now i'm saying goodbye to you until monday, until we meet again and for some good news. humanity has come close to a breakthrough in the fight against cancer. a scientific sensation. doctors have learned to reduce or completely cure pancreatic tumors in patients. previously, this type of cancer was considered the most severe and one of the first vaccines. cancer will most likely appear in russia. several research centers are working on this. how do cancer vaccines work? is it possible to extend the technology to other types oncology? and how long will it take to bring the drugs to market? this is a question of science. i am alexander gasnikov, rector of the university of inapolis. and today our guest is one of the developers of the russian vaccine, vyacheslav kosorukov, director of non -experimental diagnostics of tumor therapy, the national medical research center of oncology named after nikolai nikolaevich blakhin. vyacheslav,

hello, good afternoon, vyacheslav, please tell us about your vaccine, how does it work? well, here, of course, you need to give such a large introduction, so that it would be clear how it is radically different from what was previously assumed, because the history, in fact, of the oncological vaccine, it has been going on for probably more than a century, back in the late 19th century it was noted that - after some infectious diseases there occurs either...

there biology accordingly became possible after some time to read the human genome, accordingly tumors of individual cells and so on, that is, technological development has led to the fact that we are already in at the beginning of the 21st century, they began to understand how vaccines work, first of all, these are infectious ones, from them, so to speak, they began to understand whether it is possible in the future to make such a thing on such a mechanism.

some nodes with subsequent damage to the body, accordingly, well, it would be logical to assume that one of the most promising ways that exist in, so to speak, in the treatment of a tumor, yes, this is to teach the body or force the body to recognize the tumor again, to attack it again, so to speak, to modify the response of the immune system so much that it allows itself immune system or maybe with some small help to find the tumor these to... destroy at the beginning of the 21st century vaccines have already begun to appear against the tumor, because so-called tumor-specific or tumor- associated antigens were identified, yes, that is, this is a group of proteins that, let's say, are very strongly expressed in the tumor, this seemed at that time such an encouraging factor, that here we see that there, conditionally, in breast cancer there is a lot of the antigen so-called xer-2, yes, but it didn't seem that simple, because the proteins that should be expressed on

the tumor, well, it would be desirable for them to differ from normal tissues, but that's exactly how it is, basic cellular immunity works poorly, because these are essentially normal proteins, our immune system learns not to kill normal tissues, quite a large number of such antigens have been tried, i think there are over 50, in the middle of there 2000, there is already closer to there 2010-2015 we have appeared here...

because it constantly mutates and so on say in the tumor mass some clones are formed that differ from the tumor progenitor, yes, but they, for example, already have the ability to interact differently with the immune system, and there are, so to speak, thousands of such clones, it turned out that in many tumors, which are characterized by the so-called genetic instability, and can be formed when there is no antigen, that is, mutations. which are in the coding part of some proteins, they result in these same proteins with replaced amino acids, they are very similar to normal ones, but these pieces, so to speak, sites where a mutation occurred, they already differ from the norm, and we can

bioinformationally, that is, with the help of, say , trained neural networks of artificial intelligence, that is, this is such a large bioinformational complex, identify from the entire mass, there, relatively speaking, it can be several thousand or tens.

here we come to the fact that with the help of a large number of personal antigens for each patient, we can attack almost all tumor clones, that is, there is... immunity, which leads, well, in a certain, so to speak, percentage of cases, yes, to either stabilization of the disease, or to regression of the tumor, up to this, and the most important thing is that the task of such an approach is, this is the maximum extension of the relapse-free period after surgery, why is surgery the key parameter here, well, either surgery, or in some cases a biopsy can.

it is already known that they will be, in the case of tumors there is no such thing, we cannot say what exactly, in what place the mutation will occur for a specific patient, some individual cases, to predict, well, not to predict , but to assume, but it is impossible to cure, well, vaccinate against everything, well, these are billions of options, well, actually, a tumor is not one disease, there are more than three hundred completely different diseases with... consider this a second medicine, here in terms of different course, that is, this is oncology, the number of diseases, that is why it is not possible to prevent everything, but at the moment when a tumor is detected in a patient, some preliminary treatments are carried out, the most important thing is to take a sample, we can, as

i already said, sequence it, determine its genetic code, the code of those proteins that it expresses, that is, what is happening there at the level. both dna and rna, from this, already knowing specifically his disease of this patient, for him to make a vaccine specifically for his tumor, this will be like a vaccine for his tumor, as well as for those metastases that, well, potentially, he may have, well, we classically understand that the patient, when it leaves at a more serious stage, yes, there is the third, fourth stage, this is usually already the metastasis of the tumor or there are serious sprouting organs, yes, which do not allow further surgical treatment of the patient, so the introduction of immunotherapy allows the body's immune system to begin to recognize this tumor again, to train it and prevent metastasis or prevent the development

of the tumor, let's say there - in the surrounding tissues and so on, development, but in some sense to kill these cells and even roll back like, of course. someone else's granules with other origins are the same, yes, we, by using a vaccine, by using immunotherapy methods, we significantly increase the likelihood that the patient will develop his own antitumor immunity, this is our goal - a combination of methods now, conducting personalized vaccination - to raise this probability of the appearance of the body's own defense to the maximum level, well, let's say there is a 60% positive response - that would be great, now immunotherapy in different methods gives from there, i think, 12 there to 40%,

this is for different cases, and if we manage to raise it there to 60 there, god willing 80% for some types of cancer, this will be an excellent result, well, after all, different types of cancer have different, as it were, aggressiveness, for example, if we take pancreatic cancer, then unfortunately it is considered, as far as i know , one of the most severe forms of cancer, because the mortality rate is very high. will it work on, for example, will it work on pancreatic cancers, well, we haven’t done this specifically yet, our object now is melanoma, melanoma is just well, again, not all, but there are aggressive forms of melanoma, they are associated with the fact that they have a large mutational load, yes, that is, many mutations, that is, there is where to look for non-antigens, there is something to teach the immune system, there is a type of tumor, which, for example - firstly, does not

greatly distinguish the tumor from the norm and, accordingly, it is difficult for the immune system to fight them, so in our case we choose those types of tumors that have a good mutational load, this is now, as i already said, melanoma, potentially we will have to with some types of lung cancer, some types of cancer. where we showed that yes, indeed, in mouse tumor models, when we

make their model vaccines for them, uh, well, probably, there are from 40 to 60% of the peptides that we synthesize, they can be immunogenic, that is, an immune response develops in mice, and this is a very good indicator, because if we take the full, so to speak, number of mutations, yes, it will be a fraction of a percent, that is, we rise from a fraction of a percent due to information technology, so... so say elements of artificial intelligence up to tens of percent yes probability, that is, if we make 25, 30, 40 for the patient , let's go into more detail, that's how for the patient, yes, that's how you see it, that is, that's how it is in general, well, just ordinary people are watching us, that's how they can imagine this procedure, which will already be tried on people, that is, how it will look, that is, well, ideally it will look. as follows, that is, in the center, which has - diagnostic system for identifying

neoantigens, yes, that is, so to speak, a separate complex of measures, respectively, after surgical intervention and, well, roughly speaking, cutting out the primary tumor in the patient, a sample is taken from it, which passes through the degenetic system, that is, it is completely sequenced, at the output we get, well, there are 30-40 neoantigens that are characteristic of this patient, specifically this patient, then this information, while the information, this is nothing done by hand yet touch, it is sent to, so to speak, a site for the production of personalized vaccines, such a site is being prepared at the gomaleya institute, they have it produced on their site according to the submitted sequence.

technology in the 6th tier 8 weeks, that's well , so to speak, 2 months, this is the range within which when everything will be, well, as if the work will appear already. there, well, god forbid, if necessary, after some time, to what extent will this technology be generally available, because it looks like it is available to the chosen ones, it is of course, it is more difficult than the covid vaccine, more difficult than the flu vaccine, but remember how much the genome sequencing program used to cost, it was tens, if not hundreds of millions, it was 25 years

ago, yes, this is what started 25 years ago, now all the same costs. there are tens of thousands of rubles, as you understand, technological progress significantly reduces the cost - seemingly incredible things before, now it is commonplace, yes, and here the situation is similar, yes, when the technological chain is completely debugged, and the ministry of health, so to speak, the main organization that manages, so to speak, the ministry. is set up to ensure that we have a system built for the full cycle of production of personalized imarankovaccines, that is, it will already be a production chain, in this case the cost will, as far as i understand, fully fit into the requirements of insurance medicine, this is high-tech medical care - high-tech medical care, within the framework of high-tech medical care there are also

more expensive methods they are used, that is, from the point of view of applicability, this is well one of yes.

therapies are being developed by several scientific groups at once, their own versions are specialists all over the world, several examples in our review: a virus against cancer, specialists from the national medical center of radiology of the ministry of health of russia are going to knock it out with clinklin, the drug is already moving to the stage of... clinical trials, it is based on special oncolytic viruses, when introduced into the patient's body, they can attack cancer cells, destroy them or set the immune system on the tumor. with the help of a viral vaccines we can not only directly affect tumor cells, but we can also label these cells, roughly speaking, and the fact that these cells begin to carry on their

surface certain structures, antigens, which... are initially viral, initially cause an active reaction of the body, immune, protective. another area of ​​work of the mrna radiology center, a vaccine that retrains the immune system to attack cancer cells. they plan to move on to human trials in six months. the drug is being created jointly with the gomola center, but in sirius university has already created special nanoparticles that, like couriers , deliver drugs to target cells. among other things, this is the path to treating cancer. our task is to get the drug right into... a real breakthrough was the success of an international group of scientists from the usa and germany, who managed to improve the condition of patients with pancreatic cancer , one of the most aggressive. their mrna

vaccine, by the way, is related to the vaccine against coronavirus infection. experience in creating personalized vaccines, which preceded the mrna vaccines against sars-cov-2, are now helping to develop cancer drugs faster and provide patients with personalized therapy. and doctors expect that positive dynamics to continue. according to experts, over the next 5 years, the volume of the global biotech drug market will double and reach almost 400 billion us dollars, largely due to cancer drugs. let's return to the studio, well, we saw that a year ago there were experiments, so far... in this regard, the question is, these are such successes, which we observe in the world, and i hope we will observe in russia in the near future, this is , in your opinion, the specificity

of personalization, yes, personalized medicine, the use of some modern, including artificial intelligence methods, this is what is the key to success, really personalization, as if from all sides, relatively speaking, this is a very important factor, because personalization here... relatively speaking, a tumor and the mechanism of its development on the shelves, this is precisely the question of personalized diagnostics, from it predictive therapy is taking place, so to speak, it is precisely the application of the therapy that corresponds to a given personal tumor, not only depending on where it occurred. there is stomach cancer or there is ovarian cancer, for example, but the personalization of the therapy itself, the application of a certain set of drugs, now

chemotherapy is already the second generation, yes, now there is targeted therapy, antibody therapy, cell therapy, that is, vaccine therapy, that is, the future is the future of personalized medicine, that is, such as a summary, of course, of course, this does not cancel surgery, it does not... cancel other methods of treatment, yes, but it complements the general set of methods and maximizes the overall effectiveness of patient treatment. and artificial intelligence, artificial intelligence, it allows you to process large amounts of data, and let's say genetic data is a huge amount of information that cannot be done manually, this is exactly what it is used for as a tool, and again, artificial intelligence is used by us in various directions, this includes processing. genetic information, image processing, processing of large sets of diagnostic data, yes, the oncology center is one of the leading centers for the use of artificial intelligence for

various tasks in general therapy, our part, which is used for the vaccine, yes, this is like a certain piece of the whole complex of methods and applications of bioinformatics, medical informatics and methods of artificial intelligence in... development , namely practical yes, that should be to benefit the patient in improving the results of his treatment, this is probably the final question, in your opinion, will it ever be possible to cure cancer, if possible, what are the prognoses? well, again , we treat cancer, the question is what kind of cancer, so that it would be like the flu, like the flu approximately, well, we treat the flu, and covid, for example, if it were not. if we did not treat it, there would be a severe course, here it is the same, cancer is not such a disease as cancer, there are 300 diseases, and some of these are there every year

more, we can cure a larger number up to a complete cure, this is to say, an absolutely transparent trend that has been observed in recent years, on the one hand we see an increase in morbidity, yes, but one of the factors here is an increase in the efficiency of diagnostics, each time we begin... well, each time more developed technologies allow us to cure some types of cancer up to a complete cure, this is really so, well, each time we will be able to simply expand the nasology that we have successfully learned to treat, i would answer like this, well, it sounds very optimistic. well, we must set ourselves, so to speak, a certain level that we are trying to achieve, it should always be higher than what we have now, and we understand this level, we

are striving for it, unfortunately, a complete victory over oncological diseases is a matter of the distant future, but science does not stand still, who knows, maybe one day cancer will really become something like a cold, unpleasant, but not fatal, to questions of science answered vyacheslav kosorukov, director of non -experimental diagnostics. tumor therapy of the blakhin national medical research center of oncology. vyacheslav, thank you very much. thank you for inviting me, if you have any questions, please contact me. thank you. the service-credit potential of the bank will show you an individual offer. for all credit products of the bank, find out your personal terms in advance, apply for a loan with monthly cashback in 5 minutes for up to 30 million rubles. hello everyone! and i know exactly what

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