improvement association. years ago the plan was hammered out. i don't know what believeous and expert staff has spoken. i don't know what previous commissions could not understand about noncompliant use and i hope you can understand this and do your duty and get rid of this thing in the park. thank you. >> and tag ert cummings, michelle meyers, patrick ryan. >> good evening. my name is chris and i'm an employee at the hanc facility and i oppose the closure of the hanc facility. i do feel that the closure, while they're trying to address many problems in the neighborhood, i do not see that the closure, how that addresses any problem specifically. i mean taking away the recycling center will not stop the homeless problem in the neighborhood and will push the people that recycle into other neighborhoods that do have recycling centers.

once again, i do oppose the closure of the hanc recycling center. thank you. >> thank you. >> two more names, jude koskie, katherine howard. carmen raterra and mark brennan. >> my name is lori. i'm a 21-year resident of the inner sun set. i'm also a deuce paying member of the inner sunset park neighbors but ways never asked what my opinion is on the hanc recycling center. i am completely in favor of keeping the recycling center in its current location. clearly it's not obsolete based on so much of the continual you have heard here tonight. it's being used by homeowners. it's being used by poor people, elderly, homeless. it's being used by gardners. it's being used by a whole myriad of people in our community. so there's nothing obsolete about it. i also want to just add that i have heard that the rec and park commission is considering the installation of a water treatment plant in golden gate park, which sounds like an

industrial use to me. maybe i'm confused by that. but there seems to be somewhat of a contradiction here. and finally, i just want to say that poverty is growing in our community and in fact when there are places and times when poor people gather, it's actually easier to outreach to them to help provide services. and hanc is a place where the san francisco homeless outreach team has outreached to the homeless community to help place them in appropriate service. thank you. >> thank you. >> my name is wayne wily. i'm a hanc employee and i would like to oppose closing hanc for the reason that homelessness is not hanc's problem, it's like san francisco problem and not only san francisco but the world. and most of the people who come there are in fact intelligent and can hold a great conversation.

all of them are willing to help each other and not only each other but anybody who comes there. have i never seen any violence there. have i worked at other recycling centers where it's been crazy and a wreck. that place is like harmonious. it's like the heaven of recycling. other than that, everybody is there who i work with is very nice. have i never seen anybody who opposes the place not even ever show up. some of stuff just comes like out of left field because i would like to invite everybody who opposes the place to come there and just see how it runs as a function and see how beautifully everything goes before you even think about closing it. thank you. >> next speaker, please. >> good evening. my name is chris keen and i live in coal valley. i use golden gate park to ride my bike through. i try every day but i'm not always there. but what struck me is that i

moved here recently from the midwest a few years back is that there's an industrial site in a park. while i'm sure it's good and jat who just spoke said is really honorable, it's the park and rec department, not park, rec and recycling. and i think the homelessness issue, which needs to be addressed by the city and recycling issue, i thought it was terrible the woman who said she couldn't recycle from her apartment the board of supervisors should change that and require that. we shouldn't require parks and rec to fix the recycling program and fix the homeless problem. thank you very much. >> good evening. happy holidays. patrick ryan, immediate past present, former board member. who are the most important visitor tots park? it's the children. it's our city's children.

and that's who i'm speaking on behalf of tonight. yes, hanc does not cause homelessness. what hanc causes is a caravan of homeless people, some of them very dangerous, to cross paths every day with our city's children. i know firsthand because i bring my children to the biggest playground in the city and i have seen the fear in my children's eyes when they have run across belligerent, drunk clients of hanc with unleashed pit bulls. so i don't bring them to the largest playground in the city anymore. i take them across to the playground even though we have to ride our bikes a lot further because my children are afraid to 0 go to that playground. you have a duty to protect the most important and vulnerable visitors to the park, and you're doing your duty and i applaud you for your courage and to do what you must do, which is protect those children. have i seen firsthand what hanc's clients can do. and it causes our children to be put in jeopardy. that, ladies and gentlemen, is a

nuisance. thank you. thank you for your bravery. >> thank you. >> next speaker please. and then we also have carrie duncan, evan campbell, rick seinfeld, kathy carvinger. >> good evening, commissioners. i'm jude koskie, founding board member and dmissioners. i'm jude koskie, founding board member and director of s.f. grow, san francisco garden resource organization. we're fiscally sponsored by san francisco parks trust. since our inception in 2002, our volunteer-led group has provided information and resource referral, education, advocacy and technical assistance to the city's community garden coordinators and gardeners. we were founded on core values centered on equitable access to gardening for all san franciscoans and strongly value the unique opportunity community gardens offer to residents, organizations, businesses and local government to promote shared vision and enhancing the experience and connectiveness to community.

we understand the perplexity of the proposal and in the event it proves the proposal to create a community park guarden, s.f. grow would support its development, if the proposal were approved, s.f. grow would straighten the process to involve the the community ordinance together to best meet the needs of the community. >> i have three more cards, paul green, mark juarez and bruce woof. >> good evening, commissioners. golden gate park preservation appliance. i'm delighted to hear rec and park staff refer to the department as the department's most important planning document f you're going to apply the master plan to the industrial recycling center, then you must apply it throughout golden gate park. you must therefore immediately deny the request to build an industrial water treatment factory and golden gate park. you must also stop the proposed

beach chalet, turf soccer fields and sports lighting. the master plan doesn't make that part of the park as a natural wildlife section. it's not an urban sports stadium. you need to be consistent in how you apply the master plan. if you do not do this, people may assume that you are using the master plan, manipulatively to fit the department's own agenda for golden gate park. thank you. >> good evening. my name is mark brennan, longtime resident of the haight-ashbury. i live three blocks away from this site. any divisiveness that has been created or started up over this issue has been created by hanc and the recycling center. the greatest impediment to improvement and quality of life issues in my neighborhood is hanc.

it is a destination center. it is a dinosaur. it is totally tone deaf for ids neighbors, surrounding areas. it has no lease. has not had a lease since 2001 continue pays participant rents, essentially one penny square foot. it makes no sense for rec and park to subsidize a nonprofit organization who uses the proceeds to find its particularly strange brand of ideological politics to the great detriment of particularly strange brand of ideological politics to the great detriment of my neighborhood. a community garden would be the ideal solution. something that everyone can enjoy and take pride in. thank you. >> thank you. >> next speaker. >> good evening. my name ted and i'm president of the hate ash -- haight-ashbury improvement association. and i want to make point this is not homelessness and goodness of

recycling. this is a business issue at heart. hanc has a contract with the rec and park department, the city of san francisco to rent this land for a purpose. that purpose at one point was a leading edge. it has over the 34 years that the site has been there has really fallen behind the times as recycling has taken on a totally different dimension in the city. so what hanc is before you today is looking for a bailout. her heavily subsidized by state and local funds, as you heard the preenchous speaker stalk about the price they pay for square foot. they should be paying $10,000 a month for that space, not $500. so there before you to try to get a bailout to stay in business in what is is a failed business model at this point, they never bothered to update or revise.

i urge you to support the community garden as a better alternative use of the land. thank you. >> thank you. >> good evening. my name is rich. i have lived in the inner sunset for about 15 years. no one here is against recycling. but this facility is obsolete. it's not necessary anymore. there are supermarkets you can bring your recycling to and more important, there's curbside recycling all over the neighborhood. and all this industrial concern in a residential neighborhood does is act as a magnet to bring people into the neighborhood and raid our recycling every week. it's not just the noise, it's throwing our trash on the street every week to get our bottles and cans. every week have i to go out in

the morning and pick up my trash, pick up the trash of my neighbors, put it back in. the site is obsolete. it's a magnet for a nuisance in the neighborhood and it should be relocated. thank you. >> i'm gilbert johnson. i was born in san francisco 1940. that was several years before it was popular to do so. i have lived in the inner sunset for 57 years. i remember when hanc came in. they were a modest operation that did good work. over the years they've grown. at this time they have grown extremely large. i think i would like to see them move not because i'm against hanc but because i think that they really need a new location

that is more compatible with the scope of what they are doing. i work as a volunteer at the legion of honor as a gardener volunteer. i'm very much in favor of community gardens and i am very much in favor of this one. but i think that the issue has been up a long time and i think it needs to be dealt with in an intelligent way, and i'm seeing an issue that is being railroaded through and it upsets me greatly. thank you. >> thank you. >> hi. my name is michelle welsch, i'm a resident of the haight-ashbury neighborhood, a regular volunteer at the hanc native plant nursery and i oppose the closure of the hanc recycling center and plant nursery. the rec and park department did not hold public hearings on its proposed repurposing and

violated its own stated policy on community input. there are ten jobs at stake here. not to mention the eviction of a highly used public service and your department staff has forged ahead with a divisive and ill-conceived replacement project. i urge the commission to urge its department to start the process of open community hearings on this issue. thank you. >> thank you. >> about afternoon. my name is bruce will. i'm a member and board member of hanc. and first i want to -- we've heard a lot of things here today and a lot of things have been true.

a lot of things are extremely specious. one of the things you haven't considered when it comes to the accusation and allegation around crime is that you have been offered absolutely no data at all. i don't see anybody here from the police department. i don't see a captain here from the park station. and i don't see any data and anything that was presented by your staff. so what i'm showing you here and as quickly as i can is this is from the city's new crime spotting website. and what this shows is live data that is presented every day, like it shows up and alongside over here is lacing -- it's hard to see with the reflection, but it's a listing of all of the different times of crime. as you can see, this is from november 2009 -- and i would appreciate some additional tifmente you have had very serious accusations -- >> i will give you another minute. >> thank you. so here you see around this area, which is cesar stadium, you see a lot of crime since

2009. if we go to november 2010, this is for the entire month. you don't see anything in that area. if we now go one month earlier to october, 2009 -- oops, you have got a lot of crime in that area, ok. and then we go to 2010 and we see absolutely barely none, ok. this is live data from the police department. now, if we open it up wide to the entire city, what do you see here right smack in the middle? that's the stadium. that's the panhandle. and there's no crime there reported. ok. i think you really need to research this -- if you're going to take crime as the issue to remove the recycling center, i think you need to take that issue very seriously based upon

factual data reported. what's the difference between 2009 and 2010? a new captain. thank you. >> thank you. >> next speaker, please. have your names been called? then come on up. i need to you speak into the mic. thank you. >> my name is kathy. given the city wide recycling program and blue bin pickups, i think the recycling center -- >> hold that mic up. >> should i start over? >> yes, start over. we'll give you a minute. >> given the city wide recycling program and weekly blue bin pickups, i think the recycling center should be moved to a more suitable and industrial location. the site on the east end of the golden gate park would be for

vibrant community garden and contribute to the nearby neighborhoods. thank you. >> please come forward. i have called all of the names on all of the cards i have received. so if you would like to speak and your name has not been called, please come on up. thank you. >> david. have i not spoken on this item yet. i think it's appropriate that we're discussing c.r.v. and red herrings since it's hanukkah and time of redemption. but in addition to the previous comments that i made about environmental review, there again is nothing on your calendar item that speaks to the environmental review on this decision. i hope your staff could suggest that. if that has not been properly conducted, i think you should put this over. i agree with the comments from the other speakers that this wie other speakers that this needs further dialogue. i think we have heard a lot of opinion, some of which is not

necessarily factual. i think once people get off their radiological place, which can actually talk about -- the logical place -- ideological place, we can actually talk about crime, homelessness. but as engage in a meaningful dialogue. -- but let us engage in a meaningful dialogue. it is very difficult for people to do that in a minute. thank you for listening. >> my name is evan campbell. i am going to talk about still like, but i want to speak here. i am a big fan of recycling and community gardens. the city does a remarkable job compared to other large cities in the recycling program. what the city could use more of its community gardens. there is a long wait list and not enough of them. parks are -- parks are for people and not industrial use. thank you. >> next speaker, please.

if there is anyone in the north concourse who would like to speak, will you please come up? >> my name is mary sporer. after listening to everything, i think it is really clear that there is something very peculiar about this whole process. we have got here a chimera, a mythical beast made up of the body of one thing and the head of another. i am also reminded once again of lewis carroll, as you have heard your for in the past. it is through the looking glass. sentence first, verdict afterward. this is like a trial of hank that is attached to the body of

the community gardens. it needs more time. there is no way you can make a rational process out of this unless you deal with two completely separate issues. thank you. >> my name is peter zimpone. i volunteer with the nature group and several other neighborhood park groups to restore parks in san francisco. i am a big believer in recycling and the environment and community gardens, but i also believe in our parks and believe the park should be for park activities. recycling is great, but i do not think it is an appropriate occasion for that activity. i think you need to look at where a suitable place for this activity is. i have listened to all these people talking and it does good

work in the community, but i think there are better uses on park land and having a recycling center in golden gate park. >> my name is david marcus. i am a resident of the neighborhood and have been for the last 12 years. i have three kids. they enjoyed the part and what the part is doing. across the board right now, i think that excellence is being evidenced in this decision. parks are a place for gardens, not for industrial efforts like the one we are talking about here for recycling. i think there are sound ideas on the table as to how that effort could be relocated elsewhere, and strongly encourage you to vote in favor of the plans being put forward. i think it is good for us all. thank you. >> my name is kathy bowen. i have lived in the haight ashbury for 10 years.

i am also a public schoolteacher. i heard concern about the well- being of children. as a public schoolteacher, and a fierce advocate of our children. the recycling center an entity that is supporting making this planet a safer, cleaner place for our children. there is also educational programs. children have field trips there. i also support gardens. we have a garden program at my school. we are excited to have learned in the last couple of days that there are other sites that have been proposed for a community garden park that would be more appropriate in terms of sunshine and clean soil. i fully support the hanc recycling center. i am extremely appalled and concerned about the community outreach, or should i said the lack of community a reach, that has taken place in this process, and i urge you to give more time

so that everybody can look to the fact, and also to perhaps meant some of the divisions in our neighborhood that have occurred because of this process. thank you. >> good evening, commissioners. my name is richard ivanhoe. i am the current president of the haight ashbury neighborhood council. i was hoping i would be the last speaker said you could breathe a sigh of relief. i am sorry you have another item on your agenda. we support community gardens. maybe i should borrow one of those tags. but the question is why here, why now. it is the wrong location. as others have said, there has been a community outreach.

that has been a theme throughout this agenda item. we have possession through the end of june. there is time to do community outreach. we encourage you to do so. and maybe the discussion should be what our industrial uses in the park. is the parking lot and industrial use? is the proposed water treatment center and industrial use? -- an industrial use? i have got a letter. i do not know if you already have copies. thank you. >> my name is michael barons. i live in the inner sunset. i would like to say please do not put recyclers and urban gardeners against each other. i think that is the major point i would like to make. there is space for both people. i was raised on a farm.

i consider gardening and recycling both non-industrial uses of the park. some people look at farming and gardening as recreation. recycling is recreation. some people do not. san francisco deserves to be a city that has options. thank you very much. >> i am in favor of keeping the recycling center open, because it taught me how to get rid of vegetable oil. before, and was pouring into my kitchen drain and stuffing up my pipes. today, i take the cooking oil over to the recycling center, and it is picked up. i am thankful to them for showing me how to do that. thank you. >> next speaker. is there anyone else who would like to make public comment on this item? please come forward.

if there is anyone in the north light court that would like to speak on this item, please do come up. >> my name is rubin, and a volunteer with the coalition on homelessness. i have an outreach to homeless folks in golden gate park and have had the pleasure of conversing with some pretty sensitive, intelligent, and thoughtful beings. regarding the area in question. i have walked and jogged through the area many times and have never detected a foul odor or stench. thank you. >> is there anyone else who would like to comment on this item? seeing ninone, public, it is closed. [applause] president buell: go ahead and clap. that is a good idea. and let me thank you for trying to keep your comments to one minute. i know that seems onerous at times, but it is 10 after seven

now and we still have another item that should be a long public hearing. with that, it is in the hands of the commission. i am going to ask for comments and start with commissioner harrison. vice president harrison: i have been around the department for a lot of years. i started working as a gardener in 1964. over the years, i and my fellow gardeners have expressed concern over the hanc and the effects. the term homelessness is not a real term. what i feel is that the hanc center is a resource for these addictive people. they go there and they collect -- and during my term on this commission, i have heard people from the neighborhood come in and complain about the hanc and the folks that go their raiding

their recycle bins, leaving the dust behind and the papers and whatever. as far as my fellow gardeners were concerned, one in particular had such fear from these addictive people that he had to go to psychoanalysis. that may in part be being a gardener. be that as it may. i think that from listening to the folks over the years complain about this hanc thing -- not hanc in and of itself, but their customers rating the local garden cans, and pudding burdens on our gardeners -- the safety of our folks in the park, not that they have anything to do with hanc. but it is an ancillary situation. i think hanc's