the cam gloucester 10 days, or what else made it drastically defense for mazda camps of the sun. rise, watch on t. the time action or time. see and welcome back to going underground rule. gusting all around the world from a middle east where nato proxy forces, in concert with israel and al qaeda, trying to ever throw governments not only in palestine, but in lebanon, and now syria. this is nato finally, j simon and defeat and its proxy war on russia through ukraine. all these issues and from the british is riley genocide in gaza to nato nation attempts to destroy everything from venezuela. give us a hell and southeast asia, a given the propaganda treatment in totalitarian, so called western newspapers, tv,

cinema and literature. but there are some who have expose the lies in the rackets a rogue report versus the american empire co founder of declassified. you came, i cannot delineate something of the systematic corrosion, while few managed by imperial forces. no wonder it comes into us to buy long term friends of going underground. joan pills, you know, i'm john, ski, and julian asylum. dramatic joins me now from london. now thanks. so much for coming on. i'm going to book uh the, the rackets is, it's been a week where even major propaganda media like comcast sky news, warner brothers is cnn. that 11 mouth piece is like your, or our v c. have found it difficult to explain to their audiences, i think how it is that they support l guy to in syria. how does your book, the racket give us the dimension in which to understand why the bbc and john simpson people are on the well, what know these people actually know? i'm a know what cnn is given by their viewing figures. but why the media are,

is completely up to they, they want to support those links to the atrocities and $911.00. it's yeah. what is interesting, isn't it? i think it goes to the hall, the message of the book, which is that the mainstream media is not what we told is not what uh, what were you dining? john is a school that we are a check on power. the journalism, the constructs the lives of the state and corporations when you get inside it. and i work for financial times, if most of the reporting was done, was that the financial times you realize that actually the mainstream media is really an adjunct to state power. often they do do some good stories of sort scandals and that kind of thing. but in terms of systematic analysis, a systematic, the construction of the propaganda, you get none of it. and that's why this is such a beautiful system in the way because it does allow some freedom within those confines of the main stream media. but really it protects power at all times. and

just to go to a point about what's happening in syria. so of course, outside the now which is re branded as h t, as in syria in syria, is useful to us now because we have been trying to, over through the us government for over 10 years. so those people as soon as they, as soon as they become useful to us, we have we, we rehabilitate them, and propagandized for them. in fact, there was an article today that they kind of grew up, which said sub utilize, of how, i guess the friendly ge ahead is. so going to build a new syria, that kind of line something that you the people diversity on behalf of those that have been historically chopping the heads of children. exactly, i'm, i'm imagining thing. tell someone that you know, the type of 2001 in america, the 23 is made. so we're going to have mainstream media. i actually talk about all kind of as a good thing and about how they can bring a new syria. um, after

a decade of war, it is, is preposterous, but it is not, but it's not just syria, it goes against everything. every systematic mode of exploitation is practiced by the west is justified, is legitimized by the mainstream media. not since published this whole heaps of ideology which were effect from a very young age, which is effectively oh, lies. and we don't have a media which takes it apart. we have a media which regards to tied to it. so we live swimming and propaganda. and it needs to change, i do think it is changing now. i think it's that's any different from even the time i was working at the financial times, which was a 2009 to 2012, that was the mainstream media had more of a hold on the narrative than they do now. because social media has allowed us to bypass the mainstream media, and that is why there's such a tax on social media,

but also why this whole industry is brought to the about this information, which again is a junk state. how often if you look at these organizations, the funding, so who this information they often funded by the far enough, based on the state department. and they, what they are about is to try and be legitimize new voices, the work outside the mainstream, and reveal new truths that you called into the mainstream. says that there's always ways that powell will work to protect itself in new circumstances. yeah, we have enormous. good, thank for knowing the brand american watch, whole good will planes we use to protect. i will guide you in effect this week despite denials. of course, the little musk we might get into that later because he relates to bolivia, renewal book, lithium uh, quite important for his cause. he mentioned jones is just that you went to the prestigious columbia journalism school in the book. you say they went through all to the racket and it's lies. and questioning things made you out somehow

n t a metric. to tell me about the columbia journalism school, which, you know, some people in the academy might know the way to public the i've never heard of these, but is this? yes, it's the school is basically the most elite, john is a school in the world. it creates an educate stubs of next generation of top corporate journalists in the state school. so worldwide. and i didn't really know that before i went now nicely went to leads university in the u. k. so normally, university by go good story when i was there, which got me into columbia by city. but i was extremely disappointed by the the cult and the level of journalism that was being to practice that of just one example is a henry kissinger who died recently. but is one of the most blood sites will criminals of the 20th century. he came to columbia university when i was there, and i found that he comes, came every year and that's the kind of speak can participate about politics and

blah, blah blah. and he was accepted as a sort of a kind of a warm and cuddly statesman. and i, when i was in the room when, when are you speaking? and i put my hand up and i just said, how do you sleep at night? and the whole room just like you to go in order to goest and then everything inside him. and he said, do you think you a maurice superior to me? and that's an easy question to also when is henry kissinger you're asking you. so i said yes. and he said, and then he went okay, there was a bit of back and forth. he was like, well, the, the stuff you brady, who lives, blah, blah, blah. but interesting, the often that i was attacked massively by the faculty itself. one of the they to a system here that will cover those left. exactly like the what i did was disgraceful and one came up to me often and said, you disgraced yourself the other day. i got basically 0 support, but that is very um, telling about what columbia university's role it's, it's to whitewash and to support essentially american war criminals and make the

actions seeing pop. what we're told is a little while ago during a world of law and blah, blah, blah. so the night with all normal exceptions, geffrey sex, i know victoria newland and hillary clinton are there at the moment. no, jeffrey sites is amazing, but he's not in the journalism school. the i'm talking specifically about it. does this what is most of the great academic throughout columbia? and also there are few in columbia but few and far between. i knew some ways they also add on and generate the illusion is there is a free culture that that's critical of power because it's kind of a fig leaf. so they say, oh we go x x professor. well, i'm on a gym level is just, uh, uh, it's a, it's what you would expect to do. it took you about the most elite school and in journalism, in america is just producing the next, ideologically trained propagandist for the american empire centrally. and then the same happened when i went to the financial as long as you realize, okay, well, i've got hold of things i need to learn to enter the mainstream media. but luckily

i had the japanese newspaper that told you, go away and do your save the world stuff. when you left, i was i see the editor, the etc. and that was a line on the yes, he said uh, i mean he was using is a nice enough guy. uh, but he said uh, i wasn't, there has to just go in the say below stuff and maybe you can come back when you're a bit older. but what it actually, that'd be nice to get to this week's events. it gives you a threatened me personally. i should say, i am proud to say, i mean, am i 6 as far as we know he's actively supporting what's going on and i don't know whether you know, most with it, because we can see on social media the, the outside to read violence. whether that's shamed, what's your blinking state department? just say look, we know we're not doing this. and the jake sullivan displayed, having previously said outside is on our side and through the kind of distance weaknesses with the same time on the hand, having to do it. and how does that because it must be

a hard sell even to those young list and use desk to say, yeah, we're on the side of the outside an isis. yeah. yeah. is an obviously, um, they want to do it on the hand at least. but there's been quite a lot of, i think stories of come out in the eighty's route setting. israel prefers to have a set in place rather than the on no, no outside or somebody's not us government, which i think it's just a began to pull out by, by these really is to try and monday the was what is very, very clear, the israel, the united states allies have been trying to break the excess of resistance for that for over a decade. and syria is a key part of the supply line from iran says blog. and also will this happen soon after that ceased by the it was, was low. and so i think will these things are connected. and what they want to do is a for the a separate team and they don't care who they use. that's the point. so they, well,

obviously they want to come about it because of up to about this, the reasons why you say, but even then they don't, they don't care too much. like i said, the us going to pay the telegraph and you're going to see more more about that. people have short memories and people are very, very susceptible. it's perfect. done the look, the h t s is reruns from they were previously outside of they've now they've they, when they, they start, we're in suits. they said all we're worried about diversity. we work outside and out. um, but, and people buy it from. yeah. and she has this, we go hungry about a cooper should have a christmas tree being taken down because of course they want to kill. the christians is starkly. i mean, i don't think they get over there though that the you a president phoned as that on the day to give support society or any of your friends with a ron. this region has changed. what do you think about organizations that are being pro palestine? looking, looking at the genocide, you can see the guitar a news channel allowed to 0. where was the 1st ever english language jump?

really interesting how they're embedded. it seems without guide, as well can saw, was allegedly one of the main funds of news, right, as well, which is what pays it pre gusts to ice. yes, that came out during the time. i think it's ours. go up quite a be record of support in extremis, across the region to be in the syrian civil war. and so, i mean, i think the ice, you don't know about the position of the u, i. e, in the saudis as well. i think that essentially they want to break your on the tags . i've certainly not there, certainly not that position. and of course we are here. of course it is starkly. in fact, that's really what i'm coming to about the, i presume they haven't just read your book and realized that history has changed. but i mean, as you do any, a, b, i m, f and world bank destructive policies. people increasingly, you know, going to one these loans are they, these countries? i mean, you can see molly and send

a goal and you can see what's happening in the southeast asia. i mean, i'm not saying is just your books clearly, but the world has changed, doesn't it? i mean, obviously ukraine has made that change up to the sanctions on russia and the sanctions on china. do you see the changing now? yeah, there's been a massive shift to the east, essentially, and it's major on china to be honest with you, because even russia is not in terms of use economy on the same scale, was trying to so trying as rise and let's say in much 1015 years it could be the biggest economy in the world. i'm, regardless of what you think about the chinese government. uh, the space that opens up for uh, independent governments in africa and latin america, asia to operate is huge because of the end of the cold war. there was only one game in town, which was the us, you know, and there was a pretty big time the less than independent movements. get this out, the taste as a 99 for mexico, but i and then it changed a bit when travis came in in 1999 in venezuela. but essentially,

if you're trying to escape these institutions are the i'm asking well back, which are for it to be honest with united states. that was there wasn't any other po, to organize around the next change now. and so you see the brakes uh, buying can and, and also some of the 2 things happening that i kind of, i get back in it, i'll stop you there more from the ortho of the racket. a real group of us is the american empire and co founder declassified u. k. after this break the, [000:00:00;00] the hub. so i'm for. yeah, i mean, i mean, yeah, i good dogs, good times for

a week. give me and point me in creating tabs on it. so if you type this timeline, we're at the stage. we have the width is we've been at the top for 500 years to have no, you have not had no serious challenges. i mean, to emulate guy. uh, i mean self destructing the welcome back to going undergrad. i'm still here with the author of the rock as a rogue reported as the american and by and co founder of declassified you came, i cannot math in part one. you were talking about this new world order as it were, as regards a new ways to, to have a economies in the global south. but this is happening at the same time, the rise of china, which is already the biggest economy by a, by b, b, b,

as the genocide is how you are in london. i mean, how hard is it for them to comprehend these journalists, i learned the british public what the government is doing, and you might have to remind us, what exactly is the british role in the genocide that you've been, i know, tweeting and writing about the intimate relationship between this a k as kyle, i'm a government and genocide making him able criminal. yeah. well essentially i think that's the top line, but we are not just complicit in the general southern gaza way participants and have been from the start actually. but in terms of or will impact upside on the public, the public doesn't know because it goes back to your original question about the media. the media has left out all the information that people would need to understand all role. in fact, at the classified we've done pretty much all the work on the u. k. military intelligence role, which is extreme. i would say that this is

a tripod type genocide. this is a u. k. us and israel us is providing mostly ons. you guys providing most of the intelligence and these roles getting done and in terms of how that works on the ground. there's one story came on the new york times in the summer that the u. k. uh, intelligence services had deployed a spite team inside israel to help these route with this operation in gaza. so that came out a new what time does leads find his right? the official, these ready officials said that the guy spies were giving quote, value added to his ready operations and they were quote, providing intelligence we call and collect and all right. so this is huge in the context of the fact that as i see restaurants out for the prime minister in the form of defense minister, the fact that as a genocide case at the i c j, the wells high school ongoing i need and these and he's ready officials, a leaking that the british have a being providing stuff that they conflict and that right,

you would think that might interest the media. that story is never be mentioned in the u. k. media, the, the other side of it, there's never thoughts about is the, we are the you, k is sending a spice by, oh, because up every night, pretty much and sometimes to the, now they're in the sky for 6 hours. and they, the, that intelligence has been been positive these raised now the case a while it's just the hostage rescue, but we've only got one hostage in casa, and we had to win the flight started. one of them was killed, it looks like bodies raised themselves. so what is that information? why is it going and what, what, what does it involve? because my hunch is that it probably is being used for operations by his route. because it, i think it semantic, wesley, because if he says i need to do with hostage rescue, while these run these present the whole offensive, you can cause a as hostage rescue operations. so it gives them leeway to, to do whatever they want. again, there was

a question in parliament actually all the while it was democrat here recently, but he said he also ministry defense. can you tell me the information we're providing to israel is not being used for military targeting, and they refuse to wassa so, so there's a box that's the, that's highly suspicious. the other side of it is a special forces. now special forces, people don't know a highly secretive part of the u. k state. if either even more 6 to be instead of just say just easy to get space of easier information about what they, what they're up to. that'd be fine. 7 cause up was around the world, the u. k. special policy is coming on as ss on october 27th last year. so soon off the start the genocide sunday's paper. they will lead that the essay is that the employees to all based on cyprus, full garza operations. and then the following data that october 28th u. k. military sent out the notice to every media and it's the same. don't publish any information about what the ss is up to in israel and gaza. and since that day,

we've not had any information about what the special forces today, which is as again in the context of what was about these legal process, its own dying. we could be directly in both on the ground and goes, i don't know if something was going on the ground used to ignore the d notices when we were in britain. maybe that's why we're in the do body. but to kareem khan as being on the show and see for us case, you're of the international vocation, go to international criminal court and he's certainly not looking into your allegations. people can follow you on x, of course, because you'd reproduce the maps during the flights where britain and this is hundreds of thousands, mostly women and children. but it would be aid of the roy levels. yeah. the disgrace in the name of the the r s, but it does. but people are surprised. i have to say when, when they, when they are made aware of what is going on, it completely appends the whole world view because we're sitting on our phones. and so the was stuff we got to so you know, it's maybe the west stuff, you know,

my salvation campaigns, a bullying of civilians. believe this every day. kids, i'm more need to make the kids, the new modem, conflicts of kids with that, with no legs. the legs spun off, almost blown off, is horrendous. and then you know that we're not only just giving them diplomatic support, sending them moms, we're supplying intelligence for them to get this operation done. and people are shocked by that, which i think is why the mainstream media is so uh, it is sold by the company because again, they protect, protect power. and when have a, a ro is mentioned is who is mentioned in the kind of benign uh, basically taking the official line and the for so long as we have nothing to do with what's going on in the ground. we own the football helping use raise to, to, to the rescue all hostage, which is rubbish. i think so. yeah. is it is hernandez. i think the environment is, i mean, and people are watching uh, these mouthpiece media like bbc less and less. what do you like in in britain then? i mean that my 6 is the who are friends,

is zekia storm or who persecuted julie. in a sense, we both interviewed jeremy colbin in the new environment where people aren't anymore persuaded by the propaganda media system. their way could they do what they did to jeremy colbin? the most popular uh, i mean, socialist kind of lead to well positioned leader in the west and your babies fake anti semitism, says could they ever do it again? or are they that those deep state actors and that is your understanding. it was the deep state that you know, that people can look online to see the british soldiers are using pictures of goldman as target practice and that kind of stuff. yeah, i mean that again, it a to go back to what i said about the media and the free press and the illusion around that is the same with democracy. we don't have a democracy in this country. we have an oligarchy, and that stopped working with jeremy called him, was elected in 2015. and as you said, the labor party swelled to the biggest pots,

even worse than europe. and he was destroyed by uh, a campaign around that symbolism. but also there was many, many elements of the british state, the, uh, the one is in destroyed arms companies, u. k. military intelligence agencies, the israel lobby that you got together. and actually the, the, the reason that the anti semitism campaign became the kind of central campaign was, but it was much better than the other ones. the less poor, very bad at defending themselves. colbin himself was by the defending. and so, um, so that he was a traitor out. he was a traitor. uh give me, but that was okay. more important than colbin. what about you? because you are covering these stories about the so called the states. i'm a cool at the state of a genocidal country like breaking what. how, how say for you, we know reports of kick plan bug, the great journalist for the great zone being stopped at heathrow airport. sarah wilkinson, the pro palestinian peace activist and journalist, i understand, has been visited by police, richard, midwest. i mean,

i do feel safe that they might. the 5 will knock on your door and special branch one, knock on your door any time soon as you show the flights of british war plains aiding the genocide in gaza. what are the, any one sites that speaking out in the u. k. now, cuz it's not just the, the journalist you mentioned just recently. um a so when stanley, he's a very good reporter for electronic and funny. yeah. this house rated by the place . i don't and they sees the oldest devices, but what was quite scary about what happened to him was he wasn't even charged or arrested. so apparently in the u. k. under there was a noise they can come in the place and take away your devices without even charging you with the crime which is for outrages. and then you had sarah wilkinson, as you mentioned, and richard met us. um, they basically uh, clumping download democracy because they've lost control of the narrative as event . as you mentioned, the side of the power social media independent media has as growing massively. and

it helps to move the conversation away from the state narrative. now in the context, but when you lose control of the narrative for your traditional media assets and you lose control of the population, i, a majority, one honest and ball going to cease. while the only thing you have left is to be something the population with the law, i don't think we're going to see increasing amounts of oppression and it has to be picked up must be on the case dogma. so those that the done this i mentioned they will arrested or detain, they'll rated on the case by my so i think we're going to see the escalade in terms of me personally. i think the i'm no different to the rest of the independent media space. wherever you expect to all know that there is, there are risks that come to a new that are impressive in to. and the other thing is we know that the public sphere in the u. k. is undefended, so it will the dryness. i mentioned sir wilkinson richard, my test, i still been standing not to be struck there recently. overrated. arrested,

charged. and no single word has ever paid about in the mainstream media. so it's just the a part of the a, the news the, it's just completely a raised from mass media. i mean, it took me to google scholar. i think for me that was more scary than the rights themselves. yeah, that's, that's silence to give us thomas, i'm sympathy. i mean, i was on bbc question time with them a while back. i don't have much sympathy. we can look up how it is kind of prosecution service tried to pin fake rape claims on julian assange. you write about this 10000 perhaps us soldiers in britain. i mean the hostages here, the british government is britain like south korea are actually which is being in the news this week. a, a under military. okay. patient i, i know that talking about drones. anything are you have like in the heat that are available from the drones, which uh so uh we saw a little joining the circle door and tara, is it, do you feel like that? yeah, we are. and again, it is completely silenced by the mainstream media, but i did

a lot of work about the u. k. military presence in the u. k. n is over 12000 us troops permanently stationed in the u. k, across the 11. so who are the sites that code are? yes, but at least to the americans and operate effect to be is us spaces and they fly. also submissions often a legal ones. um, what, what kinds of carried out they were involved in, in operations in libya, iraq, other places we're not allowed to know anything that happens on the that's the outraged wall policy of the patient itself with us to the outrages you can get some information about all the upsides well you can give it to use. if you ask through transparency mechanisms about the us print military presence. you just told we don't comment on allies movements or activities in our country, which is a huge black hole in america, in burgess democracy. and that, and then the other side of that is, and also is another massive black hole is, is the us intelligence role? because we know that there's a massive c,

i a side risk routes in which was the base where outside of which, how are we done? was killed by a c i a office of unsecure. let's see, we've been spirited out the country. um we know the uh g c h give you just use the because largest instead of just i can see it has a huge station in coma. who would you choose to be? it's not as leak showed the hot 50 percent of the funding for jesus to jesus. he viewed comes from the national security agency in the united states. so that basically running the station. and that's how it works. us just we all as a vast some state and we do what we told we are, i'm, we're, i'm where we know a lot. and now government does not allow us to know anything about that us activity activity. notice the transparency should be much higher for foreign military reason for an intelligent agencies in our country. we should know more about would you be able to know more about them than all right, but basically opposite not cannot. thank you. that's it for the show match book. the rack is

a row group. all of us are the american and buyers out now continued condolences to those surviving the u. k. u s. u, i'm genocide here in this region will be back on monday for more on the scale of that genocide which could be as high as 25 percent of guys are killed until then keep in touch, why will i social media if it's not sense of new country and then to our channel going undergoing tv and revel dot com to let you know the episodes of going undergrad. see you monday the

the, the russian states never is as tight as i'm one of the most sense community best most. i'll send some of the same assistance, must be the one else calls question about this, even though we will then in the european union, the kremlin media mission, the state on the russia to day and split the ortiz vote net, keeping our video agency roughly all the band on youtube tv