as the, as all sizes, all gaza is coming on in the habitable box. the quote in from the you are the ideas on and see monetary and a failed to reach those in the is of as, as accounts identified, accusations of the international court of justice as it was either around the world before the is the pressure components. asians to take inside of the 2 decades. so the you, as soon as you present in iraq may be coming to the deadly amount of time. but that decides to define the us, that i'm to terrorism, go live and those are those christians celebrate christmas with one of the most popular stuff is hosted by buses packed for the sake of pedro insect from

the others. all the headlines of this, i'll have a nice guy on the go with often with time pm. really back the the time action or time. see and welcome back to going underground, broadcasting around the world from the middle east. has there ever being a more dangerous time to be alive? aside from the climate emergency? we face what un secretary general, antonio gutierrez's, got a were some new arms race. i mean, it's the fading you as were in rush or through ukraine, the, by the administration set cost for spending of a $1.00 and a half trillion dollars of us public money on nuclear weapons, over 30 years to fight russia, divide china,

and let's go straight to professor bryan to and distinguish professor that miss american, or hispanic sciences of university of colorado. boulder is pioneering research on you. pay a winter is revealed. what's in store by them. pushes the button. he's in boulder, colorado. thank you so much chaperone has june. very right. coming on, so in 2023, we've seen reports of secret catastrophic accidents on u. k. nuclear submarines biden's ending u. k. a capable weapon reading to these mediterranean to enforce the ledge guides of genocide. the end of nuclear agreements being compounded by testing, new weapons occurring the fact to ex, defacto coo in pakistan. we explained to viewed him run gun before he was jailed. and we've had these really ministry admit to nuclear weapon the use of or these possession by israel. just remind us in the, in the context of all of that your work reminds us about your work on nuclear threats. this is what we've been concerned for

a long time about it does say the impact of having a nuclear conflict, i just between the super powers, the russian united states and really tries to try and have it also between your nuclear stays like india and pakistan. and i am at the moment there are about 9000 nuclear weapons on the planet that are either way or is some sort of storage. there's also several 1000 more literally just some half, all those 9000 weapons as about a 1000 times more energy. and then all the bonds drops in the 2nd row or so there's a devastating amount of energy there and that can be released in person. usually around goes office. i bring your piece of the sun with the ground because that's how this generation slide just by nuclear process is and if they are

fusion. so the 1st thing that happens here is a bright flash of light from the bomb going off, which can burn people in considerable distances and start fires. then there's a shockwave that comes from the explosion across the 1st radiation and radioactivity. the tear hills are, can be distributed over rate justices. so all those things can show people locally . so we estimate to have a war between india and pakistan. safety to a $150000000.00 people would be killed out right by the explosions. and there's a range there because we don't know the oldest of the weapons in india and pakistan . and india tested it with nearly 15 killer times 1998. but most of the weapons, you're probably at that time smaller,

but we don't know exactly where the revenues are in the united states and russia, the britain and france with their revenues are just a, have treaties, at least between russia in the united states. i recognize that ninety's something percent of the nuclear weapons on the planet. and they're only about 200 cities in russia with more than a 100000 people. there's only about 300 cities in united states and more than a 100000 people in between them, they have 900000 weapons so that every city of those 2 countries with age are more nuclear weapons. and we're only need one nuclear weapon to destroy a city of the average g of a nuclear weapon and the russian us items about $250.00 times. a yield of the original bomb dropped in japan, which destroyed

a large segment of the russian estate angel tons. so they're trying to clear away weapons are much more than 10 times. powerful is a rush involved. well, can i just schedule up there and ask you then? and i, i want to get onto the, perhaps you have some estimates about israel. we don't have any information really about what they have. but in the context of what you just said, we saw in the u. s. press while the ukraine comes like this, going on and lists quite to cooley saying, tactical nuclear weapon use in western europe is a, is something that we should assess and things that could move on from the use of the men. talking about it in quite a matter of fact, way it seemed, what did you think of that? were you taking it back? i think that a lot of people have your think that in a world between united states and russian of the united states and russia wouldn't be the only people, only countries or damage is that somebody is certainly not true. so russian sought

to have a 2000 tactical nuclear weapons. and those weapons, many would be used against target slave ships or as mines for some reason. there's like a lot of the would probably be used against the military targets in europe. i and i found about $650.00 or so tartarus. i think the russians would attack i. some of them are obvious like military bases. needy base is air force base and things like that. and also attack of nuclear storage facilities. and there are several nuclear, several countries in europe, and store us in clear weapons of respirators and frances, substantial parcels of their own. and they're also target is the same time using you typed in ukraine and things like power plants and oil refineries. the lord rises, a tactical nuclear weapons, are now spoken about as battle field, munitions,

like a tank or something in the context of the work you've done showing us the devastating well, environmental impact, long lasting environmental impact of nuclear weapons. yeah, so i mentioned that there might be hundreds of millions of casualties in the us and russia from the border between those countries added year of i'm so those casually, they're pretty big. but when you use a nuclear weapon bird is the city that is being attacked or whatever the target is . and that's no cyrus to produce a huge amount of so which we're going to be around this year and block sunlight. who did our calculations? we find that a full scale work related station russian would like so much sunlight in january when we get to the ground to be just like by the sun goes away, gets cold just like winter. the sun is diminished,

it gets cold. i sheets for him. so we find a nuclear winter whitaker, i wish it would be daily meant home temperatures, beloved freezing every day and it let us use for several years. we predicted that in that case, and then the deaths in china, russia, united states, canada, most of your would be about more than 95 percent of the population at the end of the 2nd year in the conditions and even got to their worse at the end of the same year to alarm for several more years. beyond that in the middle east we think that the 75 percent or more that people might die and um, places like a rack and we we and or such countries. um that would be some confusion over all the way. these are very effective like argentine in australia, new zealand. as others are widespread depths tired on nuclear

weapons are often confused by people. and some of them are made to be used in battlefield conditions like attacking re um, or attacking tank or gauge or something like that. some of her work hillary shells are, are there have been part of hillary shells tested deals the same as originally from here when you have a little bit and i received with one of them with one artillery show. we don't know what the deals of the russian tactical nuclear weapons are. united states in europe, and they to have only a few 100 tactical nuclear weapons. made me launch and drop by aircraft and rushes or to have like i said, 2000 of them is and they probably the used one of widespread way across your why do you think, why didn't you, joe biden sent

a nuclear weapons to lease some of the drain, you know, for the guys, a village cause of genocide. i mean these and masses of nuclear capable equipment. they across carriers, warplanes and submarines. i believe the united states has no nuclear weapons on any year. wraps carriers at this time. and most of this aircraft are not nuclear cable or certainly don't have generally, a weapons associated with and i used to be an inferior aircraft carriers, nuclear power. the aircraft carriers didn't have their weapons. but the engine pres, uh, there were allies such as japan and south korea and just really objected to having nuclear of arms brought into their country from the ship visit. so they were removed from all the ships. as far as i know, there are no need of your main navy ships, except for some reassuring icbm has the journey. nuclear weapons befalls

the old kasteel anyway, but the he also sent the submarine. and bizarrely the pentagon announced it, which is usually, you know, people keep submarine move in secret in this world. why would he, why do you think you did that? i don't think the submarines are have nuclear weapons on that either of them. hopefully it powered submarines, but i mean the so little is known as you said about the yield of some tactical weapons about the movements of those. do we know anything about israel's nuclear weapons program off to? we now have an is riley minister who said the vision you guys the meeting, and in fact, what's being widely known by the international community for years. yeah. so it was real loose and very quiet about as nuclear weapons program. and one person who was involved in a decades ago that provided some information about it is thought that they have somewhere between 80 or 90 nuclear weapons up to

a few 100 nuclear weapons and knows anything about their yields. it's possible that israel tested in nuclear weapons during the carter administration along with south africa somewhere and i'll be in the ocean. is controversial list of words of that. what design usually runs explosion and average impact. and so the carter administration denies that it was a nuclear test at the time, but a lot of people think it was i'm so we don't really think about much about the it's really weapons mean very bad to have nuclear proliferation. and literally you societies that are going, the problem is between the various factions, lease for the when the other different religious groups there, but i the 0 say they shouldn't me. and for the operation anywhere anyway, but uh, and that was apartheid. south africa, you were referring to. why is it the i a,

a is so carefully monitoring one iran is always said is a civilian a nuclear program. and they've said it was on his landing to have a nuclear weapons program. well, what is the role of the i a a and trying to prevent proliferation. you 2 weapons given i don't see anything about the i a going to tell of eve anytime soon. i don't understand the interaction between the israel in general, they try to uh, monitor countries that have agreed to um, international agreements about proliferation of nuclear weapons and to monitor them to see if they are actually doing what they said they would do. but there are a number of countries that are never agreed to the, to the nuclear nonproliferation trees. why you don't want to get it as an interim image of man is name somebody. but there are several country having to agree to that. and so they're not subject to inspection by the,

by the united nations. you know, i might, of you were in a really bad situation. you world wide here, because uh, china is rapidly building up is arsenals. indian vaccine are building up, there are. so those are 3 is building a, is our sales. united states is really doing is r, as in was, you know, to rush into developing a bunch of new weapons that are some of which are credibly scary like drums and raising parked outside of our original a few cities as a very bad trend in the world it is, you know, we're just lucky that we're not having accidents of her that lead to a nuclear volume. let's get onto the accident in part to professor ryan too. and i don't know whether the echo we sound they are coming from colorado is because you're in a bunker, but we'll get onto the mistakes and find to thank you so much. for now, more from the professor, atmospheric and atlantic sciences with university of colorado boulder after this

break the, [000:00:00;00] the, [000:00:00;00]

the, [000:00:00;00] the, the welcome back to going underground. i'm still here with the professor of atmospheric energetic sciences of university of colorado boulder professor bryan june. so we were talking about the, the chances for mistakes of i'm a get them trigger the triggering, i'm again, you know, we, we have the more on con, on this row just before he was jailed in what a municipal school, who he was very careful when i mentioned the security of nuclear weapons as a no, no that kept very securely. what do you see?

i mean, people know anyone who has a laptop knows they make mistakes on their computer. what are we talking about in terms of the probabilities of mistakes amidst had trigger operation of these nuclear devices? there are several different types of mistakes it could be made between united states and russia. the main fear is that somebody will detect a launch which isn't actually occurring and then the other side to respond to that . for example, in the united states, the american president has already john walsh and nuclear weapons by itself. any if he says lawson id, that would be a loss. and so is his job. i thought with the, with a 30 minute. yes, it is a small gap there. and so there's always a, is there been numerous instances stating detection is a launch is in the past. and unfortunately,

the world is developing weapons that even takes less time to arrive, for example, or sonic missiles showing a warning times. and the russians are developing nuclear power, cruise missiles that will just fly around the amish for all the time we can be directed to, to united states at any moment. we're forgetting basically no warning. and so that makes things more dangerous. and also make sure that the military will turn to artificial intelligence computers to decide if there's been a tag, or if there's a missile that would be durable. my computer doesn't work. you know, millions and millions of people are running these things all the time. and they're selling word, so i certainly wouldn't want to artificial intelligence. so we're going to look at your work, other types of problems, get it for the community and back. assume a numerous,

serious complex when times to originally blew out the parliament in india. originally a sessions or not many people were injured, but nevertheless, india moved from sort of the border and pakistan's original country compared to india. it has a population like russians is not very de, um indians got a huge population, a 1000000 person on army. so if you're a barrier stand, you fairly overrun very critically by the indian army. so that might be a huge, you know, you had to larger nuclear weapons quickly to protect them so that they weren't just uses 5 by close of have a big population to compared to say, uh, western european country. but going on to what you're saying there about mistakes as opposed to the fear of friends. so i'm saying sam is petra, one of the people that the russian jews you officer who prevented armageddon on the 26th of december 1983. and there are other cases of these officers who don't follow and is,

and that's why we're all alive now to tell the tale. but you do the new to your apologies, will tell you that eventually to narrow, misses that even kind of ad. since the invention usually above that shows how successful they fail, saves the operation organizational structures to continue to really afraid nuclear weapons would presumably be the argument of all the people making billions of dollars of money out of this nuclear weapons as creation and formulation. yeah, we've been lucky so far, doesn't mean we're going to continue to be working in the future. you know, the, the other aspect of this is just a waste of money. i mean, i say spinning tray in dollars or something like that to you much and metal in the ground that will never be used for anything and making a bunch of submarines or screws around the same the oceans and do nothing. we can take that trillion dollars invested in education and educating our children are

providing healthcare for everyone as a lot of the better things to be used with it. it's very clear, but some cases spend their time in spite of each other and just never profit from that, which i mean just gets me on to the question. they've given you a pioneering research and the new a winters as the drawing to tax the effects of a nuclear weapons, even in school fia, just what is the, what is the response from the biden blinking lloyd austin sullivan. these characters that visit places all around the world, talking about the need to protect the united states from the perceived threats of russia, china, ron, and i don't know who else looking moment. there is a us national academy of sciences panel studying the idea of nuclear winter and seeing whether they believe that is um, a good good science standing behind it. and i would say in the past and the

military doesn't want to talk about it. and the political establishment doesn't want to talk about it and the nature doesn't want to talk about it. how do i know roger doesn't talk about it when they want to talk about it because it gets rid of the whole idea of detroit. and so, you know, you can't have much deterrence if you attack somebody else and comes back to then show your population, which is what happens to the degree or winter is you know, and this is why you're saying the bomber administration dismissed your research engineer. 2 inches on, every administration uses a category shot reagan in the 1980s did not dismiss that. they took it very seriously. and because of that, they started to get ahold of nuclear weapons has been going on ever since then. so right now and there, there's only a small fraction of the number of weapons that there was in the 1990s,

early 19 ninety's. and so every american president on every russian president, since reagan, gorbachev has reduced nuclear arsenals. some of them i asked them, i don't think trump to do it on purpose that he still reduce it. i know other countries have stopped builder to put a rubber, and so they have a long period of time or a written in france and russia. the united states either reduce or ourselves or captain costs and even including china. so we're just now on the start of a new build up into your web and a actually inside of this, the trump who's leading, you know, of the opinion, both is to become president of your country. next year, he raced over to meet kim jong and i assume because of given the diaries and what we hear from the trump presidency, was shocked to hear that the united states con, protect itself from a single time useful with nuclear attack from north korea, which can only take 30 minutes of i'm think they pay their la or say, i mean with a trump presidency. perhaps some for some reasons,

were up to him. isn't that he understands it better than joe biden and others because he was just so shocked at this is the stage of play as regards how close we are all to death. well, i think every american president, at least since clinton is trying to find some way to deal with north korea to get them to not feel that they're threatened to agree to get rid of their nuclear weapons. yes. was minus the nuclear waste and the 3 and need installation was always threatening or 3 s. i was also really threatened, obviously by sanctions. and they can only go up there since a britain in the united states killed 20 percent of the population in the korean war. created where it was, obviously a terrible thing that happened in the past, and that has an induce officially, which is very unfortunate. and in my view, in north korea is a good example of the stay on the stage, which has

a single family who's trying to take all the money and starts population and keep it under control whether the military data is well, i mean, always you that, that is the argument used to say well in the united states as your projected filled with other nuclear weapons, divorce the deterrent. but as for the rich in this world who are benefiting out of the proliferation of nuclear weapons with their defense stocks. and so you see the popularity amongst the very rich of uh, building bunkers to protect themselves as someone who may even be, be involved in lobbying for more nuclear weapons because they realize the probability is rising of uh, new pay for us to use or 2nd use well, i don't know, we're not alive, ridgefield, you're in colorado. that's very rich. people go to a holiday. i know that. yeah. but i don't sense any trend to the united states to be concerned about

a nuclear war. i don't see people i'm building bunkers or any other thing to protect themselves at the end of the cold war and early 1990 in peace broke out of the world. and the nuclear weapons started to be built down. and i think everybody assume that we're going to start solving our problems assuming negotiations and talking to each other instead of threatening each other. and you know, that was very positive, the development, it'd be better to return to that instead of going around, threatening each other with things. and, you know, and, you know, i mean lots of people from all over the world and everybody pretty much was the same thing. they all loved their families to be saving their children, to be prosperous. and, you know, they're, most people don't care to be rich and famous or something like that. they just want to have a nice life and have their family be happy. and, oh, lots of want to be rich or famous. we have to be in a bunker. ah, give me just finally. what about the impact all of the alms industry,

the defense secretary, which is so big, of course, in the united states on academia or in academia research. i don't know how rich boulder, colorado, colorado university of colorado boulder is per se, but obviously mit and all the big loads of big a us academic institutions have huge funding. a link to the pentagon is added texting people's understanding of the dangers of nuclear weapons. detecting the american universities that there's really much military involved that it is true, that southern universities you meant to ask particular already and i had weapons parts of the university and rather trying to help the military, probably a spin off from the 2nd world war in earlier times the branch, i don't see a lot of military research and universities and uh, you know, the los alamos and the department of energy laboratories, in general have shoes,

human society just or have come from university of course and are working at those places and military tasks and you know, it's a natural, apparently human behavior to want to have the military to protect the country that you live in. and so like i can see that's a, that's probably not going to ever change. and it's a human thing to feel like you want to protect yourself in your family. but i know there seems to be no, these are mean i'd say it's not that very, a militaristic, really, you know, i realize it looks that way. a lot of the time when you're looking at the news, you see american troops going places, but you know, the general population, i don't think is all that excited about words. they would rather not have any wars . they'd rather not have to go and get in the middle of everybody else's wars. and you know, it's even now you can see in the congress, there's a lot of concern about the ukraine war and continuing to support that conflict. and likewise,

we're not very happy about the i'm us and the middle eastern problem going down with these really most americans would rather see a 2 state solution to that. and a peaceful resolution between the israelis and the palestinians, and other groups in the middle east to solve their problems in some way. they didn't get all fighting each other. there's nothing to be gained by these words. i mean people lose from that. i mean, is having a world exception, people making the money, arguably progressive, trying to thank you as well. and that's it for the final show of this season. we'll be back with a brand new episode on saturday, the 20th of january, but until then we'll be broadcasting some of your favorite shows of the series. meanwhile, you can keep in touch, right? all social media of itself tenses in your country and then to our channel going underground tv. hon. don't come to watch new and old episodes of going underground