it gets better. and the bullying, and the suicide. there were a ton of kids that came out. his clientele is mostly kids. it is good to see him coming out. president newlin: the one to conclude your report? -- do you want to conclude your report? >> yes, sir. all three of those venues are basically violating the same issue which is operation without a permit or a place of entertainment. all three are restaurants. it goes back to what we talked about in the past, the increase of restaurants.

it is a hard economic time to make ends meet. the rest, we have had the violence that you see, there is nothing majorly out of the ordinary that makes it above kind of the average of random club of violence. it is actually a good thing. so far, we are finishing up in june. june, july, august can be hard months for the entertainment industry so far as violence. the summer is starting off pretty tame. it has to do with the work done by the staff and the work done by the police department and closely monitoring and managing entertainment out bear.

president newlin: i would lik e to go to item number six. supervisor wiener is waiting to participate. the commission may adopt the recommendation concerning this ordinance. supervisor wiener? >> the sponsor of the legislation is actually supervisor mirkarimi. the supervisor from the office is here to talk about it. in addition, we added some maps that you can look at as well as information from the small business commission. i will turn it over to rob.

he will at whatever he feels is appropriate. >> i'm an aide in supervisor mirkarimi's office. he regrets not being able to be here, but the history of a is that small business owners approach supervisor mirkarimi and your commission and expressed interest in getting the opportunity to have affordable permit to offer a modest amount of live performances in their venues. this legislation addresses a gap in the city's permit as an accessory use. in restaurants, cafes, bars, and other small businesses.

it creates a permit for a modest level of live performances where it is currently not allowed. from what we understand, and hundreds of others cannot legally offer their customers live performances because the only permit available is one suitable for nightclubs and intended for that. the owner wanting to have a live performance would be required to obtain a permit as you out at what cost $1,700 for a non- refundable application fee. in the cafe would have to be creating a security plan associated with major events. it comes with a fairly significant cost of $2,000 as we understand it.

so these current requirements are cost prohibited that just wish to offer a live performance for discrete periods of time. it obviously contributes to the vibrancy and the diversity of the neighborhood. the result of this situation of not being able to get these permits is we think loss of business for the businesses' reduced tax revenue, fewer opportunity for performers and for residents who enjoy business and culture and the arts. we believe that this legislation is good for small business, good for musicians an other performers and good for san

franciscans and visitors who appreciate live performance. there is an issue with the geography of this legislation and it covers the same territory that the current covers as with a right or conditional use. the difference with our permit that we're offering with the legislation that we're offering is it will not require a conditional use permit. we feel like -- these permits are expected to have a far smaller impact on the neighborhoods and the performance for at least a year is only allowed until 10:00 p.m. and so we felt like it was appropriate to make them available to more businesses which by the way will respect a big savings for small businesses because the price tag that's associated with a conditional use permit. i'll give you a few details

about the application process and the enforcement of the performance rather than the $3,000 or $4,000 tab. it will be a $385 application fee and a $395 annual renewal fee. upon submital of a submitted application, each application will be submitted to the police department and recommendation to the planning department. the planning department will review the applications to ensure compliance and there will be a hearing at your commission. your commission may impose specific conditions relevant to the specific applicant. i think you also have some details about the enforcement of the permit in your material as well. but performance is allowed only until 10:00 p.m. for one year. after one year, they may operate

after midnight. if there have not been any nuance concerns then there is a possibility that it would be ex-tened into midnight. the hours may be reduced and businesses must comply with health, zoning, fire and other basic requirements of any business establishment. d.j. performances are not permitted as the legislation is now written and there are some other details which i think are in your materials. but that gives you a review of the proposed legislation. >> thank you. >> i'm happy to take any questions you may have about it. and i know regina's here from the small business office as well. >> maybe supervisor wiener? did you want to address this issue and the small business before we start questioning? >> yeah. >> feel free to to come up.

>> good evening, commissioners. thank you for having me tonight. i want to thank supervisor mirkarimi for taking the co-sponsor with him. i believe it's a very important legislation. one of my priorities as supervisor has really make sure that we continue to have a vibrant entertainment and night life scene in san francisco and we do in a lot of ways. but there is one hole and you go to -- of course, some other major cultural centers. the person playing the guitar or whatever in a cafe or restaurant where you don't really hear it outside but it is something that has the experience in the establishment.

that's something we're missing in san francisco, in terms of the hurdles of being able to get to the point where you can have that minimal level of live music. so i think fills that hole and i think it will just increase both the cultural and economic contribution of the entertainment sector in san francisco and that's why i'm supporting it. i understand that there are some neighborhoods that are being excluded from this ordinance. i'm not supportive of doing that. i -- i -- when it comes to the board, that's a conversation that we'll have especially with the district supervisors whose districts contain those neighborhoods but as the legislation stands right now, do i urge you to support it. thank you. >> thank you. >> good evening, commissioner, regina dickness director of the

small office of business. i want to thank supervisor mirkarimi, thank your staff director cain for working on this piece of legislation together. as rob had mentioned that this is something i know that your staff has dealt with over the years. the small business commission wants the commission center opened up. we're planning on opening up restaurants and cafes and one is to have music as an ack second sorry use and when we explain the permitting process and a lot of them are in our commercial district areas which you have a map that shows where currently entertainment is permitted and as a conditional use. it has the map with the blue and orange on it.

did you put it in the packet? >> that one right there. >> it doesn't really show on the overhead but as you can see on the western part of the city where we have many of our neighborhood corridors. entertainment is conditional use which as rob had pointed out the cost could be close to $4,000. so this made it very prohibitive and very expensive and it was a great disappointment. and then as the economy -- as the economy changed and businesses were wanting ways to bring in customers, retain their customers, this was also another thing that was expressed to our office and also heard to supervisor mirkarimi from his stitch wensy and -- and -- and

also from our merchant corridors, they're looking at ways in ways they can keep neighbors inside their district and staying in their district and being able to have a glass of wine and hear music, they have to leave their district. i think of my favorite indian restaurant and it yutes to have its saturday night tabla players. and it doesn't have it anymore because it can't afford the entertainment permit. so this was -- this has been something that we've heard from our business community. i do want to thank your director and supervisor mirkarimi for being committed in making this an affordable permit. what we really see is that we have our small businesses, one that operate with low profit margins who are really wanting to access this and thinking about the neighborhood where the economic -- we're trying to do

economic revival as well. our commission did vote to recommend this, though with the recommendation to include back in the area that are not -- or not back in -- but to include the areas where entertainment is not permitted but to also allow the limited live performance permit to be permitted in those particular areas which we have identified and you have a copy of the commission's recommendation for west portal, pacific avenue and the south of market and the c district and the parts of the market area. we understand that there are some with the west -- western somea that there are some rezoning proposals, but should this legislation pass this and then with the new zoning -- new zoning that's coming through with the western soma area,

there will still be pars of south of market that still will not be able to apply for this permit around 4th street, 3rd street, the south of market. and so the commission has made that recommendation and encouraging the district supervisors to consider requesting supervisor mirkarimi to add those back in. and i'll be happy to answer any questions if you need me. >> commissioner cain, do you have any questions? do you want to -- >> no, i mean, i think it was weighed out very well. i want to remind you that most of the people here are here for public comment. maybe you want to listen to public comment before your questions. >> i think we'll take questions -- >> whatever works for you. >> yes? >> yes. >> commissioner ricco. >> ms. andrisy. would you come back up?

couple questions. we've obviously spoken regarding the western soma zoning district. so i understand your recommendations with regard to neighborhood commercial corridors and i think it's very short sighted on the part of the planning department to create neighborhood commercial corridors and then not do anything to make them work. and that's what we have in the case of 6th street. it's just a label. it doesn't mean anything because as part of the eastern neighborhood process, they just didn't want to touch the whole subject of entertainment. in fact, as dan cider told me, they were afraid that if they got into all the wrangling that goes along with changing the status of entertainment, that it would probably bring the entire eastern neighborhood's plan down. so understandably they left

everything just the way it was. but i think it's a real shame that 6th street has the hope of becoming a vibrant, interesting proactive neighborhood that would benefit the community as well as the small businesses. with regard to western somea, which i have a small interest in , the areas that you outlined will be rezoned in the next six months, eight months or nine months or so. what they will ultimately be zoned for is called mixed use general. and the purpose of mixed use general is to put together as many compatible uses as possible. there are other parts of suth of market particularly the whole area south of harrison street

which accounts for about a third of the entire special use district which will be rezoned sally which is service, arts and lights industrial. and we've gone so far as to bring down the housing action coalition upon us by saying no residential at all. so the theory is, you know, we have probably the most places of entertainment in the whole city, is that correct director cain? there's always an argument between us and north beach. >> i don't know who wins. but it's close. you can see on the map. >> and i can assure you that every single venue in the south of market has some conflict with their neighbors already. so what we're trying to do is avoid putting more incompatible uses side by side. so i think it really works very

well to take the area south of the street to say we would like all forms of entertainment and that's a major step forward, this limited live performance would certainly be welcomed along with perform o.e.'s an everything else. especially because we're not going to be anymore housing there. then in the case of m.u.g.'s, we're under pressure to put in a lot of housing. the western soma plan is going to be adding 3,000 or 4,000 more units of housing. and since we fenced off sally and have stricter zoning in this street, we're putting new residential areas so i would caution your commission to step very carefully before they create more incompatible uses and whether this form of entertainment is incompatible or

not, i'd like to add that conversation with mr. soma but just a message to the small business commission, you know, you have to be very careful of -- the reason it's a planning process is you try to plan for the impacts of these -- these sors of things. and so i would just ask you to take that message back to your commission. >> will do. and just a couple of points. so for the west portal area, they want to maintain entertainment as not permitted but still be able to have the limited live performance because they see this is not in conflict with the residents and will actually keep the residents in their neighborhood commercial corridor. many of the businesses that we talked to are talking about daytime use. so they're talking about sunday brunch, early afternoon. so you noit, i think a lot of times we've talked to -- excuse me, if we could wave a magic wand and just create limited

intensity venues that would be a wonderful world. but that's a conversation -- >> just a couple of other points is that the "south park" district which is not in the western soma task force plan, they would not be able to to -- be able to apply for a permit and also the s.l.i. area that's out of this proposed -- this area of western s of course msks a task force area which is 3rd street, 4th street, that particular area where 25 loss orson, those businesses they would not be able to apply for a permit. >> right. thank you. >> yes? joseph. >> so i guess my question to this -- it's clear that you say no d.j.'s so no dance clubs would come of this at all, correct? >> i heard the first part. >> no d.j.'s. >> correct. it's no d.j.'s it's live music.

i just want to bring to -- to -- to light to my commissioners, we had just two examples. we had catch restaurant on market street that had a piano player for years and now that space where the piano was which is above is empty because they can't -- they just couldn't afford to do it with the permit. but they did have a piano player. and then the revolution cafe, i don't know if commissioners -- commissioner micko you may remember this. permitting this little bitty coffee shop on mission and they had a guy show up with the cello playing jazz. they needed a full board entertainment permit. and it was -- it was very onerous on them to -- to apply for that. i for one want to say i am not

for any exclusions at all -- and i'm also not for waiting for the rezoning process because this rezoning process has taken years and to think that it might happen in the next six or eight months is just -- it's just too out there for me to even think that may be real. so that was that. also with regard to west portal which is very close to where i live, there are lots of restaurants that would probably do much better if they have this to keep people in the neighborhood. and as far as incompatible uses, i think that's what this commission is for is to adjust for any incompatible uses and since they're going to have to come before our commission anyway, is that correct? >> yes. >> yeah, so then we can condition and adjust for that. now this permit that goes until 10:00 at night, can we adjust it so it goes to 9:00 at night if

we had to or is it guaranteed to go to 10:00 at night? >> i think the way it's written, is that your commission will review the -- it and make modifications. >> great. >> just quickly, you mentioned west portal. i have an update on west portal. supervisor mirkarimi's stance on this has been that the place of entertainment map is the guiding map as i've explained and as regina explained but is very clearly stated if there is consensus in that commercial district that they want to be included in the area supervisor wants to make an amendment to the legislation, they can come to supervisor mirkarimi and offer to make that amendment. and he called our office and said they were interested in doing that. >> yeah, there's a great italian restaurant called spiazo's that struggled.

and i think if they were able to have a guitar player or a piano player they might not struggle quite as much, for sure. >> i'm going to be a little bit more long winded than i am on occasion. >> i thought you covered everything already. >> commissioner -- thank you, mr. solma. before i say anything else, let me be totally clear that i am supportive of this legislation. i think, you know, we've been dealing with this question south of market for years and years. and to have different levels of entertainment, we try limbed entertainment permits for venues of 99 or less. we had ack second sorry entertainment and then the

planning department says we couldn't call it accesory, we had to call it complimentary. and it went on and on and on. we want to turn folsom street into a vibrant portal. right now it's just an industrial area. but every time you talk to someone in the neighborhood about the idea of it becomes the ceremonial center of south of market, they light up. you talk to them about two-way traffic and good transit service and ground level retail and all the things that go with neighborhood commercial, doctor's offices and dentist offices up on the second floor and housing further above. so this is all a positive thing. in other community meetings we came to a consensus but something we'd like to see is create the ability for restaurants and bookstores, art galleries and all of that to be

able to feature forms of entertainment. and so it's all a positive thing. i have concerns in just three areas and i think they could all be rectified if everybody of good will comes together and is honest with each other. first is the spin vs. the reality of this. the press is looking to summarize this idea in five words or less. nothing bad about the media. you have to cite your former career. five words or less i think they like to summarize this as folk singer in restaurant. and that's a great thing. and when i first spoke to supervisor mirkarimi, he was adamant about the fact that amplification was not necessary. but after a few trips to our

city attorney, it seems that there's no limit on amplification. that's correct, right? >> there is no limit on amplification in this legislation, no. with the exception of the fact that d.j.'s are not permitted as already han been stated. >> right. now the sound control the standard that we hold for night clubs is they must have adequate ventilation so that at all times the entertainment is presented all doors and windows should be closed. now, you don't apply that standard i would think on the one hand you don't want to have to put a burden on a small business to install ventilation, the kind of vent -- ventilation that we ask of night clubs. but i think the language is essentially the sound is not to

be audible outside if the doors and windows are closed, if that's correct? >> that's correct. >> ok. it doesn't require doors an windows to be closed. >> that's correct. >> and i assume if northbound's complaining, doors and windows could be wide open. that's the case, right? >> yes. and you have to keep in mind that there are provisions in the process that if there are complaints and there are problems, and there are issues in the neighborhood, then it could come right back before this commission and if the doors and windows being open in that particular location had created a particular problem then that can be addressed at the time. >> are there requirements for sound inspections before they get their permits? >> they are the same -- i don't believe so unless there are those kind of requirements that exist at every business in the city already. >> place of entertainment requires a sound inspection. would this require a sound