works throughout the day that so i said to have happen between lucas trying to and for goes and it seems like it and so calmly and quickly and not progressions that he's turning back. you know, he's hoping me. so do you think this is the end of the nasa? it's hard to imagine that it could and that this, um you, you have essentially had a uh, a military mute neg, there wasn't a mute and a of all of the people in wagner because they, they were led by per goshen. it was really a mute and a my per goes against a real estate. it seems to me against russia. and i think something will have to be done. one of the lessons of this is that it can be very dangerous to have an independent military force that is not subject to the borders of the president of russia. and you, you can,

you can use these mercenary groups here and there, but if they become so large, eventually they literally endanger the country that produced up we, we had black water blackboard or was a group here in the united states that for many of the battles and the men lease, they were mercenary group to slide to wagner. overtime their public support eroded and they never became nearly as large as wagner was. so i think this is a lesson learned here. you never want to allow a mercenary force where it had with so much independence to gain the power to literally threaten the government, the capital city. and obviously, all the western mainstream media outlets and also politicians have been watching

closely the exhaust kind of events. we've seen of the past few hours in russia, the wall street journal is not reporting to the us intensity, postpone and introduction of new sanctions against the evocative group due to this situation. how would you explain that, considering the events? well, i think what has happened is there's all just a sense of nervousness among all of the nato countries. but at the idea that the chain of command in russia could suddenly become fragmented. russia is one of the world's 2 greatest nuclear powers. up until now, russia has been led by president, put in to really is, is a rocks daddy. com influence. it's been

a blessing to the world that she has not been a bow, a tile emotionally driven individual. because he has managed to maneuver very smoothly and prevent things from getting out of hand. i think, to some extent, there may have been a few. i met all the way from washington to london to, to borrow land. hey, you know, all of a sudden if we don't have someone from where you're in control of what's happening in russia, what does that mean in terms of the risk of nuclear escalation? that may have been part of the calculation is just this idea that there's only so much on certainty that the world can deal with right now. the twin cities. he has been a for guys and because in recent months we've seen him make various out,

but i agree post online voice knows and videos and condemning the russian government at times. and then what do you speaking out of line issues like that? and people are saying that maybe he feels like kitchen odds with such a impunity because of the success is all the voc in the military group on the battlefield. what does the future hold for him now? what is he going to be able to get away with? this is what i'm asking as well, i don't think he is. and pod is very interested in watching this, this bottle, the current bottle on folders, ukrainian counter offensive of ukraine through 3 of its elite found back per gauge against a russian defenses. and in 2 weeks, they have not been able to reach the 1st major defensive line. they have just

hid up against a steel wall. now, here's a time, a steel all the time. use the uh, the wagner group has not been involved at all. uh, production tungsten way was the, literally the russian army and he just indeed was slave was, was creating tensions. and there were so many russian soldiers of the regular army who fought magnificently the 4th to the debt and for him to, to denigrate them to be little of their sacrifice. a nation which is very selfish, very narcissistic. and i think to the russian high command, they wanted to, to demonstrate that they will win this victory and they're going to do it without the wagner forces. they would have been delighted to have wagner standing shoulder

to shoulder and fighting this battle with them. but instead except for goshen was making a march on ma scale for crying out loud. this is bizarre. so i think it's going to be quite over to the russian people for the duma to the president that they have for goshen heading up. this is great on it, just i, i can't imagine that he will continue in that role. well, everyone's heads up in tons, fine. what was happening in russia is today for the past 24 hours. of course, there's still a war going on in ukraine. what kind of run medications do you think these latest developments? how well have on the ongoing conflicts and ukraine? well, it's a lot clearer right now, but it was uh, several hours ago. um,

now that this has been settled for the time being i think i think if anything it's going to strength and rushes found it because now there will be more unity between the wagner forces and the russian regular russian army. i think the duo recognized that they must provide additional disciplinary resources to the russian army and to the president. the president must have additional already to act against things of that sort. so so, so there is, there's going to be a lot of a lot of ramifications, but i think on balance, just my sense thing is that russia will come out in a stronger position. and again,

you'll see it on the phone just within the next few days. it's a reminder also to people in the west of just how risky this gamble and ukraine has become a keep in mind to rush, you didn't want to have a war and ukraine, they didn't want to, you know, have to have to go into this very bloody battle this was put in place by president obama in 2014. when the c i a was ordered to assist in over throwing legitimate government. i'm sorry, on a cool bitch, n t at the united states over through the government. now we didn't. so we do it, there certainly was a legitimate uprising, but the c i a and british m, i 6 intelligence they were there to us state department was present there. and

literally the issue we had, we had to victoria knew, one of the under secretary of state for ford for affairs today. she was on the ground and she was intercepted over her cell phone, selecting who would be the ministers of the new government. and from there, 2014, we poor and weapons, we should we construct this, this powerful ukrainian army to attack the russian speaking areas along the border . and then ultimately, i think, to drive one into russia. and now here we are many thanks for joining us on the program. really appreciate your time and your insight. richard black, full of republican virginia senate i thank you and address to the nation earlier today, president who was involved. all those guilty of treason would be severely punished . hey, prompted the voc rebellion a stop in the back death threats to russian states hood. somebody shares. good, i'm addressing oldest citizens. right?

yeah. so so the ons role says lawrenceville. so i didn't see this one of the special services the fight as a mom does a now in that block ability to sions finished like thing against me. and we had somebody who was by the doing this can probably like the last night i spoke to the commodities. i used areas as my i'm also addressing those into steve onto the palm of a grave crime and all that is today. but actually was fighting for a few the couple fighting against aggression from neo nazis. and the amount is at least 12 against us who supplies the military with information and i cannot make it hard for the west photos room that we meet with, fighting for the life and security of all people to do it. do you fall, suffering, play, and independence for items to be agreed to remain in russia and create a country with a 100 g at all? what else? right, did you see a what you it's about? so when the lights of all nation is being decided, much than those and it causes us all to be nice. here is there. a unity is up when solid ation and responsibilities who really need your immunization and everything that makes us. we've got our must be put aside co upset,

i see any differences that may be used in all used by all enemies to disrupt us from within the shade. so. so the options to so that's all unity you basically renegade, use and use against those fighting and the frog and city. that's the, it's a stop in the box against our country at all nation, but for looks you and this stop was delta russia in 1972 we, while the country was fighting in well, well, what would do it if it's victory was stolen strongly? so what would that, what intrigues and bickering behind the nations bodies, 10 victims with great catastrophe, and actually get used to it? let's have a destruction of the army. and the collapse of the states was the most of the cost territories. and the tragedy of the civil war at the when russians went against russia, i knew enough. and when i'm brought the ones against bravo, even the book and various adventurous and foreign forces, profiting most of them, told the country a pa, your look beautiful. you know, we will not let that happen again. when you grow, we will defend our country and all the sites hoods from any thread is discussed with, including internal treason identities. if you,

what we are facing now is reason you out of the big i'm emissions and personal interest. they have let the trail of one's country one's nation. and the cost of which box is fights has and commodities were fighting along with the armed forces. the towns and villages of dumbasses, where they sold the model and gave their lives to the new russia. that's the unity of the russian. well, the name and glory have been betrayed by those who were trying to organize in on for 1000000000 position, pushing the country towards on a key, on fracture side, and ultimately to defeat and capitulation, whoops, renewal thing like the pete. any internal rebellion was the deputy threats while stated back to us as a nation. here on the i'm be, it's a blow against russia. if anybody again saw people at all action to defend all my beloved again, such as the threats will be harsh. view is a couple of old eyes who deliberately went on the poplar trees in a peasant on verbally and you end up preparing terrorist attacks when

a negatively be punished. have to worry about valley so they will be able to held accountable by going by still keep the bus beyond full system, given the necessary old ways you can use the additional empty terrace security measures have been imposed in most got even the most or region and a number of other regions, stuff with a decisive measures, will be taken to stabilize the situation and run it all on done, which still remains difficult. of the work of the civil and military organs of governance is essentially blocked wherever moving is as president of russia. now, come on dimension. as a citizen over russia, not, i will do everything in my power to defend the country, the one that will defend its constitution, most of the lives of security and liberties on the citizens. with the 2 of those who organized and prepared the on preventing the stone tons, weapons the games they come back home. right. so we built betrayed, rush off, they'll lift, which will be held accountable for that. or you can be able to, those aren't being drawn into a way that doesn't. i called upon you not to repeat the grave and tragic mistakes

and something to any lots as a patient in these criminal actions order from the see what i'm show that we will defend and protect what is the insight put to us together with all motherland to lead me will either come any old deal that i will becoming even strong kosky will get through the bulk of the chaise. yeah. can a pretty goshen has denied accusations of trees and claiming he was saving the country from ruined or blaming the ministry of defense for the car with this crisis . so how the dispute between vault the russian top ross to escalate to arms, we use any of these ecos on us, breaks down how soul stuff it. a quick reminder, it will begin on friday when uh, the head of the founder of the wagner group. you've given you pre gordon, he accused the russian defense menissi of shelling, one of its trainings sites deep from the home front. the russian defense ministry denied all such claims. they said that while the video that was posted by the telegram channels affiliated with the wagner groups,

which was reported to show the aftermath of the shelling, they said it was fake and that nothing of the sort happened. but you can, you precaution, he was already held bent on uh, continuing and it is now now that in hindsight it can be, we can say that he had it all planned in advance. and this is like a, it's like a chess game for him. and he did obviously saw that if you move that head to the suburbs of the city of photo owners and m h a time calico up to is reported to have made a hard landing with one person injured in the incident. yeah, crosses, police were being taken, pausing, baffled to in the russian army involved, could have finances aside from that stuff so, so, so it could, icing on social media of a post to be showing the daybreak of a k, a 50 to helicopter, which is came to have been shut down by the vault group and the city itself is reported. the crew were killed. so i'm going to fight is also reports be attempted to shoot down another russian army highly concepts. the ad classes, however,

is said to us, deployed very slowly, flags to guides. the missiles also in verona is a launch. 5 is raging as an oil. that goes with a $155.00. is it currently bossing the slaves? and also spraying near by storage units to keep them cool to prevent the fire spreading, no casualties have been reported as yet, and the spanish movies and the russian capital forces have been deployed to secure approaches to the city. our case of being set up with the trip supposed to be taking up positions in southern most military equipment was supposed to the different sides. moving across the city with ahmed personnel. carriers stationed along highways on the approaches to west the most sky with us while local authorities have announced count to tara may assist and now in operations in the capital with all nice public events, canceled the situation on the streets, remains calm with the most goodness, saying there are no restrictions on entry or exits to the city,

although the limitations on the use of personal transpose in means of communication with most contact points on the outskirts of most good being puts in place for extra security check. media blog design, publications of goals are being bullied by authors. he's against the store thing official information. most goes, matt has declared monday, a known working day and announce security service on high alert some of the concepts harrell operation. in order to minimize risks, we have decided to declare monday, a non working day, with the exception of authorities in essential services, the military industrial complex city services. we ask you to refrain from traveling around the city as much as possible. traffic may be blocked in certain blocks and on certain roads, city services are operating on high alert. things are a little bit different as russian president vladimir put announced earlier, anti terrorism measures have been put into place here in moscow,

but also in the greater moscow region. and we have reports of checkpoints that have been set up and also national security personnel that are on alerts. now these anti terrorism measures have also been stood up in a nother city for it on this, which is about part way between here in moscow, and are also found on where wagner group fighters faced off against russian military earlier. now what exactly does this mean? what are these measures? well the last time they were used was in 1991 during and attempted to by a communist party hardliners against then president mikhail gorbachev. and they're really, really rarely used, but exceptionally, in this particular case. and what they mean is that checkpoints are set up that interception of communications, including email and telephone calls can occur. searches

of bags or cars can occur at check points. people can also be asked to produce identification. so these measures are really exceptional. but um, for now, people are out and enjoying the weather and things don't seem to be too much different here in downtown laska a circus president just held a phone call with a lot demand page and expressing his support. there are some lead to is also said to be in touch with the heads of neighboring states, including bella, rooster's, bank, as done as catholics done to keep them updated on events. however, the russian foreign ministry claims, as certain of the countries appears to be watching with play. the rebellion plays into the hands of russia's external enemies. we warn western countries against any hints about the possible use of the internal russian situation to achieve the rest of the goals. our country will continue its suffering course to ensure its security,

protect its values, strengthened its authority in the international arena, and form adjust multi polar world order western mainstream media didn't take long to pick up the story with headline speculated single to 2 of quoting and verified information adding fuel to the media via voices, for example, posted an article, a slicing of sol pending, wagner had taken control of the city over put on is a spike that being denied by regional officials for now wisdom politicians also to be just monitoring the on folding events in russia with food giving any official reaction for sidelines. they've been speculating when the potent era will be over and whether he'll be overthrown. the as always overlay to start days can be found on our website. all t dot com will be back for the very latest in 30 minutes. see you then the,

and we've told you in the past about the us department of veterans affairs. it's an enormous sprawling bureaucracy and is one of the most poorly run departments in the entire us government investigators. they are deal on a daily basis with things like fraud, investment,

drug crimes and other white color issues. but imagine going to work one day and learning that you're not needed to investigate these routine white color crimes. instead, you're needed to investigate a serial killer. and even worse, a medical serial killer assessed you a pass who works under color of helping patients as a medical professional, a doctor or a nurse. i'm john kerry onto welcome to the whistle blowers the . 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 our next guest is that rare person who has seen the darkest part of the underbelly of society. ru sacrament is a renowned investigator specializing in tracking down medical serial killers and is in demand as a consultant on the subject all over the world. he's a former special agent in charge of the ne field office of the criminal

investigations division in the us department of veterans affairs office of the inspector general, where he was responsible for criminal investigations into a 195 veterans affairs facilities. he's a licensed private investigator and is the president of the society of professional investigators. in addition to his professional credentials, he's the co author of the highly acclaimed book behind the murder curtain. special agent, bruce, sacrament, hunts doctors, and nurses who kill our veterans. bruce sacrament. welcome to the show. we are so happy to have you as well. thank you very much. i'm actually honored to be here today while the pleasure is online. i've been looking forward to this for a long time. i have to tell you this conversation is, is going to be fascinating for me personally. there are probably fewer than a dozen people in the united states who have had a career focused on serial killers and even fewer who have focused on medical

serial killers. before we get to that specialization, tell us a little bit about your career and about how you got started in investigations too . well, um, i started investigations probably by watching too many colombo, you know, um, not being a big, tough, dirty harry kind of guy. but i used to watch columbia and i so you know, i could do that. this guy is more brains in braun and i really like that. so i started out as an investigator with the us department of defense and i was investigating contract fraud and procurement for a line. and it was pretty interesting. and then jimmy carter way back when began offices of inspector general's in every federal agency. so every page of federal agency at that time and now just about every agency has an office of inspector general and most offices of inspector general all kind of torn to

different directions. one is in the office of the what it and one is an office of criminal investigations. i was responsible for the office of the criminal investigations for the ne united states. and i had a tremendous smorgasbord if you will have cases to pick and choose from. because hospitals well hospitalized big cities and any kind of crime that could occur in a big city could almost kind of happened in the hospital. you know, we had procurement for or contract for what we had drug diversion. think of all the narcotics that are in the hospital. i mean we have the most complex scientific equipment to inexpensive items like diapers and everything in between. and we have with very, very concerns about medical records about the security and medical records. so running the hospital is a very, very complex job, and unfortunately the as

a big opportunity for some criminal activity. now with the v a, i must preface my remarks by saying that the old will well bring majority of the am for the most honest hard working, dedicated compassion and people you'd ever want to meet. absolutely, yes, no, that being said, there is a very, very tiny percentage of people that will take advantage of the system. and unfortunately they have victims on nations fewer roads. and that's really thermal. so i was really on it in 2 respects. i was on it to be in federal law enforcement. and i was honored to have a position that worked out for veterans that actually helped us secure safety and security and the best health possible for

a nation's heroes. it was a wonderful, wonderful position to be. and you had a long career at the department of veterans affairs. tell us about the case that made you an expert on medical serial killers. i have to assume that somebody doesn't just wake up one day and decide to start killing people. they operate on detected sometimes for many years and we're talking about doctors and nurses here. how did this all begin in that big case? well, you know, i'm working all these other cases that i just described. and all in one day, my phone rings, and i get a call from the chief of psychiatry at the northwood long island, b a medical center. and she says, bruce, oh, you're not gonna believe this. but we have a doctor working here who spent time in prison for poisoning his co workers. and i'm looking at the phone and i'm from looking at my calendar. it says this

april 1st is this like some kind of april fools, a joke or something. you know, and she says, no, bruce, this is really true. now what? i didn't think in the united states of america, you could spend time in prison for poisoning people and come out and be a physician. so i was wrong and natural, it started the story of a dr. michael swain. know the michael's wine will kill people, not only united states. he told people with a world do you know when he was in medical school, john, when he was a medical school, he was known as double swine. go license to kill all my gosh. fellow students in medical school and then to the dean and they said, you know, the, we don't think these guys when bill should really be a physician and the dean said, what do you know your only students on the dean. i think he could be a doctor, but i think he needs more training. so let's keep him for about 6 months longer.

right. next thing, you know, he ones up in ohio state university and he's killing people. and he winds up being in m e n t, and he actually toys him, his co workers invited his co workers and he said, hey guys, you know, you work so hard, have some donuts in the donuts and they all got sick that night. and he calls them up, he says, tell me, will you symptoms tell me everything that happens. he's re losing the excitement of poisoning people, not only when he actually put the boys in on these donuts, but healing how they suffered. mm hm. and it turns out that the donuts were actually sprinkled with loss and made it easy. and these are not stupid. about 2 weeks later it comes to what some ice t and they have the ice t test it, and it's loaded with awesome. wow. and the police did a fantastic job and he gets 3 years in jail for boys and his co. ready marcus,

and then he comes out and he's a doctor again. it to be a lot. it seems impossible. how can anybody pass a government background investigation and have your license? yeah, and have your license reinstated? yes. well, i'll tell you this, this guy. it's an incredible sociopath, you know, he will, he was an ex marine and he got out of prison. and he gave the store, he says, you know, i'm an ex marine, i got fine. i got an a bottle in the roll. but here's a piece of paper from the governor, restoring my civil rights. nobody checked it, nobody verified it. and the next thing, you know, the guy is a doctor again, this time out in the west coast. and it'd be a facility and he's doing well. he's actually in the.