of the i'm actually in redundancy and welcome back to going underground rule cussing all around the world from the u. a. in the heart of the middle east on the day 38 years ago. the well did confirmation of these rails may be 200 nuclear weapons. good to see the usa apartheid south africa. and one of hollywood stop film produces israel has to this day no, come clean. the new k, a whistle blower motor kind of a new new would be honey draft and kid that from london by room for his revelations before decades on torture in his riley prison. the world today tends to the prospect of the use of those nuclear weapons by

u. s. u k e u back to israel. this after a run, finally retaliated for the gaza genocide. the test run this as a nation of palestine chief negotiator attacks on their radiant diplomats and the killing of thousands and babies to a res iconic lebanese resistance need to pass on this route. i would circle genocide, joe, all the cause tyra's now presiding over millions, display skilled a wounded, mostly women and children right across this region. i'm joined now from rome by alice to cook. you k, diplomat in full day you foreign policy chief advisor. he's a founder and director of the baby base complex for him and all of the resistance, the essence of the as the mist revolution. thank you so much alice of joining us again. it's been a while. lots happened in the year. have you on going on the route, i think in the beginning of this year, you can see from the headlines there's only one of course story. and that's a do by based a gulf. the news you run a tax that israel vfc the japanese paper thing. israel steps up

a tax on the wrong proxies as if they're all just their own proxies everywhere. i guess 1st your take on whether there is now there's no real us defendants. they said, the largest fleet, the united states has in this area and then at least in the mediterranean, didn't seem to scare you wrong. no, i think that was deaf. would have been a mistake. i don't think there's been a lot of talk about it wrong being frightened or scared or dis todd. it boss invests. in fact, it was a calculated decision, maybe or in the wrong, by the leadership of this. it would not want to cause a regional white wall, big war and other words in the region. but for all sorts of reasons. i mean not because they were particularly fright box it. they've been preparing for it for

about 20 years. but simply because a lot of this happening and a very much aware of being very trustee in touch with most of as you know, um the payment issue is ready coming to ahead of the moment. yes. and the most moment of crisis for the united states facing a major, major defeat of the us, the and the secondly, because the brick summit is coming up on the 25th of this month. and i think that both the most go and care on, and of course, basing would like this to parcel well and at the a substantial meeting with many new initiatives and honest. yeah, i mean i, i do want to get back to this region, but india is foreign minister jason cars width binds and i'm not sure whether anyone is with the bible is able to, in the white house. and it goes to india has

a huge and international, lots of transport, cory door operation going, which iran is an important, essential part to the united states to understand what's happening in the brakes. and what will be discussed in cars on the tool or the bad. just signaling look at all american interests in the region should activate against the threats of a run. just when india is doing a massive deal with a run, as is russia. and as is china i, i don't think that the moment there is much understanding of the middle east, but i think most of them, at least textbooks that were in state department and other places have been removed . they have been removed and we have a being run essentially by people who do not have much expertise in it. or if they have expertise like pay most cost time,

it is really from the is really perspective process from, from the united states perspective. that's the us ongoing, it was an idea for us. this is basically as rails man in the abiding cabinet. yes, he has, or he has an office in the white house. a he moved from state to buckland, where he did the demarcation negotiations with lebanon, about maritime areas of exploration. and then he went into the white house with one secretary, and the team in the state department was dissolved as i understand it. so he's sort of all breaks is a one man band i took the white house. yeah. well, i want to explore whether it is incompetence or it is actually by design. i'll give it a but just briefly of when it comes to the incompetent side of things, a rookie mistake by president possessed can be wrong to come out with the bizarre statement that somehow he'd had ej assurances that restraint would be rewarded.

restraint from iran would be rewarded in the light of the smile on the mud or in the tear on which we between. and the reward of course was enough for all i was as estimation. i mean, basically basically i suppose you will put it in those terms, but as it has been, the was sort of there is politics involved in less than 10 wrong. and i think that when, as ash county who doesn't have that sort of experience was made for president, he was pretty well captured to can we say buys a basically buys as i read some cut to me sort of a crew and in iraq. and so he did and to his embarrassment, he did believe assurance is that he was given

a by you your appear on an american. both are, sees the would be substantially relief of sanctions. for iran, the would be a guaranteed c star and garza on times that would be acceptable to hum us. and as he said, it isn't the view of 2 words. they lied, none of it was true. um, so this being a lot of anger in iran and a lot of soul searching soul searching because iran has being very careful and it's reactions. it is shown grades, health strange, really dating back to the killing of cut some sort of money. but also off to the attack on the syrian on the consulate in syria and damascus, where it raining and generally was killed. but uh, at that point they did mitigate very much to what drones

and miss house thought. but it was costly orchestra to alaska and who was a foreign minister at that time off to it's spoken. he said that you know what we call to get this right. i mean, in the sense that we are trying to be restraining and also allows us conflict to escalates into a wider war. but we've called to maintain that sort of sense of deterrence and we've got to maintain a sense of strength. so there is of been a lot of criticism. this is the restraint, much of the case it if you like, by that or a full mist wing been did wrong, has contributed to some extent of play, but contributed perhaps to israel, of feeling and part to be able to take up the whole lives that has put

a leadership, including statehouse on the throttle, and then to attack the level of across the board. i mean, uh from all sides of level of them. i mean, is riley suffering the soldier because a treat whereby they are dividing up their routes into sort of sectors and telling people to evacuate one sector, move to another sector. and then when they called the, as i told to move back, because that sector is about to be attack. so there are more than the 1000000 displaced from the homes and the something a large number, i think 1500 killed them about 8000 injured. these are not as bullet people the so basically ordinary level needs. that being said to be connected with, says paula. and of course we have the same. the same justifications. oh yes. um. has buller is hiding behind the people? he's using them as human shields in every house. there is they've produced this

fantastic idea of a sort of missile at b and b, whereby lebanese was sort of keeping me solace in the homes. i'm getting a small fee from his bullet for doing so. this is all nonsense complete nonsense because i was in lebanon in 2006, and before and often during the war, and even before the war has put a to great effort to make sure the one know up and saw o quit, indeed military assets that were anywhere near the level of these villages or cost, so they kept them quite away from it. so the idea that they know having this house in the attic and things is just a typical propaganda. but it has no no basis. but it's being used for the tax and the a tax r, as in garza intended to put pressure on the civilian lebanese population. imagining

that back end to turn on on his book, in fact, fall more than in 2006, a lebanese with just the usual exceptions that's come out to them supporting that. i'm with the, for our minister and the president. think, you know, we stand as while this is an attack on the 11th the system to attack on, on as bo, we are being attacked right up through the back car and across the 11 and, and, and very rude. so it's very different. but yes, there is a very awful lot of criticism of pay iran and the wrong is having to look for a half a. you know, there is a real got it. i mean, you know, i don't want to make it sound so simplistic like you know, but it is, this is jessica contributed to it. i mean, those are ro dilemma. you can use self restraint if you like, in order to try and avoid going to

a broder will. that is in the interest. so they run the interest of a rush, or i see interest the order of the region not to have a full of ultra note will. but at the same time, the other side cause that dilemma is that actually by too much. so for a strength, you end up ways. um if you like escalation and you end up with a wall anyway. and sometimes you find the bike cell for a screen that actually will comes to you even whether you wanted to know. so the question was, and this is why i think we had this officer and it was the honest, as it came from the supreme national security council, just to remind us that possession, who has had a lot of publicity, who has no say in these decisions. this is not his field for him policy security policy lies in calling with the supreme the national security council under the

supremely, that the supreme leader makes the last decision most the press since he is basically concerned with domestic administration of the state, but not with foreign policy and off with security as the good cause, stop you about more from the former advisor on me least issues. the foreign policy chief ivy is longer up those right the, the insulating people are disgusted with what's going on with that. sending huge amounts of money to the lensky in terms of weapons to kill russians when actually, we're taking money away from people that hadn't been one of the big things in the

tell you that i never about domestically is that the color labor government have taken one and a half 1000000000 pounds away from the the plug it back to going undergoing. i'm still here with us. decrypt for the british diplomat and founder and going director of the baby based complex for him. house during part one, you were talking to me about the desk and not having a foreign policy control in there on, i mean now give me, i mean i lived in terra and he does have power to resign at any rate, but as regards and i should also add disregard, spare, where we moved to gauge to the side of the national security is true the true. so maybe he was power to it's, i don't know, but there's a lot of, i mean it's a very lead cruelty issue, but i just wanted to on the line. i mean, iran is not alone in the style. lemme which i well did rush, i give them bad advice, reflected rush, cuz you have them bad advice,

me sure. stood by me just to make sure the day before as well. you know, russia has had had the same dilemma and during the war and the great and there will be times where they've had set backs, reverse thoughts, and they've had to stop them. thing can reassess and, and actually the been changes in the, in the senior military leadership in moscow. so, i mean, these things are not confined to iran, is the general opprobrium about this dilemma that, you know, if you act with restrain, it'll get written wrongly interpreted this weakness and actually bring the war you don't want onto. that is the danger. and so possess cams is being much criticized for those comments that he made. and 4, in the sense, almost go behind the backups of the system to talk about them in with the americans and with the europeans. because he does not have a mandate to do that. he does not have that monday that lives with the security

council a lot with him. and it was the supreme leader who had ordered, if you liked the attack in retribution for the killing of i'm there. and it came from the tall full from the head of the security council. so i'm, there is a lot of sort of concern. i'm sure it will pause, but i think that's one of the reasons we have what we had uh the um, the recent miss all attacked in, in, in iran, as iran, in israel, as iran wanted to recuperate. the sort of sense of the parents in the sense that they are serious and that also to show that they have that capability and so miss all because of cost their restraint on the 13th of april when they followed miss house full wasn't misinterpreted completely as well. we'll just,

you know, they will no doubt 99 percent were knocked out by a us above the defense systems. and so now they've had to demonstrate that actually is wells at defense systems on not very effective. i'm not quite capable of landing um, ballistic missiles as to saw on target in israel in a very short notice. yeah. blankets, idea of censorship at the moment of the impacts and the results of it. just some ripple is the tile of maze. we have 15 is we didn't have it in the f 35 and it had to him a base in israel, f 35 that 15 and not a single is riley casualty it'd be is to be bought uh as regards the ssl for strain criticism, it could be made that like that about certainly would've, i'm advantage over the libya debacle over put in allowing things to get to the stage. are they willing to hand stuff to them made on to and, and so forth. but is there

a similar mistake being made by people who think that netanyahu is running the show here? i mean, we know by didn't said to me not can megan in 1982. he wouldn't care. the whole of 11 and civilians were killed. a was wisdom and i can beg in the, in the atrocities in 1982 blinking off to october 7th. and he came to as well as a jew who was brought up, of course, by a lawyer and comfy don't to the most ads robot maxwell is still a little money in britain from the pension fund of samuel piece us a piece are and i think is his name during confident and maxwell. is this a plan? was this a, a genocide jo plans in the beginning? because then, so then jake sullivan, of the national security council, the in the united states doesn't look so stupid load is blinking then your playing mazda strokes here, bringing the u. s, which always wanted to get involved. because clearly the us were involved in terms of the reaction to iran's retaliation using the destroys in the,

in the red sea. and they're prepared for it. they going forward. this was the plan all alone. it wasn't. i mean, i'm not, you only can say that about ukraine work. the heavy, the dictators are lensky is losing, but this is the plan to exterminate costs. i think it's higher. so i think for is for, for a long time, i mean the plan about garza and the pon about the west bank and of course, destroying this bullet has been loaded aboard for a long time. it is deeply entrenched in the israeli policy, and of course, netanyahu came to congress and related to ross very clearly. he said he invited america to war games good wrong. so you, if you like the head of the octopus. uh that is strangling in israel and he said this is a war of civilization against bumper some so everyone knew that this was sort of in,

in, in the works. now i think there are 2 elements to this that, you know, don't blanket so directly because of the 1st strategy is that i think the, the, i don't think a particularly the most, the other parts of the system. but certainly not, you know, as a, the congress is old both in, unless of course, the other parts the new cause of certainly all the pentagon is getting increasingly worried about over extension that america's getting over extended road. if you like, china is ramping up the pressure some in the pacific. they've got it more of a carrier in the field. but the pentagon wants to put more resources that. and it's still preoccupied with ukraine. and to have a wall pin with a ron. and in the middle east, with all it's american bases with all ex,

um, uh, a few like exposure as far as her abilities. so i think it was not so popular. and i think that's probably what made the pentagon. i actually vito's the idea from bread and from others, from a blinking to a permit, the premiums to fall. so miss solves deep into deep into rush. although that could be changed. that could change the, the moment of goes by the time does the road i could have back to that can happen, particularly in an election period. well, you know, a good. i feel like political till he points are essential and appearing tough on budget is considered to be the sort of i'm talking point to, to make supplement for, for by him and his team. but i'm just saying, i'm not sure. and i'm not sure at this moment if it's a good idea to have

a wall with the wrong and kind of visit the like to prospect of the policy and bar in the united states. i mean, that's a very complicated domestic calculation, which depends on the so do you like the little composition of these 5 suite and states and, you know, in some there are quite substantial numbers of muslims. they belong to them already . surely by now with the pictures we've seen from guys and 11 and the m and a nice area and there are things i think so. but i mean these 5 states, so very crucial. i mean the election. so one or austin, this and the trying to recuperate, but i mean, actually they're getting the, taking that whole deeper and deeper with the statements that are being made and going to be uh how some last fall a is an iconic filter. there's been an iconic go,

someone who has, you know, spend the low standing for national liberation and 2 colors ellis. i mean to been, you know, signs manifestations in cash. yeah. artist of india and across the middle east. venezuela in bertina. verified that is last, you know, i do want to get that chico, is it time in the time limited to us? i just want to say, why is it iran react using these traditional warfare means? i mean, it's a long time since carlos, the jackal was operating against the, the owners of israel as it were, the back as of israel. where's the asymmetric warfare going? i only ask because if it is true that it was be just by design and that in fact, trump who is being fed the, the ron was behind his assassination attempt. and if the bible in any cases sponsor the genocide and cause if that was if they had the powers behind it,

rather than all this obsession in the progressive media are arguably against that. and yahoo! he is in the impetus now to attack the, the senses of power, the, the metropolitan powers which are the senses of power, operating in west asia rather than using tel aviv as well. i think them the pressing festival. what you're saying is partially true, but the net, you know, who it has carried a lot of blame for what's happening and everything runs as well as he was lost power or something. everything would be right. i don't think that this is necessarily the correct perspective because actually he has the support of a cabinet. he has enough support with in the can i sit to survive until 26 and he's made it always made it clear. i think he gave a

a and then to be in the seventy's to hastings writing a book. and he said in the next full bullying, well we will of take a girlfriend of expelled old will. i was getting in some arabs and i think between the river and the sea. so i mean, he's been part of this for a long, long time. his father was a private sex rate to get the tense k, so he's a jump button. ski revision is like most of the cabinet. and there is a majority of the, it's really is it was obvious when this government came into the and we saw the mizrahi, the jews that come from north africa in the middle east. what taking key positions . these were the people at the beginning, a broad festival, into a one. and then then tuesday, they cooled. and this is great. they feel, i mean, you know, that program said it will. it was obvious some time ago. what was the program to

establish and the israel on? yeah, i mean is the program or a life palestinian state is the program of entity blinking, blinking. so it's broken up by the kinds of people we haven't got that much time left. they all know assignments. we agree that by assign is, i don't think there's no difference on that. and i'm saying that actually, i mean what that is, the question is big data collectively lead it into this, or did they just facilitate fits as it has a lot of the met him. yeah. who and the cabinet. i mean to be no restraints put on is the tool. so is it a question of passive permission given the past is because they're actively all they've signed another 9 busy and the other day 2 days before the h to the yeah, there's nothing passive about it. and straight down very quick,

very quickly. and finally, very quickly. finally, i should, i actually went through this with you about brittany's role with the doctor theory based on the british prime minister thing. he's all up left for it. and then, then denials that the you in daily britain know a target for any resistance attack, should it become a symmetric and do strategic and outside of west asia. julian hassan who gave us so much information with that. i suppose. i recall most importantly, babs at the moment, the memo from uh, jake sullivan to hillary clinton saying isis was on the us aside in syria as long as smoke for the 1st time about his torture and the counsel of your meeting this week. how far do you think his life is in danger away from all of these other big geostrategic topics? i mean, we did a lot of interviews with julian massage before his cafeteria to and torture by the british, of course. but i called tell, i mean i can give you a little story to view,

but i don't think it is in danger now. i think he's done it. his deal way out to say he even knows that he was a journalist and did some things, but i think that's probably as much as one can tell the end of it. but i mean, who knows, i mean, those are the sort of the black areas of policy that you're not allowed to see. they all kept very much in the dark. i don't know, but i think i'm hopeful. anyways, he is. he's okay now how's the drug? thank you, and that's of, of the show. i'll continue to condolences to those surviving u. k. u. s. u on violence here in the middle east will be back for more on washington's wall with the brand new episode on monday joined by the c i. as former kinds of territory, dr. michael sure. until end, keeping jace bible as social media results sent to the whole country and to our channel going on. we want to keep you hon. they'll come to lunch and you know that besides of going underground semen, the,

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