copy? >> yes. i have five copies. mine has my notes. >> give him mine. i can see this well. >> there are double sided. we tried to save paper. what you can see are the two permits we have. you will notice that each of them have multiple locations attached to them. the reason why we have a variety of trucks, almost everyone is on our permit, the permit outside of this location, we may choose to work with hamburgers. we may choose to activate that space with a truck that sells

hamburgers. as you will notice, we included all of the menus that we work with. we do not, we have not placed any of them that were mentioned -- i believe it is bacon bacon. we did not place any of them and will not place any of them in this location. because even though the appellant did not request us to have restricted food items, we chose to do so. but, to be clear, the reason we have those trucks is because of the wanted to work with them in another location, we would have to have them on our permit. it is a very simple process. so, when we update our permit, at the multiple permit is new. we are the first individual

group to have this permit that allows us to look at multiple on the same permit. when we update those trucks, we do not receive a revised permit that lists all of our trucks that are part of our permit. we have gone through this process and updated our vendors. in the pellet's brief, they mentioned that we placed a truck at front. there is a process for dpw handling these issues. they could have called dpw and they could have sent somebody to verify and we could have been held in violation. we, without anybody knowing, we placed somebody down there as a mistake. what we did was caught the mistake without anybody mentioning anything to us and two days later, that that truck was added in.

they have the proper documentation. that is why there was confusion. we go out of our way to make sure we operate within the guidelines of what we set, which is higher than any other standards. this is the location. as you can see, there are a two of food facilities in that general area. the one closest to the center of the circle, it is a one hour stop that was probably there during construction. as far as we can tell, it does not locate there anymore. the other one, a stop for a grilled cheese a truck that we believe does not go there anymore because it is out of business and a permit is being transferred.

on top of that, it is only there on fridays and not in the same hours. they have longer hours. >> neither of those are yours. >> neither one. you will see it close to the density of what we are talking about. the single truck permit, and we used with in the open appeals process and nobody objected to it. our truck was out there. there is information there that indicates during the open appeals time, we used our permit and there was no objection to. we feel like what that demonstrates is that it was not an issue. we use that permit for people to demonstrate different concepts. the food there will be changing all the time. this is where we are located

now. it is within 300 feet of properties. we were not placed there. we were given that location. i am going to present you to some alternatives but i think it is important that we recognize that we tried to accommodate grumpy's with what we were able to offer because of the flexibility of the platform we use. we sent staff out three times to find the owner to come up with marketing opportunities, to let them know we were coming down and find out what accommodations could be made. we carried on correspondence with the management team before we went out there and they knew what was going on and they were the ones that suggested an in courage the hamburger restriction should be adequate. it was not until later that the

owner found out and it became problematic. we are not trying to surprise people. we only serve, and we made a voluntary restriction we are not going to sell hamburgers while grumpy's exists. we only placed two trucks out there. we only worked two days a week. all of these were commendations we were trying to make. again, the of the restaurant would make it sound like they are defenseless to trucks coming in and stealing their business. we have no guaranteed parking. if we do not have parking, we cannot locate there. we have no protection from the weather. we have no liquor license. as anybody knows, while happy hour may not start until 3:00,

liquor can provide product the keeps a lot of restaurants and business. we are only there 45 hours -- four to five hours three days a week. it is difficult to see but we have highlighted grumpy's menu. the yellow portion is the portion that is hamburgers. there is another page to the menu which we did not feature because we did not think it was fair but that features breakfast, happy or cocktail sessions. this page, that when you deal with the actual legislation it deals with ethnicity and the composition of the menu. when you look at this, it becomes very clear that the majority of the menu is hamburgers. by us restricting our menu choices, we were accommodating

their request, their needs for restriction even though we did not have to do it. this was the distance of all of the restaurants in the north waterfront association. that is the appellant. other than grumpy's, the closest restaurant is subway, which has marketing power on its own. four hundred 27 feet away. from there, it is not a matter of 310 feet. it is a matter of 400 feet, 500 feet, 600. fog city diner. that is a long way in san francisco. if trucks are hurting you, you have a bigger problem than the trucks that are there at lunchtime two days a week.

this is, you can see the density of office-commercial spaces. there are three circles. the one in red is the area where we chose to locate. you can also see other locations where we have identified there is similar identity. this is the similarity density of food and beverage in the other areas. as you can see, we perceive this and the customers perceived this to be an underserved area for food and beverage which is why we chose to locate there. the appellant mentioned that britain mortar restaurants have a number of costs. so do mobile food vendors. they have to be certified under

the state of california to have their truck legal. they have to be authorized by the public of -- office of public health, they have to go through a stringent permit or that are inspected before they can go and serve. off the grid, in three days of going out managed to collect 700 signatures from people who were supportive of us being there. we were there for three days collecting signatures and we produced this. i want to leave you with this . the withquote is from a food editor located a -- first quote is from a food editor located nearby. "off the grid the is a blessing. -- having off the grid is a

blessing. to my mind, off the grid makes his neighborhood more dynamic." you can read other information as well. i also have a stack of testimonials. i have copies of them if you would like to read more testimonials from customers that are happy with us. thank you. >> commissioners, once again, the appeal for this permit suggests that mistakes were made by the department. this was followed up by mr. cohen who said that this was the first day of the program. i will say that most likely

mistakes were made on that first day. it was not a case where the department looked to obscure or obstruct information to the public. this was an honest mistake. the department of public works is the department that process to this. however, what many people fail to recognize is there are multiple jurisdictions within the city that oversees those portions of the public right-of- way. in this case, their application happened while under court jurisdiction and the department would not be able to issue a permit at that location they decided to move into to an adjacent block around the corner so that it falls under public-

works jurisdiction. staff believes that 300 foot radius, even though it shifted, was sufficient as it relates to notification. it appears that we have erred in that aspect. the interesting part department gleaned from the appellant's argument was that this permit should be denied the requirements of 300 feet notification and we should consider anything beyond 300 feet potentially. there is also something else associated that is less than 300 feet as not applicable in this case. we are not certain the argument in that case. yes, the conditions as it

reviews a mobile foods is ethnicity, the density within the mobile feud community. -- food community. had grumpy's been informed, we would have given the applicant in this case an opportunity to work with grumpy's to resolve this independently prior to holding a public hearing to make a final determination. obviously because they were not informed, this step failed. nevertheless, based upon the information provided, there is an attempt by the applicant to restrict food sales to avoid that direct competition.

one of the rules is not with a need to inform us in any changes of menuhin trucks 72 hours before they operate. they need to inform us ahead of time so we can do the verification independently that there is no direct competition. based upon this information, the department has nothing to add at this point. yes, we failed to make an adjustment to notify the public in this case. i think that is what created the situation. i am not sure based upon the reasoning or the applicants that there could have been a solution less a review in this case.

i am here to answer any question you may have. president hwang: when your department reviews the question of direct competition, what is the scope -- i do not know if i want to say radius, are using the 300 feet boundary? so if the many changes and there is direct competition with restaurants, -- >> the department would try to use that radius as the absolute area that would not involve direct competition. it has suggested we go beyond or we shrink it. because they are in direct competition. nikon is challenging from dept.'s perspective to make that evaluation.

president hwang: you have that discretion. i found that persuasive that if you are at 301 feet, that is one block outside of the jurisdiction. but if you are but350 feet, -- are at 350 feet, you have room to consider the competition of the type of food with those restaurants within the radius. i understand their needs to be lines drawn somewhere but there has to be some space to have discretion. >> absolutely. in this case, i will use a hypothetical. if someone is selling food that serves -- they have a truck that sells hamburgers and they are within 300 feet of a mcdonald's.

i get a complaint and we go to a hearing from mcdonald's saying that they are in direct competition. yes, they are and we think carefully in this case. how much of an impact are we dealing with? how restricted should reestablish that requirement -- should we establish that requirement? one place that sells it portend dollars vs. mcdonald's. we are running into this situation where they were selling gourmet burgers over a cafe that was selling regular burgers. it was very challenging to make an evaluation. >> i am talking about going outside the 300 feet radius. you have discretion under the code as it was argued by the

appellant to consider whether there is direct competition beyond the 300 feet. you have that discretion. >> yes, we do. we did not have a public hearing to evaluate it because they were not notified. >> i was talking in hypothetical. >> if that information was presented, we would do an evaluation based on that information. >> ok. thank you. president hwang: we can take public comments now. can i see a show of hands of how many people intend to speak? if he would line up against the wall that would be helpful. -- if you would line up against the wall that would be helpful.

>> hi, i work at the 401 k that is a small business on the corner of green and battery. we recently moved to this location february of 2011. we were previously on grant and bush, which is the french corridor near the financial district. we came from an area that was saturated with wonderful food options, keeping, everything you could imagine under the sun. we moved to this location, a beautiful business -- beautiful location. we felt we were moving to the suburbs. there is no real food options and that was a complete of every

one of our small business employees who work with us. so across from us was one of the more expensive restaurants. we have the waterfront with a lot of very expensive options but not a lot of options for people who do not make that much money to have that as their lunch every day. there is not a lot of choice. we were so excited when off the grid came there. for many of us, we have to walk to north beach, bring our own lines, just to have some choice. you exhausted the choices you have and how often can you eat a hamburger? it is not good for your body as well as your mind. off the grid day was great options. we were excited to get outside, which we were not doing before. we appreciate that and we will hope you consider off the grid is a good option for the

neighborhood. you are going to have more foot traffic. there are not a lot of options. it did to us out and we appreciate it. for some anecdotal information, i have many friends who go to grumpy's and at lunchtime they do serve dhaka called. -- alcohol. it is great for diversity and we appreciate they are there. president hwang: next speaker, please. >> we are a company at 747 front street. we looked out and saw one day trucks on the street selling food and there was applause in the office of about 100 people.

our company expense in the christmas season to several hundred more people so we moved to this location last october. we found that when we moved, it was a barren wasteland of tauruses for food. more to the point, -- of choices for food. more to the point, it was difficult to find food and get in and get out in the time they had. grumpy's can take 30 minutes, 40 minutes, 60 minutes to get in and out of that establishment. when we saw off the grid come, we thought, this is fantastic. this was more choice that we have. this gave us more options that were not available for people who did not want to have a

hamburger, i did not want to go to a sit-down restaurant. and we really appreciated the diversity of choices that were provided and the opportunity to get out of the office and walked around. we want to say that we support off the grid. president hwang: next speaker, please. >> this is a lecture wanted to submit to the board of appeals. -- letter i wanted to submit to the board of appeals. my name is chris o'day. i work in the area for a

nonprofit. we are at the corner of battery and vallejo. i have worked there four years and i wanted to come and support the food options that off the grid of first. i have worked there for four years and it is tough to speak to other people who usually have great food options but it feels like this a desert of non-food in a city that is so available of great cuisine. there are other options to off the grid. they create a vitality, a social networking through notifications and facebook and things like that which is also a high industry area down there. this is the area that they called media coach -- call media

gulch. most of the morning news, abc, cbs, nbc, are all in this location. i think that a lot of the arguments that after two or three months, you have exhausted most of the food options in this immediate area. the part that matt had made earlier, fog diner is 1,900 feet away. the solution is just as far in the other direction. -- saloon is just as far in the other direction. those complaints are that they are so far away, we do not have good, decent options. we worked in an intense industry where you only get 15, 20 minutes for a break. going somewhere and getting experience. you cannot do that when you take an hour at grumpy's.

grumpy's does serve alcohol at lunchtime. a lot of people who work at 4:00 in the morning, to a clock is their dinner time and it is their drinking time. grumpy's makes most of their money at happy hour. anyone who works in the area knows and sees that it is on the streets. anyway, it it is a great opportunity to have off the grid have the type of food and diversity. it is not hamburger's, it is tikki marsala, diversity that creates excitement that does not exist there with anybody else. i hope to see it would continue. president hwang: is there anybody else who would like to speak? we will move into rebuttal and we will start with mr. ryan.

it is a six minute rebuttal. >> i do not have much to add. i would urge you to follow the line of thinking that i believe you are considering and that is that the 300 ft is an arbitrary number designed to help dpw and struggles with the issue to have some certainty in their jobs. who does not walk two or three blocks to lunch? the choices are great. nice few is great. -- food is great. but brick and mortar businesses are affected by this. i would urge you to look at this permit. it is not what the statute and hands. it is just not. -- statute intends.

it is just not sure if it is not fair. i do not think the legislature intended it to be done this way. i would urge you to, as dpw suggested, step back, reevaluate this permit, and the owner of grumpy's was not involved in these conversations. apparently there were some managers at the restaurant who apparently off the grid spoke to, not the owner. maybe a compromise is what is in order because we think it is excessive. it is not what most of the food truck experiences are like. it is not this. it is a hardship to our clients and we would ask you to reevaluate it, have a director's hearing, a move the permit to one struck -- one truck