the, the welcome to cross stock bullhorn were all things are considered on peter level. finally, the trump administration has started its pitch the end, the ukraine complet. needless to say, it did not go down well with the european establishment addicted as they are to this war. will trouble the plan work? will the russians agree to discuss these issues any more? i'm joined by my guess, george samuel, we in budapest, he's a pod cast where the guy goal, which we found on youtube in locals. and here in moscow we have dimitri bobbitt. she is the deputy for an editor uncomfortable sky, a problem, the daily or gentleman cross type roles in effect, that means can jump anytime you want. and i always appreciate it. let's start out with george in budapest. well, we've been waiting for this for her

a long time. it was a campaign promise, and no trump is making his um, his move as it were here. obviously i'm making reference to what was going on at the munich security conference. and we had p pegs, that's which kind of surprises all he eloquently delivered the administration's position with quite a bit of forcefulness, i would say much to the gloom and doom of the europeans, georgia. the, you know, from the health said, i think it's an interesting game that the trump administration is essentially saying a great has to make a territorial territorial concessions. the u. s. as not backing ukraine. membership in nato and no commitment of american troops in some kind of post, more posts, conflict environment where article 5 could be invoked. that's a pretty interesting starting point. i mean that was even after negotiation,

which would be your opinions found appalling. um, what do you get from that? because there's a lot of hard negotiations ahead. there's a lot of details, there's a, there's a lot of ambiguity out there. but from the get go, the trump administration is making very clear. it does want this more to come to an end. george. what was the question i, i agree visa that the new but the trumpet, those rates and they play it once this war to and, and that is even clear from the, the telephone conversation that took place between the secretary of state, marco rubio and um, uh, russian foreign minister, so like a lover of they agreed on the meeting in saudi arabia is going to be obviously a very high level of negotiating team on both sides. and what was interesting from the russian read out of this conversation is that the united states pitched to russia a general. the time, i mean, he was saying, well, the week with,

let's sit down, look out our differences. and at least according to the russians, the americans brought up the number of sol points with the russians, the issue of the embassies and the normalization, with a record of the situation with the embassies and the consulates. and the, essentially, the suggestion that the sanctions unilateral sanctions of the united states impose on russia could be a pull negotiation. but that's sort of in a way where the problem lies. because i think this is what the trump administration want to say. look, we are offering russia and they told they knew anybody any improvements of relations, but then we want something in return from raw ships. basically we want russia to and this will allow us to cease by now on this, this now. and i think that's going to be a difficult one because the irregular russian would then have to say, well, our human issues have not yet been resolved. i mean, the issue to be with the, the,

for all the list. they're not, they're not even fully and across from the russian controls. and we want a permanent guaranteed, somehow security for us. and that's, that's, that's the hope isn't up with discussions. there's gonna be very, very tricky to going forward. yeah. damage. george is absolutely right. i mean, in some circles, i think it's fair to say there was you fauria that there is light at the end of the tunnel. there is a commitment here, but it's george rightly points out the war is continuing and there is no indication that it's going to stop any time soon. so we're really kind of in a levitated state here. we have intentionality. we know we where we want to go, georgia is absolutely right, a form of de talent, which has been so grossly absent and us russia relations. so, i mean, there's a vision, but what's the next step? because the more is continuing dma. but it was clear that the next step was going

to be negotiations of both negotiations. how old is it? a market, who billable? and the 2nd level of i'm a one to sign some kind of an agreement that pulled and the sports. yeah. they can agree on future thoughts that may bring that result. and the danger is that the idea of loans will get enrolled into this. the goal sheets, of course, to the main idea of looks of the current, uh, european leadership and uh at least 5. so the gradient stablish, so basically i was better re assure by the phrase or other he trod from uh, from uh, uh, basically from, uh, uh, i did go up, go up yesterday to him unit. he said that the, i think what we don't want to get to do is get to a large group of people in discussion. and so he'll say that the, you may not be at the table. when do you ask hold stokes, with russia?

well, that would be very, very good because this is what you would need for a good to go see, since you need to call. so trade all the big points, you know, this is why people mess where full of moles, that's why they never broke about. they do all legit. uh they talk about the business, you know, here's what we've had. we've had with this quote, which is the wine warrant out the idea of what you know, a game economically or from the war in ukraine, except maybe bought some of the military industrial complex. and the crazy brand new national slide part will be will sell them instead of being at the margin. so okay, what does expire any way to, to high positions a rush chihuahua stuff was because we understand your green became so much where it last most then all ducks you are a because last it's a profitable relationship with russia and mary gold at the end, promptly is a, is a for a magic person, i don't want to idealize him, is not the idea is to be smart,

that she wants to make money. and she is a very much cubit aged by the fact that we spend $113000000000.00 on support for you. great. do you? there's some of the information she thinks that she can quote them, save them by you bringing that show results. that's going to happen. i mean, one of us will tell you that, or the least she made spoke rosie, you know, this is of what the see kind of still closing chrome. that's what's the email i sent to you, are you bringing up the word losing and georgia, the ukraine has lost this military conflict. okay. how within, so again, we still don't know, but it, we know the outcome, but the other big loser is europe. in all of this. i mean, the americans went to munich and basically lectured them even hector them. okay. if you're a vassal states vassals don't pull a or are not invited to the table, you accepted that status. so don't complain. now, george,

that's that's exactly right. and what the kellogg was suggesting when he said what we had in the past, we have too many people at the negotiating table was rip, referring to the main spruce. as i'm on my side, almost remember the americans weren't involved in it. so that was a european process, so that could have been the opportunity for the europeans to throw the wage and, and to resolve this. so you know, that, you know, that was that he was under the, the french german war spaces in the midst prices. they didn't do anything in a year off the russians issue. they complain. so say, you know, they look like no one's doing anything about the implementing minutes and they didn't bother doing anything. so now they did the mom a seat at the table. having malik firstly failed for 8 years to do anything with that, see the table of it, but it did usually you reveal aspect of it could be quite dangerous because they

absolutely uh, re bid. there's going to be a meeting on monday involving all the high level european states. you know, my crowns in the powder is background a little bit. this dom i'm a little, i mean i'm sure the trump administration shaking in their boot. it's so that that's exactly. but they, you know, they so demented that they intend to be somehow involved in your grades and that's where it starts getting very dangerous because everyone else. yeah, i think that there's also a call or a to that dema is that, um, also uh, the american delegation made it very clear. or maybe not course of layer, but your, your role is to clean up the mess because american troops are not going to be there . there's not going to be the kind of security guarantees that you would like to have the image without american security guarantees. the are being was, the ones are essentially useless. i mean what the u. k. and you go and we can have a 100 years security agreement. and i mean, this is just comical stuff here. so europe is paying the cost for its negligence.

and i think both of you are a surprise, i certainly was the here people exec talk about the men's process. we've never really heard of a high level american official actually mention it in the context that he did. there's a learning curve over there, some place that depending on dma as well, it's amazing. i saw the european lead is a, is a, i mean bank, if you don't, you just response to a trunk smooths actually what we hear is oh mooney game. i mean, still do is that how long have you been say it's, you know, i think for 30 years every, get them to have dialogue with brush it was mentioned in the once about really and even though we're actually was not present unique in that team. so it did was something between the gods, the french and the british. so again, a toner, difficult problems to russia. that's from project seem to be a new new bands at. that's your, that's

a normal how is how was advanced that they can, you can just set the tools you know, into you're being in prison for a expression beads which did not fit to these terrible ultra liberal ideal. would you know, at the rest of the body do a person for brain next to on a bush clean the stairs. you know, no one did that before. so basically, uh, basically what we see is, uh there you are please. i told him, oh stip at the same time block, so steep about his block. so see, because europe, these are the only part if you, that's one of the what the can do. you know, they and the lance kansas. me. they want, they want to continue because they exist, they, they hold onto they, well, i mean, and they meant, i mean, well, you know, it was just because it comes with this. yeah. but it can be for material reasons. obviously there's an ideological element. we can't allow the russians to win. that's not george, that's not thinking geo politically,

this is one of the biggest problems we've had with this complex. but i think what they're really worried about, and we'll talk about in the 2nd part of the program as well, is a nato is at stake here, and they all know it may do is at stake it because this is why we're in a unprecedented situation whereby the americans are saying we on out, we want to bring this thing to an end. the yorba thing. know, we want to keep it going. but then the question is, well, how are you? europeans are going to keep it going without the americans and guns and the landscape came along the music. is it going to congress at all while you go to come up with a european on media? but that's the events that have the hip so that he gives an feasible though, but so that's, that's is very, very unusual because in the policy, it's always been the other way around. we had belligerent the americans and the europeans was a no, no, no, a calm down in the room, reassuring everything. but this time, it's a european's, a belligerent, the americans, you know, they, they want out see, but i think why it's dangerous,

because foot frustrated doesn't provide any security guarantees difficult. a european come to the best. alright. that holding, i hope we're going to continue talking about nato. and the 2nd part of the program, gentlemen, i'm going to go to a quick break. and after that quick break, we'll continue our discussion on russia, ukraine, and the trump administration. stay with our team, the,

the russian states. never as one of the most sense community best to him then i'll send, send the, send the 65 to 5 and speed. the one else calls question about this, even though we will bend in the european union, the kremlin media mission, the state on russia, scooting and supports the r t supposed net keeping our video agency roughly all the band on youtube tv services. for what question did you say a request, which is the

welcome act across the board? horns were all things are considered non peter lavelle a demo. we've talked about the trump administration's pitch. we've talked about the european reaction to it. now on this program, we're going to talk about what about something that hardly anyone else talks about and it's very important how, what will the russians settle for? because, you know, we nato expansion, not one in east. we had nato destroyed about po with the former yugoslavia and nato has been causing trouble all around the world. it's already been mentioned on this program. the mens process thing we can add to that is stem bull informed with viewers will know exactly what we're talking about. the russians

don't want to get fooled again and i will living here the russian people don't want to set me settle for less. there's a lot of pressure on the kremlin, on president putin. well, you're absolutely right. and actually the word is just on the european union are based on to absolute be erroneous wild suppositions. the 1st one is that i was wondering what was not stopping your brain, see what, what size, the voltage except full and after that, that's the 1st one. what's the position of the seconds while? if with purple, what they call, which is g m, as it will be so much nice that you know, there will be quotations for crash, the peaceful go. russia. it's helps a lot, you know, if uh, which is replaced by some of the code that's going to be going to be a lot more belligerent to what fuel. because the majority over actions have very and agree to, to it's a lot of people expected to play the role media to during the music process and

people before and europe always fade with us. and now the b, c, you know, people see how and doing america was say, whenever we're serious about the quotes, we just want to ukraine to get time to think people here for what the know they, they, what should be here. russians have access to the media a lot of us before, and we just know that google translate us if you want to check what she said. so indeed, my own before was that the president against power will be important enough to come . the other 4 pets here and still agreed with some kind of books. what it will be, i don't know. what i can say is that what you never want that all the car. i'm just laugh cheap. how i remember he's cool. we already have everything that we need here . what we need from your brain is your age. your credit. uh and obviously uh, an agreement look, have to be, it's a cheap at some point,

not only with the united states, but with the nature of so because if you're the mains, the leader, and if you're for the main strengthening, that holds you be left thoughts here not person looking to so but the left to get a bit st. george. that's what gets, that's the crux of it all. here is the root causes of it all. and of course all of his wants to see this carnage come to an end. and i repeat what i've said for 3 years, a conflict that never ever should have happened in the 1st place. my goodness is worth talking about this. can you imagine them? the soldiers in the field wondering who's going to be the last one to die as politicians talk? and it's a really big thought to contemplate and with the, the issue that really needs to be addressed is security for all, for all the and the west has to, we learn this. they have forgotten about it because they've been ideologically

blinded. and most of phobia blinds people into it and doing very, very dangerous things that we seen for the last 3 years. security guarantees for all, we're all old enough to remember the helsinki process. we're not the so all that we meant. remember you all to, but it, we need something yelled a yell to slash helsinki process. it trump is in a hurry. you can't get this kind of stuff done quickly. george, where you come, then you're, you're actually right. the zip um, what the referee is looking for and that, and it has been since it was sensitive issue. those 2 documents that december 2021 is helsinki. 2 point. oh um. the problem there is that the europeans are absolutely no mood for any kind of the hills. think a process. so even if some kind of a global conference were arranged under the auspices of the united states, they wouldn't do anything. i mean, they, they wouldn't agree on anything. all that would happen is that the europeans would

be there, you know, the carrier call us and it was the live on the line, and then it will, wherever is the joe and john. so leo fried right much and they would spend that time yelling and ranting and raving against the russians, they wouldn't agree to anything. and that's why the think, you know, so if i think so, what would russia settle for? i mean, obviously there's the issue of the for all blessed with, you know, rep address is not in full control. that's one thing. and then the is the live, belong to and security guarantees. and it's very hard to see how it can get those long term security guard just given the mood in the europe. the, the danger, however, for russia is that if it says no, we not the supplemental, this then is actually, this would have been a, you know, an opportunity to get lost because there's no question. you know, the united states is doing something, the bible didn't do a whole bonnet, they didn't do it, he's the united states is now offering some kind of a partnership. and the removal of ups that goes to

a fruitful relationship. you to say no to that. then, you know, russian will be the very difficult position because i think of them the trump administration, particularly trump, himself mercurial as he is with them, you know, resume hostility. and that is some even more intense than um the, the bites of this patient. it's such a very difficult situation for restaurants as to really bringing them home maneuver very, very cleverly various, usually a very diplomatic way to keep the americans on board. why did sure and did so long term security interests and deem a good tell our audience how russians have thought about this conflict in the late being able to contemplate that it could relatively soon come to an end. we never really hear much about what russians think we're russians are always tucked out, but they're very rarely listen to. so give us a flavor of the time right now. or worries knows of you. there is a pdf,

you missed 2 calls for the 1st time in 3 years. we have a good news to know about. if there's some kind of dial, restarted the brush or the west, and of course the no wiley directory straight the about people dying. and there was no, and there is no f decatur to was you agree? yes. relations between grasses, debris, it's very much like relations between the french leave them in the, in front of differentiated in belgium. quote, her may be a few, jo. so, but the generally speaking, there was never any teach at least what was the idea of what people from the stop, you know, it was of the war of the west against russia. and right now, what the of the month, you know, these 4 regions in ukraine, we need them 1st because uh they have always been populated by a few questions. i mean, reach history co rusher was explained into the south of find in both them on and by . that's how the,

these areas see the web see what populated by russians from inside, deep inside gras shirts and, and we need these for robots for security because how strong is next to crimea without tara sometimes use. all was exposed. uh, basically is rogia is the link between bandwidth washer and pretty near show that there can be transportation and don't boss, you know, don't. yes, kimball desk. they, they moved. they are, they're wanting brush or they suffered so much for 10 years. constant won't close them. uh, strikes won't be green sites. uh, the boat hadaway, you know they, they lost solely so basically what process requires a medium above everyone was difficult to and people very and get the so what we got from gabriel's emmy brand new groups. well, i know i will say, oh no, no, you know, when they read it, they said we said that was so much we can stand up and all they say don't smoke,

all thoughts continue and on ukraine comes loose. so these people who's in the ramp, so they're pretty, pretty typical. yeah, well that's one good thing about all this and the russian liberals of the so marginalize themselves, they've turned into a national and international joke, a topic for another program, george, it, it's been talked about. um, but i think it's just very vague right now and maybe that in part of this you for you. um uh, the trump and uh she could be in in moscow on may, 9th um the 80th anniversary of the defeat of fascism in europe. that would be that would, that would be of a magnitude of the fall of the berlin wall. george laid, it says a boot being full dishes, move something crumpled like, i mean i was like bold moves. um i, i, i have a feeling he is not going to do that. he would just go so much comes to the lease and uh, in washington any your but it's quite possible that that would be some senior us

representations, you know, maybe a go at the level of buckle rubio, maybe at the level of a cal, all. but that will be some us, some representation in itself would be a significant move and a game, you know, it does the rustle then in a very tricky position because the americans are making all of these moves. but there was a thing in baton and they want you to end this war, even though the russia has a visitation not to accomplish the goal. so therefore, it only adds a southern measure of pressure on russia in idea of how to respond to what we owe, basically be a very, you know, a generous offer by the american say, look, we recognize all of you, you will suffer anything. we recognize the old of the terrible things that have been done to you. and we, you know, we're here. so now we want something from you in rich on, you know, trump for anyone's, that's a peace agreement. he wants it done and he wants it done. so a demon, how did um uh, the former president of ukraine zalinski acquitted himself in in munich because he

threw a quite a few temper tantrums. um, i mean uh, he feels that the, uh he's been spurned by the americans, which i think is a fair assessment. but the, he but his, um, uh the, the countries that are with the recording him, i don't really the or are not significant. i mean, emily, in a better box, she can yell and scream all you want, but nobody was the tears. what she says, i mean, the europeans will, you know, might marry him. but you know that, that, that's a sloppy seconds. as we used to say in high school diploma. well, this is becoming a software suitcase with all the handle of where you are being all for the europeans because they haven't invested so much. they gave you all kinds of order assume prompts. there was a joke, it already made proportionately. the principal, you know, the very human defense are the only problem is he's not the french citizen. so that was the only of what he didn't get to look. she bought all sorts of orders. can you

read the from your products and no, i wonder how many passports he actually has like a that's a sidebar. okay. what's the appropriate fees that the key amount feels himself for that? so he makes contradictory statements like, oh, i'm ready to give trial all the nasal results. this will be great and all the lab got, you know, it's like a bankrupt. uh, gamble you know, says i have so much of oh, you can certainly take it off. all right, gentlemen, on that note. um, he definitely was the big loser in munich. um, a fascinating discussion. i want to thank my guessing, budapest son here in moscow. and of course, i want to thank our viewers for watching us here at r t c. and next time, remember across top roles, the,

[000:00:00;00] the the, the take a fresh look around. there's a life kaleidoscopic, isn't just

a shifted reality distortion by power to division with no real opinions fixtures designed to simplify. it will confuse who really wants a better wills, and is it just as a chosen for you, fractured images presented to this. but can you see through their illusion going underground? can the military vehicles likes to minors? a political dance can be read below the as fighting range? do you have to use today?

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