the name where i sit most of the time to breeze. i'm suffocating in myself, waiting for the hours to pass, hoping to find some oxygen particles to breathe and stay alive. oh, they said, well clearly the husband, he said, how rough last of many of the policy ends is proved of isabel's wrong positive financing defense, i'm destroying lives in hygiene model. then this is the 5th time carlita has been arrested. the 1st time was in 1989. it wasn't that long. it lasted for a month. the 2nd was in 2015. the surgeon 2017. the 4th in 2019. and the feast was in 2023. these are the time she has been arrested. as for what this means, the continuation of the rest without charges or with fabricated charges is nothing but a continuation of occupations policy of silence and voices, and the sport of the for rushes attack on our people. they don't want a person like salita who has no relation to while it's,

she's an influential figure in society. they don't want these kinds of people and that's why they want to keep her away from her people. and once we enforce their understanding of a policy of silencing voices, yes, my wife is a 9015 pounds tenants. what can be said about similar cases. pick any case and any home in all of palestine incited, you will find a sad and touching story. all the cases of our people, including my wife, are no different from any other prisoner. all the cases of our detained people are unjust and conducted by the occupiers. my wife is no more than any other prisoner. what is the rest of the funny? does the former know like as a senior member or all the popular funds for the liberation of palestine in december also very home near the west bank city of ramada? the reason for this anyhow, it was never specified. it was the 5th time she was arrested. thousands of policy is, are currently being held in is really present according to the remodel base rights

group plan is as husband again spoke about how these are the authorities isolate the prisoners as they restrict the contacts with the outside world in this minnesota. then there is no contract between the detainees and their families, no visits, no phone calls. the only way to get news about them is through whatever business by lawyers are allowed, which are already heavily restricted, or through annual release. the person who was in the prison cell with kalita, or any other detainee. therefore, even the simplest ride, stipulated by international law regarding communication between the detainee and their family, do not exist at all, especially after october the 7th. there is no entity that can be approached for assistance except for the institutions, the deal with prisoner affairs. and these have limited influence. and after october, the 7th there it was is non existent. there is no chance for assistance. these of course, is the responsibility of international communities, international and international institutions. because israel acts as if it is above

the law, disregard or international was international humanitarian law. and as you need the conventions, he doesn't care about any of the international legitimacy and the world is watching and staying silent while seals support in the occupied state in its war against our people. a bob that instead of a long call, so fully back of the top of the out, the the, [000:00:00;00] the

hello and welcome to cross ok. we're all things are considered. i'm peter lavelle, outgoing nato general secretary stilton burg claims. a russian victory in the ukraine. complex is the biggest risk to the us led military blocks. this is all the more reason russia will achieve its goals in this proxy war, the cross sucking nato. i'm joined by my guess, ray mcgovern in raleigh. he is a former c. i a analyst in washington, we have wilmer liam. he is a political scientists author and radio talk show host. and in salt lake city we crossed to david pine. he is deputy director of national operations for the task force on national and homeland security. all right, gentlemen, crosstalk rules. in fact, that means you can jump any time you want, and i always appreciate re let me quote the outgoing general general. so i try and make a self and bring he said a russian victory and ukraine would change the global system. well,

i actually agree with him and i think it wouldn't be a bad idea. go ahead, right. well yeah, i'm reminded that just 3 weeks ago who changed himself talked about starting back and said that, you know, he dealt with them when he was present the driveway and at that point he showed no signs of dementia. this is the thing i remember about stone. burge, most of all is his full pod grunt day before the d u parliament on let's say of september 7 last year where they said, you know, the russians. so for the said deal. yeah. you know, if, if you stop tries to get you crazy and so we was not in days so it was no room and they go all way. well as a reset. oh is, and the store, they have a big got. the guy looked the kind of the bag, right? that it is you create

a day. so this time we communicate is pretty much the same as last time. well, we all agree where the same as appropriately conditions are right. but the whole thing has to do with russia needing reassurance, right? that you create and will be neutral, and nobody seems willing to even enter chain that notion. so maybe stall bird is showing signs now of incipient, so it may be mid term dementia. what the, the, well, what we, it's hard to say with him is an individual that i can clearly say the, as an organization. it's 75. okay. it started a little early in the case of nato, but there is certainly a demented point of view there. wilma and one of the interesting things it was, we had a pending unofficial saying, nato is preparing for a prototype for a protracted wars. i thought it was a defensive alliance. so i mean they, they, they constantly blur what their mission is here. i mean, well, if you're defensive alliance, why do you have to expand?

no one's explained that to me. well, it's a defense is supposed to be a defense of alliance. i think the n a, a nato is a north atlantic. they are trying to expand into the pacific. they talk about championing human rights, but they somehow decided to invade libya. they can't seem to understand and what their mission truly is. and also it's important understand that really their mission has their tenure, their mission has passed and i think the leadership knows that the, that the jig is up. they know that their time is over, but they're sitting in this vacuum talking to themselves and encouraging themselves . so that they can reinforce their own insecurities. i mean we see for example in the washington post, they say that they're trying to trump proof of nato. and in order to

prevent trap from doing any damage, tomato or to prevent the elimination of nato itself. well, that right there tells you that they clearly understand that their time is wayne and final point they talk about. they have to have victory in ukraine. the premise that they're using is because if russia, when they will take over europe, take over the world and then move on to the mon. no. what that demonstrates is that nato itself will collapse, and i don't know how that they can expand geographically, but they don't have any bullets because they're out of weaponry. so who are they going to fight and what are they gonna fight with? well, you know, david, the whole point, i mean, if you look at the origins of nato, which kind of makes sense, that was the cold war of the soviet union had its own military block. the more so impacting,

came into existence after the establishment of nato. it was an ideological struggle and of primarily for the soviet union was to maintain its gains in the 2nd world war and to have security against a revenge as west germany, weak cetera, etc. but then the natal up to date doesn't think in terms of security at all. because because if you had a secure already architecture in europe, you wouldn't need nato because it wouldn't be a new architecture would include russia and be with russia that we have, it's against russia without russia. that's nato is afraid of that, because then it would risk its own existence. david. absolutely right, yeah. so nato was a lot of those bits of alliance. up until the end of the soviet union, when the worst soft pack was disbanded, nato should have thought well, the biggest span shortly there after as well. 1994 when all russian troops were withdrawn from eastern europe. and at this point, uh, you know,

natal began to be in advance of the alliance with uh, its uh, brutal bombing of uh, of serbia yugoslavia and 1999. and uh, is this been mentioned, it's continued in with the live use syria in to now in the parade. and there's a, you know, the only the only path to choose security for nato never states is by having some kind of mutual security braimer notice of the event i with the, with russia, right, as there's really no other path. and so, but david, we, we had that with the soviet union with the helsinki process. we had that, okay, the indivisibility of security. we had that, okay. and, and, and re now the us as a noun, so they will deploy previously band nucular capable missiles to germany. we're going backwards re, we had the i n f treaty. we're going backwards. right?

yeah, peter, you know, i go back to the abm treaty, which gave a strategic stability for 30 years, 3 decades count them. i was instrumental in that treaty. i was so cheap for the soviet our policy bridge. and we told kissinger next and that the russians are really serious about this. they didn't want to spend themselves into oblivion and they were afraid of trying. it was going to steal a march on them. we provided the problem that i the trust but verify. we provided the verification stuff and, and that was an ad in scott ritter is where it's sort of my, my life's work. no, it stays. okay. now you have scott ritter is life square. the neutral, the immediate range nuclear forces treaty cub put that last to 30, tell years problem got out of that. and now as you say, there's

a special arrangement where new medium range, ballistic missiles, i've got to go with the german or you just like the pershing chose way back in the eighty's per guide. say we're just dried them in the eighty's. it surprised the hell out of me that we could agree with the russians to destroy a whole class of nuclear missile, but we did it. now we're back to square one. or even worse, i have some words to say about the f sixteens as well, but perhaps go ahead and went ahead and go, go ahead, go ahead, right, go ahead as well. you know, i was thinking back to when f sixteens or got came to the for a bite in was in japan, a barcode fell after losing hundreds to thousands of ukrainian troops. right. i zalinski goes off to tokyo to the g. 7 we're biting is, is that where your last fight in turn? so sullivan says what we're gonna do? i'm the, how about? yeah, let's give eps exchange and that's when biden's in house here. so he's gonna let our allies give them metric state. now that's the kind of decision making, i mean,

did they check with the pedagogy to the checklist, but no, no, no, that's, we need those up right away. now what's gonna happen when the f 16 is good, shut down. yep. and the, the other stuff puter is out. all these same people. there's a wellness, the pressure. yeah, we have this a low you blow your mind through the clear weapon. so maybe that's the only day we have now. well, it's a really nice thing. another to i'll tell it says, well, i'm ready that i mean, the, the only, the only way forward for nato visa, the ukraine, is escalation. and what's really, what's at stake, the very existence of ukraine. and as, as ray is pointed out, they entering into the realm of thinking about a new killer war. i mean, this is going into the realm of insanity. go ahead and watch it as it is already in the realm of insanity in what re points out very, very clearly is there is no strategy here. there is when you just say we were losing, what do we do now?

oh, let's give a map. 16th. there's what is the desired outcome and results and if the desired outcome end result is the, the do dissolving the russian federation. but that's just not going but right, but we all know that's the goal. we all know that that's, that's just and i want to walk to the moon, but i don't think that that's going to happen anytime soon. and what they're willing to do is risk nuclear annihilation in pursuit of a fantasy. so that the military industrial complex or the mickey met as re, likes to refer to it can generate more revenue now. okay, david, that's a good point. in lieu of a strategy, let's just keep enriching the arms producers. okay. inside the beltway,

so they can buy another house in the hamptons. go ahead. yeah, i mean, the strategy a big guy is for us to maintain its, uh, its iron grip on, on data, which is really just uh, you know, it's part of the americas liberal empire. and is this so the imperial dependencies are united states. what we need to do here in the us is uh to transform us back to republic from empire and, and i think president trump is moving, you know, forward in that direction with the plan to restructure nato. hold us troops out of the eastern europe. perhaps even a hand over the david where i get it, we're approaching the bank here, but it took trumpets elected on that platform. don't you think they'll in peach in before and all your ration? well, it depends on whether there's, it's a, you know, it's a democrat control house. i mean, if he wins, uh, we're gonna, you know, republicans will keep the house. so i okay. okay, well i, i take, i was, i'm being kind of facetious. but i think that they would have someone,

lindsey graham would lead, read me the charge, right, gentleman, i have to jump in here. we're gonna go to a hard break. and after that hard break, we'll continue our discussion on nato at 75 years old. stay with are the united states trying to impose sanctions on russia. that's the best thing the, the code of happened, the russian because the sanctions on russia, against agriculture, against the other items, or made russia fetus hurting samsung. so as on agriculture and now, so the major growth export are no longer dependence on the united states and you are

the the welcome ex, across stock. were all things are considered on peter level to remind you, we're discussing nato at 75 years old. the ok, let's go back to re, obviously, nato is not in the mood. maybe it's incapable of compromise, even if it, in its own best interest. it's unwilling to compromise. but you know, as they're celebrating in washington, what comes to mind for me are broken promises and let me enumerate here, not one step in east we met, that's 1st one, ukrainian neutrality, another lie, indivisibility of security. i've already mentioned that on this program here. and of course, we all remember the minutes process here. so um, even if there were miraculously a piece feler,

why would the russians believe anything coming out of the current administration, particularly considering who is in the, in the oval office? right. those are russian words, new for me. uh, those are the initials this most lovely. okay. incapable of reaching an agreement. okay. that's what they use now for the us. and in addition to the 3 you mentioned, i would simply say that not many people know the biden told to chain directly in person on the telephone, on the 30th of december. yes, that the us for not deployed offensive strike muscles in ukraine. 3 weeks later, geneva loved rough approach, blank, good nature. what about that? we're talking about that now. i'm like, yeah, that's that. but forget about that. we have the right to put the opposite side process and you agree? and maybe we're talking about how many were put in,

but so there was another one. and last but not least, of course, most the, there's a lot of the agreement that was made out there in uh, in an east stumble uh, in march, april of 2022, where the initials were on those agreements and bodies. johnson came in the u. k. and so now and no agreement when any of these damn russians, we're gonna bite on bite on and we'll give you everything i need to provide. yeah, well, it's all in. so you made a very poor choice app, but now we see the results of all that. well, i mean i'm, but i'm sure his bank account is uh, benefited enormously and the people around him. i mean, he's not even the legal president. okay. he's head of the cube regime. well, and what are the interesting things that i've been watching over the years? is you know, we, even at this summit to, in washington they're talking about expansion. okay. um uh it continuing to do so in the balkans a and then going into central asia. i if i'm not mistaken,

an official from armenia was invited to the to the conference so. but it seems to me that ne toes ambitions are not just as we see it right now, but they want to replace the united nations. we have, there's a rules based order. they have their own sense of, of legality is against international law. it's against international institutions, and this is, this is kind of nato's a. it's a vehicle for the united states maintain, had gemini, go ahead and washington. and as we know with the rise of the shanghai cooperation organization and the operative word, there is cooperation with the rise of of bricks with the rise of the organization of the state health states. the time for this imperialist expansion has ended the folks at nato. they just haven't gotten the memo yet. and because now the ship

nato is a militaristic organization. and when you look at the seo, when you look at bricks, when you look at the shanghai, when you look at the health states, they are operating collectively from an economic perspective. and this takes me quickly back to uh, what i'm one of my favorite films, the godfather, when uh, when, when virgil, the church, the lots on says and tom, he says look, i don't like violence, i'm a business man. blood is expensive. and the united states wants to and especially things to lindsey graham spread all the ukrainian blood he can get his hands on while these other countries are moving beyond that, starting their own currencies so that they can engage in trade. which leads to development. yeah, uh and development and gender security as well. david, you know, also kind of parting shot from the, the nato conferences, a targeting china, be a,

it's claims of dual use technology and selling to the russians. they've never been really clear about that. but you know, a china is enabling russian ukraine, but it's in nato. it enabling other more as well. and you crazy, they never seem to get the balance. they are go ahead. david, a, yeah, think stream. we have a hypocritical for the us and data to argue that china is not allowed to aid aid to russia militarily or strategically. well, you know, the us is providing a long range missiles with which it hits uh, russian targets deep inside rush. and even, uh, you know, potentially missile defense radar. so to take out the, you know, chucks of a, a for us is a nuclear command control system. so uh, yeah it's, it's, uh, it's fine, but uh, we establish kind of a, a revised international order which reflects your national order is it currently exists with russia. china, us is a,

is the only degree superpowers been without this empire of us is established in, in europe. it re, you know, the ins and outs of government and decision making. who is making this nato policy in washington who is making ukraine policy in washington. and who's making russia policy in washington, a spell on solid name sullivan, and the name blinking. and so a supporting actor or austin and victoria nolan, the hiding in the shadows for the ladies from still in the worst wing there. and they're in control. and you know, maybe the best evidence of that is that on the way out of that is just this should notice treasures on the way out. and they decide that they'll pick china now is the bit know why as the enable or uh say, say uh, and as the you know, as the blame for all this stuff. and if you look at china and they've already, as david said,

called it out as hypocritical. but if you also look very closely at how the world is divided now. and india just having come from a hot summer with food chain. and you're looked at the nato folks. so did anyone notice anything this? think about all those nato folks, all 32 of them. you're all white. you're old. but like the rest of us, ok, they're all white right? well, in and many of them are from countries that were the great colonial powers. same thing that's exactly right. so the whole world sees that and how we have isolated russia and give me a break web, isolated ourselves. and that's is very clear by moti shows that the mosque was very clear by, by this last gash. now as far as data is concerned, and nothing is going to happen in ukraine until after november, when in the us election it takes place. but then nato's got a really worry about. it's not in jeopardy,

and whether it's so has any useful usefulness at all? it might be quite well more. i mean that this is the thing, this is a craven choice that they, that nato is made. you know, it's almost like do or die. it's like, as ex, essential. but if it's a choice, they don't have to make this choice. they can say, well, you know, we should have a new security arrangement that's, that's what needs to be done. that's what russia offered before this all happened, but they can't do it as well. you put it in the context of do or die. i would put it in the context of do or suicide. because the, the united states via nato started the conflict with russia via ukraine. the united states is trying, it's best to start a fight with china. the tie one there, you know, there is an adage on the corner, don't start, nothing won't be met. and they don't seem to understand that. so if you just stop

trying to punch the, the, the adversary in the eye and sit down and have some conversations. maybe we can find them avenue to piece. but as gills got here and says, ask them why they're fighting for, and they'll never tell you the economics of war. it was a david, even though there's a lot of bluster, you know, when you think about what, what military capacity to be. don't we take uh, off the table on nucular capacity, the military's in, in, in nato. we're not that particularly strong, but they're not really well funded. turkey has the biggest army, they're not getting involved in this at all here. i mean, it's a lot of a bureaucrats in my mind that have really pushed jobs and you know, they're threatening the global war, but this, but they, they don't really have capacity other than a new killer capacity. go ahead david. yeah, this is absolutely true. i mean, uh, the uh, britain, france and germany each can pro,

deploy up to one brigade in eastern europe. whereas, you know, the u. s. can provide more than that. of course, maybe a couple $100000.00 troops if we, if we were to search. but in a rush it has uh, 12 combined arms arbys. uh they might have more now that's, that's how much they start out with. and a by triple the size of their, of their ground forces double this. you know, they increase their military by 50 percent. they increase the military spending by, by a double in their, their now it's a cold war level. so a spinning in the sizes of their armed forces. so, you know, us in nato or are much weaker than it than have been presented in, in a, in a conventional or even just the conventional. and i got a cyber war. i think russian would be victoria is i wouldn't, you know, wouldn't think that they, you know, russian troops would drive to the, to the looks channel. but certainly they could take all of eastern europe without a whole lot of difficulty re we got one minute left here. how will history remember

this call con fabbing in washington this week as well? hopefully they'll get paid up below the headlines. hopefully they'll know that there's adequate proof that russia does not intend to go beyond ukraine, so to speak, the accords in each stumble. in march, april 2022 showed that voting did stop and then it was double crossed. our case stopped before it took on or ukraine. so why is it going to go to poland, the english channel? so seldom has there been a case where some, some serious as so been adequately debunk beforehand. for god's sake, russia did stop. it's not going to stop now. well, the problem is the domain we have right out of time nato doesn't want to stop. that's the problem. i want to take my guess in raleigh, washington in salt lake city. and of course, i want to thank our viewers for watching us here at our dc. you next time. remember, prospect tools,

the acceptance. and i'm here to plan with you whatever you do. do not watch my new show . seriously. why watch something that's so different opinions that he won't get anywhere else to give it. please do have the state department, the c i a weapons, bankers, multi 1000000000 dollar corporations. choose your fax for you. go ahead, change and whatever you do. don't want my show stay main street because i'm probably going to make you uncomfortable. my show is called stretching. but again, you probably don't want to watch it because it might just change the way you

the, the, the can create in supply rooms in the protocol region as move towards the others, particularly important areas. 5 as t, of course being good. $1012.00, the scope of the initial intent was completely unaware of mr. bureau visit to prompts. that's quite normal by the way, because i've never been aware of the comings and goings of nationals from all over the world, whether they have print nationality pro. and my goal is to try to defend himself from the rest of the co founder of, of details in the preexisting type of policy. right. really, susan,