use last year just wonderful benz was a jersey, i'm sorry, sorry, a dirty so. sorry we so we have run out of time on a see from plaza told into thank you so much here. and so i really, really appreciate it. very enlightening things again while they go that route, so i will be back to the top of the hour. we'll see you soon. the . the hello. welcome to world a part of today kansas, congratulating himself on the long piece. here is now in the midst of

a blog and possibly quite protracted conflict. what's left here is how long it may take until please return the call to discuss that i'm now enjoying buying sooner. back and european problem is number representing alternative for germany. mr. back is great to talk to thank you very much for being available. my pleasure and good afternoon to you now. uh, let me start with a personal question because alternative for germany really in russia is also in for trade as this party. um, oh, i don't know how to put it diplomatically, somewhat crude crude and not particularly enlightened walters and yet uh uh, judging from your condemning background, if you have an advanced degree in law, utah. 7 as an ox for them, the london school of economics. you wrote the book on emanuel con um with such a scholarly and intellectual background. why did you off for this particular party? well, let me make 2 points 1st. it's greg. yes,

i did study the small i philosophy and politics at at oxford university and i've written books on a manual, cabs, legal reasoning, and the european court of justice. these are scholarly books and the adults are badly political. now, there is a common misconception that if you've received a decent education, you know, she's willing to play to in to politically correct, the liberal into nationalist and perfectionist. that is not by you. i think the purpose of education is to make you critical, including self critical, and these items. and it should enable you to question received wisdoms as president opinions. and that's what i'd be doing all day long at now to my 2nd point, the a f d a d is

a young party. and what you've tried to put spa, well, possibly diplomatically, as i think that to me seems to bear in mind. we are young party, which means we have lots of edits of politicians. it is great to say that some of my colleagues are perhaps not always chosen the most last and due to magic way of putting it. however, it matches of politics. you also sometimes have to be political to express, i'm talking about tubes, and then secondly, you can imagine we all talk to you that is questioning practically every aspect of the political consensus, a west germany, in particular sense no more. that's a relentless tongue. pain be waged against us by the policy. um yeah. finance the just as i was kind of late or really late, let's pull that down to the campaign against russia as president,

24 by the same media in germany. speaking about the matters of politics. i know that in the european problem, if you are a member of the identity and democracy group as well as a participant of the conference on the future of your how do you see the relationship between identity and democracy and do they have any place in the future, if you're, as well as to questions we are asking here, the relationship is a curse. we know that a few democratic countries that uh, they don't have a strong sense of identity. usually that's a sense of national identity, otherwise, exception switch, southern disability. so i'll put, although you can say that have a sense of national identity based on a particular political emancipation struggle against interior powers of all of them . so it's, as we said, it has an identity which is multinational. and the same to some extent could be

said about the united states and europe. democracy has generally involved in the case in the, in the context of nation states. now to the 2nd part of your question, whether the opposite is fairly clear, both democracy and um, a identity, especially national identity in western europe and the french mrs fund, the president to the european commission has announced that she wants to bring the homes of millions of non european people to europe in the next 10 to 15 years in my you, national identity cannot survive such a massive influx of people that have no causal rooms in europe. and if i may a search point um i had on the calculations on that roughly as

present. one of the all germany's population is partly for you the large and it present trends of immigration continue even that to diminish level. it isn't charlotte. both rate remains as low as it stays. germany was cease to be ever jar t john in the country by something like 2075. and mister brad, can i? uh so he is here for a 2nd because i'm sure you know what the people on the other side of the political spectrum would say, and they would see your comments as xena fall big. but having read with you have a sad about migration. i think you're making more of a sudden, social and institutional argument that it takes a, you know, a certain percentage of people, a lot of in society are rooted in its culture. what it is in its ways of lives to preserve that way of life and to develop it and to move it forward. why do you think and i mean,

the field of science socio and you're still well developed across europe. i mean, there is a department, the fulfillment in any major university. why is it not taken as a practical consideration? why is it always discussed within the framework of publicity or skin color? where's, you know, traditions they do have certain and very practical value for ensuring stable and comfortable lives by you one by point very clearly i need to elaborate on this. i think is, society can be stabilized by very great rapid changes also in the speed of immigration. now why is this further, these sudden simple view which was calling place and you're up until about 30 years ago. nowadays, ostracized some kind of tries into those xenophobic. you view now the reason for this eh. ringback seems to be quite a yeah, because the kind of liberal agenda we see the west now is not really reason based,

but it's a kind of quays i really just creed. and that file to crowd out of all sorts of realistic, practical objections to validation of creating a kind of city on the hill on of okay, can i ask you about one other thing that has much more direct relevance to where i am in russia and where my relatives are in the ukraine, i'm talking about the war in europe, and i think here again, another very important to you were put in tradition was it's not broken down. totally rejected. and i'm talking about this notion on the european a balance of power or balance of security because you're of, as we all know, how has had many wars. but one of the resolves on that war is a 2nd. diplomatic and international relations culture that is rooted

in the balance of interest and about a balance of power and for a long time it was respected and no one could argue that the long piece that i mentioned in the beginning was also a result of that. but distribution seems to be slowly rejected in the case of ukraine, because no russia security interest even taking into consideration and haven't been taken for quite some time. and secondly, the europeans have, when we put all their, you know, secure disabilities in the american vasquez. why? what did happen to europe that has been tried and tested by war so many for so for such a long time. well, the sad fact is that the launch uh that the last great funeral p moore is now what he's a very a, it was, it happened a few years ago. my mother experienced states as a child. and the last thing she was that old ones is a nano more and touch and ration for the baseball and his perpetual visit that'd be

provided by most europeans not much younger now. and we've seen significant changes in the educational system where history awesome sauce in the post era, so much as football. i think that is one reason. secondly, i think you are slightly misrepresenting the tradition of realism, that your kids thinking. i agree, it's very important tradition. but because you're dominated intellectually for several centuries, practically, or the traditions of liberal, of international relations also originate in europe. so if you take a manual chat, he was surprised to introduce the national, the lead those nations. this is the whole idea regarding tradition of european a international relations c k. so the religious tradition is why important,

why last or the right it's be forgotten. i think the reason is part of the that, you know, is a much diminished continent. the europeans don't need any way and you don't go and you've got a positional input turns. well, some people do is they want to be at least the last. the great is models on the well in the world. and i think that's part of what is mentioned back to europe after it started the most amazing job. well, hey, you know, i'm studying psychology on the side. i have a great interest in depth psychology of calling young and that he has actually explored the trends in the collective unconscious quite extensively. he wrote a lot about the knots and on and then as, as a suppression, all file where you have to, we are and you know, when uh, when i see these people that you are also referring to only concerns with the

future. only concerns with the illusions north as being informed by the past, but out on history isn't it? i know it comes across as a form of south only nation that form a self in a holy nation. we know it from psychology, always produces hatred. then not just hatred of somebody else, but it's usually also self hatred that down it is projected on to other nations. do you think it has anything to do with the current uh, demonization of rush or all perhaps other countries like china where you run or is slightly made. oh cool. so what do i say in the cold? but there was, there is that event, a free to is need sure, it is a characterization of certain relations make somebody some of the points. i myself made the point, this impotence maybe at the source of age diminished position. ha,

i think in the case of russia, there's another element. russia is labeled understood in western europe. the final point is that the west, germany, in particular, has been integrated into western structures for 7075 years now. whether it reads of a great amount of pro, but got a and a you to gratian into western systems. so thinking through education and to get his job in the account from west germany, a buddy's job. and he, i think there is a much greater skepticism towards the receive western liberal directive. so it's costly, an east west to buy the europe because at the present dimension is complicated then from russia's positions, not necessarily the favorable way. because then you 30 years ago, um,

35 years ago, the soviet union dominated eastern europe. so i think the president set a set of concerns in eastern europe is security. good sense? okay. well, mr. back we have to take a very short break right now for the sake of our editorial security, but he will be back in just a few moments. stay tuned. the, the, the,

[000:00:00;00] the welcome back to wells appliances with the are back a are a problem in member representing alternative for germany and mr. brand. before they break, we discussed the, you know, this multi faceted and very complicated attitude that the some germans have towards russia. and i've heard you say in one of the other interviews,

the menu of your colleagues of the european permanent that's filled with hatred. not only for russian, but for the kind of conservative traditionalism that russia represents. do you think these people who are filled with hatred, do they even understand the, what the russia tries to leave out in the world? what it tries to base it's and identity on what you have to be an ideal part of it . we have about one on one and a half minutes. so i often have to me how to use short time traditional conservatism with sasha, sorta. i think the factors that play russia, i think, such as basic issue such as the diesel standard of living, ask you a very important the government has to be very concerned about a security, a basic comforts to the population. that's one aspect and the other i a point is in your book,

i think historically education has suffered. so for many europeans they a general majestic ebc um class to something like 1960 . so the, his history starts to the sexual cultural revolution of the 19 sixties and they reject anything that went on before. so i think that is part of the problem, the most about decision makers in your now operate in the state be a historical man of they sometimes told his story, compatible deals, but they are very ill informed that you mentioned the russians government. the focus on the standards of living and european politicians on the country often talk about and spit, aspirational and inspirational values, but ensuring basic safety. ensuring basic um services is not just the value

insincere. 2 of the government and that maybe it's just my russian bars, but i wonder is part of the problem here is indeed the could be conflict between governmental judges and governmental aspirations. and the i found the total rejection of the europeans of the form. because a, if we analyze the recent decisions, including the binding of all trades with russia, it looks like the living standards of europe and citizens, a non deforest bray, or it's in the caching on the i think for the last, for the 5. yes. living standards for at least possible relation, most of your have not improved this as simple as that. now they are declining as a result of the inflation, which is at least partly resolved to be coronado dogs plus the that is a new grade. and that kind of inspirational and s rational value catalog,

that all politicians are constantly invoking at these ideas are very far removed from the concern of those most people. so yes, in that respect you absolutely right. most european governments say that people and possibly that's also what ends up at the core of the ukrainian crisis. because i think the government, the refresher for years have been stating that they have a duty to protect back interest, secure and interest. it's not just an aspiration of value, it's something that we have to act upon. we have our military for that besides reason, but all we heard in response was this some exploration of value. so some of you are being politicians and the ukrainians. now i wonder if this call, if this dilemma between or no heart disease and aspirational valleys, if it could have been resolved without an arm, possibly given your understanding what's been happening in your brain not have from

february of last year. but the a couple of decades prior to that, i think you've given me a lot of times arise and that makes altering the question easy. because i think that be very little. i be added to the rush. i'd be immediately immediately coast. oh, okay. some of your yeah, towards the west of your country is taken off as paid. remarkably generous. if your countries have treated java, the as well as russia has in the last 33 to 34 years. russia agreed to leave those days without a body practically nbc. when we touch the back, i just want to say, this is the way russia treated just germany of this is a historic tradition of resolving conflict for actually if it was the same case with napoleonic wars, the russian welcoming friends back into the family of european countries not taking any contribution and it's

a consistent then philosophical approach that the russian state has taken over centuries. not just over the last century, i gave you the example that i do about best. so what that was, if you want me to put the the board general tubs, there was a very, a distinct approach to see confirms of relations with west west of europe. and that's the law of lee. oh, not for the re boss. so then was that a little that much? i bought a me ton. so if you're close to the base of the concessions and your cost of k baycove, it shows initial cost saver ton. well then at some stage you may change your approach. i think what we have to realize is that you're to get the waves and driven off by the united states. people that are kind of such a rush off in russia except it's

a great deal to beach is really expensive. so the earliest thoughts and the american sizes you, they could just march about forward and that does surprise, that is my side doesn't degree. now the european. so i think i'll just be surprised about it because i see have a more rational attitude. they, we go the board as a kind of a top. okay. the other piece so often distracted by the idea of this think well, um i guess it's easy to be an ideal list when the time is a good and i, i've heard many experts say that the e u. us partnership was always on the american terms. but at least you have the benefit of the for, and direct investments and relatively fair trade. but it's no longer the case. i think the terms of your partnership changing very rapidly and you're bound to give much more and receive much, much less there. i mean, the american policy towards your, of a is pretty hawkish is if not predatory,

at this point of time, given the industrial capacity. is it that are being transferred to the united states? now, how long do you think it will take until be european voters? they'll be you are paying for additions, but then your team voters will fail the pinch and we'll demand something, something different from that leaders. what you've chosen very hoss was full kitchen, private address. i like to defend the united states and this would god. yeah, just being rational from the point of view, i think is the european reaction. that's very nice effects. what it is to follow on to the europeans primarily allowed themselves to be ported. that's a position the united states is just do a loss in their interest to be fat, but aids in and out of respect. i see got off the wall during the cold war. the united states required compliance in military and foreign policy matches. but

they ton guarantee a highly the standards that's come to that. the alliance with the united states, western integration, it's becoming increasingly expensive for your many europeans as yet to minority weight can be twitch, bus, man. how the ball politicians also there is a die called to be how long it will take. i cannot tell you, by the way, can i ask her? this is something that is absolutely puzzling to many of us uh, in uh, russian, particularly those who live in saint petersburg area, which is a city with huge german heritage, china, very strong cultural ties with germany. and this is also a city where many of the gas projects originated. for example, the north stream pipelines were built uh from the, from that side of the bolted cost and given all the explosions. and the recent um,

statements for example from uh how, how we uh prime minister uh, oregon. uh saying that seem doesnt exclude it to a possible repeat of sites incidents. i just wonder, do you think you'd be your pains with amber, one to know what actually happened to enter that own energy infrastructure on the i mean, i understand our fee refresher, but on the fearful that something like that could happen in europe at this day. and age the clear questions i can give you. yeah, i'll says the government don't want to know the people for the most part had a suspicion. what happens? uh. and the last day they couldn't care less or what of the oppressive climate which makes it very difficult to go on a spade a spade, because our government has systematically a void,

a serious investigation awful carried out the attacks that terminated. they do not wish it. they don't, well they know that they don't wish it to be widely there. i know i hear part of that, but the russia has experience a number of terrorist attacks by ukrainian militants just today. and i think it's pretty clear that if the waterville come, ever closer to russia, russia will respond. do you think people in europe understand that? uh, you know, the, the time for illusions is over the, it's, there is a real war on the ground in russia and ukraine. and if it continues, it may come to europe as well. no, they don't understand that probably speaking. i think some people, as i'm kind of a mobile, i'm office the but the last great what happened so long ago that most people think this better can somehow be localized if they were fully aware that it is full,

may escalate. and because the interesting paradox, let's assume the waste is right, and they can really push russia back. uh, get your grade to push my shot back for would you be so can you, can you spell out the, the, me, you yes, i'm just trying to sort of summarize what some people i think is the best the greatest actually said that because russia isn't sending it's whole, i mean they may push it back. i don't see that burst, your kids have adequate infection. they did these circumstances. a great power or life about shots, well respond with any means, edits, disposal, i'd like to be. i'd like to leave it as an id. tell them it is that it's clear once, i mean, i guess the best your p as our web is absolutely not. and so wouldn't be united states or so. so we'll china. i mean, it's a, it's a, you know, international,

a politics one and one. i mean, it's the, the basic uh thing that the people study in international affairs plus. now can i ask you? and the last, the very last question because you don't sound very optimistic, but what's your best hold for the next couple of years as far as russia, europe and the whole world is concerned? yes, you're right. i know by disposition, an optimist, and the last decade is generally to me, right. but obviously we'll have to do what we can also said that even at the end, tomorrow we should call to at least by law street. so i think we have to reach an understanding in the ukraine. this whole has to be brought to it and i can give you an easy solution what this might be. but what i don't know is that this is a grave danger to your it is already wrecking our economy is no longer it's not

doing anyone any good, certainly not to your so we have to do what we can to advocate mr. beth. it's been a great pleasure talking to thank you very much for your time. but thank you and i couldn't agree more with you on the website. you very much. thank you. thank you for watching hope to hear again. well,

the part the, [000:00:00;00] the great craft into the fault of the russian capitalist, financial districts in the early hours of sunday, pasco says, ukraine is responsible for the damage. no, in the circle of friendship need of hail the success of the 2nd of a rush. i happened to summit with a joint declaration. this thing is harold's new era corporation and rush, i guess things didn't ship shape as the country logs. navy, very loose,