we did that outreach. we can talk to groups of three, four, five, 200 times and give you some statistics. no way to check it out, and all of the you all would agree. let me tell you, commissioners, our area, the bayview-hunters point, we, on every level linked with environmental justice issues, we have been on the forefront. not the department of the environment, not some bogus so- called experts who say this, that, and the other. we pay the price. we know that our people have suffered. our seniors have suffered. our children are dying slowly. we have been on the forefront of environmental justice is used -- issues. and guess what -- we have not been canceled. ask yourselves, commissioners, if you have had one forum, one workshop with young people.

ask yourself. we have to revisit that issue of going back to the community and having people on the table so that there is a meaningful dialogue. [bell rings] thank you very much. commissioner moran: thank you. mr. pell. >> thank you. first of all, i want to alltodd for the good work in writing this. i checked the advanced calendar. this has been pending for two years. thank you to todd for this and thank you to commissioner vietor for taking a good policy and making it better. i would ask that you could refer this to the cac for its review prior to your adoption so that the cac can look at it and maybe see if there are any further tweaks. i think this is something we should do for agency wide policies, ascended to the cac for comments. i do not think that will create unnecessary delay.

i think we're already doing things that this policy suggests. i know there is a roomful of people here that want to talk about the sewer. so thank you very much. commissioner moran: all right, commissioners. >> i would support it going to the cca -- cac. commissioner moran: the other one. before we get to that, why don't we move toyour amendments? commissioner vietor: ok. of like to make a motion to amend the current policy stated. >> second. commissioner moran: and it is from the public? all those in favor? opposed? ok, without objection, then we will continue this until -- when does the cac meet again? >> i believe it is next month, but we will get a date certain

because there are two items. the technology policy and the rate-payer assurance that you talked about earlier this year. so those two items would be going next to the cac. we have them for august and september forbes the rate fairness board, cac, and the bond oversight committee. commissioner moran: ok. it they could schedule that for their next meeting. >> the meeting today will be the same time next month, too. the same day as our commission. commissioner moran: o we will wait anxiously for their action and bring it back when it is ready. i would like to point out, when we get into the next discussion, we have kind of a test of how we think about those principles. so thank you. before i go to the next item, i think we're going to be there for a while, so why don't we take a five-minute break?

and we will reconvene at roughly 20-of.

commissioner moran: all right, we're back in session.

>> item 14, sewer system improvement program, validation workshop number two. >> [inaudible] >> microphone. >> director of the sewer system improvement program. very happy to be here today to have our second workshop on validation. today's session will be a little bit different than how we talked about the treatment plant projects. those were very well-defined. some of the projects we're discussing today are more conceptual, and we will be returning to the commission at distant points, like when we finished the watershed assessment and as we define different alternatives. some of what you will hear today are best concept for projects. before i begin, i want to acknowledge the very hard work that staff have put in. the waste water enterprise

infrastructure as well as the department of public works. several of our folks are in the audience today. they have put in it really countless hours and a lot of very long nights. i also want to thank our general manager, the deputy general manager, and everyone who participated in putting this together. they have coached us. they have kicked us. they have guided us. i think we have a pretty good body of material here today. if you recall, at the last presentation, july 10, we focused on treatment to. today, a collection system all the way, talking about watershed frameworks. the slides, please. thank you. today's workshop will focus on collection system. it will be the same type of format. we will have points where we can slow down and discuss, but feel free to have a discussion throughout each. we have a bevy of experts here

to help dr. perry much of anything. the final workshop is august 28. at that time, we will be incorporating the input from workshop one and a workshop two and bringing a full ssip program to you. the duration, the costs. we will have another discussion about the raid. we will likely be talking at that time about our public information program and how we are going to roll this out to the public and get the word out to the general population. at that time, the final workshop, the commission will be able to make adjustments. we will still be able to have something fluid, but we're hoping that we can get an endorsement of the program so that we can be able to move forward and have district planning for implementation. >> sorry to interrupt. i do not think my microphone is working. the 28th -- that will be at our regular time, just to confirm, a

1:30 p.m. meeting, correct? commissioner moran: we have not really discussed that, but that would be my assumption. >> ok, because that is our next meeting after this one. we do not have one again in august. commissioner moran: yes, we do. we have two. >> so we can confirm it the next august meeting. commissioner moran: we will. how much is on the advanced calendar for august 28? >> very little. this is supposed to be the more important item of that day. commissioner moran: that being the case, the regular time should be fine. >> ok, thank you. >> by the end of the three workshops, these are the questions that were presented at the first workshop. we're looking to be able to answer these. and then we can get our full ssip. during today's workshop, this is the detailed agenda. we will be talking about the levels of service.

strategies. focusing in on the strategies. we talked about goals and the levels of service before, but today, it is important that we are all on the same page with strategies. i will present that. i will be followed by the program manager who will be talking about program validation. then we will have one of our waste water enterprise staff presenting on green infrastructure and the options we're recommending there. then a program manager will return to talk about collection system options. once again, during the course of the workshop, we will have time so we can be able to talk and you can ask for additional details. there is opportunity for discussion. with that -- i did skip one to by the end of workshop two today, we want to be about the answer these questions. we will have a modification for one of the goals. this was a request for us to take a look at something from commissioner vietor. we will be looking at -- do you

agree with our approach for implementing green and gray? do you agree with the projects we are requesting to move forward? and do you agree with the regulatory approach? with that, we can begin the content of the workshop. one thing i think is important to remember is the ssip is going to help the puc to achieve its vision. we're looking at reliability, providing public health benefits, as well as providing public benefits. we heard today from some of the earlier the earlierodors. we want this program to be a positive in terms of reduction of odors and improvements in terms of visual, but the base is to have a reliable system. we have to look at things that are going to be coming our way that we see already. changes to the regulatory climate. climate change. we have to weigh that with affordability. our responsibility is quite large.

at the last meeting, we talked a little bit about our six goals. these were endorsed back in 2010. and commissioner vietor asked that we revisit the second goal, the storm water goal, which originally read minimize flooding. we did reevaluate that at the commissioner's request, and we think that integrate green and grey infrastructure to manage storm water is a lot more comprehensive. we are really taking things now with an urban water should approach. we're looking at all of our different problems that stem from storm water, and we're looking at solving those in a way that incorporates both grey and green infrastructure. this reinforces the commission's policy to look at things in urban water shed framework. commissioner moran: what was the old version? >> minimize flooding. commissioner moran: ok.

the good thing about the old one was that it had a very particular focus. what has happened to that focus? >> commissioners, if you recall, the discussion of minimizing flooding -- flooding is actually pretty minimal in this city already. only 3% of the city that has the flooding, and that is on the streets. there's very little actual damage claims that we get for flooding, and we have spent millions and millions of dollars. but if you are looking at really managing the storm water, then you're talking about a wide variety of things, including a lot of the other items of better on their including benefits to communities, adapting to climate change, doing a variety of things. that is not just a flooding issue. there may be other issues that impact the citizens of san francisco in terms of the flood waters. that is why we thought it was a broader kind of discussion to have that kind of thing for

storm water. it is not just a flooding issue. even when it is not flooding, there are better and worse ways to handle storm water. encouraging storm water to go on to the offer is better than bringing it out into the bay. it is a larger discussion. does that answer? commissioner moran: i think it does. but there are some places, not large by area, but there are some areas with fairly chronic concerns. i do not want that to get lost from a broader definition. >> what you'll see is that, by managing storm water, you do reduce flooding. we do not believe there is any way to avoid flooding, particularly where homes have been built on top of what used to be lakes or creeks in the city. water will go down. with climate change, you have more intense storms. and you have a 100-year storm or a 1000-year storm, there is

really no way to avoid all flooding. you can minimize the bite managing the storm water. commissioner moran: ok. we need to have that discussion. that is something that i think is syllable, and it is quantifiable and concrete. as far as -- do you know when your done? have you achieve your outcome? those measures help with that as opposed to are we more intelligent yet or have we in tigre -- integrated enough yet? >> if you look to the number of properties that have filed claims against the city in the last 15 years for flooding, it would be substantially less than one-half of 1% of all property in san francisco. and there is no way you'll ever did it to 100%. you are really talking about impacting possibly 0.1% or .2%

in the city. that does not seem to need to focus when there is that a broader focus of managing storm water. >> i agree with president moran. the reason i do is that it is very visible, and people come to us when we have this flooding. so i think we should have it. i am just looking up here. in the notebook, it is not mentioned that it is for flooding. but on your slide, it is. >> the slide says manage storm water with a green and grey infrastructure. in the notebook, the same words are there but it is rearranged. flooding is not in either one. we did take it out after the last meeting. we spend tens of millions of dollars to avoid flooding and floods in the 1980's. we have had $7 million in claims. we spend up to $20 million in

flood avoidance, and he will still have flooding. it will not go away. you need to look at the broader context as our proposal to you does. >> kumbaya proposed modified language. -- could i proposed modified language? could we get the goals back up there? something that might read, you know, maximize green and grey infrastructure to manage storm water and minimize flooding -- maximize green and grey it infrastructure to manage storm water and minimize flooding. >> when we send out the slides to you, is that manage storm water with green and grey infrastructure. people pointed out that the other one started with verbs, and that is why it was wrapped

around to say in degree. it is the same words with the addition -- >> to manage. [laughter] >> we are getting suggestions from various sources. >> could the commission entertain of the concept of this waiting until we get to this ago in the presentation, and then we can look at the level of service strategies? >> [inaudible] >> we are trying to address and incorporate with the other commissioners are saying, that is still be in there, but it is a combination of both. something along the lines of green and grey infrastructure to manage storm water and empress of -- minimize flooding. commissioner moran: my first reaction was i am not sure we

want to maximize infrastructure, but i get your point on it that, and that is helpful. if you can do stuff without large infrastructure, just building big infrastructure is not what we need to do. the idea is to solve problems and to make improvements, which if you can do that without maximizing infrastructure, if you can maximize outcomes, that is better. >> if we could all this connect hour storm drains from our roofs and water our lawns with them, it would not require additional infrastructure. it would have a great impact. >> of course we support the idea of maximizing infrastructure. >> especially if it is green, right? [laughter] >> duly noted. commissioner moran: thank you, and we will come back to that. >> we will get back to that. we will advance the slides. i will briefly ran through the goals and level of service.

this first goal and level of service relates to reliability and regulatory compliance. and prior to discussing the goal, i want to give you a quick tour of our watershed. san francisco occupies about 49 square miles in area. there is a ridge line running through the city from south to north. we have two drainage basins, the west side and the bay side. within this two drainage basins, we had eight distinct watersheds. when a drop of rain falls on the west side, it will find its way towards the pacific ocean. the bay side, of course, towards the day. we will be talking about this a watershed a lot today. it is the largest one in the city, 10.9 miles. the focus of our discussion is the collection system, and challenges we have in the collection system, a lot of them are storm water. and when the volume