to you but this danielle was put in the middle of the hello welcome to world a part of today can just congratulating itself on the long piece here is now in the midst of a blog and possibly quite protracted conflict. what's left here is how long it may take until please return the call to discuss that i'm now enjoying vines in our back. and european problem is number representing alternative for germany. mr. black is great to talk to thank you very much for being available. my pleasure. and

good afternoon to you now. uh, let me start with a personal question because alternative for germany really in russia is often for trade as this party and off. i don't know how to put it diplomatically, somewhat crude crude and not particularly enlightened walters. and yet uh uh, judging from your condemning background, if you haven't advised a green law, utah. 7 as an ox for then the london school of economics, you wrote the book on emanuel con, um with such as color, lee and intellectual background. why did you off for this particular party? well, let me make 2 points 1st. it's greg. yes, i did study. so small i philosophy and politics at, at oxford university and i've written books on a manual, cabs, legal reasoning, and the european court of justice. these are strongly books and they, and alter the late political. now, there is

a common misconception that if you will receive the decent education, you'll see that there's a ton into a politically correct, liberal, internationalist, and perfectionist. that is not by you. i think the purpose of education is to make you critical, including self critical and enlightened as it should enable you to question received wisdoms as president periods. and that's what i've been doing all day long at now to my 2nd point, the a f d a is a young party. and what you've tried to put spa, well, possibly diplomatic, late ad i think you have to say is to bad minds. we are young party, which means we have lots of edits of politicians. it is great to say that some of

my colleagues are perhaps not always chosen the most last and the magic way of putting it. however, it matches of politics. you also sometimes have to be political to express, i'm profitable tubes and then secondly, you can imagine we all talk to you that is questioning practically every aspect of the political consensus, a west germany, in particular, since the mall. that's a relentless pain. be waged against us by the late fee. okay. finance. the, the, the, just as i was kind of late origin. let me just pull that down to the campaign against russia as president, 24 by the same media and germany. speaking about the matters of politics, i know that in the, in europe and problem if you are a member of the identity and democracy group as well as a participant of the conference on the future of your how do you see the

relationship between identity and democracy and do they have any place in the future if you're, as well as to questions we are asking here, the relationship is a close. well, we know that a few democratic countries that uh, they don't have a strong sense of identity. usually that's a sense of national identity, although i exception switzerland's isn't very good example though you can say that have a sense of national identity based on a particular political emancipation struggle against interior parts of all of them . so it's, as we said, it has an identity which is multinational, and the same to some extent could be said about the united states. all the democracy has generally involved in the case in the, in the context of nation states. now to the 2nd part of your question, whether the avia is fairly clear, both democracy and um,

identity, especially national identity in western europe and the french, mrs fund, the president to the european commission as announced that she wants to bring the homes of millions of non european people to europe in the next 10 to 15 years. in my view, national identity cannot survive such a massive influx of people that have no causal roots in europe. and if i may a search point um i had on the calculations on that roughly as present. one of the germany's population is partly for you, the large and present trends of immigration continue even that to diminish level. and this is all in both rate remains as low as it stays. germany will cease

to be ever jar t, joe in the country by something like 2075. and mr. black can i? uh so he is here for a 2nd because i'm sure you know what the people on the other side of the political spectrum would say, and they would see your comments as xena fall big. but having read with you have a sad about migration. i think you're making more of a sudden, social and institutional argument that it takes, you know, a certain percentage of people, a lot of in society are rooted in its culture. what it is in its ways of lives to preserve that way of life and to develop it and to move it forward. why do you think? and i mean, the field of sense, so see old, you so well developed across europe. i mean, there is a department of wholesale and in any major university, why is it not taken as a practical consideration? why is it always discussed within the framework of publicity or skin color? where's, you know,

traditions they do have certain and very practical value for ensuring stable and comfortable lives by you, by employees very clearly, i need to level rates on these. i think is, society can be stabilized by very great rapid changes. we also have this view of immigration. now why is this part of these settings simple view which was calling place and you're up until about 30 years ago. nowadays, ostracized as some kind of, i'll try the incentive, so it'd be a huge view. now the reason for this, eh, seems to be quite a yeah, because the kind of liberal agenda we see the west now is not community reason based, but it's a kind of quays i really just creed. and that file to crowd out are all sorts of realistic, practical objections to validation,

all creating a kind of city on the hill on of okay, can i ask you about one other thing that has much more direct relevance to where i am in russia and where my relatives are in the ukraine, i'm talking about the war in europe. and i think here again, another very important to you or put in traditional was it's not broken down. totally rejected. and i'm talking about this notion on the european a balance of power or balance of security because you're of, as we all know how it has had many wars. but one of the resolves on that war is a 2nd. diplomatic and international relations culture that is rooted in the balance of interest and about a balance of power and for a long time it was respected in the you know, one could argue that the long piece that i mentioned in the beginning was also a result of that, but uh, this tradition seems to be fully rejected in the case of ukraine because no russia,

security interest even taking into consideration and haven't been taken for quite some time. and secondly, the europeans have, when we put our older, you know, secure disabilities in the american vasquez. why? what has happened to europe that has been tried and tested by war? so many for so for such a long time? well, the sad fact is that the lodge, the last great european war is now what he's a very a, it was, it happened a few years ago. my mother experienced states as a child. and the last thing she would have a one is a nano more and touch and ration for the baseball, just perpetual vis, that'd be provided. but most europeans dom i've got to go now and we've seen significant changes in the educational system where history often stops in the post flow era. so much is football. i think that is one reason.

secondly, i think you are slightly misrepresenting the traditional realism of your cuz you're thinking, i agree. it's a very important tradition, but because you're dominated intellectually for several centuries, practically, or the traditions of liberal, of international relations also originate in europe. so if you take a manual test, he was surprised to introduce the notion of the lead those nations. this is a more ideal regarding tradition of european, a international relations c k. so the religious tradition is why important, why, but the labs sort of the right, it's been forgotten. i think the reason is part of the that, you know, is a much diminished continent. the europeans don't need any way and you don't go and

you've got a positional input turns. well, some people do is they want to be at least the last, the greatest models on the world in the world. and i think that's part of what is made to bait in europe. yeah, it started the motivating job. well hey, you know, i'm studying psychology on the side. i have a great interest in depth psychology of carl young. and that he has actually explored the trends in the collective unconscious quite extensively. he wrote a lot about the knots as an arm and then as a, as a suppression. all file who you have to we are and you know when uh, when i see these people that you are also referring to only concerns with the future. only concerns with the illusions north, as being informed by the past, but out on history isn't it? i know it comes across as a form of south only nation by that form of self in the holy nation. we know it

from psychology, it always produces hatred, then not just hatred of somebody else, but it's usually also a self hatred that down it is projected on to other nations. do you think it has anything to do with the current demonization of rush or all perhaps other countries like china, where you run ash? east sledges. cool, cool. so what do i say in the cold? but there was, there is an event, a previous need? sure. it is a characterization of relations make some very similar points. i myself made the point that impotence maybe at the source of a diminished position to ha, i think in the case of russia, there's another element. russia is labeled understood in western europe. a final point is that the west, germany, in particular, has been integrated into western structures for 7075 years. now,

whether it reads of a great amount of product, uh and uh, into gratian into western systems, or thinking through education and to get his job or the i found from west job need a, a buddy, nice job. and he, i think there is a much greater skepticism towards the receive western literal directive. so it's probably an east west by the europe goals. and to present the method is complicated then from russia's position, not necessarily the favorable way. because then he, 30 years ago, 35 years ago, the soviet union dominated eastern europe. so i think the president is set a set of southern eastern europe is security, good sense? okay. well, mr. back we have to take a very short break right now for the sake of our editorial security,

but he will be back in just a few moments. stay tuned. the the

hi, i'm rick sanchez. and i'm here to plan with you whatever you do. do not watch my new show. seriously. why watch something that's so different opinions that he won't get anywhere else. welcome to please or do you have the state department to see i a weapons bankers, multi 1000000000 dollar corporations. choose your fax for you. go ahead. change and whatever you do, don't marshall state main street because i'm probably going to make you uncomfortable. my show is called stretching time, but again, you probably don't wanna watch it because it might just change the way you the

welcome back to wells, of course, with our back, you are a member representing alternative for germany and mr. brand. before they break, we discussed the, you know, this multi faceted and very complicated attitude that the some germans have to with russia. and i've heard the say in one of the other interviews that many of your colleagues at the european opponent that's filled with hatred, not only for russian, but for the kind of conservative traditionalism that russia represents. do you think these people who are filled with hatred, do they even understand the what the russia tries to revolve in the world? what it tries to base its and the identity on? what do you have to be in the eyes of the part of it? we have about one on one and a half minutes, so i often have to be had to use shore time. traditional conservatism was such as

salt and i think the factors that play russia, i think such a basic issue such as a decent standard of living, ask you a very important the government has to be very concerned about a security, a basic comforts to the population. that's one aspect and the other a point is in your book, i think historically education has suffered. so for many europeans they a judge majestic ebc um, prior to something like 1960, so the, his history starts to the sexual cultural revolution of the 1960s. and they reject anything that went on before. so i think that is part of the problem, the most about decision makers in your now operate in a strictly

a historical manner. they sometimes told the story compatible deals, but they are very involved. now you mentioned the russians government, the focus on the standards of living and european politicians on the country often talk about and spit, aspirational and inspirational values, but ensuring basic safety. ensuring basic, um services is not just the value in since you 2 of the government and that maybe it just my russian bars. but i wonder, is part of the problem here is indeed the could be conflict between governmental judges and governmental aspirations and the, and the total rejection of the europeans of the former. because a, if we analyze the recent decisions, including the binding of all trades with russia, it looks like the living standards of europe in citizens a non before a spray or it's in the caching. oakley, i think,

for the last 55 years living standards for at least possible relation. most of europe has not improved this as simple as that. now they are declining as a result of the inflation, which is at least partly resolved to be coronado dogs plus the bed as a new, great and the kind of inspirational and s a rational value catalogue. that all politicians are constantly invoking at these ideas are very far removed from the concern of those most people. so yes, in that respect. yeah, absolutely right. most european governments say that people and possibly that's also what that's of at the core of the ukrainian crisis. because i think the government, the refresher for years have been stating that they have a duty to protect the interest secure a dentist. it's not just an aspiration of value, it's something that we have to act upon. we have our military for that besides

reason, but all we heard in response was this some exploration of value. so some of you are being politicians and the ukrainians. now i wonder if this call, if this dilemma between or you know, heart disease and aspirational valleys, if it could have been resolved without an armed conflict, given your understanding what's been happening in your brain not have from february of last year. but the a couple of decades prior to that, i think you've given me a lot of times arise and that makes altering the question easy. because i think that be that a little i be added to the rush. i the immediately, immediately the coast. oh ok. somebody you got to was west of your country is taken as big remarkably generous. if your countries are treated the, the, as well as russia has in the last 33 to 34

years. russia agreed to read is cation without a body practically, nbc. when we touch the back, i just want to say, this is the way russia treat in just germany. of this is a historic tradition of resolving conflict for us, right? the was the same case with napoleonic wars, the russian welcoming friends back into the family of european countries, not taking any contribution. it's a consistent then philosophical approach that the russian state has taken over a century is not just over the last century. i gave you the one example that i do about best. so what that was if you want me to put the the board general tubs, there was a very, a distinct approach to see them. so relations with west west of europe. and that's the law of lee, the property we boss. so then was that a little that much?

i bought a me ton. so if your cost to the bank concessions and your cost of k baycove shows and that will cause a good ton. well, then at some stage you, they change your approach. i see what we have to realize is that of the waves and driven off by the united states, the federal clubs, so to russia, in russia, excepting the great deal of beaks, is really expensive. so they are already installed at the american side this you, they called just march about forward, and that does surprise, that doesn't degree. now the european. so i think i'll just be surprised of you because i see have a more rational attitude. they, we go, they, it's bull as a kind of a tug, a, the european so often distracted by the idea of this think. well, um i guess it's easy to be an ideal list when the time is a good and i,

i've heard many experts say that the e u. us partnership was always on the american terms. but at least you have the benefit of the foreign direct investment and relatively fair trade, whether it's no longer the case. i think the terms of your partnership changing very rapidly and you're bound to give much more and receive much, much less there. i mean, the american policy towards your, of a is pretty hawkish is if not predatory, at this point of time, given the industrial capacities at that are being transferred to the united states . now, how long do you think it will take until be european voters? they'll be you are paying for additions, but then your team voters will fail the pinch and we'll demand something, something different from their leaders. what you've chosen very hoss was focusing credit address. i like to defend the united states and this would god. yeah, just being rational from the point of view, i think is the european reaction. that's very nice effects. what it is for us all

to the europeans, primarily allowed themselves to be ported. that's a position the united states is just doing marketing their interest to be facts. but it's in another respect, i see got off the wall during the cold war. the united states required compliance in military and foreign policy matches. but they had ton, of course, guarantee a highly the standards that's comfortable that the alliance with the united states . western integration is becoming increasingly expensive for your many europeans as yet to minority weight. indeed, twitch, best men, how the politicians also there is a die called to be how long it will take. i cannot tell you, by the way, can i ask her? this is something that is absolutely puzzling to many of us uh,

in uh, russian, particularly those who live in saint petersburg area, which is a city with huge german heritage, china, very strong cultural ties with germany. and this is also a city where many of the gas projects are originated. for example, the north stream pipelines were built uh from the, from that side of the bolted cost and given all the explosions and the recent statements, for example, from uh, how, how we, uh, prime minister uh, oregon. uh saying that it seemed thousands excluded to a possible repeat of sides incidents. i just wonder, do you think you do your pains with amber, one to know what actually happened to enter that own energy infrastructure on the, i mean, i understand there is a refresher. but on the fearful that's something like that could happen in europe at this day and age. the clear questions i can give you. yeah, i'll says no european governments don't want to know the people for the most part

had a suspicion. what happens? uh, an awesome day they couldn't care less or what of the precious climate which makes it very difficult to go on a spade a spade because our government has systematically a void, a serious investigation. awful. okay. dollars the attacks that terminated, they do not wish it. they don't, well they know, they don't wish it to be widely that i know i hear part of that, but the russia has experience a number of terrorist attacks by ukrainian militants just today. and i think it's pretty clear that if the waterville come, ever closer to russia, russia will respond. do you think people in europe understand that the, you know, the, the time for illusions is over the, it's in there is a real war on the ground in russia, in ukraine. and if it continues,

it may come to europe as well. no, they don't understand that property speaking. i think some people as i'm kind of a mobile i'm office feel, but the last raise will happen so long ago that most people think this method can somehow be localized. if they were fully aware that this tool may escalate and because the interesting paradox, let's assume the waste is right. and they can really push russia back. uh, get your grade to push my shot back for would you be so can you, can you spell out the, the, me, you, yes, i'm just trying to sort of summarize what some people i think is the best the greatest actually said that because russia isn't said he gets hold on, the ben may push back on the back. i don't think that burst europe. he has had an

adequate conception that these circumstances, a great power life about shots, well respond with any means edits, disposal, i'd like to be. i'd like to leave it as an id. tell them it is that it's clear once, i mean, i guess the best europeans are web is absolutely not. and so one thing united states or so, so with china, i mean, it's a, it's a, you know, international, a politics $1.00 and $1.00. i mean, it's the, the basic uh thing that the people study in international affairs plus. now, can i ask you the last, the very last question because you don't sound very opportunistic, but uh, what's your best home for the next couple of years as far as russia, europe and the whole world is concerned. i guess you're right. i know by disposition, an optimist, and the last decade is generally to me, right. but obviously we'll have to do once. we can also said that even at the end,

tomorrow we should call to these by law street. so i think we have to reach an understanding in the ukraine. this little has to be brought to an end. i can give you an easy solution what this might be. but what i don't know is that this is a grave danger to you. and he's already wrecking our economy is no longer, it's not doing anyone any good, certainly not to europe. so we have to do what we can to a mr. bad has been great pleasure talking to thank you very much for your time. but thank you, and i couldn't agree more with your task website. you very much. thank you. thank you for watching hope to hear again well the part the

so what we've got to do is identify the threats that we have. it's crazy, even foundation, let it be an arms race is on all sides. very dramatic. the only personally, i'm going to resist. i don't see how that strategy will be successful, very unclear to get a time time to sit down and talk the .