in chicago for 50 years during the secession by richard daley. in any case, i can talk about my work on behalf of trees. that is also something that is pretty important and benefits the entire community because of the economic, social, environmental, and other known benefits of a vibrant urban cities. given that i cannot force the planning department to do what is supposed to do, i have filed another lawsuit. in any case, i'd like to sum by saying that i think i would be a person who is broadly representative of the public, as required by the seat of the charter. i believe that disclosure of regulations for political

campaigns, lobbyists, campaign consultants, officials, economic interests are part of overt -- part of open government. if appointed as ethics commissioner, i would continue to advocate for the public's interest to ensure that the city's ethics laws are enforced early in the ways that the public expressed them to be enforced. i could read from the mission statement of the ethics commission. not necessary. with no political agenda it ties, having demonstrate my interest in good and open government, and very tangible ways, i think i could do a good job. supervisor kim: thank you, mr. grossman. are there any questions for the applicants? i have a couple questions, mr. grossman. you talked about the importance of the ethics commission in

being a body that enforces ethics. what do you consider to be the most important charter mandate that is currently not being met by the commission? >> what it is not doing now that could be done? i think it is slowly the slow realization that open government is important for what it does. without that, -- open government and good government work together, hand in hand. supervisor kim: what criteria did you think should be used to determine who registers as a lobbyist? >> who registers as a lobbyist? supervisor kim: what criteria should be used? >> i think anybody who is a hired gun to interface with a

political official should register. you have this great area involving managers. i don't think the way that they cloak it should be the difference. i think the rules should be written in a way that anybody who is actually doing that should register. the other thing i think they should do is to make sure that the person with whom they meet should accurately put that into their calendar. supervisor kim: my last question, this has, been several ethics commission meetings it -- what are your thoughts about televising the commission meetings? >> sorry? supervisor kim: what are your

thoughts on televising the meetings? >> absolutely, no question. supervisor kim: thank you. that is all my questions. but before applying. our next applicant is dorothy liu. -- thank you for applying. our next applicant is dorothy liu. >> thank you, commissioners, for consideration of my application. happy birthday, supervisor farrell. thank you. it would be an honor for me to fill eileen hansen's seat. the reason i applied for this position is two fold. first, as an employment attorney, i advise and counsel organizations all the time on compliance issues.

our largest clients at our firm at golden gate our public entities, public agencies such as the golden gate district and the university of california. i definitely understand the need to work with stakeholders, the need to make sure that everybody understands what the law requires, what needs to be done to comply with the law, and why this type of requirements are in place. i do understand that. i think that in and of itself is important to building trust with the work force because i think a successful organization is only as successful as the labor management coalition ship is with the work force, and i think likewise, as a watchdog for government organizations, the ethics commission needs to explain to the public what is required and why it is and compliance issues and make sure

there is transparency issues with everything we do. our firm has been hired several times by the city of san jose's ethics commission to investigate government practices there. my colleague in my employment group is handling that. our firm is well aware of the importance of open government and good government. so the second reason i applied is because i have always believed in the importance of serving in my community. as you know from my application, i was a longtime member of the community services committee of the asian-american bar association. i was on the committee about eight years and i was co-chair of the committee for four of those eight years. we ran a legal clinic for low

income san francisco residents, in partnership with the asian american caucus, and with the legal outreach. we also partnered with chinatown developed that project chinatown development center on community rebuild some projects. which i know that you are into that place familiar with, supervisor kim. for several years now, the officers of the asian-american bar association have approached me time and again at asking me to become more involved with local government. i have always declined, thinking all i needed to do was stay involved at the community organization level and that i could not really make a difference, did not really have a voice. with this opportunity presented itself, i thought long and hard about it. i decided it would be a good way for me to contribute to my community, the use my legal skills and analytical skills,

and also my interests for perpetuating good government in this capacity. those of the reasons why i applied. as a commissioner, i would be fair and objective, as i am in my day-to-day practice as an attorney as an officer of the court. i would respect the integrity of the board, for certain. i would be open and willing to speak to all of you about issues that need to be addressed. and of course, in my capacity as an attorney, i am always looking to make sure that laws are complied with and enforced. i do have some speakers here who ino may need to leave -- who i know may need to leave. i also have a letter of support that i could give. supervisor kim: i just have a few questions.

i know that mr. grossman is barrett active with the ethics commission before. have you attended or listen to any ethics commission meetings? >> i have, i have. supervisor kim: and having read the charter language, what is the most important mandate that may not be currently met by the commission? >> there are challenges to of limiting rules and regulations. i find that all the time in my own practice with employment. i think it is a challenge to draft rules and regulations that are easy for the public to understand, easy to comply with, but at the same time strike a balance that is not a hindrance or burden to the public. that is something that probably could be improved upon. supervisor kim: same question i asked mr. grossman, what criteria should be used to determine who registers as a lobbyist? any thoughts on that? >> i understand there may be a frustration with certain

individuals or exceptions to that rule, and at that attorneys don't need to register as lobbyists. i understand there is frustration with that, and that may need to be addressed. so that the public does not perceive it as somebody who should be subject to the lobbying regulations that is not. to be honest with you, i would need to review more carefully the argument for and against that as presented to the commission before i could decide on it. supervisor kim: last question, this has come up at several meetings -- is it important to televise the meetings? >> that is tough for me as well. i understand the need for open government and transparent government, and obviously they are public hearings. at the same time, i have given this some thought because i know many courts do not like to publicize hearings, even though

they are public hearings or public proceedings, for the purpose of not turning the court room or the hearing room into an entertainment channel. i think that certainly visual media is different from audio. i think there is a concern about witnesses in the courtroom who may want to testify, who would not necessarily want to be broadcasting their testimony to the entire city at the push of a button. i know they are concerned at that, but at the same time i understand the need. it is a public hearing, and understand the need for openness in government. i think i would just think through those issues and arguments a little bit, weigh both sides a little more before i come to a decision on that. supervisor kim: thank you. at this time, i will be calling

for public comment. >> yes, i would like to call -- supervisor kim: no, no, i call public comment. >> my apologies, chair kim. supervisor kim: i will be callingc these bnames. celia, thomas, patrick, and bruce wolf. >> good afternoon, supervisors, my name is celia lee. i'm here to speak in support of ms. liu. i have been a net attorney in san francisco since 1994, and i know her through the asian- american association. i served from 2008-2009.

i also shared several committees prior to that, and i have also shared the same committee as ms. liu. i want it to mention it was a time-consuming committee. she described that she organized an office staffed of the legal clinic for the indigent and those who are english-language limited. these are some venerable civil rights institutions, such as the asian-american caucus. she also organized a clinic in oakland and at the library program. you also heard, and what to speak about her community service. not in the legal sense, but also in helping to rebuild and retain and tend to the housing projects in chinatown. she organized a lot of community volunteers, students, regular folks, not just lawyers.

i have had the opportunity to work with thims. liu. i have the highest regard for her skills. i think the city would be very much enriched by her service on the ethics commission. thank you. >> good afternoon, supervisors. i'm here to speak on behalf of mr. allen grossman. i have known mr. grossman the last two years. he has been on the sunshine task force. he is one of the strongest advocates of open and transparent government. the relevance of that is the ethics commission is the enforcement agency for when the sunshine ordinance issues orders a determination. for the last two years, unfortunately, the ethics commission has not been forced

any orders of determination. -- has not enforced any orders of determination. i think that is because they're not strong advocates on the ethics commission. regarding ms,. liu, i am sure she is a fine attorney, but i am troubled by the fact she represents the city on many matters. i would think that ms. liu would have to recuse herself at a time there was an ethical issue regarding the city of san francisco. finally, let me say this. i would like to see this committee start appointing more seniors ouon commissions and boards. seniors. a lot of wisdom, and most importantly, they're not looking for the next step on the latter, so that can speak more frankly without fearing the

consequences of their proposals. thank you. >> good afternoon, supervisors. my name is mike. thank you for the opportunity to address you. as ms,. liu indicated, we serve for the san jose ethics commission since 2002. i have worked with 25-30 commissioners, all of whom have been appointed or served on the commission since 2002, and i really have to say that i think ms. liu as all of the qualities past of a commissioner with not only in forcing the ethics laws but also interpreting to the public with those ethics laws require and what impact they may

have. over the course of time i have been dealing with an open government and good government, i think have gained appreciation of the importance of how those affect people in their daily lives and how important is for commissioners to articulate the standards, and also exemplify them and what they do. it is true that ms. liu is a member of a large law firm, but commissioners need to look at all of their qualifications. i can tell you that the influence she would bring to the job would be nothing but the highest. i think we have a sterling reputation for not on the integrity but credibility in this area, and so i would urge you to approve for appointment. thanks. >> good afternoon. my name is grace. i am a resident of the sunset district. i'm a legal writing professor at the university of san

francisco school of law and i'm here to testify on behalf of ms. liu. i have known her in the context of the asian american bar association. she was the co-chair of the search committee. at the time i met her, i was working alongside her in chinatown, pulling weeds and painting buildings and removing graffiti. i have the highest regard for her in terms of her dedication to the community. the chinatown community development center work helps mentor high school students, which was a wonderful activity for lawyers to get involved with, high-school students, talking to them about their futures, in the same vein as a law professor. she and her form -- she and her firm support diversity in education, they hold interviewing clinics. i support diversity in the legal profession and improving our

profession, and she has had a great commitment to that. i think she is smart, hard- working, thoughtful, and analytical, and i support her application to the ethics commission. thank you very much for your time. >> good afternoon. my name is patrick. i have been a resident of san francisco 20 years, here to support the recommendation of dorothy liu. i have known her about 15 years. i have served as general counsel with local agencies, i have gotten to know dorothy through our law firm, through a number of community and civic activities as well as social events. i have no doubt that dorothy would be a strong asset to the ethics commission. she is smart, hard-working, responsible, dedicated, and when she commits to something, she follows through. she uses her analytical skills.

she will be thoroughly prepared for your ethics commission and to understand and evaluate the issues and will work to resolve those issues, knowing her. in portland, she is a wonderful, caring person, somebody was a team player. i think that helps her be successful in all of her various endeavors. i strongly endorse dorothy to the ethics commission. i think she would be very objective and serve with integrity. thank you. >> good afternoon, supervisors. my name is bruce wolf. i occupy seat 8 and served on the sunshine task force. i am here today to support mr. grossman for the appointment seat on to the ethics commission. i want to first report that yesterday at the capitol, we

reported that california gets a d-plus imn terms of transparency in government, which is important for this particular appointment today and for the commission, considering and san francisco we have a very strong sunshine ordinance and we also have a very functional team of watchdogs on both sunshine and ethics. this is very important for the city. we want to make sure we get the right person in place. mr. grossman has been very helpful with many issues, but sunshine and ethics -- both sunshine and ethics. i like that he is not affiliated with any political or business body. he is retired. he has 50 years of experience, which is very important to us. it shows his civic engagement. i think it would be commendable.

because he is also in retirement, he can attend and dedicate a lot of time to this position, which i think is important considering many commissions or boards have difficulty with attendance at this time. in my experience, he has been very tempered. i tend to be more outspoken, and he seems to be more tempered and brings a sense of fairness and balance to the discussion and helps me real myself in. i appreciate his ability to do that and convince people. i would urge your appointment for this person, mr. grossman. thank you. >> good afternoon, supervisors. i am richard. i am here to speak in favor of

the employment of allen grossman for a number of reasons. first of all, mr. grossman modestly said that upon retirement he learned a lot about sunshine. he has done more than that. he is an activist in sunshine, and he has done a great deal to educate the sunshine ordinance task force about sunshine law walls and the way they should be interpreted and applied. i'm here speaking as an individual. we have not taken any vote on the task force or anything like that to support either candidate for this office, but at the task force, there are a couple of things we are involved in. number one, we're trying to draft a set of reforms to the sunshine ordinance to put on the ballot. no. 2, the ethics commission is drafting regulations regarding the handling of sunshine issues, and the ethics commission has very graciously salought the tak

has helped us and putting together both of those packages. another thing i would like to take issue with what was said about televising b. meetings. she said it might become entertainment meetings. well, this meeting is being televised. i don't think that anyone has given that kind of disspiriting assessment to the televising of those meetings. i think that the task force meetings should be televised. thank you.

>> good afternoon. i am a longtime member of the league of women voters and passed president. i am here to offer my strong personal support for mr. grossman. how in history elkin way he has explained how the ethics commission has been fulfilling.

this particular seat that you point is to be generally representative of the public. mr. grossman is a model public citizen. whenever the three years that i served on the task force, i have found mr. grossman to be a strong, knowledgeable, and articulate advocate for the public. he is wise, fair, passionate. he often calls us to task and helps us learn how we can be more effective. he has been helpful to us.

he has been working with us to improve how we do our job and we need him to be on the commission to support san francisco. >> good afternoon, supervisors. i am a friend of dorothy. i have been a resident of san francisco since 1993. when i think about the qualities of a commissioner on the ethics commission, i want someone who is responsible, as integrity, and they have strong analytical skills.

she conducts herself with dignity and decorum. if you were starting from scratch, you would be well served by using her as a prototype. i have seen her counsel and guide her compliance to understand. i have watched as the people develop trust that she had researched and analyze issues the early. she can work to build consensus and build her share of the work.

she looks for ways to contribute to the community. she is always willing to participate. most recently, the cycle for survival. think you. she can be counted upon to do what she says and be trusted to give reason to guidance. thank you. >> the commission is suffering the d