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or someone was this, we would show a new people to the the the hello, i'm manila chan. you are tuned into modus operandi. the term banana republic has long been used by us mainstream media to describe the political instability in countries of the global cell, most commonly thrown at latin american countries for the many presidents having and thrown behind bars for corruption. well, could these chickens have come home to roost? as the world watches several cases brought against the us? 45th president, donald trump unfold before the cameras. today we'll take a look at the us drama, and the many cases of world leaders who go from president to present. all right,

let's get into the m o the . it's the 1st in us history. a former poetess indicted on a myriad of charges ranging from corruption to some that are tantamount to fomenting a clue, or blocking the transfer of power. donald trump, now the face of this watershed moment ahead of the 2024 elections here in the us, where he is by many measures. not only the leading opposition candidate against incumbent joe biden, but the leader of the pact to win all these trials. he's facing our spark in the conversation of a weaponized justice system against political foes. while this is the 1st for the wes, this is not the case around the world. so joining us to discuss the many people who have gone from their nation's highest office to

a miserable prison cell. it is ecuadorian journalist esteban cadell. he is the editor at the cradle. you can follow him on twitter or x. i still call it the former followed him at esteban car locks c a r l o p. so as the bond, as we watch these trials of donald trump unfold, historic for the us. no former po, this has ever been indicted on anything ever before. you being a journalist outside of the us and also an ecuadorian citizen. what goes through your mind? what do you think of what's happening here in the us? well, i think of seeing everything that is happening relating to trump. uh, the 1st thing that comes to my mind is that uh, it's a situation that has been a long time call me. and i just said, there is no former president that has actually been indicted or much less made to uh, you know, send to prison for our crimes committed during their administration. and uh,

which with trump embrace has a lot of questions because what it, what it feels like it's, uh, it reminds me of, uh, what do things said recently that uh these uh, is uh, political persecution of up on the 08. 0, is persecution of a political opponent and uh its uh, he talked about the growth in is a very traditional system. and i think uh, this is uh, very much the view outside because uh, outside of the us we do not the in general and see that the beings the same way that our people inside of the us see it. uh, we do not exist in that same bottle. so uh, the suppression withdrawn with the coming elections with the, with biden's own legal problems which are the attorney general's into you. i seem to be honestly this interested into looking into them. it feels like, like i said, like something that has been a long time calling because it also speaks to the,

to the level of the patient that exists within the united states. that up, according to some researches uh, is reached a point that is uh, essentially reversible, you know, between democrats and republicans and another thing that jumps to my mind is that dave, it's a part of the system. you know, and it's, uh, it seems to exist. uh, to serve the same interest, you know, internally, maybe the republicans and the democrats may have a different system that are some small. busy outside, when it comes to foreign policy, you know, it almost doesn't matter who is sitting in the, in the white house because in the u. s. foreign policy has for so many back. it's now been centers on, on war, on sending weapons on law fair on sanctions. and now, i don't know if, if the drums case is indeed a case of an offer, but the way that it's being deployed it's, that's going to be racing many questions. so far,

30 or 40 years now the u. s. has often tried a latin american countries for prosecuting its own leaders, us mainstream media likes to use terms like banana republic, to describe some of these arrests of these presidents in central and south america . do you sense any, have talk or see, or perhaps even irony right now, given this historic moment for the us there's definitely a high level of the bumper. see a given what is happening in the us and even before, and i have a lot of i or any indeed. yes. because uh, this idea about, uh, nothing american countries are run into republics is, um, it goes from a colonial his perspective, you know, and this idea that we kind of go over in ourselves, that we need, you know, overseers that we need to do what we're told essentially, and this call is from the, from the euro. when the spanish, the bridge of used to french, the british, it took over these land. and, you know,

do what they need to do with the indigenous population. and it's, if it remains, it may have to say might be or remain. so now we have a us precedent, essentially facing the situation that is um, in the scope, the base to what has happened before in the, in many like in american countries. although to be honest enough in america, the interventions or the, the yes, the us interventions they've been and usually targeting people who represent the national these movements or you know, along political lines like these movements, communist and socialism. and not so much when it comes to the right wing. so i would say that's mainly the, the biggest difference right now with what we see, we what's happening with all the truck. all right, so let's get into a more specifics of presidents past and present in south america who have faced legal trouble. talk to us

a little bit about lula da silva in brazil. he was president from 2003 to 2010, but then he found himself in some legal trouble through what is now known as operation car wash. he was convicted on corruption charges, but then fried and clear to run again in brazil as most recent presidential election against incumbent j or bull sonata. he emerged victorious and is currently the president of brazil again. but now also, nato might face legal was he might end up in prison to what's going on with brazil, and this sort of ping pong match of political foes behind bars of what is currently happening in brazil is essentially the return of the rule of law of institution that lady, eh, because i think there are more parallels between what is happening to both so nato to add to what is happening to trump down. what happened to that because it was the big thing uh,

filter of the of the use of the judicial system to persecute uh, a person for political gain political object. so what happened in brazil with the job the investigation was that of the united states department of justice initiated this investigation that initiated through a small prosecutor office in brussels of hardest right city. and so, you know, and f b i, agents were meeting constantly with uh, with this prosecutors, they charging the case was meeting also was talking to prosecutors directing them on how to, to leave the case towards the worst of workers party who represent that a, a national project for the a project of national development, least i believe 36000000 people out of over the he essentially ended in new jersey . he is up in albany or, you know, he doesn't have he, he has his flaws. but he's, he was the target of

a campaign that sought to remove him from the ballad in 2018 and he was put, embrace on this and pursue that. some supreme court, they uh, an old, old, all the evidence which were uh, essentially what they are known as corps. agree. bargained testimonies that were of pain eh, after many trials by the prosecutor, after many attempts by the prosecution to get the testimony that they wanted. that's it, they're all political goals among all other types of manipulation. i think on the other hand, most of nato, he, uh, he is under trial for uh, for corruption, for uh, a different cases. i believe probably the one that has the most uh, spoken about is a huge keep in uh gifts that the, sorry, if i'm going to gave him a bustle, nato, and he was also a bar is now from running for all season field 2030. because in the lead up to the 2021 and next on that he, i won't go into gathered. i don't know how many i believe it was about

a dawson for him and boss others in the room and essentially yelled at them about what he said. it was gonna be fraught, committed against against them via the electronic voting system in brazil. so. busy busy if you've tried them and if you made the election result the 9, this is where the c minorities to the trunk situation. com concert and what's the not always a is a mind that represents the computer. what's who no one who never present that. she's the, essentially a neo nazi, he's a man of the bus will be leaving the rise of indigenous people. he's a man that believes that corporation should do as they please. i don't know if you remember a, during his tenure and there were these giant forest fires indiana song and they were for a not big part that were initiated by the practices of this corporations with both scenarios. you know, they actually allow them to go in to, to expel indigenous people from their own communities to raise the line, to, to burn down trees so that they could set up their operations. so it does the

situation in brasil it was a case of law firm that expended are across nothing american right extended to my own country and it was all the other brick a scandal. it ended with the persecution of left the seat or 5 go there with the ink cars the ration of his vice president autoglass who had spent 5 years in prison. and during now you know, you can survive 25 present massacres. he and also at the same time in that by the, not a single other birds executive was ever prosecuted. so that shows you how and the judicial systems in our countries have been a kind of, uh, turn against a popular projects, a turn against political. and i guess political figures who represent it in general represent uh the same ideology. right. coming up next,

there's only one country in the western hemisphere whose polls show that they are even less happy with their government. then americans find out who when we return with esteban, cardio sit tight, sam. oh, will be right back. the the the, the claims of the king of the belgians leopold the 2nd to the congo were finally authorized by the leading european countries in 18. 85 in the very heart of the

african continent states under the rule of the belgian monarch was declared. since the beginning, the congo free state was total, may have for the local population and functioned as a universal concentration camp. the majority of the population, including women and children, were forced to work on the rubber plantations. those who failed to fulfill their quota were beaten and mutilated to keep the congo these people under control. the king set up the so called forest bleak which were punitive detachments that cast terror on the captured country and its inhabitants varying that their subordinates would simply waste bullets hunting for wild animals. the officers demanded that the soldiers gave an answer for every bullet use, and as proof presented a job hand of an african, it was not uncommon when drying to justify the use of the munition. the colonists amputated the hands of not only those who were dead,

but also of those who were kept alive. the atrocious exploitation of the congo turned into a real genocide. you know, late 20 years, the policy of the belgians laid to the death of nearly 10000000 people alongside the holocaust. the genocide of the congo population is considered to be one of the agreements pages in the history of mankind. the only one main thing is important for not as an internationally speaking, that is at nations percept uh, allowed to do anything, all the mazda races as any of the mine. and nathan saw the slave americans rock obama and others have had a concept of american exceptionalism. international law exist as long as it serves the american interest. if it doesn't, that doesn't exist by turning those russians into this dangerous boy,

a man that wants to take over the world. that was the culture strategy. so some of the new one english v i v, i not leashed it often zuba and tablet block. nato said it's ours. we move east. the reason us, hey jim, it is dangerous. is it the law? the sovereignty of the countries, the exceptionalism that america uses and its international war planning is one of the greatest threats to the populations of different nations. is nature where this found the shareholders in the united states and elsewhere in large arms companies would lose millions of millions or is business businesses good? and that is the reality of what, what we're facing, which is fashion. the welcome back to the m o. m manila, chad,

while it's no shocker to anyone that in most western democracies, most of the public is never too happy with who they elected to office. i don't know, maybe it's buyer's remorse. maybe it's something else to. esteban claudio, the editor of the cradle, is back with us to guess try to unpack that. so how about peru, esteban not long ago, just before christmas of 2022, president federal castillo was carted off to jail, immediately ahead of an impeachment vote against him. what were the circumstances around custio's case, and where is he now? procedure is it because figure is a different case. i would say because castillo, essentially what happened he, he did what uh could it be, can see there as us. busy cool, she the so, um apartment, it's a even though he didn't have the, the legal or the constitutional and grounds to do with it. but he did it because he

needed to achieve voc over inability because the one second to prison about a year in 5 months into his he's a government that's the you was a real teacher. he came essentially from nothing he's paid. it was 1st left his precedent, but he came to power with no issue. she couldn't a really go over. so when you get this old man to what he attempted to be sold parliament, it was because for the past year and a half, she was not able to do anything. she couldn't even swear in his own minister's. because the far right groups in the program congress, but i'm not a visit and they would have been launch the launch uh, 3 impeachment proceedings i can streaming the time that she wasn't off is the one that came out from the moment you step in from the moment she wants to elections the one that came up. so eh, see you're also has a, the issue that uh, before he won, she started to distance himself from the, from the region of last, you know, at some point in time. so anyone who was the band event as well and project it was

defend because my daughter and then a few months later, she was not going to come once more. uh, nothing america we, we say uh give you, you know, warm water like, or you want to play with everyone, but you have absolutely no strength to do so. so you play to do play to this trend . so the other side for all of the media for have all the preparations and we'll have that backing up in another state. so now people there are being ruled by a precedent of the novel autopay because of the 12 percent approval rating. the congress guys on 9 percent approval rating, i believe, and stories of these and 71 percent of programs he owes approval, but a lot of it. so that tells you a lot of where, where she stands. and she's also b 9 investigated for the depths of about 6. the protestors who died one cause the westwood embrace on. so custody is still in prison. she's the reason to be saying that he's the big the most of a plot that uh, you know, they tried to do is booking someone. but uh, as far as we know, this is something that uh,

submitted it to himself. and the interesting thing about the way that it was finding and that i, when i was researching is that um, open the crowding democratically elected president stuff having elected in producing the mid eighties. i mean the rest. so, you know, but those tells you how the corruption runs in the country. yeah, the peruvians are even less happy with their government then americans are based on these polls. so these incidents with presidents, they're not isolated to latin america. it happened in france in 2021, but without much global fanfare, certainly not much talk about it. here in the us. france being america's oldest ally, saw the former president nicholas or cosy convicted and sentenced to prison for 3 years on corruption charges. they say he quote was influence peddling and violated

professional secrecy. hm. that sounds familiar. stateside 2 circles. he is now facing yet another trial that's scheduled for 2025, around a ledge money received from the late libyan leader and well marked adolphe star. cosy, who's a lawyer that turned politician faces, charges of corruption, again, criminal association, illegal campaign financing, and conspiracy and misusing libyan public money? your thoughts on circles? the, i think it's what's most interesting about it is why you said how little it was spoken about, you know, starting to see he is actually not a hasn't been arrest if he has been to think of the utmost detain a he, um he's you scroll deal we've, we've got ocoee sees very chevy uh when i was looking into it. you know, that the before nato started bomb being uh, libya about 2 days be. busy worth a nato answered. she said in

a television interview that she had given money to the campaign of. i'm sorry for cnn to, to wherever you close before you know, maybe it was uh, was the when. uh, ams deals with friends. eh, it'd be suited perry's under uh, surfaces government for the 1st time in 30 years. so it was, uh, you know, like i said, he's very easily. he's a very interesting case that he's not spoken about. and i do think he's no spoken about because this is not the role of french leader. and as you said, this is one of the main highlights of the united states. and at some point just feels like when you, when you are western liter and you align with the with the, with the aspirations of the united states, you can almost done the wrong. yeah, let's not forget that and media circus. surrounding gadhafi is visit to paris where he was allowed to pitch a better intent outside the l as a palace. if we took

a wider look at all of these various presidents of these so called democracies all around the world, they're getting done on corruption charges, right? it's the theme for all of these presidents, but yet nobody has been brought up on actual charges like war crimes, crimes against humanity, or anything real like that. not only of the presidents, but people in the administration's. i mean, look at george w bush's people and the lead up to the iraq war. why is that always corruption, but nothing like killing millions of people. i mean, except for slow but on the list of it. but he was trying at the hague, of course, but we don't have enough time to discuss his case. and i think that the focus is usually put in corruption because he, the focus wherever puts on, on the war crimes on the, you know, legal invasions in the fours western countries to, to confront their own legacy, their own history, which uh, you know,

what they have left behind and we're talking about the cypress. he is indicted on corruption charges. so i could see was one of the aspects of the median war. he was a bit of a surprise was the 1st going through the start of the media. you know, you have up iraq, obama getting a nobel peace prize, and keep in mind that a, a, i think drug more bones at any, the president, he's also an architect. they give me a war uh that were in syria. so i think of it the focus usually falls on corruption because it's something that allows the western uh, so called democracies to circumvent the reality of what they have done across the world. because the moment that they have to confront that is the moment. but the car, the car was you know, and don't forget that of the united states, for example, is not a signatory of the international criminal. uh, eh, they do national court of justice. you know, the same with israel, which is one of the biggest culprits of human rights abuses of war crimes in the,

in, in modern history. so i think it's, it's about that, you know, as you said, these are white color crimes. you know, these are a and then what is the sentence as in the end there is nothing the least. yes, i am very glad that you brought up the, the nothing yahoo because he keeps flipping through the legal cracks as well. but again, that man would need a whole episode to discuss as well. all right, as the bond patio editor of the cradle dot c o check out his work there. thank you so much for this. very enlightening and fun conversation. right, that is going to do it for this episode of motors operandi the show that dig deep in the foreign policy and current affairs. i'm your host middleware chan. thank you for tuning in. we'll see you again next time to figure out the m. o.

the need for a monday, i'm not getting back to the stuff. yeah, i'm either going to use the motor fixture. take just a month at $100.00 level, that's in toronto, hunger. i lied to you on this, this typhoid. ok. now i need be here. we need to get decide what's best for us to do site 6 and one on the last she's on by. that'd be a lot more. you and you, now i'm out of this, get a hold of, you know, send the 1st will be for 240. that's the what do i equal to the show if the other 2 months ago and it doesn't go to do for me quite a while. so who shall handle so? alrighty. for me to

a little since you are pursuing the most in those specifically, i'm a big i'm one of the see at the end of me say guess on the mall. what has an appointment for the thought of it either? i won't say that some of that is somewhat of the media you got on. i'm glad you know, got a long way. yes. under then use it and they are sort of the song of a k. i knew i love is that goes to you that i mean, i think you can only go see, i'm a persona of a be that me court that i, i didn't go to almost the end to see the best. so not about that out of, in the, see it, the single man for the month of man on and all that. i don't want to lose the

remainder the age of a mazda minutes off on, you know, do the, i see them go, lags it, and see i couldn't help them. but these are, let's see. let me look to see like tennessee video. can it out of this that fit on? so, being at that point, let's see on there the most to go by the and i suggest you have, let me say one of us, one of the subs have been in the media mckinney and the new battery needs before. so let me get some game which are my policy. ok. so you see that goes in a 2nd. i mean either it is by you say things like that and then generally a going i think the 2nd floor on

the the watching is why is that? why in this control, if i give both plenty of the store and this this, you should have been a short order for now, i'm not going to say lots of green scale. now when i am what i could catch at your desktop session. let's just

sean your guess is when you bought it and you said almost, you know the the, the, the, the slicing between the idea on how much minutes ends intensifies in gaza is really defense minister says that some of those already lost control of the territory. the hospitals in god's us shut down over to the fuel on medicine schultz, which is a 1000000 census, very shutting. one doctor says the health care system is on the verge of collapse. the hospital is full of displaced people. the health care system is dilapidated infection control measures are almost non existent here and some francisco clubs, the st. solve homeless people and drug addicts, us all that of the chinese lead of choosing things upcoming visits for the apex