sword is really about putting to arrest the effects of history. so they'll be individuals in my family who to have risen to a certain success, and then it just dissipates. one can see this repeating pattern of individuals arise and then for rise and then for rise in the following stream, the quickly. and so this is a very typical comment, consequence quoted through dish which in which basically the ancestors are trying to get your attention to fix the situation. so you can move on peacefully or what do you do in social emotional learning? well, the question though, like each each station has question. and the question for social emotional learning of who had been their friends in 5th grade who are here? i'll go pretend share social emotional day because some kids both

on say, but they didn't have friends until they couldn't share about friends because that enough friends action instead of deep deep well maybe like creat fluctuate and i could meet you was pharmacy. that's how lift gates had. he was in prison. how can i do night? the society divided into wonderful cost feeds and communities in that these $30.00 and the jews in the dogs that goes on is that inconvenience, lack of sense of food on the you need a strong black funding. and i assume that it's creates a really no one this then a do will provide you with that data, actually many streams of the little feet and struggle. uh,

one common narrative that is that's being held is that it was largely a non violent moment. of course, the pleasure that month, month on the, the congress put on the british judge to model persuasion to ensuring that to you know, to the non violent movement actually rang through the conscience of the colonial press. the dentist, i gave him a formula. they said 19 o 8 before 90 came on the scene. he said, don't join the a doctor. see, don't join that army. he said that has been in saving. you don't join the quotes if you can do non cooperation on these 3 sectors. you will paralyze several guys. it does not happen before got to do because we need that exam the to actually put all together. we need to gundy. could you give us a simple message which even then add a stroke expert, understand? and.