adversaries has, once again brought the situation to the brink of original conflict, seemingly catching washington of a guard or unable to respond effectively. where does these percolation of a new war leave the old ones to discuss that i'm now joined by david crayton, page politician and leader of the heritage party, to start cursing. that's great to see you this morning. thank you very much for your time. nice, thanks. it's really good to join you as well. now, the middle east has been a source of instability, are very turbulent area for quite some time. but there's been a very noticeable, very vivid escalation over the last couple of weeks. how do take and do thing is just another seasonal flare up, or is it something more serious, more consequential? you will have problems and i'm at least go back ultimately 75 years. but this current flare up started on the 7th of october with the actions of some ass one. that was a very strange thing because they could get over the most secure border wells. i

don't understand that myself, but then obviously since then it split up more and more. israel is retaliated completely out of proportion to what happened on the 7th of october, and now they're trying to draw in other countries. they're not just fighting against the mass in the gaza strip. they've opened the front against lebanon bombing, lebanon, the bones, the, it really wrong day. they killed the leaders of mass and the, and these are in the apartment building and in iran. and they boeing syria and they're doing taking actions in the west bank. so this really is an escalation, a big escalation. this happened in the last couple of weeks and i think the world was horrified. a couple of weeks ago when they were all these page explosions and exploding walkie talkies, the count some his ball outside does. yes. but lots of in assume to women and children as well. now, israel as a, as a national, after it's national behavior,

is a, pretty much the product of the west. it wouldn't be able to be what it is. it wouldn't be able to behave as it behaves without substantial military diplomatic financial support from the west. but there is a paradox here because i think at this point of time, it's national behavior. it's asked, is it odds both with the democratic administration in the united states and perhaps more broadly with the interest of the west? is it still an asset to the west? is it still a genuine ally in the k? more era is right? it was seen there was no question because this riley was on the side of the west against communism. and now since the full of the building bulls, since the fall of communism, things have changed. and, you know, we had a decade where rush, it was very, very much, you know, in the warm relationship with the west in the, you know, the, the late ninety's early 2 thousands. but i think now people are changing. so, you know, this is a long change of, uh, a few decades. of course,

we no longer in the cold war, so we're not, we're not fighting the tool now. so now people are really questioning a lot what is riley's doing? and i think the thing that people are looking at is that response in killing tens of thousands of women and children in gaza. and a lot of people are absolutely horrified by that. even people who previously supported israel. so the questioning, well, well, what are we doing here? what, what is this country doing? why are we giving so much military support and political support to the country that actually is going round? you know, and it's, it's definitely the likely clinton's in gaza. some people use the word genocide, you know, it's, but the beginnings of that and that goes again. so one of the values and principles that we say we hold the are in the west. so let me ask you about that specifically because it's not only about the valleys but the house about commonsense, basic commonsense and your own sense of self preservation. and what i find

paradoxical about the western decision making is that the west, on the one hand, easily picks up battles to be a very powerful nuclear armed opponents like russia and with damaged, prefers confrontations, kinetic confrontation over negotiations. but when it comes to suppose that allies like israel is the other way around, it seems to be open to being used to being manipulated to being sidelined or ignored. it doesn't seem to have the god, so they ask human to sort of change that dynamic, that the relational dynamic in its own favor. how do you explain that? obviously the most powerful country in the west, the con, but the country that's pretty much from the show is the united states. and the buying and administration has a lot of people who haven't joined us is riley citizenship. so used to the israel in the united states, a pretty much one and the same in terms of, you know,

where the people who are making the decisions. you know, you go on to the blinking. you've got linsey gray and you've got victoria new and all of them i've joint is riley citizenship. so they're very much thing 10 and support israel because you've got all these people that do are as ready citizens as well. but also the other thing is to power adults, because some of these people actually have a lot of antagonism to, to russia. and this was explained by my friend gonzales leah rob, show people what she showed. notice him who was killed in you, cried and he did a very good explanation of this. for example, look at victoria knew that she's a defendant of people who are forced to leave the ukraine 2 or 3 generations ago and paul drums as they possibly have some kind of self conscious intergenerational. i'm talking to isn't even hatred of russia because of what

happened a, a long, long time ago. and you know, there are people around like that. and then some other people go to the length of saying that they want raising change in russia because they, they've instigated the cause of revolution. obviously in ukraine. in the 2014, they tried to call the revolution and batteries back in 2020. the idea is they would do that in russia as well, but then in terms of the money people is riley, is either it's the still king holes in the middle east because they, they want to take some of the landing dollars though you've already got people setting up property agents to sell the landing dollars that from where people have been ethnically cleanse. and it's a base in order to apply military operations to bones, syria, to bomb the rock. and there's a lot of american companies in that taking the oil out of syria taking a lot of their off. can i ask you

a specifically about this relationship between the united states and israel? you said that that one of the same. and i think we broadly agree that israel is ultimately a creature of the west that it wouldn't have been possible to exist for israel. the way i know it exists today without the substantial support the western powers. but the west has to operate within viewing it. janet seems like, like israel right now, can operate within period to even though the west doesn't particularly like it. i wonder if, in some strange way is really is giving the united states and there was more broadly a taste of what's on the policy is that it's some strange sort sort of deal political come up ends of actually being faced with the consequences of your own policies in non other than your partner or a country that you call your partner? yeah, i mean i get to say something even more detail. you can come to the city. yeah.

it's a jewish projects. obviously it is the jewish state and the people who are the main move is behind creating israel. yeah, old way. they were in the west of the jewish people, the role stalls, families, etc. who provided a lot of the money in the beginning to buy outlines to support these right of the states. and that continues today. obviously, as i said, the special help from the united states and be here on security council or with the military supplies, etc. i mean the is really proctor, it started perhaps as a and is really initiative, but the wave survives and the way the, you know, brabs land of other nations. i mean, wouldn't be, it'd be possible without the west of other things. so no of course, no, because it is supported with a lot of money and we've ministry support from the west. we give them bundled billions of pounds. the israel and ministry supports protects it. specifically from the united states. it is going that every single. yeah, yeah, of course a wouldn't be able to survive without that lifeline. i think, you know,

is riley is one of the top beneficiaries of aids from the united states. of course, i can speak most about the united kingdom and i think this is reflected in the us as well. is that the 2 main legacy policies and so i would call them the conservatives and labor. they both have within the policies, very, very powerful lobbying groups for israel. there is the conservative friends of his route and is the labor of friends of israel, and many, many people in the top of the government of the you type today, all members of labor of friends of israel, i may receive donations from this organization as the conservative ministers did to a large extent during their 14 years previous, the key installment coming in the i'm gonna tell you something which i, i made a video about on my youtube, a few people who've seen it. but when i 1st was elected to the london assembly, which was 2016, i was taken to jerusalem, i wouldn't say, i'm sorry,

it wasn't good bundle them through their opinion or something. but i was either invited to a conference in jerusalem about freedom and democracy. i went to nice to all, this is great. i'm just going to go and meet some people. and this is very nice. i had a visit to because that sits on my trip. and while i was there, i, we, we were all taken into a room in the back of the contest that we had have been meeting with the member of the can. i said, and i didn't know this was going to happen. but he drew out something which is called a jerusalem declaration, which is something that we were off to sign in, the sort of co operative environment. and it says that, you know, you will put the interest of music around this time is the only person that didn't sign it because i didn't want to sign something that was going to make me e. like beholden to something, make that declaration. but most of the people didn't sign it and you know,

part of it back. and i think what was that old about as time is going on, i realize that, you know, they were a couple of american congressmen with me on the trip. but i realize that almost everybody who becomes a congressman understand that that is expected to sign or off to sign this jerusalem declaration which made them play just personally to support the nation of israel. so you have to take a short break. let's stop for a moment, but we will be back to the discussion in a few moments they tune the release of russian states never as one of the most sense community

invest, not getting hold of all sense and up the speed, the one else holes. question about this, even though we will ben in the european union, the kremlin machine, the state on rochester, d. s r t spoke neck, given our video agency roughly all the band on youtube, the tenant services for the question, did you say they requested the welcome back to was a parts with david kirsten, british politician, leader of the heritage party as a person just before the break here you're,

you're sure this very interesting experience demonstrating how sure the israel is about exerting its influence and how little it's cares about the other countries. because um, you know, we would presume that all those british or american political agents would have a legions to that people 1st rather than the people of israel. now i would, and i asked about that because the american politics has been in disarray for a couple of years. but now particularly we saw by them is ling dock. and it happened that this precise moment is their own, chose not only to escalate in gaza, but also to open up 2 additional friends in lebanon in iran. do you think it did it on purpose? simply because it's main sponsor, it's main ally. it happens to be distracted. yeah, i think the timing is very, very interesting because you've got the president selection just coming up. president trump is likely to be re elected. but at the moment,

the united states being title, as soon as you say biden is not knowing whether he's coming or going for a couple of years, come all the house is not the brightest bulb in the package. i take it, i think many people with thing to say, i'm so everyone around the welds, you know, it is able to just try to do things and act so now israel, particularly to get things done in this moment where there is chaos in the united states. and, you know, obviously this is related a little bit to what's happening in ukraine because everyone can see that he's not going how the western leaders wanted it to go. so it's route is probably be looking at this and thinking well now is all the time to do something. but this guy, it's a 2003 and the start of the rock war. i'm sure you and a lot of people will be aware of the speech given by general ways of the clock when he talks about the united states. a well, the west of getting to war with 7 countries. so that was a rock, lebanon, syria,

libby, a sudan. i think somali of that is, i go on the one to know the last guy was there as well. yeah. yeah. they were gonna end up with the wrong. and that was that going to be the final country that they were gonna get. so will with and cause instability in. and then, you know, basic be plugged into the assets, put in little topics on the we have a great opportunity to see how it all played out. and i think it demonstrates that the main problem with western decision making is well to put in the diplomatically the shortage of strategic for side. because all those wars, 2 words in iraq, health, strength, and iran, ultimately the meddling in syria empowered radical islamic groups like ices. and left to a huge migrant wave into western europe. if israel worth or habits way in lab a non in iran,

if it succeeded to in toppling the range and government. and how do you think it's likely to influence decision not only in the region, but also let's say in our hemisphere, because the implications would be larger than the middle east. we're the point of the was the being waged by the people in the city and state is not to the top of the regime and then put in a raise the human rebuild the country. they say that's what what they want to do. but the point seems to be, to cause chaos and the in those countries, they are also causing cares about the cares is reaching their shores as well. i mean, it's definitely me reaching western europe maybe in a couple of years at the real range of the u. k shores as well, but it's already reaching the u. k. shows that, you know, we, we have a, a huge number of the military aids may have my friends coming across the channel illegally. and now we've got a $150000.00 to run the asylum system, the mainly you about this asylum seekers. but they come from these countries mostly

on man, middle women and children, which is means, which is why i didn't think they'd genuine refugees as such. but they coming in to the u. k. and let and this tie else in the you tie as well with an increase in crime is adding to the housing crisis. there's millions of pounds being spent on these people who have come into the u. k. and this is all a result of the was, which should be waged over the last 20 years. i mean, absolutely, i agree with you. and it's, it's also in the insane movie that the was one perhaps for the european situation is the water, libya because i get that see actually all that he's is obviously not popular with the powers the be in the west. he was very good because he had bought this height of migrants. he wants to come from africa since he's gone. and that was, you know, 12 years ago now there's been a lot of migrant started through libya and then that obviously was added to with the was in syria and on the rock. and now you've got new migrant boots starting to

take place from lebanon. and if we get to will with the on i said i, i think that's to be the worst possible thing that anyone in the west could try to do. but if there is some kind of a ministry of tackling the wrong, massive bombing of the wrong people are losing their houses and they become the homeless. what a lot of them are just going to slot into europe as well. you know, i don't blame them, but that's going to be, you know, very bad for a continent which really isn't coping very well with the millions of migrants that we already have because of the was that have been waged by the governments of all nations. now perhaps we would the both agree that the west is not very good at the ending it's worse responsibly. it tends to sort of shifted attention to another conflict. and maybe it's a wishful thinking on my part. but the thinking about the conflict in the ukraine, i have a slide hope all fuck the west. the seeing being time city in the middle east. i'm

also experiencing its own fatigue around the, the premium conflict, the progression. do you think it's possible that somehow it's thinking about the ukranian situation may shift towards the perhaps in being distracted letting ukraine and russia figure it out between themselves? and i hope so. and i think some people are starting to realize that, for example, schultz and john, so their of, of germany is said he's not going to provide. he's told us crews messiahs to ukraine, which is a good state. and i mean, that's a good sign in the way, i mean, they've been up to now being quite belligerent, but they, they not doing that. and hopefully people are starting to see sense you even, you're even getting pieces written in some of the mainstream media outlets saying, but russell is doing very well now that are balancing it, increasing pace and the dung bass of the eastern ukraine. they changed the tactics and this is putting the ukrainian all me eat the on the box the and indeed the

friends in the don't box is collapsing and the color skin cogent didn't go as they wanted. it's, you know, a couple of months ago when the, the crating forces went into the coast region, all the main stream media and politicians with sharing that on. i mean, upholding the, um, because of the loss of life that, that they were doing that. but now that housing was how they thought to me being pushed back and, and everything that the ukrainian forces present lensky regime under the patronage of the west to try to do isn't working. and it, and people can see that is, i think people are disgusted with what's going on with the sending huge amounts of money to the lensky in terms of weapons. the cable russians, when actually we're taking money away from people that hadn't been one of the big things in the you tell you that i know about domestically is that the current labor government have taken one and a half 1000000000 pounds away from pension. is we something called the winter fuel allowance, and that is just gives them

a little bit of money to see them through the winter to heat their homes. but the taking the other way of giving twice as much zalinski and as long as goes on the moon, people have disgusted with the billions and billions of pounds you rise in dollars which are being sent to ukraine. what public services is in health. so people here being taught them to child. ok. well mr. gordon, i hope that people are not just disgusted, but also bring their discuss. do they pull additions so that the politicians can change the course? now you mentioned the german literature being somewhat of restraint in terms of sending long range missiles to russia and allowing them to be used against the russian territory. but the discussion is ongoing and british media. and the brits seem to be very belligerent when it comes to any kind of attacks against a restaurant or where do you see it going? do you think it's just the sort of the public discussion or if may go in into an

actual escalation? we have in the, in the u. k. is, is what i call it a uni policy. we, we've called conservatives and we got the label. they say they have rights and expedited, right? exactly, identical in terms of policy. so what we've got now is salma, but he's basically a continuation of johnson. and the soon i can, who is a continuation of my and come around and brown and black before them. they're all with united by city getting in the same direction. stallnicher is absolutely the gun ho for sending weapons to ukraine for them to buy a deep into the russian territory. that's what he wants. that's what he's going forward. he even went over to the united states. the was commission most simply and incredibly bite and said no, he didn't get permission for this to happen at the time. so i mean that, that came out of nowhere, even though it's a good thing because it's absolutely the wrong thing to do. it would be a disastrous and reckless escalation of the conflict. is that with the happen?

um, but i would make a distinction between the politicians and the people because the people increasing the or against best, they're against escalating. well, we can see now the overall for 1000000 ukrainians have died. you know, including lots of young man who are being press gang going to the front line. you don't even don't have anything to do with fighting. and, and this again, is really pushing the consciences of the people in the west and who are different to the governments who seemed to be on another level of wanting to escalate the board intentions because they still invested in taking back hold of the land and ukraine. because there's a lot of money behind it, they want to get in take control of the mines in the minerals. in fact, this even being said, and some of the mainstream media reports, there's 4 trillion or 10 trillion dollars was the assets and minerals in the don't boss on black rock and other west and multinational companies and,

and stones want those assets in order to be able to take money out of ukraine. that's where they're concerned with. they're not concerned with people. they're not concerned with russians and ukrainians together. you know, young man, uh, killing each other for the people and the powers that be who are in charge and who are making the money. and that is disgusting to a lot of people forgive me for saying that. but i thing if you're, if you're leaving the in, in the country that you're doing democratic, you do bear some responsibility for the accidents of your, of your leaders. and that applies both to me as a russian. and i assume to british people when they consider the policy as a fuel nation because, you know, saw some people, there are some politicians there on, not just the threatening of, i mean they're, they're contributing to the, as he said to the killing of many, many thousands of our soldiers and, you know, our ukranian neighbors. now, there's been some recent changes in russia's military doctrine with president put in announcing the end of the so called an nuclear immunity of the non nuclear

states. and nuclear states will no longer be a sort of in joining these pretends of innocence. when they send weapons to the ukranian slunk line and pretend that they are not involved in conflict. if those weapons are used against russia surgery rusher with change the right to retaliate directly. and i assume if russian does so, it may affect, you know, civilians in the west as well. do you think a proposition like that is likely to sort of uh, bring some sobriety you to the way the british public, the british leadership is approaching this issue? well, i hope say, but, you know, president putin has been warning about not escalating for, but since the beginning of the conflicts, and this is something that the west didn't needs to get involved in the, the most shameful thing that the west has done was done by forest johnson in april 2022. when there was a peace deal agreed between president putin and zalinski,

and jonathan went to the landscape with other people and persuaded him not to sign it and to carry on fighting. todd is absolutely upholding on the stain on, on nation and because of that hundreds of thousands of more people have died. but you know what, what president police in his saying now is, don't fire cruise when he saw ios into russia, you know, which is absolutely reasonable. because in the west, the lead is always want to say, one of the war with russia. we don't have well with russia, but then they do everything to act in the amount of that they are a war with the wrong and their, their supplying weapons and expertise on the satellite imagery. i mean, what have, uh, what else do you need to provide? i mean, other than the actual soldiers, but the funding, the b service thing of this war continues with the western help. yeah, of course. i mean, you know, you can make the old. so the philosophical argument, you know, if you give someone a gun and they shoot,

said someone and can someone who's responsible the person who ex, shot the gun on this new guy. but she to the gun, you know, they both responsible and this is the situation. the west is in it, the volume, and then what we're doing and you know, back to your point about the west and the people bearing some responsibility for the governments. they elect. well, yes, i mean, and that's why i've, you know, the political party and the heritage policy, which is saying, among many obvious things that we're opposed to more we shouldn't be getting involved in 3rd party conflicts around the world. except to try to deescalate things and speak peace and get people to stop fighting and stop giving each other the so i stood candidates in the recent general election. unfortunately, you know, we didn't have enough people wanting to come and stand for us to stand everywhere in both for us. well, mr. kirsten, we have to leave it there, but thank you very much for being with us today. okay, thank you for watching hope to see her again on the world's a part,

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authorities within the city. everyone is their own citizen. half the people are here because of their notice. go and the other half here because they loved the place and there's nowhere else they'd rather be in here. but i don't know his ard wonder explain. you just have to experience labs, and by doing that, you have to live here the dish they have right here in lagrange. this is one of the dining halls. it was a mess all for you know, soldiers boot place, you know, several 100 people have passed through here either under way, somewhere else or provide safe space to abuse women and to elderly people to mentally ill peoples who addicts to children. you know, some cardboard checks, you know? but the cardboard shack is broke up for you. you just been sleeping on the dirt. what are the basic rules? isn't sylvia. and if you ground, they'll find out the

the, the us used to go right. what was the only thing sending weapons, ukraine months before the conflict started? that's the take, at least of the us secretary of state police blinking, defending his track record and praising right pools. they may, you don't conflict stuttering up around the world. we saw it coming. we were able to make sure that not only were we prepared and allies and partners are prepared for that, the credit was prepared. we quietly got a lot of weapons to, to ukraine, to make sure that they hadn't had what they needed to defend themselves. things like strangers, tablets that they could use to bind in raises only funds by honoring hillary clinton and george soros with the highest to us civilian toward the middle of freedom with a controversial track record. go and.