and even when it came to something that wasn't even presented as, as a factors as a piece of news, but something that was humorous. i've listened in 2021, senior officials from the biden administration, including the white house repeatedly press, star teams for months to sense or certain call read 19 content, including humor and satire, and expressed a lot of frustration with our teams when we didn't agree i believe the government pressure was wrong and i regret that we were not more outspoken about it. so again, you know, you can have activists. yeah. who will like julian hassan, for instance. he has like a legendary figure, who basically choosing between his life and his, his freedom and his principles. he chose his principles and we, we will show where he got him and how again, how militancy the united states have been going off for him. and on the other hand, you have businesses, you have businessman and we can clearly see the take talk is

a business for them as the primary thing is to make money. and the american market is pivotal. it's crucial for that. they are no active as to they, so when they need to make money on the, the health and the well being of the business, which is the social media platform. right now. it takes precedence above all else for take. so hence their decisions. hence, them, again abiding very, very well, they're being very abiding when it comes to the to situation. and if they find any other accounts that have all the in the name or, or on their logos, they will bind them to end. or they won't ask any questions about the freedom of speech or anything like that, because again, it is all about the money. now, when was the last time you heard the word piece being used in the west? as regards the ukraine conflict, it might take some thinking instead, the latest approach by,

by the merciless be of his nature bikers centers on the so called victory. next cross talk discuss is where the a part of the goal of keeping the fighting going leads. that's right ahead the the the hello and welcome to cross stock were all things are considered on peter lavelle. former ukrainian president zalinski is in the us peddling what he calls a victory plan. unfortunately, this plan doesn't speak to peace and security. in fact, zalinski and his nato patrons have only one goal to keep the complet going. n well

funded this approach is a defeat for ukraine, the prospecting ukraine. i'm joined by my guess, steven guy, it's in belgrade, is a research associate at build rates, institute of european studies in bows. what we have on the right that we can call he is a former ukrainian diplomat. and in sweden we crossed to reg simmons. he is an independent research or, or a gentleman, cross type rules in effect. that means he can jump any time you want. and i always appreciated. stephen, let me go to you 1st and bell grade. this victory plan has been bandied about, i'm not sure what, how much different it is from the zalinski piece plan. we can go there if you want, but what is he trying to achieve because other, you know, at this point, it just seems like a public relations page in the dying days of the biting administration. your thoughts, stephen? it is great that you just as soon as the last these baseline uh which lists are

rated on uh, june 15th uh, 16 of the near basel in seasonal. uh, when uh, basically what we had, it was a, uh, the conference. busy the dollars uh waived. sure. all right, and would you everything to be spike getting more more money and weapons essentially what go from that. uh yes. today i'm reading that it was his, um, the 3 of us are all speech is, is that the last is the greatest salesman? whenever he comes to the united states, he goes backwards with $60000000000.00. this call press is even i think more malicious because he talks about the victory plan at the moment when you cranium defense is crumbling in the us. and what this means is escalation of war sheet demands for me to, to basically directly get involved was more important here is over the last few things, but what the nature of leads and the outgoing administration think because what

they want is, even in the event of trunk, winning the election, they want him to become a hostage of war. and at the same time, this goes along with the dramatic escalation of war individually. israel officer destroying, basically gaza and killing tens of thousands of people now is doing, began to say an action in, in lebanon. and what they want is to drag the united states. at the same time, we see our truman shape uh, aircraft carrier, moving slowly to the middle east. this is very dangerous. i think this is the most dangerous moment so far is between now and between the american elections. yeah. assuming that it could be what was popularly known as the october surprise, but was there's so many issues out there that could be the october surprise. unfortunately, andre, let me go to you and basil one of them. you know, i can understand ukraine has security interest. so, you know, i,

i've never begrudged that. okay, but i can see how this regina, that it's illegitimate at this point here. so lensky is the former president, after all under its own constitution, is landscape doesn't talk about security. he doesn't talk about peas. but he talks, he wants the little conflict to continue, but the longer it continues, the more he moves is man. and the smaller ukraine becomes like, explain the logic behind this. for me. there is no logic. there is logic at the same time. you want to see kind of that is that that is a so called piece time victory time, but you can call whatever, but it's a plan for war and destruction of implants status. it still has to come solve this for in 2019 could have stopped when he became the president with a mr. corps, haven't had getting an autonomy for the don't boss area and having a great united, he didn't do that to continue the search. this war margrave's process,

and so leading to full scale war, we think that we should sit on the frame territory. mcnally states and russia usually play in to die more than 90170000 slips for data from the finance or the grout. today, the deluxe these so called peace plan. yeah. it's the same power lose as much as possible. maybe doesn't care what the premium meant. we doesn't care about what's happening right. and you just find the church because the docs week breaks millions of orthodoxy framework, which is the 1st place of orthodoxy in the side of the world. but this is what we see today, a full destruction i try to restore, but we try to explain it to black rock, to the beach, safety to keep himself in power. and that is that there's no peace, i call it could have done it and stop. oh, the 2022 ended this whole of what should do that because he got orders directly from washington. love to keep this one going because to make more money to make more money for the most industrial conference of washington and of each state. that

is it, this is probably pretty important standpoint. do i talk to a lot of the products or formative an actual rounded world today? more than 60 percent of the brand new product for him come back. that was a fact. and they all were just wondering what else they were the main street is that uh you said it was driven president for home or different part of the many frank this the scope, scope of positive deflection. where you crank, you're going to do the story. our country you have to, we yeah, well, i want to know later eventually he'll probably end up in one of his villas in miami or, or one another, a police or destination. that's what he thinks, what we have, what? well, i mean, if he gets out of the country, because a lot of people want to see him in a ditch as well, that's what happens when you choose a patron, like nato. a great and one of the we had over the last few days, we had the british prime minister at the behest of tony blank and apparently go to washington and there was going to be the big fan fair that you know the ukrainians can use western weapons issued deep into russia,

it didn't happen. there wasn't the press conference, there really wasn't much of a read out. and of course, well, the political sphere is a buzz. what's happened here? the pentagon finally say, no, you people are really, really nuts, particularly since we're on the hook to go to war in the middle east again. i don't know. maybe we'll find out the truth here, but we did, we, we were staring into the abyss because for a change, they listen to what president vladimir putin said. you do that, then we're in a state of war with nato. go ahead, greg and sweden. oh, absolutely. is the in the 80 piece of the whole round. where will this uh, this uh, kind of the stuff weird but going to uh well, hey, and which, uh, they needed to actually activate the targets russia and they expect the consequences of the,

of the. ready personally said something and they were forced to listen. i think the creations i did last in barnes behind closed doors with a unit dollars or less, boom sign or licks john hard with his clothes and stuff would be fantastic. it was by the dump the strange love moments and hugged the bottom and let's divide them up . but then you have those other ones. uh, deadlock that ones it well, no, let's do some extra comments. same see it. and so this provider will be closed, will be a briefing in the guide to that was done a go ahead and use that was on the bottom. and what people are that great that that brings up the issue here. and this is, let me go back to stephen in belgrade. i mean, the mantra, coming out of nato capitals. is that, um, uh, the russians wilson with the big bay claim red lines, but they never, uh,

hold to them. well, number one, i would claim when we talk about red lines, most of these fictional red lines come from the west. it's not what russian officials them actually say themselves. but in, in this case here, they're saying that the, the russians won't escalate. will apparent. i always remind people that russia threatened to invade ukraine in 2022. and you know what steven? they did. okay. so i don't understand why people say they're always bluffing. russians don't bluff, they act. steven. and i think that this so logical mates or is nothing else about a firm logic because what they are doing is they're literally pushing the world towards a con, leads lation. and then they're going to have with the smile of their face with a smirk, which is kind of amazing. uh, i think that's the site is definitely not bluffing,

but russia still cannot come behind the amount of evil that these people are capable of doing. uh, who would have thought that uh, your brain for a quote with all the american equipment would be cost. uh, and we would see again german times burning on that. those same fields where they burn some 70 plus years ago. so these people are ready for to do everything and anything in order to stay in power as we see what's happening in the middle east. the nose, if he doesn't escalate, he will probably go to jail. he will have to base charges in his route because people are single more, most of the people in every society are normal. they want their kids to go to school. they want to have certain feet in their lives and they certainly don't want to die. and thermal nuclear war. and the problem is that we have a small click on the world, i wouldn't say even leaders of people in power,

different sectors of power. who are interested in dolton list collision. i don't know what the big thing they watch uh, you know, the james bond movies and they have a little shame on the c or, and, or software. so they think they move flight in space or, or, or save themselves biologically, somehow, or whatever they, they think it is a delusion because what they are essentially doing that they are trying to, to remove a huge war. uh, and i think the, this is critical time, as i said earlier between today and, and the american election so that it won't be able to. andre, what is you ukraine, get by doubling down because you is of the zalinski quote unquote a peace plan. basically asked russia to a surrender it's, it's the same thing. and why does this, i mean, is this a fiction for a western,

a lease and finance years? i mean, certainly people in ukraine can't believe it. go ahead of people. we probably don't believe there's a lot of people. ready that need to be supplement the relax regime goes under the lens they want this morning and we want to get back to the economy. there's nothing for them are under under this regime. so they're looking forward to trump south, but so i'm still running a lot, all are usually pushed, but this technician idea that he can win, but it is the world is being in the albany so called the warrants in washington, but he's not to use just in the hands of the public tiers around the globe move on to the washington. that is that he likes it. he loved. yeah, i mean, as i said it, in the interview, one say was the greatest role of his life. be kind of let the mask slip because he does enjoy being this, but i don't know if he's going to be able to get out of this alive here. gentlemen, i'm going to jump in here. we're going to run a short break. and after that short break, we'll continue our discussion on ukraine. stay with parking

the they will have chevy and it shows the position unix begonia fit the willingness, the couple. what are those appreciate, what are your new adults? but then you would just give them a one shot to the level so. so that's it for me just so that way you don't hear them step is just a little bit slow. so i know control is the sounds, the visual of the yeah, i do have to make sure that people come down. yeah. i'm literally so frustrated with as mentioned to them. yes, i pretty much show you a different level may assist you more. um, when you do it on different shifts and which the technology you can throwing up at

the let's just sponsor, excuse me, just go out. i don't know if it was a go or you don't wish to just go in and put in of the good thing is done with the subject 0 and this was was the controller. so sort of all the welcome back across the square. all things are considered. i'm peter roosevelt, divide. you were discussing you create the plan is go to greg. i mean, it's really interesting. my boy, it's uh, yeah, uh, johnson came out with an article on the spectator titled that it's time to let ukraine join nato. and then in the, in the, i think the 1st paragraph or so we, uh, we need to, uh, to get you crate into nato now. and i mean now, okay, i mean,

this is the biggest food on the international stage is i'll tell you what's a very competitive stage these days. what is motivating him. we even have the head of the outgoing head self and bring them a nato even admit that this complex came about because of nato expansion. he admitted it's all public part of the public record. and the russians have made it clear that this is a, they said, and this them before and if them bowl and they keep saying today that is a prerequisite to wrap this thing up here. but boards, johnson continues to do it. i mean, is he an ideological not case or is he just making a lot of money off of this? go ahead a lesson just because it's not all the or it's a case of the employee. the guy is definitely showing side cognitively challenged inside the of was career options, place and probably most of the around of a slow end of this particular retrospect. what do you use?

trying to do is trust, drive himself to the decision by gives in washington dc to carry enough body above for the career of barbara johnson to continue being a boss on the globe and stage, i mean, but this is purely a be awesome, but he's prepared to prostitute themselves to one because in order to do that, you know, stephen, the problem that we face right now is that i believe and what we know that the, the, the real history of this will be written one day. is that a blinking newland sullivan. but they thought the same, the threats of a conflict, they thought the sanctions would work. they thought the international isolation would work. they never really thought that a conflict would happen and they were caught flat footed. and that's the reason why they've never had a plan b stephen. i hope so. that's kind of with the presumption that they are rational,

real point explain additions who just won the victory, upset not to destroy their own countries in the process. so why see more when you have a dispatch in boynton, johnson is the last case. similar as those are then i would, i would call the human floss there like the joke, or sometimes i think that the volume was the, was always preparing us for the events to come. remember all the catastrophic movies with the washington in your being destroyed and all of them being failed before 911. so i'm now when i look back in 2019 and the movie joke or i think book johnson i think of as i see, i think of people's who did not get enough credit because they were bullied. oh god . oh, god knows what kind of frustration they had, and now they are just shopping the planet with a smile on their face. and the, this is, this is what i'm really afraid of. it's not on rationality. i thought even dr.

strange along kind of logic. it is the logic of a few even because that is what i see, i always and trying to find some kind of a, a, a rational thinking, why are they saying so, but this is more than a blog because as you just mentioned previously, they know for a fact that russia is not the last thing at the end of the day. so why are they promoting? why are they provoking ross at the response to iraq? that's, that will explode inside of russia. it is, it is lots, johnson is advocating for it is one of the last key is advocating for benefit. but as it says, the last, you know, that important. what is important is this, the, the dark elite behind stand behind a chance of that behind these people who are, uh, i don't know what they're they trying to do, but this is going beyond the real point thing. this is going beyond geo politics.

yeah. and be fit and because it's at the end of the day it's it everyone security is threatened everyone by doing this here. you know, i'm 31 of the things that i thought about during this, and i've been watching this situation since 2014. that's the beginning of this conflict here. that most western audiences are never exposed to. but i have always been, you know, bewildered how you would get this elite and in care of, supported by the wes willingly. you know, people say ukraine is a victim and i always say, well, no, it's a volunteer. they volunteered for this mission. this is an inexplicable to me and considering the results today. i mean it's, it's so will drink. but to add to it, right? you have, you're going along with it to look at all of the elections across the board. i mean, schultz was, you know, he's happy that his party gun or half a point higher than a then is the alternative for germany. i mean, think about that 2 or 3 years ago,

would you think that would be an election outcome in germany all through europe? i mean, what is going on here very much like what stephen was saying here. i just don't understand why people signed up to this because it's always to their detriment. what is ukraine gotten out of this? what is your gotten out of this? we know a lot of arms made makers made a lot of money from this. ok, fine. but everybody else, i'm today, the leaks with the when do these the, so we've got out of this is their bank accounts still more they, they have or possibly be working with states and to look up to their owners and masters in washington. that's what i get paid for, you get a good parish after all those. the address is actually on the line. she gets a good person. she comes over and sits on a board directors or company or a board of directors, and i think i chickens the money to assist you with the so called you previously. i was there. i found out of the 6 of 16 i left the gun position. so now i will not be part of a steering to get my function blood shed,

and i saw how or shameful i was in his office. i was seeing all these process. there's always going to purchase, making to sell to that americans. and that's where is the door, the assembly, and to start off, that's what it was. they were selling it all directly. ukraine was the, the lead to be praying were starting their country off directly to the west and they were looking for the door. so whatever channel the choice that is, the biggest problem is they're thinking you're really thinking about their people. they think about themselves. that is the biggest situation here. and the same thing with the so called a lead to washington. they have the email and then they had a practice, do this, then if i had to destroy rochard from, with them brand new slab, what do you think each regular american unified so i do the solar watches for the parks taken apart. they use all the resources of a rush, that's what they were planning was and they started going to happen in the 1st 3 months of this proxy war. they used to play a man, but it didn't happen. well, if i should stay them over the place, government rushes stronger than ever. the whole world is back camp, russia. i forget what i remember confusion all behind bridges broke and this was

the result of didn't expect them. that's going to be their karma, the loss. but the people are shocked and that is the biggest situation. people in europe are suffering. the prices are starting rockery, most likely doesn't even jeremy mercedes leaving germany. great is total destroyed, and is going to be costing over $500000000000.00 to just to rebuild it. the west is not going remotely. i think that's the biggest question. what's, what is that, what is the resources and leave you find what we may find out? i mean, i suppose, uh, by the time this program errors, we may know more details, but i mean they're, they're banding about a trillion don't got another trillion dollars. it will take it in small bills. thank you very much. i mean, this is extraordinary here. you know, great there's, you know, i actually, you know, before all of this happened in 2014 to the present. i used to go to ukraine a lot. and i really love ukraine, and i really enjoyed visiting kevin and meeting with ukrainian people. and i

actually care a lot about the country to this day. and the only way to ukraine is going to survive. europe is going to survive and the world is going to survive. and we go back to the helsinki idea of security indivisibility of security. that's the only way out. okay, and that is ensures that ukraine, at least in some form, will survive the past that the zalinski crowd is going down. a sure is that ukraine may face the destruction, complete destruction. go ahead, greg, and sweep to you about your duties commonsense. this is the problem. i mean, most of these people love, at least in china, is in heavy stokes, above woods, and just looking to know too much existence. i mean, the moment that examines the greet uh to garbage of what ive been ukraine's independence was lovely last meeting. so when he, when he was to go,

i gave him your take on the boss, which is why the, the always so he observe is live do clients, independence was all of us. and i mean, but i think the issue now is a bit by the base like literally the existence as awesome, potable rates late. and you did all these people talking about like the, the, also the conference a not in 45. and that, you know, i rush, it was on the lease and that was going to divide up, rush or off to it. say, you don't live in reality. i mean, i think one of the things which is going to tell is as a lives he has done the, i suppose the right uh from on the, in the, the public can do. busy he believes that he is a subject a not object of these games. and i mean his big bonding is getting

a little bit too high for the concert or some of these people. so i mean, the volume of will be when you're trying and zalinski and the rest of the draw between this is what the us us with the goes to i, i, i, this is what i taught when this was all beginning. i told a guy out of a good friend of mine, she has family and ukraine's like. but you know that they're not fearful because america is on our side and they said they will dump you when it's appropriate when you're no longer are necessary. and it's happening right now, steve. and i think what are the last minute here? because even i think the bi monthly administration wants to give a gift to a potential trump administration, and that is this failed ukraine project. they just want to drop it in their life, and they'll say, see trump the last few. great. go ahead, steven. exactly. maybe that's the that was the reason why by then i was very trump has, but the on the more serious most uh my question is what comes next?

because i think that is the last piece already a person of the box. he just got so his award and the dump that strong, his crumbling what i'm thinking of is these a statement of atlanta variable said that move always next to what does that supposed to mean? and it's very indicative of that. also president developers on the cycle side of the back on bell rose was marked the beginning more homework 3. so maybe these people are already on talking about. of course major people are already thinking about what comes next. well, steven, steven, i'm sure all of you and our viewers saw that last interview with victoria, new and in that smirk on her face. they've got plans. they still got big plans. we're gonna have to leave it there gentlemen. i want to thank my guess in belgrade basil, and since we've been of course, i want to thank our viewers for watching us here at r t c. and next time remember, prospect rules the

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