is the place but yeah, the the hello and welcome to cross stock were all things are considered. i'm peter lavelle . the alternative for germany is on the rise doubling its popularity since the last election cycle. this party challenges neo liberal orthodoxies on the issues of immigration, military alliances, and the nature of the european union, and much more. this is why there are some who want alternative for germany band, the

cross talking german politics. i'm joined by my guest on laughlin in paris. he's a university lecture in history and political philosophy in dubai. we have ralph niemeyer, he is chairman of the council for the constitution in sovereignty and cabinets. we crossed to michael brook. he is a political analysts or a gentleman, costs are girls in effect. that means you can jump any time you want. and i always appreciate it. john, let me go to you 1st, the you in, in parents, what do you, well, how do you explain the rise of the alternative for germany? because anywhere in main stream media, legacy media, it is, it is uh, we should all be running for the hills. we should be terrified of these people, the most rogatories things that you can say about politicians and a political party. and that's saying something these days is applied to the alternative for germany explained to us a while it so ridiculous kind of picture. i mean, the policy was founded i believe, about to 15 years ago, essentially by economics professor as it has a rather a lead to storage. and it cannot mix professors who were worried about the euro.

and they didn't want german suffering. t, german monetary sovereignty to be dissolved in new york and minus a union. and for many years that was the essence of a, of these policies. and then, little by little of the, let's say, more populist issues came to the full, particularly immigration. and now of course, the whole issue of the war with russia, but the idea that this is, uh, some kind of, uh, you know, rene sunset, whatever is all basically ridiculous if you compare the if the 2, you kept the united kingdom independence policy, which has in some respects a similar history having also started off being uh, originally founded by uh, by academics. um, uh, but uh, in fact uh, a different story in the sense that you get and if it one uh, any of a seats and the national problem. and um, the, the fact is that the i sd, is much more centrist than you can. you can give that to you. kit was

a danger to democracy on the country. you could for ends up winning in the sense that breakfast, of course was, was carried out in 2020. but the, if the doesn't cool furnace thing is rather cold as leaving the european union. so . so the idea that it's an extreme is policy is it is quite wrong in the end of the cost, the fact that it's labeled as such, yeah, is an indication of the left is drift and indeed of the tendency to sense the shape and to tell the tire and this in which characterizes so much you are paying politics today. not, not just in, not just in germany. what ralph, i the, the, the, the party recently had a gathering and an issue that we would call in american politics a, a platform. and i read it through, i think it's like 97 pages along. very interesting reading into echo with john said there, i found it to be quite moderates. i don't see any extremism at all. now questioning nato that has been something that people have been talking about since the end of

the cold war. so i don't think that is extreme having control of your own borders. but actually it shouldn't be an extreme disposition to want to have sovereignty. that's the whole point here is that it's challenging. these piety is a meal. liberalism, but you're simply not allowed to do ralph? yeah, that's correct. and that way i must agree, always withdrawn because it is a party that does democratically and that gives and actually i don't find other than that. i disagree with with the economic policy. maybe because i'm rather investors them to marxist. but i don't find them being extremely right, being what they are being branded all the time. they're actually not. i mean, some members probably are to be seen in a different lives, but this has been all parties. you can go to the left as you find some style them. this is coming in. this will get, you know, but the majority of the body, generally d a s d is feeling they've got that the cd you,

the crystal comes out of the conservatives, of them is a smack of that because mrs. america was too much as so for the democrats charles that with us he was from the c d. u and she probably created a f d by the also by her little stats on, on the immigration issue that aroused in 2015 the year. oh, but it is widely accepted know, although a, if these, those that they want to leave it. but if you imagine to go back to deutsche and mark, we would all say that this would make our products too expensive indeed. and we wouldn't export anything anymore because everyone would try to buy it into dodge and marketing or the new dot to mark. so this is not really a concept that they can in on earnest the follow. then they need to accept that the heroes, the euro, and to be, they have for some time. well, yeah,

but they're having, having a reform monetary policy is also necessary. i think we all know that as the e you is essentially facing bankruptcy. michael, let me go to, i mean, a ralph kind of touched upon it here. i mean, can you describe for my viewers? are viewers who votes for this party? why is it attractive? it's doubled its popularity since the last election cycle. that's an earthquake for, for established democracies like germany who votes for them who supports them of the for the be and most of the, the submitted the, the, the i submitted that is a see the is on the table, the door plus the size of the plus the party property and so they have no uh, d, as to will close the d. and that may make

a t c in the homes, nearly 70 percent of the property. and uh, germany is the boss and the best uh and the site is useful. and in the, in the eastern bar, the f b gets nearly $70.00 and the biggest, uh, yeah, the biggest problem is uh much mobiles. and uh, and so the use the company uh the, the, the, the, the, the, uh, the, the, uh, cost is the man. and yes. oh, this is the government uh the same and also this is uh, it's, uh oh, i mean it's, uh, let me tell you to the quality supply pointing to the government. and so people say this government does not because he doesn't pay it. and so the, the,

the, the box, they say they use it as a way to bypass the government. exactly. telling me in front of somebody, this is turning into a party for the politically homeless because it, and it's, it's, it's, it's going across geographically out. again, it's a, it's a strong hold in the ease, but it's fretting okay. and they are winning local elections here. and i would do respect to our german gas here. oh, you know, over the last 20 years i really don't see much difference in these parties whatsoever, except for b a f d john? well the ac is one much more of the local elections pizza. they have a, a and the a team members in the national parliaments in the buddhist talk about the, the, the politically, the phenomena of the politically homeless that you rodney identify is, is, by the way, upon european phenomena. and i mentioned youtube amendment to go in britain, which tasted as early as was largely supported by disaffected. conservative policy

support has not been to observe executive the same thing in front where the rise of the national riley that i some of them on that. so now is in direct proportion to the left, ism and centrism of the previously main stream sent to right party. you see the same thing initially. obviously, with the rise of the fraternity d'italia, you see it in the netherlands, which is being governed by a, a supposedly liberal law or at least send to rights coalition. but which in reality has drifted ever further to the left and up as the angular mac codes, whose impala full of it was 1516 years she governed uh, for 3 out of have full terms of office it together with the social democrats. so police circles tend to write policies, have be shifted to the center or even to the left, and that is indeed what creates the i state phenomenon in germany and all the other phenomena that i've mentioned in the other countries around how much is the crane

issue field parties like the f, b and other populace parties in, in europe. but definitely it is um, showing the sofa the reset by the voters who say they disagree with the government also on that issue. they don't believe the mainstream media propaganda. that's a so auntie ross and the buyers that people, they say, you know, we want to have peace with russia. we don't want to send us into a conflict. we want to have the more neutral stance in that. and that's why they support policies, of course, who do say that, but it's not only the i yesterday who signed this is also the last as biology. and now you'll have to look at a new phenomenon. yeah, because, sorry about going to next. we'll start a new policy that will attract voters from a cd to 17 democrats and her current tasked into our skill at frontier and

a former leader of his own democrats. the book push far to get her probably 20 percent as not. now you have 20 percent, a steep good tassel bound to potential 20 percent on the left is so the question is if they split the opposition like that, why wouldn't they not go in at least one way to get in this issue, but they say, let's stop the war and ukraine, half of populist government and overthrow shows just for the sake that we can add to this war. and after that pass democratic with falls into the country that over to you. and probably the reason why people are voting for extreme is policies are so caught the extreme was politics, i could set it up at a spot is democratic because the elective democratically and within the constitution. yeah. but i mean, it's kind of the sum total of our, our discussion taskbar, is that this is much more than a protest. it's a, it's,

it's coherent, it's ideologically coherent, and it's quote, creating a base for itself. no, under the establishment is a freight gentleman. i'm going to jump in here, we're gonna go to a short break and asked about short break. we'll continue our side discussion on german politics. stay with our to the, the we are in august on what is the most ethically and culturally diverse regions on the entire planet. as you make your way through the start, you will discover, each region is known for its own unique arts and traditions. the

use of 3 people use of, for instance, coming your what's the saw my love to have to choose between you. if you want to get to the store, this goes you have to leave it up there. the word meant that i play anything that apple beat was awfully cool my lot. so shift things to get suitable for something that you all of this opportunity might not mature. less of

a piece of paper for you, said i or the welcome ex across stock. were all things are considered on people about your mind. you were discussing german politics. the go back to michael. michael is a remarkably, i suppose, maybe it shouldn't be remarkable of annalee to better box. the for administer said a few months ago that she didn't care what her constituents thought when it comes to ukraine. she visited the european parliament and said that, uh, that we're at war with russia. i mean, how much is added catalyst to people this throw up their arms and say, this is coming from the green party. the whole party is here. i mean, there, i just think there's such a disaffection from the establishment again from afar. when i look at these parties

here, they are so homogenous at the end of the day because they all clicked their heels when they're told to um, by the united states. go ahead, mike is the, is the best on the c b and is the say something that people, lot of the they, they don't know what the teachers they make the goals and know. she said, yeah, has i found out 60 days and we will know so yes, we are not thinking about this. and she said a few days ago that the yes uh huh. 60 days and the goals and yes, and they also, they made the unit such a sleep as se, the gemini, in the and yes, you can see this tapia t, but this, the t. and so the s 5 to honestly is in the government and

the f b because we've all the f b is the way to class is gonna cost is every reason you formation this and our many easy for the whole for the and the comedy not wish to be the radius, i say the next month and i can use the benefits and the j 6 on the system. yeah. and the pad voc also famously said that putting asked to change his position on ukraine $360.00 degrees. this lady is well good with numbers . okay. i can, you know, i, she's already with geography. she's not good with history. anyway, john, i'm back to business here. there seems to be a real serious effort to try to ban this political party. and there is a means to do it through the constitutional court. what does that mean to the fact

that the read contemplating it? i mean, why can't they just, you know, they just don't trust voters, they don't trust the democratic process. what's, what's going on here, john? i want to answer on that pizza, but i just want to come and tell them your question to michael just now to make sure i have and his on. so i'm afraid, i don't think we should get too carried away, hoping that they will be a great left right alliance in favor of peace and ukraine, and essentially adopting what is caricature does it pro russian position the if day is very split on the issue of russia, it split among its leadership and it splits among its members. there is in particular, an east west split within the eye if day we talked about the east germany, at least in part of germany a moment ago. these mother, germany is more radical than the west of germany, which is more liberal about in the east of the anti russian feeling. which of which

has a hangover from the communist period remains fairly strong. and i don't think that we can say that the, if the electrodes in the eastern part of germany is necessarily pro russia in the ukraine conflicts. and in order for that to be in the lives with sort of talking today that would have to be a very strong united if the present position on this. and i fear that both are internal reasons. and also by the way, for. ready europe and political reasons because the i state belongs to a group in the european parliament, which is definitely not pro russian, although some of its department, but policies may have been in the past for that reason as well. i think the, if the position on russia is relatively cautious, they cool, cool, stay cool for peace, which is regarded as being pro russian about a they all have a strong as i say by these internal divisions. and indeed, the whole history of the i state has being one of the internal divisions. the policy has systematically lost its leaders. there's been splits. is one of these

policies, but these very very and totally divided. okay. the only issue of finding yes, uh, the german, um, uh, fits for the protection of the constitution as put it as, but the policy under surveillance to put them under surveillance 2 years ago. and this shows once again, the title of terry and drift of europe, europe, germany is not the only country where this is happening. it's also happening in the netherlands. we have for them, for democracy, has been a singled out by the intelligent services that danger to the states and the danger to democracy. but it shows the, the extreme decrepit to develop political systems. that policies which i know, certainly a democratically elected but which are internally very democratic. i have days like many of the german political passages for in terms of the democratic with lots of folks taking the monk taut team members. for example, folks who should be the candidates in such and such an election. yeah,

i do that these people are a dangerous democracy, really is absolutely horrifying. and it shows indeed how the, the secret service is and the, the, they, they so called the bodies that are supposed to protect the constitution in these various states call themselves the primary dangers of democracy. harvey might. yeah . ralph and you know it's, it's really kind of an echo of what they're trying to do to trump and his supporters. they, they want to get him off the ballot. ok. they don't want to give people the opportunity to vote for or against them. they tend to forget that that's how voting works to vote for or against something or someone against another person. you're, they don't even want to give them that opportunity. what do you think they would, would there just be a passive exempt instead this party could be banned. but i mean, i'm saying a little deserving does closely as well. but i must say here, this is only making them more popular. it is if you want to compare that with another lawsuit against prestone trauma,

that makes him even more support the same be watched with the former east german, the ruling body, p d. s, the former communist or socialist body to trans into the body of democratic socialism. often walking down. they had only, lots of patients by the office for protection of the so called constitution and all that, you know, and they, whenever they found is dogs the link of great of dc. my left the lead us of the party at that time. the pano spend up the people united is behind this man the behind the party because and so the deputy and the same to have them here as well. i mean they try to balance the party one time. that was the not so knowledgeable partnership, but i that's low impact the next little is really the surface potty actually. and they tried to balance out the federal constitutional court as well. and it fades

big time. it's about 10 years ago. so, and since that time, we know it is not easy to band the parties and especially why wouldn't some of the band d a s d? i mean, they are, i mean, down my thoughts, you know, i'm on the opposite side of the political spectrum. but what i own stuff is the principally the democratically organized. i don't. okay. some members why something difficult sometimes, but what we're not that's democracy because because stand up become just liquid. so i don't think that there's enough space to develop them to put that into that process of adding it to this address, making them more popular if they want this than yes, that's the way to do it. yeah, michael. yeah, it seems to me that it be worrying about the growing popularity of the party isn't a deterrent from the powers that be in the what we have in the west is very

a hedge, a monic political class, and they will do everything in their power. we see it everywhere, they will do everything to protect their power. if it's even against public popular will i think they will go after they have the go ahead. yeah, of course i tried to the steps and the every time i don't know who this name. so it's not only that the safety is a lot of the move, but by the, by the government, by the end of the season. they see that the, um yes, that is the government side of the deal to the side and the yeah, because the people to see is the government side for this up to be. they have to vote. you model the, the and so the guy, uh, the, uh and uh, i guess the mazda service a, and i don't see the size to be so bad as a and b, i,

v was low. i wouldn't be the best the fusion because the, the model is just to discuss is a can see this discussion the is the, the end as a process for that hire somebody needs maybe 5 or more. yeah. and the bands, as i've been on the west side in 203-2070, they said no me time is a full year and maybe so it's okay for the the which you know and it just time when low speed was pnc, says and the government isn't c a and as i say, you have to vote or the, you know, so i kind of and he said to go on, that is the, well, you know, they're, you know,

they think of going back to young. they're going back to the issue of ukraine. i mean, i see that i see the west being ukrainian ice because zalinski banned all of his opposition and it was a cheered by the west. okay. i cheered by the state department. so what's, what's, i'm a german political party who cares about that. we're getting to the point where there's going to be reasons for people, or there will be no reason for people to go to the polls. if the leads are going to determine who you can vote for, finish up for us, john. and yeah, i mean, i think that even if the policy is not bands, the fact that this has been formally declared to be under suspicion as it was in 2021. which means that, uh the, uh, the custom shorts, the, the, the body which puts a allegedly protects the constitution can spy on the policy. you can listen to that, i phone conversations can put them on the formal suspicion. i think that that is already even if they are banned in a few, it's time that is itself

a disgraceful step. because naturally it means that they are operating under control. that means that the policy members and leadership will practice self censorship and so on. so i, i don't think that the fact that the, uh any, any attempt to close it down like failed means that this attempt in itself is not terrible. it is terrible. and i also think, and i think this is what you're suggesting in your question, peter. when you are in the situation of military conflict, as we are adoptable, the german foreign minister, as you've just said, has said we are well with russia. then all the usual se scouts about human rights deputies. and so i'm go straight out since the window because if germany says, i'm johnny, i'm sorry on this very important point. john, i have to interrupt you. we have run out of time on, i think, my guess in paris, the by and cabinets. and thanks. so our viewers for watching us here at our pc and next time remember, prospect the

known in vietnam, american war, the vietnam war last, it's almost 2 decades and dragged in numerous countries. not any written down, but you don't see it now. why it's all on empty news. hundreds of thousands of american troops with sent to the country to bank the south vietnamese on me. i don, i'm sorry about that. not many american soldiers, limited resistors, most of us like the down entire villages and spread dangerous chemicals and lee laid up day by all right. did the americans ever fully acknowledge what they did on the vietnamese veterans ready to forgive?

yes, yes, that's the way to the after the nazis bower in italy, states foreign policy became extremely aggressive. benito mussolini needed glorious victories. he decided to achieve his ambitions in africa. despite the fact that formally libya had become an italian colony back in 1912. the vast territories of this country were not actually controlled by rome. the nazis decided to put an end to this. but as soon as the religious order of the santa side stood in their way,

the arabs did not want to submit to for and power and put up fierce resistance. dividers against colonialism were led by the seats of this m a side order. omar l move star, who is nick named the lion of the desert for his incredible courage. despite the violent, bombardments and voice and gas usage, mass keyboard agents, and the imprisonment of the local population in concentration camps. the invaders could not cope with the era patriots for a decade. in 1931, omar l most star was captured and sentenced the hanging at the trial, the hero of the libyan people behaved very bravely and rejected. pardon. pursuing a policy of genocide, italy was only able to temporarily suppress libya, 18th of the entire population. more than 100000 de boats fell victim to their. however, just a few years later, the entail you enroll, collapsed. in 1951,

libya became one of the 1st countries in africa to gain independence. the russian states never as one of the most sense community best. i'll send, send up the consumer calls question about this. even though we will ben in the european union the kremlin mission, the state on the russians cruising and split the ortiz full neck. even our video agency, roughly all the band on youtube, the payment services for the question, did you say even twist, which is the.