possible and the people wake up to the reality of what's really going on. i hope so . saskia and i'm left with a lot of hope because the, the russian nurse, the russian military and the russian volunteers were very, very disciplined and powerful. and i was amazed at their youth, you've melody and welcoming of me. i was very proficient at one very glad to hear that you took out a warm welcome. you have a very warm welcome head to what's on us. how to you about was full of us off soft us all me upset, spoke bennett. thank you, scott. thank you. and it's such a good buy from us. it must go. so now we're going to head on over to do by actually with tons is coming underground is up next, enjoy the the

i'm action or can see it. welcome back to going underground. broadcasting all around the world from do by where will lead is touching down for the un time of change conference starting this thursday comp 28 because it meets in the alleged u. k. u. s. and you nation backed genocide in the region, leaving hundreds of thousands hungry to night in gaza. if today we have a world full of surplus food and people are still having with tens of millions in the usa for us to rely on federal aid to eat. what happens when climate change exponentially increases? wildfires, floods and droughts all around the world with me in washington dc is a u. s. government's woman chief economist at the department of agriculture and senior research fellow at the international food policy research institute. dr. joseph global to thank you so much for coming on. so varied figures,

but around but maybe 830000000. they're going to go hungry to night. more and more than enough food for everyone in the world. it to ease. what would you have done that the reason food for him in rome, if you was still the u. s. department of agriculture is chief economist what you've sort of shows you that the yeah, i don't, i think these problems are beyond the chief economy to some of the you have to remember that something like 60 percent of the world's hunger is people are in areas where there's conflict right now and so that's, that's a very difficult thing. you're talking about much, much bigger problem. their sense of war is going on here. we see this all refugees, all sorts of personal calamities that are again, hunger is part of that. i mean, daily it is, but you, if you're there, the department of agriculture for 30 years, i'll be, is the, the countries that are listed by your institute and,

and others has the risk of, of widespread big universal famine. they're all on the military attack or military and defense, or from the united states. i mean, what do you think is the at the agriculture department? i mean, if we can go through the, i guess i don't have or i don't take your point. i what countries in particular, you're talking about hunger ciriani tube. you're off campus, john. yes'm, in somalia, syria garza, i suppose. yeah, i was, i or i wouldn't necessarily point the finger at the us on that, but if that's your opinion, that's fine. but really i, i'm asking you, what do you think about the connection between food and violence, the weapons trade? oh yeah, no question. absolutely. i'm, i, i, that as, again, as i said, it is one of the major causes of hunger. because, you know, when you look at hunger is really boils down to availability on the one hand in affordability on the other. and unfortunately, poverty and hunger or go hand in hand,

best or tragic part of all this but, but the bigger problem in some areas is just availability, particular income areas where there's conflict and, and that's what we've seen as big a search over the last 10 years and the number of hungry people, and it's been in the areas like this to help the countries that you mentioned and again, is, is totally exacerbated by war. and yet the recent headlines have sent it on say the black sea green initiative, or the indian uh, number smart the rice export regime is judy by the indian government. so i'm going to be increasing before these 2 issues. raise their head store. sure. but, but prices play a big role here, and when you have actions taken by governments, the exacerbate food supplies are, you know, jeopardize food supplies that has an impact on, on, on,

on prices. and because of that, it makes, it seems like rice and wheat and other things west affordable for those. what do you, you know, import those products. you are reading of the black sea green initiative because we had someone from the oakland institute who told us that the next to the next to no impact on poor countries. just 3 percent of the ukraine food went to poor countries . it was a more of a propaganda weapon in this war in, in ukraine then act. oh no i, i guess i think that's totally false. i mean that's, i just, yeah. well, you can, it's a supply 10 percent of that was week something like 13 percent of the world's core and before the war. that's been um, you know, but unfortunately they're now producing 35 percent less than what they were doing pretty more. as a result of more, and that's less, we in the world market that's less corn in the world market, you know, in terms of where we went, in one sense, it's almost

a material because what those supplies mean for the rest of the world is lower prices and lower prices are felt by every country in the world. so yes, there, there was some we did go to africa through the world food program. a lot of, uh uh, we went to north africa and in the mid east, you know, traditional buyers of u claim we, but right now there's almost nothing coming out of the black seas. and their production is it's, uh, yeah, it's been reduced by 3040 percent. so i mean that's, that's the reality of the war. and you might argue that that's not, it doesn't have an impact, but i would argue longer term, it has a certainly has an impact. because if there is another shortage somewhere else in the world, you'll see prices jumped out in a big time. but the un themselves only said 3 percent went to those countries and prices of being more historically low as to why. but what,

what do you think the, what do you think the market for you claim wait was before the war in sub saharan africa? hazard a guess? i mean, it was, it was then tell it is not one of their big is one of their big markets. you know, the really about cents. but then why was it sold to us is, is about all about oil supplies is all about way supplies and supplies are, when do we have less suppliers on way? marcus, you have higher prices and that's why you have problems in, you know, with poor countries. when there is an affordability issue in terms of buying green here, but clearly tony blinking at the state department wasn't saying that he was saying, ukraine is a fundamental part of its ups are in africa and dependence on food. and this is what we're hearing from nato capitals. well, i guess you're talking about higher prices, you know, a, we're in the end today which will be by the actual slide exports from ukraine. yeah,

to how the in the i'm just saying that the ukraine, a switch shipped, they're very important for embodies north africa. they shift a lot of weight in the past to asian markets. they, they ship some of the sub saharan africa. and what we saw last year is the subs her now i forgot i had last week, you know, they were down about 11 percent and some of that was due the fact that less weight was coming out of the black sea. and, and the fact that we prices were so high in the 1st half of the year. yeah, i mean, we have it for manual is that it was actually something benefiting a big agribusiness. how difficult is it being a senior research fellow at the international food policy research institute? because you are funded by moscow funded by washington. you're funded by k b, m g, which is lucky martin consultant, a company. i mean that deals with raphael and how, how does an institute like us remain independent when we have a weaponized at the moment and research on how food systems work is so weaponized?

yeah, i think you'll, i think you'll find and talking to people that the general impression of the work that my colleagues do is very a jet objective. the very i have your right. i've been funded by over my current a short time there. i've been funded by a lot of different countries, a little bit from the us, but mostly from europe, from other other countries around the world. and essentially to look at issues like trade to look at food security issues and to look at, at the market analysis, which was my former job was tracking markets around the world uh at the department of agriculture. you do take the one of the most fundamental reasons for global hunger is how pressure global south countries are to privatize the land and inevitably creates all the goc power that the ends up with their food being

exported. instead of being fed to that populations, you know, i don't, i don't think that's an issue. i think improving productivity around the world is, is very important. and that's, you know, that's true in the course. countries of sub saharan africa is true. it's true in the big export and countries like australia or europe or the us. um, we have a serious challenge over the next several years to feed a growing population and a population that is um, you know, uh, facing climate change and other things that are really important. and that's going to mean, you know, countries around the world need to improve productivity. yeah, we heard from progressive under the shiva on this program, people can watch our interview with their own rumbles saying actually productivity was much higher before the incoming huge crop companies. they destroyed

productivity. i understand your institute is also funded by crop life international, which is represents b a s a. yeah. what do i want is i don't know what i, i don't know what crop lies if there is much funding that comes from them. most of the funding comes from their own, your website and the major funded govern metal. and so you can get into the, i'm the productivity of crow ups you believe is held by these big multi nationals that clearly have an interest in making those countries dependent on i think there's a as well we also support our are other centers like center that have public research for on, on week varieties that have been shipped all around the world. are you there? yes, there are private developers for things like mays and story b, as in particular. but we've seen an enormous productivity gains. i don't understand . the point of, of, you know, you would refer to this other study because that certainly is contrary to anything

that we have or that we've, we've shown. i mean, when you are at the department of agriculture is during that period, the china broad, 800000000 out of poverty. clearly with the will be at some small scale farming. but under a large democratic controls right up to be ging. tonight, $40000000.00 in the united states will starve without federal aid. annual food snap program does not show a stock contrast about food security. how did that happen? it's is, unfortunately, there weren't changes in government or in the, in the social safety net in the ninety's that took away a lot of income support, replaced it with a whole suite of programs. and we right now we have a food stamp program that is roughly a $142000000000.00 annually is provide supplemental nutrition assistance to families in need. and the projections are over the next 10 years that those will

run, those outlays will run around a $120000000000.00 a year. yeah. but oh, you mentioned aid and federal aid, the changes in the ninety's. but i mean, obviously the point is not to be building out a 2 people lives a, it's self sufficiency. no, absolutely. no, no, no, absolutely. i mean this is, these are big structural issues that the us has done poorly out. i would, i would argue, i mean we just, we have persistent part poverty, particularly in rural areas, are in urban areas, but also in rural areas as well. and you have families that have been generations and poppy and those are not things to be proud of. i would agree and did you see it coming when you were in the department of agriculture? because as i say, a different, you can always this new like, this isn't new if i were to go. if i were to go back to 1998, when we, when, when i was at the department of air holding, we initiated the survey. we had 12 percent of families in prison,

food and secure households, you know, is down marginally sustan's. so your point of making very little progress, i think, yes that's, that's certainly a problem, but this is something that the, the us is, are certainly we've been tracking or the us department of agriculture has been tracking for many years now at least is getting better adult enjoy the global, i'll stop you, the more from the us government diploma chief economist at the department of agriculture and that senior research fellow at the international food policy research institute. after this break the as a result online,

it was can be started by line. please can be satisfied for the importance of we can never be of a station. so that transparency is an extraordinary join mistake. patrice then just succeeded in finding documents that existed in making them available to the world public. i mean, what could be more boxed by publishing information and sharing information with the public. he was exercising the right for a speech he did so in the public interest wants to so long realize tends to me. uh and, and honestly, to relate to seriously my mind though, why advice may assume that no one who is the guy that illegals anymore wisely fort adjusted for him to be on box weighing

a 174. he used to go through the defensive. all we going to let that stay the welcome back to going on the right, and i'm still here with the senior research fellow at the international food policy research institute. dr. joseph logan joseph. so we were talking about the systems of, of, of food and the bulk of the, in the united states. what about the, what's really being in the news lately, which is about this india and on this multi rice ben. why? what is your understanding of why and is doing it in any way as well? hey, you have to look at this in perspective. india has, the rice production has, has increased substantially over the last 15 years back and in the early, 2, thousands, you know, they were probably about 5 percent of the world market. they're now 40 percent of

world exports come from india. they've been very important in for a number of countries, a re supplier for many, many countries, both in asia, but also in africa. subsaharan, africa, west africa, a yeah. so the, the, the, at least the way the, the indian government has articulated the banners that there they have concerned about food insulation. and food prices or rice prices have been high in india and like they have been, are all around the world. and they have more profit, even the whole of services are in africa put together in india. they have poverty. yes, that's true. they also have more rights to they have a surplus rice in their, their, their country. they have plenty of rice to feed their population. that's not an issue. i think um uh, but the more the government is rice isn't the only thing. they have a ban on onions. they have a ban on the they've had a ban on we last year. so this is all, you know,

it's no surprise the government is up for re election or they'll stand for general elections next year. they want to keep food prices. uh, you know, i could try to keep a little insulation white's a lot of countries i might. yeah, i mean, inflation has been food inflation. it has been, you know, in the high double digits for many countries around the world, including western economies, including the us, including the, you know, it doesn't matter. we're actually on that subject. why is, why is food inflation so much higher in western europe that in the global south countries have well, one reason for the very good. yeah. yeah, there's a good reason for that. is that, you know, this is this, i think i'll use a fact, a lot of people don't appreciate it is the fact that most the costs of retail food comes after it leaves the farm. so if you look at the price of bread, the week in that brand is only about 5 percent of the value. so all these other

costs afterwards, things like labor costs, things like energy costs, you know, to transform the middle of the wheat into flower, to transform that flower into bread, to get that on grocery shows, all that costs money. and those are been things that wage rates have been up and a lot of western economies, we've seen very, very high energy costs. so that is across the board. and so, you know, is the oil, it's electricity is other things. all these things have added to processing costs and causes a big increase in um, retail food. so there's more likely to be the loss of the north stream pipeline why than in mainstream media so called are they always talking about food supply and farm supply? when it comes to hi, i agree, are you, you raise a great, great point. i have to raise the press interviews. people have done with me. i always point out to him that most of the costs come afternoon. the found and,

and some of those. if you look at the retail price in, in uh, a more developed developing economy that those, those largest typically are less that is there, there may be less processed or thanks, but this is, is still true. there are 2 there getting, for example, getting green in from the port to inland markets that all costs money. and that's where we see big inflation for a lot of countries plus the exchange rate. um, you know, commodities are old denominated in dollars a typically. so if you put those in local currencies, look at egypt, for example, we prices in egypt in addiction, pounds, you know, or at, i was very continued to be at very, very high levels. whereas world prices are generally come down to being below right now, roll pre war levels. so clearly until the dollarization, the dollar is a refuge in that case, but these journalists are not, it's a, is it

a question of the fact that the food policy is weaponized, you must have come across that into department of agriculture. how food policy can be weaponized and how, whether it be protectionism or whether it be as part of military intervention. i mean, we only have to look at sanctions, regimes in both by the united states on countries. and so the salvation iraq, obviously, when you were at the department of agriculture to see how weaponized the subject can be when it find the filters. i yeah, i don't, i mean what you're talking about in one sense, i mean, is there a conflating wars which i think again, i think we're both in agreement wars or bad things or populations. they really create enormous problems or a poverty they call cause problems with hunger. but in terms of, of price is just the relationship between food prices and underlying farm prices

are important. cos there's a lot of costs that have nothing to do with the farm sector, but have everything to do with what's going on with the rest of the economy. yeah, but the john lives on it. it's where are they getting this information i have or? no, i don't, i think the journalist have a hard time understanding that i, you know i, i find the most the conversations i have people say. huh. i didn't know that i didn't realize that, you know, you've explained it relatively soon. i well, hi, it's complex in the sense of detroit under you. you've tried to sort through those those past, but um, you know, the found value of food at home, consumed in the us is around 25 percent on the average. if you look at total food, so including the food consumed away from home, it's less and you know, it's about 13 percent. if you look at the consumed away from home, it's like 5 percent because you you have to pay everyone in the restaurant everything else. so those are complexities. uh, just apply. got arguably, i mean,

why don't they also understand interesting, lee. i mean, you were again, you would probably at the department when the so called the natural family needs the hope you're a good leading to live aid eritrea now has full food security. why is it that a country which is closed off like that? as for food security or say contact me on the country, i think there's a country that doesn't have a conflict going on. i mean, i, i can look this, this is, i don't think this is a car key is, is necessarily the yes or all tarkey works very well as long as you're having yields that you're producing enough to feed your population. unfortunately, a lot of these areas are also in areas with very highly variable rainfall. highly variable yields and the fact is they, they have um, you know, when they have big browser production, short balls, they need to import and they, they need, they need a shirt and they're trad, doesn't, there is available as far as i know. and i don't, i didn't,

yeah. when it comes to talk to us because yeah, we simply can talk about about cuba, but isn't the plane here? then the privatized food systems encourage scarcity to increase profits. it, so i, well, i would agree, i would disagree. i would strongly about that. i think that that if you look at i, you know, great case, some point is what happened with the ukraine. ok, so here you had a country, again, supply and 10 percent of the world's we and all of a sudden shut off entirely in those early months of the war with big markets like egypt and others trying to find food. i think the market worked extremely well, but that most of these countries were able to source food from other suppliers and those are private trade that so essentially then which case, why was we not much cheaper for all that time when uh, when the, you had 10 percent of the week that wasn't in the market. i think i told you this is,

this is basic economics of supply and demand. if you take 10 percent of the weight off the market because of blocking the ukraine from the rest of the market, the wheat prices will go up. in fact, i would argue that in the early months, the war there was concerned that russia wouldn't be able to export. we and rushes another major market that cause we prices to spike, you know, to record levels. and yeah, but that always seemed to be the surpluses behind the scenes. isn't that the point? because that helps the scarcity which increases the profits. why is there any hunger if the world has enough food? is a question of, i think the question is affordability, and the question is poverty. and if you see the progress that was made in countries like china, you things to look at the progress that was made globally prior to the, you know, the last 5 years or so. you see that they marched hand in hand with improvements and income around the world that makes food a 40. and that makes that,

that the hunger is, tends to diminish in those things. now when you add conflict on top of the best, that just creates all sorts of additional problems that aren't easy to solve. but to me, the number one thing if, if, if i working with the, to, to solve the problem with conflict and, and i think we would see poverty diminished just like we have seen in places like there are 3 us places you know, around the world as a hell where i lived for a couple of years. it's just a wonderful place. you know, buddy, if you have more is going on, it's very, very difficult. because salary region embracing different food systems as we speak . i mean that how dependent on the 10s of millions of people that rely on the federal aid. hi. how dependent on the on on what suddenly happens in the house

of representatives in washington from day to day. i can can suddenly as you know, it's not program, not sure. i know who your talk, barry. you talked about barnes? well i'm just saying is regards budgets and when the budgets a voted on an agreed in the house up. yeah, no, i mean look, that is right now the congress is totally dysfunctional and i think that's uh, a each huge concern. and it needs to be for how long is this house? and i mean, just even when you are at the department of agriculture, all these tens of millions of people's lives hung in the balance of if a budget was no i or if you're just look, if you're talking about farm bill, the, the, the one is the the deadline, yes, the farm bill expired, but, but farmers are covered this year under the, the old farm build. so the real question will be next year is planning. the

decisions are being made that they'll have to have a farm bill by the end of the year, or have some extension of the current farmed or which, which could happen. but, but, you know, with the farmers you're talking about roughly there's us a call. so says that the number is around $2000000.00 farms in the us, but if you look at the farms that are actually producing 85 percent of the production, you're only talking about $300000.00 or so farms but. but yes, they are. a lot of them look to farm subsidies, but farm subsidies are a small part of their overall income. and in fact, i would argue as an economist, that these programs should be done away with dr. joseph global. thank you. thanks very much. and that's of, of the show will be back with a brand new episode on saturday. but until then came and talked to my role as social media. if it's not sense in your country and had to add channel going underground tv on rumble, dot com to watch new and old episodes of going underground. so you said that the

tape. uh, but with good he does go was like short term, but i was calling to check to see to see, oh see ya need them to see she must see washing who'd be in the, in the most of the. yep. they put us on that it can, is undoubtedly an institution developed, dependent on many countries. they have 1300000000 roman catholics around the world . and as they say in america, follow the money that it can guess most of its money from pro western countries. the of the nato countries, spain, italy, england, germany, as well as mexico and the united states. so it is dependent on you think that people sort of covered uh, those google grants. are you guys you have to deal with rich new. i mean,

the west bank residents lot the streets enjoy. this is probably the 3rd group of the book, united palestinians. some of the free agency needs describe life behind fox. every day we were under suppression. we were severely beaten. they used to provide us with water for only an hour on a daily basis. emotional reunion is on to get us in israel to as hostages fried by how mazda were united with best families. a 9 year old gall buried by is really in western media as a victim of how my food policy.