the next question is maybe my bring and brightest story and of course to everyone. so the right thing tonight, merry, merry christmas from bethlehem in palestine while a person in question is explored next as christians and other minorities, fear persecution this christmas day in syria. come the country survived the turmoil its enduring or is the ancient language has withstood many, many a tax over centuries set to be carved the cost of the effects, the, the, the,

[000:00:00;00] the, [000:00:00;00] the hello and welcome to cross talk. we're all things are considered. i'm peter, live out. a solid is gone. now what, what about syria? is it gone to? it would seem so outside powers are carving up the country. what was in

international proxy war against the mass, because it's turning into an international civil war. is there a place for the syrian people, the cross talking syria and joined by my guess, we risk in be real key as a security and political affairs analyst, also in lebanon. we have each of the stuff. again, he is an associate professor and canada research chair in the history of the modern middle east, at the university of british columbia. and in manchester we crossed to peter ford. he is a former british ambassador to bahrain and syria. are a gentleman, cross up rules and effects, that means you can jump any time you want and i would appreciate it every single time i i'm best or forward if i go to you 1st and in manchester and the title of this program does syria have a future, and if it does, what is it?

go ahead and i'm afraid that suit looks very great. very blake. indeed. now of course 3, the media are in the west hoping and emphasizing the positive and the word which keeps copying is tribute ation cumulation. because there are some people in the street so obviously overjoyed at the removal of the shaw. but that's only hosted the picture if you, if they took the cameras to the board that we live in on. and then to hear it. some of the 1000 streaming out every day in, in fear for their lives. tribulation would not be the would coming to the mix. so basically, half of syria appears to be looking forward to the kind of future that they want and incentives future. and the other half or more,

i'm dreading it. well, ali, you know, this is the famous phrase that goes back to con, to lisa rice, you know, creating the new middle east. well, i suppose there is a new middle east now, but is it, is anyone security been enhanced with this dramatic change in syria? ali and they wrote, and i think that the main beneficiary or whatever to remind the fisheries as we whole know, regarding the events in serious in the immediate future. and they need to, you're having this right of them to, to the age for their own reasons. i think that the is randy is of played on major major pods in how the situation was on the fall that it was before right before the events in syria. and when benjamin video spoke about the human disease. now what it is that for the time being his interest or these really interest, converge to with the top cushion versus i'm not sure how long that's going to take

. or i think we were really starting to see some rivalry emerging between the turkish and these radios. on those i think that nobody security has been enhanced. i don't think so. okay, security more the way it has been in the past actually. yes. you're still designated as a group turkey, if you remember before, it was subject to terrorist attacks my system while your other groups and there's a rear wheel chance of devices can take advantage of what a 2nd place. this is a very, very good environment for why it's just a rock describing for these ladies. i think that the expenditure displays all day that has to be admitted. it has been so they've expanded into serial depart additional territories. so their ambitions dot com, yahoo, i have nothing here. who is our admissions has been serviced. and it's interesting to note that sort of thing is your, how these do not have a history of targeting, as well as even the former head of the most uh, a site that they sent back in 2016. so i see that these rates have benefits and as

your previous guest mention, i think there's a cost. there's an operation by washington. the ministration has spoken about how they contributed to what has taken place for the in the. and i don't think that this service american interest for their to be how you studies, you know, how the less concrete hemorrhage i can see area was a day to be even a week site to be in syria. because as i said, that serves eliasis and particularly for president, i like to find him. that would be a disaster because a person to electronic, sorry, that will be a disaster for him. because find that he's watch. we saw i, it was the, the great that and he took responsibility for the assistant ational about that easy recall. yeah. but be careful what you wish for. it's always the case here. she helped me if i can go to you also in lebanon here. what is the future of this region? is it neal ottoman is um, is it zionist? is that american head gemini?

i mean, they all can co mingled together for long go ahead as well. i think at this point, it's difficult to see how things are going to go about. we do have some indications in relation to what happened in syria that as i've been mentioned, although i kind of disagree about the uh, whether this benefits or doesn't benefit the united states. but we do have 2 big winners on did use political stage, which is 30 and is reading. i think we have to look at more than one dimension. so why does that? i mentioned it has to do with the one that we struggle with the military. the distance under justice that goes to israel and the head, germany, and the presence of us forces in the region, including in northeastern c o. yeah, the future of u. s. military bases in the region. so that's one dimension. the 2nd one has to do with the economic bi mention uh no matter what we think about whether these groups the celsius, thomas groups are in line or not in line with western ideology. if they adopt any

liberal economic model, they opened up sir, yeah, for investments for an investment, is they actually reassess it date. but sure, i was only able to bring policies that brought the key it, economic directors power into the region. then we may be seeing a kind of like a sort of speak uh, goal sized ation of syria, a re alignment syria along these lines. so that could be one of the future is that we're looking at. and uh, definitely is a worry. so because the level of destruction, of the syrian economy of, of syrian infrastructure is if this is going to be a new only guarantee that's just as an astonished favor, which is a governor of association of by chance own on the guard key. then that's also a cause of concern. and lastly, maybe i'm going back to the 1st point. i do think this is a legal situation for the access of resistance. there's no question about, oh okay, that i want, i don't get to that in the 2nd part of the program. that's one of my questions here . a master ford. what about that?

i mean, if there's, if there's going to be any kind of a economic rebuilding and you need security a, but i don't, i don't see the elements of security in, in the, in the, in the present, the even going into the future. i, i don't see how this is going to pan out. there are too many competing interest as um, but the, to the key questions here. uh the, the sanctions. uh, really. and the oil. now there is, uh, i mean decent rush uh towards the sanctions relief on the part of most of the western powers. and many of the public relations exit of the jihad. you regime of directed towards this because it was basically sanctions the data for the shop. and it may well do for the new regime if they're not listed. and therefore,

a people's hopes dash and united states seems in 2 minds on the sanctions relief. on the one hand, they are inclined to indulge and consolidate the new tests who are in power and damascus. but on the other, they seem to be hearing is riley voices saying, hey, don't be so quick. uh you don't all these people any favors. they're not even useful to you anymore. they've done the job. they've got rid of the russians. they got rid of, you ran, they got rid of the best shot. you don't need to be make nice with these people. so i sense that the united states, as usual, will listen to the is raven is on this, and we'll uh, drag it seals on sanctions really. on the oil. i think the u. s. is in

a bind and they will end up so written during it to the jihad is that those us troops had one main function to start getting his hands on the oil. in theory, the troops were there to find boxes that was a fiction. i know it was to stop exit, getting the oil and to use the proceeds from the sale of the oil to fund the cottage autonomous administration. well, the you, it doesn't need the cards anymore. well, they couldn't let the cards go. yeah, i think that's what we'll have to. yeah, i'll we, i mean, there, that's the, the, that's the western powers having any, have any interest in a recovering syria. i mean, just leave it as a wasteland. doesn't that serve a purpose for what the west or israel, even for turkey. so i think that the west policy to what syria is very much to a large degree, dictated by israel. i think that southwest sees the situation in syria. but

regarding the issue of sanctions, as an important point, i think we have to remember we're talking about a group of which grew from a car. the in the extra yes, usually was formerly i'm a stop start was the, it's going to get the official affiliated on the card that you're talking about a car that which was behind the cruise of september 11th. so i don't think it's going to be that easy where there use, well, once it or not, whether it wants to sanctions to remain or not. it's not going to be very easy for any american ministration. i think to remove the sentence that would put it in a very difficult, difficult situation. you're talking about the worst, have a foreign terrorist attack on the it was farmed land that in of itself. i think he's a, he's a big motorcycle. uh now i think that um, when it comes to which lights on the interest on the paid on his rounds interest, which device will interest the diane, are you getting that happening?

i know some of these are the type of up syria now regarding the new liberal help book, which is a colleague in may. we mentioned, i think that you'll learn a lot from other shut off. he's trying he possibly use and see regarding looping, and not serious, adopting a more moderate steps that might be true. but there are a lot of all the hard line elements with the united states would disagree. and i think that's going to be a major issue for many of these people could be valuable and could the 2nd to why is this, for example, the year which sections which might expect to continue to remain in place given the hub cart building. that's also going to be another obstacle. so there are various, various issues at clyde i think, which would pose, i really, really big on the challenge and difficulty for. yeah, you know, it's, it's very answering, we're all talking about the interest of us, the countries, but not the really the interest of the syrian people. i think that's the point of the program gentlemen, i'm going to jump in here. we're going to go to a short break, and after that short break,

we'll continue our discussion on syria and state with our to the look forward to talking to you all that technology should work for people. a robot must obey the orders given by human beings accept. we're such orders at conflict with the 1st law show alignment of the patient. we should be very careful about our personal intelligence. the point obviously is to makes a truck rather than to the various jobs. i mean with artificial intelligence, we have somebody with him in the

robot most protects his phone existence was alexis, the in 1943 at the height of world war 2, bengal was hit by famine. a year before japanese troops drove the red is out of neighboring bermount and came close to the indian possessions of the british empire . london's response to the threat was completely inadequate. the british actively used the scorched earth policy. while retreating, they turned everything around them into an uncouth deserts, having no mercy on other people's territory. food in large amounts was exported to great britain from the starving provinces. boats used for fishing and transporting food along the river system more confiscated from the local population. the barbaric actions of the colonial administration. latham monstrous consequences can

a year upset. 3800000 people die from starvation and disease caused by mail nutrition. though great britain itself had enough resources to overcome that disaster. at the same time, 170000 tons of australian wheat made its way fast. starving india did the british isles. i hate indians. they are a beasley people with a beastly religion. the famine was their own fault or breeding like rabbits. british prime minister, winston churchill commented on the reports of the tragedy. the famine of 1943 became the climax in the british policy of genocide against the indian population. according to historians, from 12 to 29000000 people overall died from starvation alone during the reign of the british in india. the welcome ex across stock were all things are considered on peter lavelle remind you

were discussing syria, the . okay, let's go back to one of our guessing 11. i'm here show. you mentioned the, the, the, the at the resistance. what is the state of the resistance? okay, we have to remind everyone, i am, us may not be destroyed, but gaza. certainly is in the genocide continues, as we're talking about syria, depending on who you want to believe. has blogs on the back foot, not defeated, but certainly been uh, injured, syria, miraculously it's just collapsed. um, so what, where does the resistance stand or do we should, should we be talking about the resistance anymore? go ahead as well. we certainly shut down the resistance and still present the resistance in some respect system very strong and actually is we, we start with guys, i move around. we can see, as you mentioned, that we are actually witnessing continued resistance and uh, you know,

happening every day we have actually casualties on these very side. that being said, of course, the situation in garza is disastrous and is we've continues to occupy a territory that continues to conduct large, large scale destructive rates on gaza and displace and kim palestinians on the lebanese front. the seas far that we have seen has stopped the fall. i think so that's one set back to if we think about the idea of the unity of the uh, friends at the same time is really as, as failed to actually, you know, take hold of lebanese territory in the south. but there's a lot of them be due at the about the conditions of the ceasefire. there's constant violations happening, the m and these are still conducting a long range of operations, but they're not perhaps as frequent. as you mentioned, the celia, as you know, the soon army has been blue. part of it has been obliterated. the non state actors, i've shown extreme resilience, i should say, these are they who do use the from us or has been look at the same time. they are

facing a serious challenge because in the case of loving on the supply lines have been caught by the new rulers of damascus. syria was a g o strategic depth offered you strategic depths through the resistance. one is now kind of also somehow giving a lot of different magic signals. it's not conducting any attacks as it used to. so i believe that of course, so long as there is occupation and now with is really expansion. and the end up in syria, we are going to see a continued resistance. but the access itself as a viable long term uh coalition is in my opinion of jack to really speak a under enormous train. and its future is on certain. and that actually task very serious question over the are the question of honors or students visa, the other forms of struggling to liberate thought is time investment,

afford out there. let's continue with it around here that you know, the appetite comes with the eating. and we obviously know that the, the net at yahoo government has been, uh, well for the, for as long as he's been in power, been pressuring the united states. do have to go on a military adventure against the ran. what are the possibilities of that now, particularly the interim before the, the next administration? well, it ran has suffered a major nature blow by the last service itself on the valley, syria. now these riley's bugs being that they have a car to according to, to terra. and it's true that all those early warning stations are obliterated. it will be much easier now for this way the aircraft to reach uranium,

the space which you the scary. so it will incline the israelis towards the venture arisen and with the prospect to the friend donald trump coming to town very soon it's probably whys sticking radians to tone things down a bit. and because it showed that that's the face. and one of the things you ran really needs to do is concentrate on the shoring all the ally, the remaining allied 11 on uh, which will need even more support. how is it that support to go to the m logistically? is a major major problem. um, but it may be that for the longer term it's paula needs to re conceptualize itself no longer present itself so much as

a member of the resistance and concentrate on its its own position in level and on the position of its constituency, mainly the she or community and level because when, when we look back at the wisdom of joining come us after october 2023. i think we have to do all so quick. this is the say that it was, it was not wides. so that's easy to say with hindsight. well, you know, it's, go back to ali with the, you know, i, i started out with you around, but i mean, a country that is very, very weak, obviously is web and on. i mean, i, i could for c, considering the instability in the region, that there would be an attempt verbage, even change in be root. that's what i'm not sure you can apply that some resume change to buy your uh, you know, living on zillow,

lebanese government comes in and out the presidency. there's a really eventually the good point. good. good point. good point. good point. good point. but um, when it comes there have been fees raised about to his radius resuming their war on $11.00 on the hosp to the exploration of these 60 day period. which is that period where the steps shouldn't be taken to start the implement been enforced, they cease fire. the argument is based on the assumption that the, the full size strength is israel hand weakens principal law. so therefore here's where can seize the opportunity and the only not counselor to has the law. personally, i don't think that is unlikely scenario or i think that the americans in particular have invested a lot in this case file. and i think that the incoming trump administration does the, does not want the situation to deteriorate and level on. in fact, i think one of the factors, one of the factors we stripped to the ceasefire, was the ultimatum which from gave before. i remember when he visited the restaurant

in michigan, and he focused on the necessity of bringing it and it happened to the lower level. in addition to the fact that it has been a lot was able to with the soul. these are increasing and the closing continues to launch me. so i was on these rarely on the front and when it was down in the room, i used to be down and out quickly about the about what i method a for mentioned regarding because the last priorities are things that has the law. i could look at the estate principle, the speech is being given by it used to create general secondary causing. it is focusing on the domestic situation, ensuring all the situation domestically without disregarding the resistance. so has the law is in this process of reassessment, the re evaluating, sorting out to get the priorities in the shikes i have costing more than way he was the one who used to be assigned with the task of the lebanese domestic situation. so when you use a mobile place on how those to, you know,

deal with the situation and, and focus on the domestic and off has the last strategy it is um, and we the, the former leader of, of hezbollah, las rolla. he famously said without syria, there is no palestine. can you reflect upon that statement? but let me 1st say that it is, would be a mistake to think of as well as intervention is unwise in any way, shape or form. but a, precisely because we have to remember that the looks of flooding desperation and what happened after was a turning point in the liberation of palestine because of this idea of a unity of friends. this actually emphasizes that trust secretary in nature, it would be very dangerous of actually hezbollah simply was throw into it's quote, unquote, she environment. and kind of became to embedded in the lebanese domestic font. because that's generally a recipe for uh, you know, uh,

increased reaction or the politics and inside level, not a lot of, as well as baltics inside. lebanon is not different from others. what actually stood out as what has been that historically, is it's actually resistance. it's opposition to, is it a lease that the colonialism? so it's very important to maintain that why and of course, taking into account how to survive in a hostile environment, how to prevent further utilization of any determines as well. so i think we have to balance these 2 things are not simply shift to a domestic agenda. and of course, reconstruction in south lebanon is itself a form of resistance. these tried sending of people's ability to go back to their homes, is a form of resistance. but it has to be framed in that way as opposed to actually getting more about what's happening within 11 on now your question about syria, historically, syria, what's the, what the, what the, you know, uh martha, my son, i said is absolutely true. celia is of the heart of uh, you know,

the struggle for palestine from the very outset. it's actually a center for out of national. i don't, let's you, that was very much about the liberation of palestine. is that of land. it was involved in all doors with these mean and it has been unfortunately, perhaps the only government that was willing to support under justice. we shouldn't forget, at the same time that the cause the father standing cause is not just the cause of has about, are serious. it's also the cause of georgia and it's the cause of egypt that the cause of the world around. so what i think is important at this juncture is to start pushing for a. 5 you know, a why the network of supporters of, of, under existence beyond celia is one to actually start to think about why isn't jordan or the, you know, people in jordan, they need to also, uh, activate, uh they have uh you know, a grassroots movement there for the can parties,

the more the syrian front is neutralized. the more that we have to think about sustaining other friends and not actually shutting them all down so that the only remaining front is garza, which is you know, a serious problem in the future. okay, and best center for we just have a few seconds left here. what's the stop israel from continuing its expansion? go ahead as well. the lesson of the last 2 years is that only one thing can stop israel, and that's the military opposition. that means because it's brushed aside uh everything else. um, a us pressure virtually nonexistent action in, in, in the un legal action. a media offers it shouldn't change. is in public opinion across the well,

israel is now a lawless state. exact thing, without restraints and it feels that it can get away with anything. and that's being proven repeatedly over the on that no general. i'm not know, gentlemen, we've run out of time. i want to thank my guest in manchester and in lebanon. and i want to thank our viewers for watching us here at r t. see you next time and remember prospect. the take a fresh look around his life. kaleidoscopic isn't just a shifted reality. distortion by power to division with no real opinions. fixtures designed to simplify will confuse who really wants a better wills,

and is it just as a chosen few fractured images presented as 1st? can you see through their illusion going underground? can the a plane crash in western catholics them and sees thousands killed but almost half it was a board the rails or by john airlines flight survive. true children believe to be among them. the 4 people are killed in the shelling of a puerto tone in rushes. chris bridge and local officials say you put in for us to police force to target civilians. process the separatist criminals will either lay