in many powerful countries, like the united states, the u. k. and canada. on one side, iran, turkey, saudi arabia, pakistan, and practically every single era country on the other. as to what countries like china, india, and russia are going to do it. and if there's a total escalation, my god, we can only guess. now, last week, we had a couple of guests on here to talk about the history of this conflict on the debate and sued right away, right? you probably watched it. it was to say, the least if you haven't seen it, you would discover extremely passionate as putting it mildly. what that showed us is just how difficult it is to have an objective, unemotional conversation. just just to have a conversation regarding this issue. even when we're talking about history,

which you would think most people could generally agree on write something happened on such and such a date. so now what, what we're going to do is we're going to bring back those guess conservative radio host, steve malls berg, who is a firm defender of israel, dr. norman finkelstein, who was an equally firm and in his defense of the palestinians. but before we do that, i'd like to catch you up on the news, israel and the government of giving them yahoo, appear ready to use this, a force of biblical proportions. i don't use that word by coincidence, by the way. that is how nathan yahoo is framing it, and his war cabinet, they're describing their actions in that way, which is only adding by the way, gasoline to this fire, because now you have both sides saying that somehow god is only on their side, which means they're killing in god's name, that's not good. that's not good. to be clear, there is general agreement that because of what, how much did they are needed to be?

so i'm kind of retribution and that may be the group needed to be eradicated. come us even arab leaders that agreed with that notion. the problem is the campaign to eradicate, come off is now apparently turned into what appears to be a campaign to eradicate the entire gaza population by sending troops in the northern guys while effectively impacting a bombing campaign. that has already killed more than 3 times the number of people that were killed by how much summer saying 3000 children have been killed and gaza already 3000 children. most of these people are civilians, including women and the elderly. say this, this heavy handed strategy is making even those who feel bad for israel now see them as offenders, because the notion of collective punishment, collective punishment, it just doesn't cut it in that region of the world. why?

why? because for too long. nothing in this conflict has ever happened in a vacuum. meanwhile, our country's government appears to be giving israel a blank check to do as they please with the palestinians. and that unconditional us support is not going over well, not at all in their work. this is what we used to do in these conflicts back in the 19 ninety's when washington had pathological military and geo political super your superior already in the region. but here's the problem. that is not the case today, not really. i get the vitamin ministration. you know, a guy who's what, from the 19 forties and fifties in his thinking the by the administration is implementing the same cold war initiatives that are likely to create a more dangerous conflict. in fact, american forces,

in places like syria and the rocks are continuing to be attacked, and us military has even shot down a turkish drone. as an ominous undertaking, considering turkey is a needle country, with an impressive if not ferocious military, which is now clearly on the side of the palestinians. so our government continues to tell is real, do whatever you need to do, we got your back, quote, we got your back. now, what that really has come to maine is we will keep writing you huge checks, right? the problem is there isn't enough money to go around these days, certainly not the fund, israel's military, in an escalating war while also funding taiwan while also fighting funding ukraine, economists and point to the us debt problem say that's impossible. yet here we are on the verge of engaging in what is almost sure to become a devastating regional conflict that could lead to i'm just going to say it.

world war 3 most in washington are barely even considering that potential lot. com y o and march ledger and mart in large measure. it's because our media has become a cheerleading team. they don't ask questions. they're supposed to be asking. now when it comes to the coverage of the palestinians point of view, it's not existent. the so let's go back down. remember this image i showed you at the top of the. busy were thousands, were seen protesting for peace, most of them jewish americans, by the way, i checked. and it appears that cnn didn't even cover it, because it doesn't fit their pro war narrative. that is why we're about to show you something i'm confident you won't see on any other news network, but we're about to do. here is an actual debate with both sides of this minis.

conflict represented as opposed to just the point of view of israel. steam walls berg is a popular radio talk show host, who i've known for years. doctor norman finkelstein is an active as an author whose books include gaza, an inquest into martyrdom, save, and you are being perceived as someone who is not concerned. and this should be obviously a very important concern for all of us as americans that we could be on the brink of all out war with iran, at least if we hear the rhetoric both from washington and from t, ron not to mention the shooting, going back and forth, he says dr finkelstein, that is the israeli is go in full force with troops into the palestinian area. busy is there's no question that not just iran, but other arab countries will be involved and that will conflict great. this more.

how concerned are you about that? of course it's, it's very concerning. but you know, i take pride when a nazi supporter calls me names. i love it, i wear it as a badge of honor, and thank you. keep doing it, sir. luck. of course i, as i'm tom, hope you think anybody wants more? anybody wants the us to get involved. anybody wants world war 3. but the bottom line here is, is that israel cannot allow more butchering maxie, what's your in unprecedented since world war 2, the butchering of their citizens. you know, they're how much is holding 9 month old babies and 90 year old women right now in tunnels somewhere. israel cannot allow this to happen again, and by the way, the world can't allow it to happen because of we now start saying, well,

if you have human shields, right, god forbid someone comes into your home, okay. and they're good and they got guns. would you happen to have people in your home with guns ok and these people say ok to kill your children, but they have babies or, or women in front of them with the people protecting your home in your home. not protect, not fire at the people came into your home because they might kill a civilian who is in front of them. you can operate like no an inch like that. just print black. so part dr. finkelstein, what do you sorry my, what, what do you the me ask you the question, let me ask you a question and i'll try and phrase it as fairly as i can. what do you say to steve and others who say we have a right to defend ourselves because of the atrocity uh that was done to our civilians, our citizens by how mos. what do you say to that?

i say israel has the right to the center. so asper, it opens up the gates of going so the concentration can, but so long as those gates are shocked into point, as they have been since 2006 are, do not believe cards, how the rate of self service in the face of a concentration can i don't think the dog sees has the right of self defense. if there were an insurrection in our insurance or any of the other concentration curves, rick at the shop, really rate that you're putting up with all the concentration now wrap, not only do you all read the, we've written loudly, egypt, the 1000 flows by 200. if you guys are close, yeah. do you believe that you believe garza is a constant traction camp or the day that over

and over and over? i don't get it. the doctor got go finish up the side of metal. i'm going to give you a chance to respond to a most the but no, i'm a to, i'm ok. what happened on october 7th? but you know, like, you know, what the, how much do they do? what is real, periodically, dogs in the abroad. the more you hear, the way you might expire, drive or to stop the expression. and so i don't find any disgusting. the searing expression is used by the is really urgent. yeah. okay. i use the disk on the,

the gentleman, what are the, what, what are the time dr. business started a lot of the, let's do this. let's, let's do this. we have a disagree. the government cannot really win. periodically they go in and say, we're following the law. it's uh, it's okay. so let's, let's, let's do this doctor for 1000000 share offering. and you and your little point says you're 1000000. sure. and your point is that fair want to add an accurate on. there are a 1000000 children in that area. the question is, and this is what i want to talk about when we come back from the break. and steve, i want you to start us off here. you heard discharge many times. the treatment that is riley's due to palestinians living in these areas like the gaza,

is oppressive, is wrong, is not a charge that i'm making. it's been made by human rights groups. it's been made by palestinians, it's been made by many. what do you believe is the way for the treatment of those people by israel? i think that's a fair question. that's what i want you to take on. when we come back, i'm talking to steve mazda boards and dr. norman finkelstein and we are going to be right back by the. busy we'll continue this conversation with you as well. go to twitter and you'll find me there and rick sanchez, tv or x or whatever they call it these days. i'm looking forward to having that conversation with you. and when we come back, of course, the very latest on the us military's engagement in this complex and what it means for the future of the regions stay right there will be right back with my 2 very passionate guests the,

the, the look forward to talking to you all, that technology should work for people. a robot must obey the orders given by human beings accept. we're so short or is it conflict with the 1st law? show your mind, anticipation. we should be very careful about our professional intelligence at the point, obviously is to makes a trust rather than to the various things with artificial intelligence we have summoning the theme and the most protect. this phone existence was on the

russian states and never as one of the most sense community best. most all sun set up the, in the system to progress be the one else holes. question about this, even though we will then in the european union, the kremlin mission, the state on the russians per day and split the ortiz full, even our video agency, roughly all the band on youtube tv services. what question did you say from stephen twist, which is the

the one sun and the total motion of the location of the unit $73.00. 1 was a unique organization in the history of the world. what they were trying to do was to simply do nothing short and build the most powerful and most deadly biological weapons program that the world had every now through you know, to production with it. so i guess it was the great deal. so i knew that sort of, you keep on my mazda thought, dismissed union one of up from the sale of that i

don't understand. i wish to know about doing so need. i know you gave him some more or less than a to you it's. i had to put up with this kind of them, why the, i don't know a party bill, you cannot push the couch. so for those people to go to 00, want this on this to should buy a new on it. on site can send me 7, won't get to the yo, yo know, put them out, that they give us together the right welcome back. we are joined by our expert panel once again dr. norman finkelstein and steve malls per gentleman walk. and dr. finkelstein has used the words repeatedly, concentration camp when referring to the treatment of palestinians. um,

it's obviously seated language, but he's not the only one who's used it. i should be fair and mentioned that, steve, if you take umbrage at that terminology, it's not just your words, but your reaction is i'm watching your x. it could be cause rick because rick, it's, it's not only disrespectful, insensitive, and it's insane. okay, a o. c, a congresswoman here in new york from the, in the, in the united states said that our border, we were keeping our, the, the illegal immigrants to come into the country in concentration camps. the left likes to throw it around. now when you show me the gas chambers and the ovens and the skeletons and the star ration and the forced labor, and the lamp shades made from the skin, of those people that were in the real concentration cast run by the nazis. then we

could talk, but to throw that around casually because you hate jews and you hate is real. if i try to ignore them so. so how would you tell you so then how is your problem? so let me ask you, i think this is something our viewers are going to want to hear from you. how would you then characterize the way the palestinians are forced to live by a country they say is occupying them there in does. how would you categorize it? is that occupying them and guys big is real left. garza is real dave garza to the palestinians, ears real when they left on the way out. left green houses, infrastructure. all kinds of things to give the palestinians a head start. what's the 1st thing literally they did toward everything is real left down and celebrated over as they tore it all down, left themselves with nothing, and then elected

a terrorist group to represent them and run on the territory. the terrorist group then did terrorist likes things and always has, why do you think egypt has their border with gaza close? so would you say, oh, we thought we'd just do that? so yeah, so what do you say talk about israel and i know was talking about israel right now . well, obviously be the 2 and targeted. so would you say, would you say give me a word, give me a description. the treatment of israel toward palestinians and gaza is what described is justified for self defense. okay, just a moment. let me tell you what that is real today. reveal the evidence that it, how mazda is main headquarters in gaza is located under the sheep up hospital. that's for the animals of hamas. are they use their people as human shields? they want them dead,

so they could score public relations points. but that's the kind of animals we're dealing with. ok, dr. finkelstein your response. ok, is it a historical question? and then there's this actual question of today. historical question is, in 2006 that these were almost draw from johnson and sat. israel redeployed its troops on the power, there are guys of israel control. the air space is really controlled. the water is really controlled. every thing that went into gosh, every thing that was all the guys to know to get to the current situation, i was referred to the animals. how exactly are we referring to? we know for sure. do you guys, israel's president,

mr. herd side said on the 2nd day on october a, you said we do not make a distinction between hallmarks and the civilian population. there are no just saying he was very in or on the point. there is nobody and nobody in the official position of the b, 5 year old in dogs on a marsh, never to according to nobody really bad. they pulled a crack. don't do all of crap. the finishes point and then i'll, i'll give you time to start. wow. that since you're not admitting any water any. so any electricity, any phone dot, what spring to target the terms, minutes,

the long on the 2nd day it's the optics stuff. nation not guess it's on you know, it's done and very she against the people of god. so i would like any other taste the i am aware of. there was how literally our nouns, every senior is really often show. we're not distinguish between all good and he's what were your letters lot. so let me ask you this so, so, so, so, so what you know better than that? well, what i know is that when i have to guess, i should give them both their piece and you have an opportunity now to essentially counter what he just said. there has been a lot of heated rhetoric though, from both sides, including from his relatives who i've said some pretty awful things about palestinians in general. do you cop to that? and if not steve to teach us what the pallet, what i'm sorry, the teacher you need to be. he said every government official said there's no

difference. that is the complete antithesis is sitting there and lying. yeah, no, no. is it ok no. is it that sound part, but the defense official did say some pretty blasphemous things about the r j a rick rick. imagine after they stayed separate the heads of babies. he said some pretty tough things. okay, i'm ok. wow. the emotions got caught up in him, but look at what they're doing. they still haven't gone in on the ground this lie or says there's been no full water fuel by there, a big trucks coming in. now the reason is real doesn't allow all the fuel is because her mice will take the fuel. they run the government, they run garza and they'll steal the fuel and they'll use it for all kinds of weapons purposes. their animals do their animals, they don't care about the civilians, the land,

right. even though the trucks happen coming in, which is a life of answers the line to what this guy just said, that none have they have easy or hard to be very careful about what they allow you to know as the, if you want to clarify something, dr. finkelstein go ahead, a kerry, sorry, not to the persons that were experimented on israel. i was referring to the statements that were made the day after october. 7th, is you, i guess your after reading is really talking points isn't going to 9, nothing defense minister said there will be no food, no water, no fuel, and no electricity allow them to die. so it's important. i have no idea what the immediate after all i have noticed is the car. so you ask a question about the saw person heard side said the 2nd day. we will not

distinguish between march. oh good the right you want me to answer. oh no, i went, oh assuming question. it's a simple question, go ahead and try to water electricity and or full as you know towards the probably learned she was just a car because you all went down the 2nd day that she was going to be the longest more the last year was in 2014 at $631.00 days and your questionnaire was mine. this is for the last 31 days, you divide the civilian population. so electricity for, for the last days, what happens? that's a question. that's if the doctor finkelstein genocide to you, steve,

you have to answer that charge. you're down, we're down to a minute, my friend. well, 1st of all, that, that is not happen because they are, there are trucks coming in. that's number one. number 2. uh, that's come off when how much gets out about how much less people leave. the people could wave israel says egypt cut open the border and pick them. mm hm. a box loaner by weight, a mosque was allowed with. so scramble and it's their problem. and therefore, and with that we have to end the discussion. it's a passion and one at that. and obviously some very important points in some heated words have been used in this discussion, but that's the state of things as they are. i want to thank you, dr. norman finkelstein, as well as the steve malls berg for sharing this combat of passionate but important debate that we were able to bring you. my thanks to you both before we

go, i want to remind you of our mission here. what we try and do with this show is simply to de silo the world. we all tend to think that we only live in one little box and we only get information about our particular point of view. we think it's important that there should be more than one point of view. truth doesn't live in boxes. truth is everywhere. comic sanchez. i'll be looking for it and i'll be looking for you. yeah, right here, where i help to provide a direct impact the the, [000:00:00;00]

the, [000:00:00;00] the tab to the establishment of the bosses for his email is been in 1933. the physician of the indigenous population in the portuguese colonies deteriorated dramatically. especially in angola, decatur and tony all day. i live at uh, salazar, encourage colonizing, be in golden lands by europeans, and sought after turning the country into a portuguese province. where the and goldens would be 2nd class people. in 1961,

there was an outbreak of violence on the part of the portuguese, in revenge for the plantation workers, dry portuguese aircraft bomb. the villages in northern angola and race riots took place in african parts of lawanda. the people of angelo rose in an armed rebellion . the roots atlas of the colonialists knew no bounds. despite the un calls to stop the island, the portuguese only intensified their terror against the rebels. the 40s actively used the political contradictions between various groups of rebels during the war colonial aircraft. regularly use a farm and drop the fully ends on peaceful villages. the portuguese empire was severely exhausted by the struggle against the national liberation movements. the revolution in portugal brought down the plazas, freezing, and put it in the murder as war against the people of angola. on january 15,

1975, the elbow or agreements were assigned in the country, gained independence after so many years of the brutal war. the of the civilian sheltering in hospitals, the northern gauze, i'll close in the cross spot and make these wavy expensive with hundreds of critical patients facing death with power cuts the evidence. even if we have to provide treatment for them like come to light, the fuel is supposed to run out within hours. the will remain here and we will not fix this place. they don't want at the cost. tens of thousands of civilian states, a southern remedy came monetary and crime. this the following is wrong phone bossman to be in place no way from