man, some banners have the clear message to quote, envy us fonts of genocide in gaza. depending on denounced that it has long strikes on facilities. it claims were used by a ron's as law make revolutionary guard and eastern syria. later it added that quote, the united states does not speak conflict and has no intention or desire to engage in further hostilities. these precision self defense strikes are response to a series of ongoing and mostly unsuccessful attacks against us personnel in iraq and syria, by iranian back to militia groups that began on october 17 with the us taking part in air strikes on syria that are usually reserved by israel washington's forces still remain on the ground in the oil rich part of the country. unwelcome for years by damascus. americans boot count in the region is growing to as bite and recently dispatched 2000 marines to israel, along with 2 navy carrier,

straight groups to park off its mediterranean shores, along with fighter jets and associated air defense headquarter elements. add to that the us air lives arriving at idea faces daily to replenish weapons supplies. former syria military general mohammed of us says his country has been victimized by terrorism, waged by the united states. of the americans used to say that it's a, it's a says, this is a guess that's covered for this is the basis of, let's say that the, the american existence or the american being is here or the legal. so they don't have any, any right to the, to say the difference in said this is, is that about the, i think got to see this says, or the access over this sense of has a life to take off or to one of those. i mean,

it goes out to, i mean it can know are, these are going to dominate or to, to, to for cdl in a or to put you to it very, very hard of the positions nowadays we, we are facing a heart of the clinic and vitamin the are the source of the vitamin. we know it is we are facing the, i mean it can do isn't material. discussing how the west of actions and palestine seem to suggest some lives are more equal than others. it's across the joint. peter and guys, next here on our to international. thanks for watching. don't go far the the, [000:00:00;00]

the hello and welcome to cross stock. were all things are considered. non peter live out. the western world is given is real, a green light to exact revenge in the wake of a mouse is attack on october 7th and doing so. the west is made it clear international humanitarian law. and the rules of war are subjective and arbitrary. some lives are more valuable than others, the cross talking palestine, i'm joined by my guest, ryan christian and franklin. he is found are an editor of the last american vagabond and the host of the daily wrap up inside. and we crossed the site. yeah, so to raleigh, he is assistant professor of political science at the institute for humanities and cultural studies. and in budapest we cross the george samuel we. he is

a pod cast or at the goggle, which can be found on youtube and locals. are gentlemen, costs are girls in effect, that means you can jump any time i want you want, and i always appreciate it. let's go to the professor in into that, and i'd like to read you a fragment that uh, and it was stated by the secretary general of the united nations, apparently, well, what i'm about to read is very, very controversial. i want your thoughts. it is also important to recognize the attacks by how miles did not happen in a vacuum. the palestinian people had been subjected to 56 years of suffocating occupation. is there any errors in that? those 2 sentences there because i've read it about 50 times and i don't see what's wrong with it, but apparently the, the, the people, the powers that be in the west think this is an atrocity in itself. go ahead and cut down the i think what is going on and guess is that as is, ryan is preparing for a land invasion. and i want to ask that especially the white stripes,

prepaying for line invasion and divide. the degree like that you mentioned is being given by the western leaders to desire to engage because a, a transitive question we should get. the operation alleged are strong from these right point of view. first of all, you have experienced an unprecedented instead of just failure of seeing as good such as for the hide or phases of this operation from the eyes of israel's intelligence service. and it's complicated, this find acknowledges. it means that it can happen. and again and again in the future. so the people who have promised, i mean is right, is the residence of the occupied territories to people who were promised to leave it in normal life. india, goodbye to if there is no chance of air, it's not the safe place to be there as migration had already started since i'll leave it in test by and dismiss at the end of is read is near no population. no country is such

a situation. the only day left to compensate for this test will be failure she occupied guess why come us off from years and create this search empty for the residence? i'll get to better thursday at the source of the say that this time us is completely eliminated. israel, she well my wonder if i could an interrupt here and go to franklin. i go to ryan him, franklin, i. i agree that that is the stated goal it but to get rid of hamas, you're going to have to get rid of the population at the same time. my point is, and they, my introduction i was suggesting is that the west is culpable. and in alignment with israel and competing with is nothing less than genocide. go head, right? yeah, yeah, yeah. it is an objective reality what you just said and this is what so frustrating about this entire conversation. and as you a so delicately put at the beginning, it's very clearly revealing that they do not care about all of the things that they, you know,

the so called roles based international order clearly only applies when they want it to. right. i mean, these are like the things i always maintain, that i want, i want my on begins and everybody listening to understand and these are objective realities. the united nations as always maintains this is an occupied territory. and because that's a reality, that means that under the geneva conventions any occupied territory has the legal right to arms struggle armed rebellion. that means that come off, his actions as the resistance of one of the factions, of resistance of gaza, of the policy in people was a legally protected acts. now, once crimes that might have been a work committed after that were committed. now those are crimes sort of like when u. s. military commit, rape, or murder or anything else that happens overseas. those are crimes, it doesn't then immediately invalidate the action if it weren't legal of a military action. but to yet, to answer your 1st question, this was so frustrating because what was stated by the united nations is so blatantly obvious and even more so how frustrating it is that it took him 16 days of indiscriminate,

24 hour bombing of civilian locations before he said that and then they, they, they go so far as to attack him on the un revoke they are you there. they're a devil at access or a and then also and literally condemn them and ask for them to resign before stating an objective reality. you know, just shows you that the they're trying to whitewash the actions against civilians and gaza. now done that, pointed to it and let me continue for one more. second, i think it's important that we understand that there is no way to remove the we, if you're bombing places where there are civilians present. whether or not they claim they're using as human shields. and we can get into that which the u. n. is investigated and found that i'm off hasn't been doing that, but that means that you are still committing a crime that's collected punishment. political is now writing articles about how it's now somehow legal because they're using them as human shields. we know that if anybody else was doing this, they would be treating them like, like the criminal that they should be treated as. so it's just, it's, it's a grotesque and what they're doing is white washing the crimes. they would have

a hold of anybody else accountable for what you know, george is go to budapest. dear george, you know, it's really quite remarkable. is that, um uh, they've been logged and said because these got comments in the west were elected. that means the people that elected these governments that are committing crimes against arabs and muslims, they are legitimate targets. so that western media in the western political world is adopted, been loggins' doctrine because, well, the, the american people apparently voted for joe biden. and joe biden is doing this. do you see how perverse this logic is? because then, but then, then, you know, you can turn around say, well, benjamin netanyahu was elected. so all the people that voted for him or are taught a legitimate targets as well. i mean, it's all very perverse, but it's being adopted george or indeed in the list of the irony to what you just said, which is that hamas is boys described in the western media as not legitimate representative of the palestinian b,

but not even the legitimate representative of the people of gaza, indeed gaza is often described as a military dictatorship, which means that it's even the list of your justification to punish the people of gaza for the alleged depredations of thomas. i mean, at least when the guys have been live, is that where you have these democratic elections you, you, you, you know, you say they're all democratic and therefore the people of the chosen, but ministrations that are one after another. i have this, you the same policy in the middle east, for example, all unconditional support for his role. so therefore, this has no descent, as far as the political elite is concerned in the united states on the issue of israel, apple. it says the reason that the american people are guilty of all the crimes of israel because it's a ridiculous piece of logic,

but it can indeed be applied to israel. and so therefore, the, they get all the argue this, all of this, all the, you know, crimes you know, the game targeting civilians. well, yes, it's true. the time us uh, targeted a civilians in the, on october the 7th. but they also targeted military, like i said, they have attacked the ministry basis, which is kind of similar to what most of the countries do with united states. uh only the bombs, it bumps military diet. it also attacks the civilian targets. so the, the attempt to suggest that how much exclusively attacked a civilians august is completely wrong. but it's don't deliberately just suggest the somehow what happened on october. the 7 in is like all the cause. it was just simply an attempt to eradicate the jewish people. it's a completely false narrative, but you know what is perpetrated in order to adjust the box? anything that israel wants to do well, and of course, george,

nothing happened before october 7th. we everything was call and everyone was happy . everyone was saying and come by a, let's go back to the professor and into that. and your 1st answer to me you, you talked about the, the, the end of israel, the, the, the, the, the existential threat that is real faces right now. that is very real and you know, as we wait i, i tend to think that there will not be a mass of ground invasion because they'll just lose and they don't want to lose. and there are, but there are people in israel, they want a preemptive strike on has, has the law up north, i think that is very bad calculation as well. your thoughts and to that and go ahead a look as you have seems to bind a certain model of the action to prince president has a old warrant is read about the ground invasion, neither by the nor matron as a customer to but kind of cindy. it's crystal clear for them that the ground and visually create it caught my eye for is lighting guessing why, you know,

when these $360.00, i mean square kilometers area was there, it was under the occupational is, are in the hands of duration, including our shuttle used to work had to describe these rise difficulties and guys, finally, there isn't quite a bit through it's meetings or forces from guys in 2005. this happens in the time to pursuing as reflecting bit store and not with besides capable of reaching columbia or over muslim world. not tolerated ground invasion. just as a mistake could activate other t is right forces. and your engine is right, is order to have the water which you got. it is already at ward. we live in them. in case of agree off golf invasion is right. it should prepare itself to flight and multi front war that each may not be capable of fighting cannot because it's slacks strategic. did you know? so did you give is a term administered it to show that diversity despatches between the cross lies and the heart to that? is there a lex it, i'm wondering if the residence of the occupied territories. i've spent enough time

in the recent years for learn swimming. this you are not, it is very interesting, ryan, because this is the dove, the strategic dilemma that israel faces and, and it's a dilemma that it created for itself in the what we've been. wow, those investigative studies, this is, it's a 56 years in the making. know, and should be surprised by this. go ahead before we go to the break. yeah, well i mean, really we're talking about 75 years plus if you want to get really specific about it in regard to occupation, but, you know, the, the, the legal state of israel is a legal reality. right? so we have to always go from there. we have to understand that this is an illegal occupation, but you know, there's, there's a lot of nuance to it. obviously it's been going on a really long time and there's people innocent people on all sides. and i think that's what this conversation needs to. what we're trying to make clear, or is it in a support? the whole point of all the programs i'm making about this is there's context folks . there's context. and when we have context, then we can have a discussion, gentlemen, i'm going to jump in here. we're going to go to a short break and after that short break,

we'll continue. our discussion on palestine state will talk to the same wrong just don't need to shape house because of the application and engagement trails. when so many find themselves will support we choose to look for common ground the the the,

[000:00:00;00] the the the welcome back across the dock were all things are considered. i'm peter will bill to remind you we're discussing palestine. the okay, let's go back to georgia in, in budapest, george, we've seen the ongoing that the security council going nowhere. and it's basically the united states and its allies that just insist on repeating over and over again

. in every way possible fashion, you know, it has the right to self defense. well, yeah, it does. okay. i don't know what the argument is here, but actually it's, it's code. it's a coded narrative to say because it has the right to self defense. it can do anything, it wants to in response and that is that they the, the catch right there. and that's why other countries on the security council won't go along with it because then they would be complacent in ethnic cleansing and genocide. george of this exactly right, it's a bizarre kind of a talking point is, or it has a right to self defense, which means the israel can do whatever it likes and then the car all the way over. that is the cost of the attack on this nebula is kind of arrow of uranium. well, well, they don't recognize that these rails white to exist. of course that's also totally untrue because supposedly do but the issue a big deal except that anyone can, i mean nobody has a right to exist. but the issue is, of course, what the,

what are the final borders of the state of israel, and that, that is pretty much in the dispute. but the been going back to you appointed by the united nations. it is easy that all of the united states and it's out, i'd say as well, this is an attack on the jews, the jewish people, and they have full since we don't want to repeat the holocaust, you know, we have to give essentially the jewish people a blank check or whatever they want them. and this was very much integrated by the battle of the german foreign ministers as a we in germany. have a special bond with israel because about a terrible pause and that, but we always have to support israel and it goes it's, it's completely nonsensical because of anything that you do have still to be in conformity with international humanitarian law. just saying that when you have a right to defend yourself, yes, you have a right to defend yourself,

but you don't have a right to use a risk disproportion, pause, and you don't have a ride to violate all these norms that it's a natural human monetary law such as cutting off a civilian population from food award to electricity. uh, few holes. uh, that is obviously a violation to say that this somehow is about our right to defend ourselves, but it's obviously a live. well, no it, this isn't. cost is suspend. morality is what it's all about and it's, and it's an exception only this time. well, no international humanitarian law should apply all the time to everyone. it's really quite remarkable. i want to say this to all my guess is real, is a child is the child abuse nighted nations. united nations made is real. okay. and, and of all countries to defy its rules and resolutions. you know, that's never pointed out here is go back to the professor intent on. i'm sure professor, do you notice that uh it would that there's a a and that coldwell be a post $911.00,

a more on global pair and of course era and as always in the center of it all. okay, so let me get this straight. uh, people, uh, the under occupation in gaza, break out of an open air prison attack is re lease including civilians. and so the united states has to attack around can you explain that logic to me because i'm not sure i get it. if the united states could take, you know, on it have it, has, it would have done it in do so it's 4 to 5 years. it is not able to do so and look at this. no, that's it. guess you're on, you're going to guess is right. again, guess about us sending us the best as no longer be able to, to, to interfere to save yours. right? for the same reason that it couldn't topple it legitimacy and call them into a mattress. and for the same reason that it couldn't be sent nature to josh and products, but

a sanders and that it couldn't embed you're on despite frequently claiming that the options are on the table. you see all options are not on the table. the both today is very different from what it was a decade or 2 ago. and there is no reason for your eyes interferes, but us in the us are strong enough. there is, there is just us forces injuries and are at their strongest position in history and is it, and it's based as supporters are at their biggest position. so i think how most so it is the best time to take back the occupied territories. i think a good it will be no war, no mastercard to march the end of user and the end of the user, we'd be marked by then by an event creation division. but we saw enough understanding about the use me to forces be to repeat this for the she deserves and residents of the territories. my suggestion is that if the vista and the doors are

concerned about the lives of designers issues provide free slide services for the so the occupied forces to anywhere in the world. they have come from. there's no need for and a lot of war the united states is not able to raise your bar as well. they, they may try, ryan, and that, and the, the, the worry is that they might fail. i don't think has pause, afraid of 2 aircraft carriers. and they use mandatory, i don't think they're afraid of it. i mean they, they've had their fighters in syria, they're prepared, they've been waiting, i would say, from their perspective for a situation like this through a rise for a very long time. and these railways be, or has the law, they definitely fear it. but you know, overall, this kind of an overarching thing. here. it is really the pathetic state of the west where had gemini from humanity. i mean, they have the language of humanitarian rights and they've, they tried, they and they use it as a use it as a console,

very often around the world. but it's really hollow in its meaning because if there is an exception, then the rule doesn't work. go ahead, right? yeah, and this is a classic tactic. and i mean, you can look back through all of that and pretty much all of us foreign policy. the joe guy off and make on my show is that they're batting 0, right? they claim we're fighting for freedom, we're trying to get freedom to these countries and they and they topple and destroy and leave it in a ruin and, and go to the next one and the next one. and so either they are the worst possible country in the world, actually starting freedom, or maybe they're not actually trying to spread freedom. you know, it's like why we let that continue is beyond me, libya left as you know, it's open slay market. now, just warring factions and we just never talk about that, it was, you know, over and over and over. so they don't have the moral high ground here. i think what you're pointing out is important that they use these terms in order to control the perception and literally the actions of other people and including their allies. i mean, look at what happened with north stream pipeline and germany. i mean, it's very clear, these people are the very ones that they act like their adversaries are in regard

to the disregard for international law. you know, so nobody's your whole there are standing as legitimate, right? we need to, i mean, but i forget the person's name and i wish i remember it right now, but a palestinian representative on, i believe it was, bbc made a very, very important point. the only thing that the palestinian resistance and the policy and representatives are actually asking for at this moment is the equal application of international law. think about how important, obvious that isn't, you know, pretty well what, what a radical idea isn't it just, it just saying the obvious is extraordinary, you know, towards, you know, it, it was, we were brought up to, to hate around the media. i, you know, we had all the think tanks and all of that. and you know, here, here we go, this is kind of how it's frame the crazy mall of the crazy people and cut out over and over again demonizing them denigrating them. but this is exactly how western leaders act right now. okay. they're the ones that are fanatics, they're, they lost their mind. george, that's exactly right. that is very amusing,

that the so there is this logic of being uh, offered by uh, width and leaders. especially in the united states that because iran the support the highlights and because it runs the boards as well. uh and the other uh, proxy pool is, is um, iran must be boned. and this has been said by lindsey graham is by said by uh, joseph lieberman formal vice presidential candidates. i didn't even know lieberman was still alive and to leave the house that i didn't know that. okay, i thought i thought that we moved on to greener pastures. okay. yeah. me too. but, but that's the iran is there for a legitimate target, because the, when it comes to ukraine, they don't say that they the nato power though they get them. it's all gets full, essentially bank rolling into the bolting and arming. um the ukraine, right? what would when auto body to the conflict?

so again, it's an ellipse, the inconsistency. but the problem is, i like if we stop escalating as well, and this is this, the, the issue that one wants to talk about is that is what your husband usually weapons in this room. unlike anyone else is ready to use the, i mean, we know how ruthless is realistic. so if so, if it is indeed these rows, destiny to be involved in a multi front wall, that it was in danger of losing as well. we would use use a weapon so, and i don't think is any doubt about that. so it's a, it's a very dangerous situation. um and uh, and then it was one that so you know, we have concept and, but we're able to do because no one has attempted to restrain is what it is or what to use. usually what was, what would model a van and the rest of them say is right as a right to defend it. somebody has the right. so let's go back to the professor right well, rapidly running out of time. i really do, i'm glad george brought up the issue of nuclear weapons because i also think it considering how these railings want to destroy a mouse,

which means we'll have to destroy all the palestinians that they could resort to weapons of mass destruction. maybe not a new killer weapon, but other ones. i mean white foss, squarespace, they use it on a regular basis now apparently, and no, no one calls them out on your thoughts be as we in the program, go ahead. oh no, it is and will not be able to use new jersey at times because as you see it, the most forces have it not be killed by new services. new services are going to destroy the order of people is right. is fighting. come us, the option is not due for a nikiya, meek service on the option is going and to invade an inmate from the ground and is where it was not. we did not succeed. as i said, it is not capable of invading guys. the problems from the drones, because homeless has prepared and planned for it, but i meant for

a lot bar and and if is right, interest goes a little bit. i'm from syria and from some other forces. it's me to be attacked. usually the best plan to destroy it is right so well gentlemen, gentlemen, we are rapidly running out of time. obviously we're going to keep a very close eye on the events here. but one of them, the, the, the primary purpose of this program is to show the, the rank hypocrisy of the west when it uses the words of human rights and international human rights law. it's just suffocating lee, a stupid ok as all the time we have general motor thing, my guess in budapest, for franklin and into around and of course i want to thank our viewers for watching us here. ok. so you next time. remember, pass that rules the,

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the, [000:00:00;00] the, [000:00:00;00] the, the dozens of casualties including women and children are rushed to hospitals and this devastating is rarely air strikes on dogs. on medical officials warrant, there's just no more space to treat them. at least 3 people are reportedly wounded . this friday and then elected home last rocket strikes on