so power save many european countries of farming countries. uh, and the, the whole point of being in the u is the farm is needs to be protect us. so there was absolutely no way that ukrainian grain or russian drain come to that, went into the european markets. so it was, it was or still up under lions foolish policy of allowing ukrainian green to flow into your of that cause these problems in the 1st place. god to bye, make say oakland outdoor samuel eddie pleasure as a senior research and follow the global policy institute. thanks again. thank you very much. right. a russian spacecraft has just bought it off from the bike and launch this that these carry a pad of russian cause was an american smoke law to the incense, just playstation. oh, so you correspondence to maim shaw reports from the north side. we are right now

at the by 2 north cosmo drone. this is where you regarding the 1st human that ever flew to space departed from and today it is a busy space puerto operated by russia in projects done. this mission also proves the spheres in which russia and the united states cooperate specifically the space fear. and it seems like this is the only fear, despite political tensions in which both countries still successfully managed to cooperate with one another. so this is the loans, the

mex fitted of allies on cost. so i will be back in just on the 30 minutes with more international news. we hope you're doing this then the the hello and welcome to cross talk. we're all things are considered. i'm peter lavelle

. nicholas goodwill, secretary young stilton burke is acknowledged, but why don't we approve this decision to enter ukraine last year? was to prevent nato from expanding into the country. the claims it was an unprovoked invasion, is propaganda. the west ukraine narrative is unraveling the cross talking western narratives. i'm joined by my guess. erin, good in philadelphia. he's a political scientist historian as well as all through an american exception empire in the deep state in washington. we are matthew crossed and he is professor of national security and director of academic transformations at bowie state university. and in montreal, we cross the bank. clerk. steel is a canadian foreign policy institute, fellow journalist and author, or a gentleman cross type roles. and the fact that he's gonna jump in any time you want. and i always appreciate, aaron, let me go to you 1st. i mean, spelt and bird, he's not the brightest guy. that's probably why he has the job because he usually

just repeats talking points written in washington. but he did kind of slip off by saying that the, the reason why russia entered ukraine last year is to prevent nato expansion. while we were told that was an unprovoked attack, that's what they keep saying over and over again. but you know, they felt a bird has a habit of doing this. he said, you know, from 2014 to 2022, they were arming ukraine to the teeth. i mean, they can't keep their narrative straight. and i want to talk about later how the world doesn't believe it. your thoughts, aaron, as well, it's pretty clear that nato expansion has been well underway since the end of the cold war. and that the u. s. has never been really candid about its aims and why it was doing what it was doing. but i think that this with ukraine, they really cross the river counter, says because they knew precisely as we know from the wiki leaks cables with the the, the, the see i courtesy i, director that he knew you know, to,

more than 10 years ago that nato was a nato expansion, and to ukraine was the red as the red lines for russia. and that was precisely why they were they stage that made on to in the 1st place to put in the us friendly government in to have it was it's, it's not that they were pursuing some diplomacy and then accidentally did something, was damaged, rushes, security. they intentionally set about inflicting as much harm to arrest and the security as big as they could, the threatened russian security and the their, their presence in ukraine or potential presence in ukraine is deemed an existential threat by russia. and the us knew that, and that was precisely why they did what they did. so this is something that more and more people are coming to understand in the past, it was only kind of cold war or foreign policy walks that understood it. and most of them were dissembling about it if they're employed by academia or in big tank.

so the result has been a slow realization that apparently has now finally reached the head of nato. that what this war was really about. and matthew is, it's really quite interesting because we, how we got so many off the cuff comments like lloyd austin, the us secretary, defense thing. he wanted to significantly weak in russia. okay. and it's comments like that. then you know, and then of course people around them, correct them. but this is a very, very much provoked war. it was very intentional as aaron this point in and out. and this is the path that they were going down. they thought they truly believe that the sanctions would work that would cripple russians. economy. well russians economy is due to grow 2 percent of this current year. i entered only contract and 2 point one percent last year. so they've grossly miscalculated over and over again . and they tow itself is a military alliance know that says united states. okay, we've seen all through this complex here, the nato. i wouldn't call it

a paper tiger, but it's really not a, it's more of a separate club, but a political club in a military alliance. matthew and i, i like the fact that use that even though it's our miscalculation because i, i like what aaron had mentioned you, when do you cross the rubicon? you cross the river, gone when you're not worried that anything is on the other side of it to bother you . and that was sort of, there was sort of an implicit arrogance or over confidence on the part of nato that it could do in ukraine when it's done with all of the other additions over the last 10 years in terms of its membership. and there wouldn't be consequences even despite the very exclusive and transparent expressions from the chrome. i'm saying there will be consequences if you do this. this is different from all the others. how nato just simply didn't believe it, or what you were mentioning the miscalculation is it really so much about provocation as much about we miscalculate and we misinterpreted. we mean nato, the united states, that russia has the capability of doing anything. and even if it does,

we're able to meet the strength to strength without injuring ourselves or damaging ourselves in any way. yeah, it's even montreal, it's very interesting is because i, on this program unfortunately, you can't watch it on youtube anymore. but when it was on youtube, i was telling the world, months before the conflict, it's going to happen. it's going to happen. on december 17th with the before the conflict, the russian sent out to nato to washington. these are the terms and conditions of negotiating or avoiding a conflict, and they totally blew it off and cells and birds again, it mentioned, yes we, we got this here, but we didn't take it seriously. those are my words, okay. but he didn't take it seriously. and in this, as a result here, i mean, this was so transparently obvious that this was going to happen. i was screaming at the top of my logs, this is going to happen. and nobody in the west believed that they thought it was this all hyperbolic eve as well. i thinking that that speech that he may where he

made the mission, which is of course, a very important mission and clear. this was a cutout for the other side. what he said was he was boasting about suite reading entertainment, joining. so i think from, from a us perspective, maybe this called anglo sphere perspective. this isn't, this isn't the bad thing, right? you have, you have seen that you have expansion nato. you have germany specifically, but western europe further subordinated to us geo political interest, you know, lessening there. there are a, they're purchasing of a russian, uh, natural gas and oil and whatnot. and, and so, so from a us perspective, the fact that, you know, ukraine is destroyed the fact that hundreds of thousands are killed or injured. and that's, that's fine. that's dot dot dice. that's worth it from a, from a jewel clinical perspective. so, so i think that, yes, i agree with you,

this was clearly provoke the, the, you know, the counter offensive is going to fail. and there is a, be, there is a bit of a problem for nato, with regards to, you know, what they're able to do. and ukraine does. i think it's still possible that russia, you know, at least guess odessa and, you know, expands expands further but, but, but from i think from a macro perspective, i don't think that this was a, you know, bad thing from us to a political interest. obviously. very good for all the arms companies. so. so it's a little bit of, i think um, you know, for ukraine is a disaster is catastrophe. and from any sort of human estate perspective it, that is, and that's the case. but from a really kind of hard line kind of geo political calculation, this is probably all still kind of basically worth it from us perspective. as i absolutely agree with you. i think that the, it's a very sober way of looking at air. and speaking of, you know, the costs and the benefits here today to the,

by the administration and slighted over a 100000000000 dollars to ukraine. what, what is the return on investment there? i mean it's not the return on the investment is a whole lot of the ukrainians or no longer you no longer living best. i can tell it's hard to know what the point to it seems. inviting maybe in the us, maybe trying to keep to avert disaster before the election. and then who knows. i mean that the, it seems like reality is starting to sink and you see more reporting in different places in the west that the counter, if they're just acknowledging the reality with the counter offensive, has failed spectacularly. except in terms of, you know, creating more you creating casualties. so this is a, it's been a that, that part is a waste. and i, i would disagree with the, with, with eve because i think that this has, it's on the surface. it's good for arms companies and so on and probably helps us

in that you know, we sell us natural gas and such. but i think that the us is a point where it can waste a $100000000.00 on war and added the deficit that way. because of its control over the dollar. and i, i believe that this ukraine war and the russian evasion of the sanctions regime in the creation of new institutions to handle international payments. that all these things are going to collude to have some of the demise of the dollar, which is really what the us empire has been based on since the post bretton woods regime really got consolidated a couple of years into reagan's administration in the us. and so it has just been this junk or not thanks to the power of the dollar its ability to run in with military. well, i think yes, i think i think both of you can be right at the same time because i agree with you as well. here, matthew, you're not in your head jump in. i think just and then maybe this is too cynical, but i've said this in the past as well. we peters that the ultimate investment in,

in the long run for american perception is always been wait, you're going to tell us we get to do a proxy. ready or we're, we gets a kill lots of russians, but we're not going to risk any american lives whatsoever in, in the consulate. and it will keep going and grinding forward and will be able to pursue through the media. public perception that the russian military is and at the leadership is incompetent with small, little wonder dog ukraine is able to hold it off. see we, we've weakened them in terms of geopolitical strength. it's all perception on it's somewhat propagandistic, but that's still a return on investment that the united states still sort of stuck in that cold war mentality. fines there are. yeah, but last but not to i think that and i think that that the love that i think that approach has it has a shelf life. ok because of, of what eve and here and just had just like there's a button, montreal, let me go to you right before we we have it. we're going to a short break. you want to jump in a. yeah. i mean, i think the, that's an interesting point about i agree with there is

a potential long term. i think clearly there's a lot of countries that are very concerned by the waves, which be a russian, a national bank assets were frozen. and, and that question of how they are sort of concerned about the long term reliability of their assets in, in, in, you know, in the west and their, their use of the us dollar. so that could, we might, history might point to this being leading to the weakening and breakdown of the dollar hedge money. and so that ben is to look back on this is, is actually very damaging to us. uh, geo political, uh, interest. yeah. well, it's not a zip the last 40 years, so as a road record of success. so i'm not counting on that gentleman. i'm going to jump in. we're going to go to a short break. and after that short break, we'll continue our discussion on western narrative. stay with our team, the the,

[000:00:00;00] the, the we are in august on one of the most ethnically and culturally diverse regions on the entire planet. as you make your way through the august, you will discover each region is known for its own unique arts and traditions the

welcome back. across stock were all things are considered. i'm peter le belcher, when you were discussing western narratives. the okay, it's go back to erin in philadelphia, we recently had the, the break summit and the g 20. and, well, it didn't go so well for the west. they couldn't get their narrative over the top. as a matter of fact, it's really quite remarkable that the g 20 ended the way it did, it made a reference to the ukraine. but just the conflict and nothing more. and that was something that we know that the west is trying to globalize internationalize, the ukraine issue, and it's not getting traction as matter fact, it's getting going in reverse here. this is a narrative that you know is something that we talked about in the 1st part. of the program that isn't sustainable people just simply don't believe what the west is saying, aaron, are right. i mean,

i think that the us has been the global empire since the end of world war 2. and in europe it still enjoys some support. but even in europe, there are signs that the us so generally may be on the way there. i think, majorities in germany, for example, believe that the us and nato are more responsible for the ukraine war than russia or guten. so, uh and, and around the world mean west africa. what's happening in west africa is related to what's happening. and new trainer says, because the, the us wanted to use the ukraine war as a way to create a new iron curtain and stop russia from trading with, with western europe and keep us near of aligned with the us. but as we see in west africa where the french dominates their poles, the neo colonial hold, which has been assisted by the us. i mean, it could it's, it's likely a recording to max fluid 1000 dad said blumenthal those emails to hillary. the french were very well be fearful that libya was going to, um,

basically we can the french, the currency in west africa. and that was one of the reasons they were behind getting rid of good that they, because he wanted a unified africa. but now even those countries are rebelling against the system. and if, if they're able to kick france out of west africa, which they've really been plundering for quite a long time or of the century. then where with this parents have returned. but to the east, i mean, this is where the us position as a global head your mind is, is, is weakening and even in europe, there's a, here's a secret suppress history of things. the us, i'm glad you have done when, if leaders didn't do what the us wonder them to do, even if they were in the western countries in the us ousted the, the australian prime minister in the 19 seventy's us, not europe, obviously, but also although morrow the assassination in like 1972 or 73 and all of palma, and i think 86 offered her house and in the late eighty's at the end of the cold war, i mean this business, this whole history of

a bad things that the us has done when it took over management of western war period, well, aaron, air and so on, bills are coming due as bills are coming due. and aaron, let me go to matthew. now what about nord stream? i mean, what you know, here here is, you know, they, these people that glorify on climate change and all this, and you have an administration the united states by all accounts come on and created the, the, the worst you geological incident and in the world history. okay. i mean, this is what you do to your friends, what do they do to their enemies? but again, matthew, this is a ship the global shift in narratives. i think it's very, very interesting. and, and we, we, you know, we saw the united states outraged about the co and nigeria, but they weren't outraged in 2014 in ukraine. the world picks up on these things. matthew, as well, i think your point also north stream. i always have thought is, is under emphasizes an incredibly important on the narrative perspective, simply because that was the one to me,

the one incident that showed significant actors in western europe. but wait a minute. the united states always tells us that when it pursues its interest, those american interests also always perfectly aligned with the global good. and they always try to sell that narrative. but north stream. and the ridiculousness sort of pendulum swinging back and forth explanation of who did it, who possibly could do it when everyone knew who really did it was the united states that showed at least certain partners in your partners, in quotation marks that maybe the united states will always just pursue is interest and if it isn't aligned with the global good, that's not going to matter because this north stream incident hurts us us in western europe. well, mass matthew, i, i, i've talked to a number of germans ever since then. and i've, i've asked, you know, what, what do people think about this? me, he told me that everybody in germany knows who did it. you just can talk about it. okay. that's another thing that's changing in the west. you,

you're not allowed to talk about certain things um questioning elections and things like that. anyway, a, let me go back to you and montreal. it was interesting um, but anthony blinking said a couple days ago the old world order is over, but it is over. i think we will all agree with that, but not on the way he thinks he thinks the american ahead gemini has a bright rate in the future. i mean, these people are completely out of touch eve. yeah, i mean, i think that the china is rise. is he is a, i mean china is now become the biggest economy in the world. and despite all of the rhetoric about, you know, downturn in short term, china is going to be the dominant economic power. it is already the dominic dominant trade. the trading nation was something like a 100 countries. um, so that's, that's a problem for the us and,

and the where we're seeing that their efforts to try to weaken chinese economy in not a successful we just saw while way was coming out with the fancy new phones, which was supposed to not be possible with us sanctions but, but, but, but i do also think that did to, to push back a back a bit against that a little bit. i do seem to see us, it has some to be a success on the military front in subordinating, you know, philippines, the fact that the philippines is getting americans, all these bases, the fact that australia has just completely gone along. the fact of japan, you know, was increasing his military spending to target china. they seem to have had some success with being in japan and south korea together. so, so they are, i think having some success at the jew political and the military level on economic level. it seems to me, if things are going there, you know, worse and worse for the us. and like as, as you pointed out, obviously the sanctions in russia, all that stuff is just, you know,

this basically not, not worked uh, as, as was, as we planned. but be a, let me ask you a question here. but here's your talking about a new cold war when we have new divisions here. okay, it's going to be russia, china, and countries around it, and then you have an american lead block. i mean, that seems by design. is that a good idea in your mind? i mean, this could all be avoidable if, if, if there was that intent, go ahead. this is absolutely madness. i think. yeah, hold on to the these perspective. i mean, i, i'm, but somebody's been to, the top concern, should be dealing with the logical collapse that we're seeing. we're seeing all over. i think we have huge problems of an equity. both of the, you know, in north america and around the world we have, we have, you know, problems that would be that people still dying from, from diseases that we should have. who is shipping wave down a long time with. i mean, device by june is, but david, russia is the problem in china is the problem. so you, this is that narrative, you know, we, we,

we can do with the environment right now. we can do with any quality, right? and we have to do with the russians. and the chinese authoritarian was a, that's exactly what blinking said a day ago. go ahead, you know, any, you just look around. i mean, here in montreal, they just reports about homelessness, right? all across north america homeless is up is up huge amounts since the pandemic. these are real problems right here, but we hear all this discussion about security. well, force the forest burning all around literally all around me, montreal, all the summer for us to bring one that's a real security is a huge health consequences from all the pollutants. obviously the, just the danger of the fire, but we're 12 security and what they really need is joining the us empire to send canadian naval vessels halfway across the world to provoke china in the, in the taiwan strait or the south, tennessee, or what they, me just sending more, more billions of dollars, a canadian weapon re to ukraine to solely we can fight to the last for granted.

that's what security we use for the people. right. i so i get, i guess aaron, it'd be the, the, the, the, the flu virus on malware in, in, in hawaii, they, they didn't, they didn't rate security so they let it burn. okay. having one of the largest military bases in the world of pearl harbor and they had no access to help those people. okay. it's a shows priorities. eric, it's, it seems to me what we've discussed with this program here is that elite driven ideas and agendas and everything else is left to, to withdraw away. aaron. yeah, i mean that's what an empire exist, score it exists to enrich and aggrandize the oligarchy of the imperialist nation. and the us itself has seen its own development as a democratic society, you know, sidelined by these people. i think in the 90 and sixty's, there were elements, a strong current and us society that wanted peace and the solving of human problems

. and the leaders who were uh, you know, leading this, this, these popular movements and this popular will really the preventable will of the, of the american people, the kennedy brothers and m. okay. and knock max even as he sort of evolved in his political thinking. they killed all these people just so the us is sort of like iran, with 9053 or, or all the countries in latin america or in the us as intervene. we've had our own development in history altered drastically by this. these a lease is oligarchy of corporate. well, that's set on dominating the world and these references to ecological problems and other problems and inequality. i mean, there, it would really be something if a nation can come along a powerful nation and lead the other nations of the world to say we're going to focus on trying to somehow work together and solve some human problems and respect each other sovereignty in the meantime, and we want international politics, not just to be a game of, uh, you know, yeah, but i are

a game of empire. it's very interesting is i'll go to matthew now. and that's what the global south is talking about. collectively, is dealing with these problems. but the west is always boiling for a fight to maintain. had gemini, matthew? well, they always, i know, talked about this for a very long time. it's, it's interesting to me that there spoiling, for a fight to maintain in germany. while of course, always trying to tell people that that's not what they're doing, reflect that the, the gemini is not the germany at all, but simply a man, eric in pursuit of global good. i know i keep repeating that phrase, but that's, that's it's narrative that it was others to buy into. i don't think it's been very successful, especially over the last 30 years since the end of the cold war. but that's been really the ultimate problem and i'm the lead tribune thing to me matters not just in a historical perspective, but in the contemporary one american media, mainstream media, for sure, as,

as definitely not invested or to go to educating the masses. oh no, sir. that's, that's not where the priority is now is when they they are public, where they are, the stenographer is for power. that's all they are. okay. um. all right, gentlemen, that's all the time we have on a think, my guess in washington, philadelphia and in montreal. and of course i want to thank our viewers for watching us here at archie. so you next time we member across the the who, when i would show the wrong just don't have to shape out the application and engagement because the

trails when so many find themselves will support. we choose to look so common ground the, the russian states. never as one of the most sense community best, most all sense of the in the system must be the one else holes. question about this, even though we will then in the european union, the kremlin mission, the state on the russians cruising and split the ortiz full neck, even our video agency, roughly all the band on youtube tv services. what question did you say even closer to

the the so infringe amenities, the person makes the support of the service of the elections in the on boss that sleep office. he said key is off. so it's either the quote putting down the report brussard side of the story. yeah. fast, the order of the french defense i pass a to leave the country within a fortnight on claims. he committed some last of acts against the west african nation general says he has not so read right so