this the i'm action retents here. welcome back to going underground, broadcasting all around the world from the u. a. today, the foreign minister of the superpower of this century, china, when he and his friend russian foreign minister. so gay lever of joins on voice from cuba and saudi arabia, the shad, you'll view in general assembly in new york. it isn't. it's nato and all allowed to war on palestine on lebanon. and the nature was on russia through ukraine and china through ty, one it comes as nato countries institute of immortal william cubs when freedom of speech with mess. specification of protest is in the belly of the beast, of, and by the usa. but also, the persecution stretches the us puppets. proxies in western europe. in britain,

john lists like richard met us, get turned by again. sarah wilkerson have faced you case, state progression of the section 12 of the terrorism act, even the great palestinian scholar and author of returning the palestinian memoir in search of fatima and married to another man, talk to god the economy has been questioned by u. k. security forces and ex, associated fellow at m a 6 link chatham house, and they just book is one stage, the only democratic future for palestine is ralphie joins we know from london. a dr . economy. thank you so much. you've been one of the most eloquent to tell is all the crimes committed against palestine by u. k. u. s. you, um, does have premises. i wanna get to the genocide in the war and devin in, in a minute. but uh, i mean, unbelievably, just, um you have been targeted thrown out of labor by a style man and his regime and questioned by police just what happened before we get into the geo political context of what happened to you

on a micro level as well. so slowly i was expelled from the labor of bulky associate because um i, i, they, uh, i had been a member for since 1986. i think um and uh about 18 months ago. um the uh, shopping the uh, the patch. uh, and they said you are accused of anti semitism. and now the editor zip forward was various articles i have written. one of them was 4 years old and they were not recent. and they were off to close a region d dot 100. and about israel, that's what i always write about. that is what i speak about is around not jewish there, but it isn't. so um i wrote back the,

the few additions. so i wrote back and i said i did this new anti semitism. yeah, i shoot the accusation. this is about as well. and i've always been concerned about is there is, there is a state, it is not the predicted. gotcha, great. i. so your acquisitions are basis and that was that it was just, i have never been right at all. they came back with, i think an identical they just should be, should judge again and friends. we've had jeremy called in on this program and you know, he's been tapped. yeah, obviously. and he's the full leader of the body. that body, i sorry to interrupt, but these really invested to britain was invited this week to be style my labor conference to be auto valley. and he said every school, every mosque, every 2nd house as a legitimate target for as well. so, you know, maybe i'll please you're not in that policy. well, frankly,

i wouldn't want to be in the party. the bike is summer. i don't want to be in a property that you should see a lot as well. a and a have to come to sort of to the police when i, when i hear about because that's a neg, another o p o. well, this was really something completely unexpected and did it at the beginning of this year, this year? well, i received an invitation to a book festival and that's fine because of my new book, which kind of get mentioned one state. and i was invited to give a talk about this book. so i went along, this is, this takes place, this book textbook takes page in a small, a, c, p, a town in sausage love, that it's a, it's a dog called lewis. and as you know, the,

the sort of people that come to the festival. uh and educated what you told me. oh no, i'm on the front line, a van to find that. i didn't to find them slightly. so, you know, i, i timed up with my, with my book and i started to speak and i said i was addressing the audience, which was your all typically, well, meaning very use people. my daughter really has an awful lot to do with what they call, sorry. minutes and so i said, let me just kind of find, 1st of all, there are organizations and a names that you hear. you may not know necessarily or there is to know about them . let me just start off by doing something about how much i now you may know or the org is may know who the message did you find in the west. in britain,

in particular, it is, it is classified as a terrorist organization. so when i spoke, i said have math, this is actually another student, bridget, for a party, and they have various functions because they are the former government garza and or so they have a section which is a resistance against occupational resistance against israel. that's what, how much is um and somebody in the audience is hooked up and said, you haven't said they're a terrorist organization. a power job was too much need to do. she mention him as in a public meeting, you have to see a prescribed terrorist organization. you have to add that and so. ready i haven't done that and this person said that you use for terrorist score.

there is most of me and i said no, no, i should. i didn't mention that because it wasn't speaking to you. the representing the palestinian point of view finished and is the real degree is not to how much is a terrorist organization and how that was that this person went a complaint to the police, which was very distressed by what i've said, etc. please go to touch with me. i couldn't believe it is about 2 or 3 weeks off to the bestbuy for the boxes. but he's going to go up saying you are accused of being supported terrorism. and we'd like to interview you. and this is an interview under caution, so it's a former ad i really, really, i could not believe this has happened to me to sized box then do go there without the lawyer. so i actually got in touch with she stopped. they looked off to me and

it was, it was back serious. so am i, under i understanding is it is against the law in, in britain, in this way. i mean, they can, the police can stop you without reasonable suspicion. and as you say, a lebanese resistance guys are resistance, all of that is considered a terrorist. these are, these are terrorist groups. but anyway, despite all of that, most british people are against the genocide and against the stomach. governments are coming or israel polls show most americans so forth to palestine at now. does that mean it's even more critically important of critical importance that legislation in the united states, obviously as the 1st amendment. so it's much more difficult there. they have come. the mass student protests against the, the genocide in say, britain, presume these are all important now to legislate so that i don't know works of

fiction works of art. i worked with culture works of journalism. all of this can be, can be prevented from reaching the public now in britain and invest in europe use. this is a serious indeed, you know, is realize have been in the and it has a very, very. ready big reach. so if we go to a situation now where uh, if you never mind why to or speaking about the past, i know or how mass or whatever actually issue when a badge which shows the published in slab or shows something like, or has a silken like sleep on a side, this can also then in trouble, the reality of the labor party conference is just ended here in britain and a,

somebody a was removed from the hole because he was wearing a badge which said free powder sine. he's a smooth badges. we're not talking about huge flags, so, you know, it's like that. and it's extremely serious. the thing is that i know you mentioned a is really power there. and we've had joined much time or on the professor from chicago's wrote these really know be, and of course, i'm john, excuse me, in on, but, you know, i, we, as everyone made a big mistake and it's not actually israel. i mean, these headlines biden fails to rain and yahoo has risk of all the war. increases is, is not really the united states that is doing this. instead of blaming israel. you brain wash an entire population to believing a little arabs are evil. so there's a holocaust in western europe, and then you pull british your it would be in the american weapons and then you

know, in the, uh, is there any occupational forces in me any pulling the trigger? is it not a product of us empire? is clos, not missing from this analysis? yes, i agree with you. i agree with you because you she, so as long as you can a, a week to sing the blame at an individual in this case nathan, yahoo! who at something called d is around not be at then in a way you are observing. the real culprits here, which on the, the, the head should be as part of the american bar. and in that sense of britain and other european countries are complicit of working with the american empire in order to impose their, their will on peoples in many parts of the world. this is not,

you know, this is part of this part of the american this we just bought a bridget useful where people probably went out to other parts of the world engaged in what we can presume to be in genocide, to act. that was new tv to show us what they did at the time, but i have no doubt they would it be similar to the access we can see. so protected by israel. they would have been done against native americans against appalachian bouncing australia against native canadians. but we will never know, but we must assume that that's what happened. and as a result of those generous tied to act against indigenous people of britain established itself as the you losers and the new inhabitants these areas search. this is something in the history,

one could say the dna and i'll return and of the west. and unfortunately, we in palestine are having to suffer today. the kind of a tradition which should have been over at the end of the 19th century. but unfortunately at it, it's not and step when they establish the simpler calling me that the point is around. but in reality it, they did it by those measurements that they employed previously to come to america, etc. and it's all bad luck that we were quote, in this ramp at the time, which is when we're over the world. so there was

a shift away from colonialism from imperialism on to independence, foundry the economy. i'll just stop you. the more from the author of one state to be only democratic future for palestine, israel after this break, the because i know it's the nicest of them, which is the same on this particular moisture basis. just you i you see for senior snap under the guise of a bank waste about 50000 people were transported. the main purpose of this concentration camp in bella rose was too insane. prisoners was typhus and use them

as a human shield against the advancing. so it'd be at ami giving my own but silly and slipped into phone. you put them in the room with like you can pick up to ship your stuff up and stuff like that, but don't want to bring your name here. i'm so sorry i missed cuz that an extra 262 people decided that there's 2 seas use people, this biological weapons leading them to perish without food, water, or shelter. the door small, it there for me, if i did the so create the new lives out there with you for the small to the can you put the intrinsic nation weight in there? so it's a huge issue. relationship for them to move the cam gloucester 10 days or what else made it drastically defense from of accounts of the 3rd rice watch on tv. the welcome back to going on the right,

and i'm still here with the author, one state, the only democratic future of a balance. and israel don't take out the economy, the economy, i interrupted you in the fall, when were you talking about the timing of this latest to genocide? i should just add before i let you continue on, on that that uh why is it doing this or listen to ends in a blinking i don't know what you think when he speaks about how he's trying desperately to stop this genocide when in fact uh when he never use of the word genocide when in fact he's boring in the weapons and giving cover and support without which the genocide could all continue. quite frankly, if i look at the big, i would be very embarrassed. i would be too embarrassed to look might see lucas, my space the memory. because how he can carry out to sure on of visiting various countries. talking about spar,

talking about american the american road in, in bringing a piece of resolution to the con. ready how we can do that with the straight face here? no, because he, he knows very well that there is a way in which this can all come at the united states turns the pop offs. alms, the understood that providing each route from said, providing israel in order to keep the genocide during all they have to do is turn time to tackle and say, right israel, sorry, that's a new mot. you're on your own. it'll be in the end to the general side and the ends of the, of the, of the current phase of this company. they don't do it. and therefore, all the speeches they made, all these attempts at,

and i don't know how they have the sort of color for the cab because you'd like the news to non ton door working night and day this stop in order to try to persuade people that they really are continuing the effort while i'm doing very well. they are a doing and a betting, and in fact there are to spend most i'm but then, but why did the journalist believe this story that it is bite and genocide, joe and how look was terrorist that that'd be the the brakes on the increasing the regional whitening war as israel bombs, syria, iraq, iran never than a human. and probably jordan moved to the mix. well

no jordan has nothing to mix. jordan is very essential in as part of the scheme because jordan is a buffer state. the project is around from out of sources be, i think even join, even that ain't the king refused to meet netanyahu. i joined the course of these events, and even some of these, a usually trusted allies of israel are not responding now. a no indeed. look, it's really difficult for, i mean there's a whole other subject about the, the arab states. what, there really is, how you continue to maintain a diplomatic ties with israel. it's quite extraordinary. you know, there's not a, not just single state has expelled, these really invested the has terminated. it's diplomatic ties to israel has well, not satisfied the rave. you're certainly not doing what the americans want them want them to do. but, but i mean back to what i was saying earlier,

does that mean that the whole, you know, edward said many people talk about the christian palestinian scholar edward site is the source of so much knowledge of generations. i've been to a time. but there was a critique by age as i'm and famously the indian scala. that is all of what has been written about palestine and obviously your book moves on the debates to make one state solution a sense of states. thing i want to get onto the, as it mr. trick, but this is about the united states and empire. it's north about is right. it's north about the balfour declaration, i suppose, the vassal britain know a vessel states of united states. and does that mean the united states has to be attacked directly? the lebanese resistance moved once and the resistance, reuben delagarza, they don't know, they're not going to make any impact by attacking israel. it doesn't have to be,

you know, uh or nothing is really it has a very important role to play in a, in the question of the american empire. so by attracting or restricting the freedom of action is around, you want to get that the import rock of the american them by no, i don't see that. you can just say we read, it's rather lower and let's just go for america. but that does not mean one is not where you have to be aware of the relationships. yeah. you have to be aware that this is the way it works. so when you are engaged in political systems or action of any kind and have to understand what it is you're really doing. now, i think that israel is one of the most important tools. okay,

and fire. and you can see that by the way, that all the western states led by america are a dash sprint to a project is around and to keep it on its feet. so you know, that shows you, it's a measure of expanding to them. so therefore, if you attack it with you, obviously you a text that as well, but you do, it doesn't say knowing, knowing, knowing what you're doing, the sign has good of us near universal the international community. if i can use that phrase, which is so misuse in media or in nato countries, a backs palestine daily and yet still from russia and from china. the 2 most important members, arguably on the security council, who i don't know whether you feel could be doing more. they talk about a 2 state solution that may be because boots and then she didn't being as no read

your latest book. but why is it they this phrase is used still by lead is of countries, but have expressed absolute solidarity with the palestinian cause. most countries in the world probably yeah, the story of the 2 states usually is distorted already to you know, the, the, the issue which actually most people don't understand is that the notion of a palestinian state and is i'm on the side d is really state which is the 2 state solution. this is something that was issued by the palestinians themselves. but the reason for them doing that is a big, huge there's the they don't on the sun. and the reason that the brothers didn't use

were interested in that idea was because they have feelings. and then this for 2 months that they would use the whole country. and that's exactly what's happening now that they didn't want to lose or not. it's not. so in a way what it was saying was ok, let's have a smooth pump, and it's not even though it's on that you don't get the original native population, 22 percent or the original home on it. so that's an option. however, the brothers to me and you were saying as it was, look, we'll take that for now and uh you know, lift aside to another date. so it's, that was the process to me in the honest allison and position, no matter the the side, the language in which it was dressed up at now the idea of 2 states was pounced on by the west. because if you think about it, it shows it from phillips quite a few functions. first of all,

if you talk about through stage, it means you are not to empty is right. is where continues to be that exactly as you change the shape? does it runs in jewish state, etc? so it's her is present in the 2 states. however, at the same time, you as a 3rd party, as, as the so called international community on not seen, israel must continue and to help with the palestinians. oh, nothing to where saying the policy is design something for themselves. so river are taking it for a state for the palestinians, even though it's on a 5th of their original. that is the truth about the 2 state solution. and these people are, and if you're there are these forces and actors who support society,

they want to be honest and see what i've just said, which is that this is not found on the indigenous people, at least if you want to sugar that make it 5050 if you're making it at 88020 at your be it's been around staff. ok. it's the most that we can try to a lot to the palestinians. that would be the only specific an independent singles could make some sort of choice. but what they've done is they've talked about the 2 state solution and you have not lifted a finger to make it up. i have said nothing in my book, but on many, okay. if you believe it in the 2 states, then you, i'm the obligation to show us how it can happen. because if you look at the map, look at the map of these ram, i don't even mean now. i mean, before, 20 years ago,

in the following 1967, you could see the number of is really cooling is springing up on over the west bank and of the time, or because up to on what piece of land is the balancing is the going to be which i'm going to make sound all the more strange that the china in rush or i can be a still using that phrase may be. but just finally as we're running out of time britain using accurate terry base. i don't know how many soldiers that we don't know that keeping it secret about their aid to israel, full, the genocide, making them complicit. bill buns with the c i a back and forth with most said you words at the p a and the palestinian authority. how to blame aside from all of that is the elite plus of palestinian bureaucracy

for the genocide of a like of which we haven't seen. i'll give a since the holocaust i don't think that they they took that to beat. so the trend of side. no, i think it's really squarely behind that genocide and it's western backups that's let's be clear about that box. you could talk about the fact that the, uh, the routing in each of the palestinians has not done anything really about opposing set aside, except by talking about just a they've continued with the same arrangements. israel, however, i don't really to tell you the truth. i don't expect much more of an i don't see people race time criticizing because this is about a senior this or this is something that was set up on the patient. it was set up by the occupied by the colonize those arrangements on not 80 and

a tour to world history. okay. i agree with dr. got it kind of me sorry, we run out of time and thank you so much i as well. thank you. and i would very much you read my book and get to understand why it is that i use paper one state over the 2 state solution. thank you. that's it for the show. all continued condolences to those very by u. k. u s. u, i'm jealous, i will be back on monday to investigate who is really pulling the strings behind vitamin hours in washington with monica obama brother in the 44th you as president barack obama? until then keep in touch my with my social media, if it's not sensitive, we'll country and i to a channel going underground tv on a little com to watch new and old episodes of going underground scene monday. the

the, the goal to much.