>> the same. 20% ownership in the company. [inaudible] >> [inaudible] >> i heard something about sba guaranteed loans. maybe i missed something. does that have to do with the sba guaranteeing the entity? >> the question on the sba guaranteeing a entity as the order of the business, whether it is a corporation or partnership, for any small business lending, you should expect to be guaranteeing that long personally. as a small-business owner, from a lender's point of view, we want to see that you are as invested in the business as you

are asking the bank to be. the idea that non recourse loans, the way you describe it, loans that you get without having yourself personally liable is not the way it works. you should assume you will guarantee the loan regardless of the structure of your business. the good news, though, for businesses like you are describing, internet business, is that the capital requirements for that type of business is generally small. you are able to get yourself further along and share in revenues with a smaller amount of credit need. that is where we see a lot of businesses and personal service or internet business get started, and generate revenues and be able to show growth without needing any capital, like a brick and mortar business might.

>> my name is terry said. i have a retail business in san francisco for 22 years. i have a 5 04 -- 504 loan. it took me three years to get. we need more capital. i tried to get a line of credit from wells capital. i was decline. where does someone like myself go? i have a loan, i need additional funding. >> did you try through the sba? >> i already have an sba loan. i went to wells fargo for a line of credit and they would not give me one. >> i can speak to you about it. when we look at funds that are needed, the biggest thing we look at our cash flow. i can address that with you.

unless there is an issue, at that point -- [inaudible] >> let's talk, ok. >> i have a couple of more questions. i know that the panelists have agreed to stay after for those who have specific questions. i do have one question for wells fargo. what are the typical rules for applying for sba loan of less than $50,000? how much money do we need to have in your bank to apply for a loan? >> i am on the smaller side of the bank. i am a transaction guy. i do not technically require one to have an account to do a loan with.

what i look for, i generally start at 100,000 and up. when it is a requirement of 50,000 or less, i tend to call of the micro guys to help me out. that is right in their box. for us, the capacity for us to do the smaller side is not there as much as it is for them. on getting a loan through my side of the bank, i do not require an account to do that. we would like to have it, but i do not require it. >> last question for the opportunity fund and a critic representative. are you a cdfi? is san francisco and s.p.a. in support of cdfi's being

established in san francisco? >> yes, we are. we were founded in 1999 with a small business loan. that is how we started our tenderloin office. >> opportunity fund is a certified cdfi, so we are providing a benefit to low and moderate-income communities. he is the city establishing support for new cdfi's? >> mark wanted to address that, in support of cdfi's in the city. >> we have a wealth of partners in the city. s.p.a. is just now rolling out a

program for r -- will be the case by the summer. let me get one last point and on the question about relationships to lenders. the question was, do have to have an account with a bank in order to get a loan? may answer is no, but the real answer to it is certainly want to do that. one of the things we see as an important thing for you, as a small-business person to establish a relationship with a lender on a variety of levels before you look for funding. part of that is opening an account with them, letting a lender know about your business, understand your business, talk to them as you are growing your business. when the economy is strong, all lenders are shopping for transactions. in times are tough on credit,

you want to rely on those deeper liberation ships with your lender. you want to develop a relationship with a lender. it is the case where you want to open up an account, while to have another bank services that you want to have a relationship with your lender with it because when you go to them for any loan requests, you want them to know about your business and feel like they are a partner of yours, not just that you are shopping them. if you are shopping, you are just looking for the best deal from them, rather than a long- term relationship. >> i want to thank everyone for coming. hopefully, you have all signed up for our updates. we are going to be hosting these on a regular basis. the next two coming up will focus on becoming a government contractor, how your small business can partner with the government. the next one will also be on how to grain your business, with tax

-- green your business, tax credits available with that. for non-profit, charitable organizations, we have a workshop coming up. that is helpful for those of you who are looking to access the committee on a durable basis. >> also, on behalf of leader pelosi, i want to thank our panel and her staff. we are tenants in this building. i apologize for the security situation that happened upstairs. if you have concerns about it, please come and see me. i would like to convey those to the landlord here so that it does not happen again. thank you.

>> thank you.

let's hear it for the band. [applause] >> thank you. let's hear it for the band. [applause] welcome, everybody. once again, i have the honor of being your master of ceremonies for the annual lighting of the snowflakes on market street. great event. i love being part of it. good to have you with us. i should point out that we just saw a spectacular light show under the dome over west field center. you probably have not seen it because we are the first to see it. you should get over there and see it during your holiday shopping. tonight, we have the dancing snowflakes from the san francisco ballet school. they are currently preparing for the annual performances of the "nutcracker" at the san francisco opera house. here's something you may or may not know -- san francisco was the first city in the country to

premiere the "nutcracker" in 1944. the san francisco ballet is america's first professional ballet company. how about that? [applause] in a few minutes, we will have the snowflake lighting, but first, i want to bring up to say a few words someone who has been instrumental in putting this event together. he is the director of the department of public works here in san francisco. [applause] >> thank you all for coming out. we are very happy to join all the businesses along with all the other city agencies to continue to improve and improve the quality of market street. four years in a row, we have been adding a few blocks in a time, and step-by-step, we will get all the way to the castro. i am very happy for this event, and i look forward to all the lights coming on. happy holidays. >> don't you love short speeches? i did the best?

another instrumental person in putting this together is the public facilities commissioner. >> thank you. this will be short also. we do the street lights in san francisco. it is wonderful to join downtown and like the street up and be part of the community. it is great. hetch hetchy green power lighting up the street. have a wonderful holiday. thank you. [applause] >> thank you. now, joining us i think for the first time for this event is mayor ed lee. mayor lee: thank you. i will be short, too, because i am. happy holidays, everybody. i want to especially thank these beautiful snowflakes. aren't they wonderful? i wanted to be on time because i know i have a lot more closing than they do. i wanted that iqbal dpw and our

puc director -- i wanted to thank our dpw and puc directors. we have increased this netflix by an additional 20. there's a total of 162 snowflakes on our wonderful market street. we have some 81 leptos that are covered. we're going to continue expanding this every year we get more participation. i want to especially thank market street as well. we also want to signal that we are seeing changes along our market street happened. this is a commitment that i have made. not only the campaign, well before running for this mayor ship, i was proud to participate in all the changes the former mayor did to signal that we want our businesses here on market street as well. you are going to see in the next few months twitter.

you're going to see zendesk. you are going to see burning man come aboard. the companies we have asked not only to start here but to stay and grow. all these wonderful companies creating fantastic jobs will join the events we have all along our great market street. you will see united nations plaza with its wonderful market parts -- arts festival starting out through mid december and there will be joined by so many events. i want to thank everyone for coming tonight. spencer, with that, are we ready? are we ready for a count of? >> i think we are ready. we want all of you for joining us. i want to thank the participants once more because once we do the countdown, you may not be able to see them. thank you very much. we are going to start the countdown. are you ready to join us?

>> 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1 >> like the snowflakes -- light these netflix. >> here we go. [applause] >> happy holidays, everybody. -- light the snowflakes. [horns honking] [siren wails]

announcer: big dreams and goodrades aren't enough to get into college. there are actual steps you need to take. finding someone who can help is the first and most important. for the next steps, go to knowhow2go.org.

>> the question when i started 11 years ago when i started doing resolution work is can anything be presented on a really low resolution device where it is potentially a digital image? can anything be presented that

way? or will it feel cold and electronic? >> the imagery will change. there will be four different sets. it is a two dimensional image. it is stretched out into three dimensions. the device is part of the experience. you cannot experience the image without the device as being part of what you are seeing. whereas with the tv you end up ignoring it.