the next we made a saw a task for can women who despite all that decided what she had to say was worth the risk june elements piece to the the one of the most difficult things to do when you're considering becoming a whistleblower is taking on a giant, international conglomerate. they have armies of lawyers,

they often times have infiltrated government. they can afford to ignore local laws and just pay fines on the rare occasions that they're caught violating the law or somebody's rights. and if an employee dares to confront them to take them on, especially in public, then it's often times an all out war to destroy the whistleblower. that's exactly what our next guest faced. i'm john kerry onto welcome to the whistle blowers the . 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 we are joined today by a major international business whistleblower. she's going to tell us about her whistle blowing revelations in their aftermath, working against samsung in south africa. it's a story that will sound familiar to you. a story about waste, fraud abuse and illegality. but what makes this whistle? blowers so important is what she chose to do. in the aftermath of her whistle blowing,

she began assisting many sting capture and corporate whistle blowers through their own experiences. she set up an information south africa whistle blowing community after suffering from post traumatic stress disorder. as a result of her own was blowing, including suicidal ideation. she set out to help others in the same positions. and like so many other whistle blowers, she suffered personal isolation and financial ruin. and friends and family members ostracized her that spurred her to become involved with whistle blowers, u. k, and whistle blowers of america, notably in the area of mental health for whistleblowers. she now lectures and trains individuals and companies on ethics and integrity and business, and she has contributed to a best selling book on these issues. june bellamy, welcome to the show. thank you, john. thanks for the platform. facebook tom june. it seems to me that the most important work you've done is that work that you've done since you blowing the

whistle. so let's begin with your time that samsung. what kind of work were you doing there? what wrong doing? did you see? and what did you do about it? i started so satisfying 2013 and i was at the digital camera traina for about 3 and a half years. and then that division closed. and i was given a different options to moving to the tv that isn't all the service division. and i chose the service division to become the if the heat trainer and, and i stepped into that role and very quickly and very early on, when i was in that position, there was a lot of talk about the director at the time and needed to the crime is i'm and bullying oh, all the use different intakes that going on in the, in the department and being used to the apartment, you know, you don't want to rock the bike. you just want to keep your heat down and get the

job done. and they were just too many people saying the same thing and it was very early on, again, some of the service division partners, the franchise tools that started raising sleggs with me. and this prompted me to look into what they were talking about. and it was, it was a 2017 in june that i decided to play the whistle actually on the face of gee. and i believe it was so around various company policies that were being breached by this director. and just to give you a little bit of a back story in 2013, when i joined samsung, they had just initiate the 0 tolerance policy on will supply. so the was 0 tolerance for any. and this must behavior. so any breaks, you know, a breach has a policy, and that is what prompts me to do this because you're on. yeah,

they train you, we will protect to supplies if you see something, say something. so that is what i did in the information. one of the key pieces of information that was given to me i ended are the because other people way to speed and to actually handle the other. so the was the myriad of different pieces of information. i'll also be on 2 different platforms. i did it in person and i utilize the circle, confidential hack law and both of those avenues. at each my i d, g and came looking for me. it was a blow which opposes direct contradiction to all list of main companies, policies that they will not come off to me today. i was about what was the immediate fall out from your whistle blowing?

how did the company react to say, i was here on the face of june, and i actually went on the, the weeks studies and weeks holiday. by the time i got back, the retaliation started straight away. i started getting emails from the i saw the departments and my medias managers and telling me to stop in stocking the stop. i guess this particular director i need, if you went to the order team division because samsung, his internal ordered team to park with that's how they manage the will supply to. and i, 16, i'm the 12, it said i'm being retained the i to the games. you have to do something, you have to protect me and the response to me was sorry, but you'll have to get yourself a lawyer. and i'll just actually the set of goss, because that was in complete contradiction to all of the years or we will protect you this thing that's important tonight. yeah, and this is something that happens with will supply and you often don't know what

you don't know in the moment and it was a 20. 19 off that being dismissed. i was dismissing 2018 a year light say that, you know, people had left the company and they gave me evidence and information that's the company was covering at fault products. and it was this particular, what's the director that was part and parcel of this whole kind of rep. so they chose to protect him and not myself because the business is a brand sense of what's coming up for the product. so the retaliation was immediate in every party and everybody knew thing that i was well supplied. the director was supplied, sorry, did i read to you that i was, it was supplied by media supervisors and asked feedback next. yeah,

the guess slips believed ostracized. and, you know, do you work stub changes? i was just detecting oh, different manners. and at the time you don't have the language in, in the any reason i control the bath is now is because i've learned so much about it. now. i'm not what piece, toxic tactics all that and a surrounding the retaliation and the guess locking in the marketing and all of those as one of those things that happens. he said when he mediates and there was no protection is perhaps more important than your direct whistle blowing. and i say this because of the good works that have come out of your experience was what happened after you blew the whistle? you went through what most whistle blowers go through. you suffered social isolation, you were ruined financially. and you suffered from depression and suicidal ideation . we've all been there and it's terrible. how did you get through those initial rough days? and i think john, it's you know,

roller coaster and it's been a lot of trial and the era and one of my saving graces is that i was studying mindfulness at the time just before i was really, i signed up to do it to you a month on the schools and they gave me a lot of awareness, a movie, and as of myself and my emotions, what i was going through with it was it gave me the tools to manage it, spit out in the states week by week. as i was reading that, um, i would have a read this experience at work and then i could apply those tools. but more the next must situations a little bit different because i'm single, i'm not married. so i didn't have a partner to come home to united states, discuss things with i made a conscious decision about a yeah, into this not to involve my immediate fame, my other, you know,

my siblings because the trauma was too much, the stress was too much. so i pull a lot of the building on myself and, and knowing, and the determined that it would have one of the things that i have been doing. and so i'm glad i'm doing this is reaching out. so i did start reaching out to support . we started a small list of night, spoke to to south africa, and we reached out to jake gary and in my mindful of compassion with my self compassion. i was attending a weekly session every tuesday with complete strangers that know nothing about most of larry, but just that support structure was the to listen and just hold space. and the tricky thing to navigate. yeah. is that when you're going to all these different scenarios, sometimes you have positives and then you have negatives. and women with success,

you say it gets to that suicidal ideation. it's being able to literally just gets through that moment in next day. focus on what's happening right now because there's nothing you can do because of the depression, the financial, the summation, it's literally just getting to learn from on that side. i'm very lucky because as recently as september last year is when i was find myself at 2 o'clock in the morning top, you know my suicide later. so how you get through it is you have to degree d a good fit resilience, and reach out you need to reach out to somebody, anybody, even if it's just the suicide health lives of use, the lux ending alternates and my resources. so i don't have food and, and people with the whole page because it is

a lot to carry. and it is a lot for people to maintain it interesting as well because it goes on for so long doesn't just you will slow one day and it's done. you will supplier and it will fit you for the rest of your life. what was it that led you to think that you wanted to do something to aid? whistle blowers, mental health? and how did you get started? what did you focus on? nice, the intro t and it's month, it's you lift experience. what is your lift experience? you have a lot more to bring. and serendipitously you was a mom on this training happening hand in hand ends in south africa to tom. there was no maple hills support and my country, so the africa is not the beast with uh, with that health system guarantee of being without a psychological support for you know, 6 months. so we have a very big back of the so, and it's also the case of you have to reinvent yourself. you know,

you've come out of this corporate c t m s moon through these years, my ph. d managed face, you know, work environment. so in any environment, whether it's a corporate setting or just the retail chain, and i would see all of these anything with a hierarchy structure triggers me and i have no trust in those spaces. so having to reinvent myself, what am i going to do not in a living. and i did start to focus on the mental health because mine was and is such disarray. and it was nice, portia, and that's we now started reaching out. luckily online. and i made a contribution to the psycho social impacts, it was a blow retaliation. you know, it was checked to gary and martina back that came up last year. and the importance of this is that the, the terminology you see, and in south africa we have rectified the l o 190. and this is

a major when, because it speaks to and psychological patients in the wordpress in the labor laws . so because i had very little support yet, and we were low as trying to help most of those. and unfortunately, even in that space, i experienced shame and bullying and ostracized ration as well. and that was a mess up for me because it was the what's the low stakes of doing it to each other, but we didn't know any beta at the top. so as i said, this being very serendipitous. i've lived to lots of mates and mobile connections in the space, and i'm truly made full now as well. so i've been working on this, getting to know, understand the narcissism behind this top of leadership. and you know, with south africa as good as the labels of corruption we have and also i will

supply those. we are called to to and a lot of them austin, kill so high managing your mental health a trying to sustain and to so moving forward is key in boxes because it's not only you, it's going to affect your family. it's going to take every aspect of the law, so these are a lot that we can offer, you know, and, and also shifting into the space. i'm hoping that i can make a difference. yeah. as others have made for me. doing bellamy, thank you so much for speaking with us. we have a lot more coming up in this conversation. june. bellamy is a south african corporate whistle blower and active is and we're going to discuss how she got out of for depression from the isolation of whistle blowing right after the break stating. 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 the

asia, pens can speak for a to we, we can, we are free to do whatever is in the interest salvation. so with that, i believe with the, with the nice of but not if it's a non issue for us news the, the german, so just deal with the, with the one will taking the picture. they were proud of domestic but are you ready

to leave to go in your mouth because i didn't recommend your printer there. know, but he got got a with or i actually was who i see on google more guy and with 10 almost a week ago. and then we'll get to under the, under the general say to us, just a lot of the street. but this, this indeed reality the many last has never been to the did you purchase a i'm tied to the police. yeah. tennis, that's hard to time prize. sanction hoya to desire just to give some of it's just stuff us to give. he isn't. and for this is a very vote decision by the gym and government to even stop because he is when the agreement was reached to generate that small divisions and mall and got

more questions or more of those the out is using to pay us what they are giving us is go to the pollution countries and now we have not been support. you've called what has been happening here. it will open the ponder as box the next thing. it will be them both then also have to pay the the welcome back to the list of lawyers. i'm john kerry, onto were speaking with south african corporate whistleblower and activist june bellamy. good to have you with this june. thanks again for being here. thanks for having me, john. we were talking in the 1st segment about your reaction, your response to the fall out from your whistle blowing. take us back to that period. you're depressed, you're isolated, you're broke. how did you break out of that? how did you decide to do something for other whistle blowers?

well, i'll tell you that you've done. i'm not out of the gates. i used to be 2 weeks ago . i had this here from the cold chair. and he took the last of my belongings that they need to know the fridge. and so the struggle is real. but to answer your question and the, the breaking out of it is that is a combination of what can you manage on the day and, and who else is at the going to the same thing reaching out. and it is one thing i know to be truly lost is that when you help others, it helps you so in this service and offering assistance to others. i have also been fueled a lot by that. and so one of the things i did actually was i started stokes, etc. and house it. and because i don't have a piece of my own and even ducks, let's see the dogs for you so much during these. nothing the but joy,

such as all these different areas of change and shift that i've tried to incorporate in small life. and the like, i say the service to others was, was a very big component of this. and that's what shifted leading to the space of naturally trying to make it better for those who come off dress because we have a long way to go. and we also sleepy too, and we're, i can, i speaking to assisting in our usual changes as well. we have some really strong civil society groups here, and the 1st draft of the proposed changes to i just license to be in a particular closes, just come out and i will probably come in. so that's, we will take some time, you know, because these not income coming in, but i will put into that because, you know, if it will help somebody else and hopefully they don't have to go through what

you've gone through. and if they do, in some ways, it's been a full that you will live yourself with whistle blowers, u k. and with whistle blowers of america, tell us about the work that you did with those 2 groups. and the benefits for south african whistle blowers or so i'd say, and what's the of america and what's the 1st point of contact? and to jack, he asked me to gina profitable in days. so you try has just recently they going through the parliamentary system. the reason in changing was allowed was the and these are very strong robust, and the case for having a completely separate own, but some of the, so to speak, remain each of these cases. so it doesn't go to the legal system because the legal system takes too long. and as we all know, as one of my high stakes the business, you take somebody like samsung. they can just start billions edits and keep use of price for as long as they want. so the key area in this is that it's brought to

different countries together. and we have a lot of collaboration happening now between us. so they, because u. k. and we also bringing in very, very of, at various other countries as canada is also, you know, coming into the conversations. and as a collective you, you look, you know, what is working, what isn't working, what needs to change, and you get to throw these ideas around and does it. oh, i hear those because when say look, we've tried this, it doesn't work. it's rather go down the street, x, y, and z. so in the collaboration again, what it's very important as well is it gives you voice. it gives you voice that you being heard, that you are making a difference because the more that we have a voice is we are a recess fuel and gives us energy to carry on working needs and very difficult,

very long periods of time in making the slow changes, so i think the big plus the big thing to remember yet, and that's, you know, we're another line. and if you reach out across the board is these you will meet and you will become connected with people who have the same goal is you and very last the street. that's we, i st. cloud, your numbers, because i'm, it's no longer just, you know, june, there will be in south africa taking on this big the, he this, you know, i, i've mix phenomenal people and across the globe. and they all support cheap. so, you know, you know, the learning this i'm interested also in the educational courses that you've developed regarding whistle blowing. what do you cover in this course and to whom is it targeted? have you seen results from it? i say n b is not a specific cause to say,

so just to clarify some awful mix with those courses. they are based on the works of on campus in which is the space detection resilience pain. so that is all, you know, the formats it's cost is what i bring into the, into the components is a lot of self compassion. the self compassion component is key because when you're in situations like this, they can be a little sick and casey, so the voice in your head must be very strong and compassionate and pro you so it's literally like having your own cheerleader in your own heat. you know, giving you the support that you need to carry on because there's a lot of nice says in this environment. and the course is that the looking to do now because of the book. and because we can apply for cpd and continue practice points. we can ass stopped educate,

seen in actually any boss or to any academia, any business who has glass and h, or any company policies in place. and we can specifically start teaching in a bass the bullying language about the what's up low retaliation? are you doing this or not doing it, or you even the way that your company is or is not supporting so successful, even really not the courses at the moment. these very few companies. that's a well the, you know, well come the honesty and the cheese of how to pay to protect both of those and might be a take books exercise on these thoughts. so writing not courses at the moment is being geared towards an education on the legal side, the psychology side,

lycos and human resources. leadership and anybody that yeah, anybody that's well for the institution with any continue practice points. this tacos curriculum around this was the land penny ation. becoming soleah with what it is, is we need to get in a peer support at the june bellamy. thank you so much for joining us and for helping to shine a light on what it is that most whistle blowers go through. and thank you to our viewers for being with us. japanese writer, novelist and essay is how we keep we're coming once said quotes. when you come out of a storm, you won't be the same person that walked in. that's what the storm is all about, and quote, these rights. and that is what leads to the strength necessary to speak truth to power, just like june, bellamy did. thanks for joining us for another episode of the whistle blowers, i'm john curiosity. we'll see you next time.

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