>> grieving, commissioners. it is basically battery model, as you can see. it is usually an over-the- counter permit. >> can you put that on the overhead? the actual permit? >> if you look in the file we provided, it would not be there. how you would have to have brought it yourself.

>> this is just a print out of the permit details report. we don't have the actual building permits. i have not got it with me. this gives the information pretty much similar to the permit. missing signatures and stuff. the permit would have required a separate employment typical of any other permit. the work would have had to comply with the practices for lead based paint because it is a remodeled. and having got through the phase of demolition, it would require that of the tenants. they would be given three days' notice of the work. there will have to of been containment and clean-up.

and if they had any problem with that, they could call and we would have sent someone from the program to make sure that that happens. i saw that in the brief period i would be available for any questions you have on the permit. >> there was a copy of the plumbing permits. it references 342, i don't know what has been appealed to us. >> i was under the impression that it was the building permit that had been appealed. >> and it references work and multiple units? >> hit references 342. the other permit, i would like to talk about that as well, but

the appellate has not shown up for it. >> you can provide us with the appropriate context. go ahead. >> i would like to speak about the permit. it seems like it is remodeling a bathroom for plumbing. it goes on to say that it will comply with a a different complaints with notices of violation. when i looked at this permit, i would have problems with the way the permit was issued because it was not specific for all the work that would be required for the notices of violation. the rear stairs need to be replaced. there is another that is ready for pickup for that. one of these complaints references the remodel. it would not allow you to

remodel four units. i am not sure it got issued by the department, there have been inspections on that one. i believe it was for 340. that is the downstairs unit that we spoke of an earlier. there are problems with the permit. the date is may 4. >> i am assuming that based on the permit number for 340, it is may 12. >> that is correct. >> i am also assuming that the permit was picked up because of the additional work that they found when they were working on in. >> the photographs they were

shelling -- i thought the photographs were wall framing, not for framing. i was there this morning, actually. i don't know what is underneath it. i assume that when they were doing the work, they could have flecked the floor because the ceiling was opened. if that involved the removal of the tile above, i am not sure. there are 10 active notices of complaints. it would just repeat it is the

scope of the work. if you're going to remodel the bathroom, you might work with the sink. the toilet would have to be there every night to make sure that they had use of the pilots. and maybe in the bedroom light in the old days. he tried to get the work done as quickly as possible. i wanted to add that just speaking as an old carpenter. >> if the unit below, they were working on the ceiling end opened up and saw the four of the above, they saw that it was damaged, then what? what we heard from council is that was not safe. what is the next step?

>> with a matter of some dry rot, you may need to take the tie up on the floor above or you can do those repairs and with the ceiling and open. you could do the work. i am not sure if that meant that maybe it was the foreign debt was damaged or something like that. if it was really unsafe, we would have ha -- >> how do you contain the lead paint from where a person is actually living, breathing? >> is a good question.

is pretty in death. you have that on the floor. he might have to have it on the floor of the old unit and make sure that it does not know -- and there are more concerned when there are children under the age of 6. vacco does require containment. >> you have particular inspectors and respond to this kind of complaint? >> we would have somebody out on the same day. it is usually educational. if you have to do this properly. if it is really bad, we will try to give them a warning. i think the contractors have to go through certification now.

it is left to the contractors to do it properly. it is something that would be in the common area of the building. and also may be on the door of the unit. dodge and people who know this? -- >> and people of this? >> people get freaked out by this. we get a lot of calls about it. there are different requirements for the interior and an exterior of a building. if you are working in the bathroom, contain the dust of that area. more questions? president goh: any public comment on this item?

lou will move into rebuttal. you have three minutes of rebuttal. >> i failed to mention the eye and a licensed contractor and there are very strict regulations when dealing with lead based paint in any way. there has been a tent there that has been living there for 13 years. i do not have the key to anyone's apartment. i had one shower on june 13. i know that because i was going

to trial that morning and i wanted to shower before and thi went. i used the shower of an elderly man i know from tennis club. the port-a-potty was not a favor, it is required that he puts that there for the worker's use. i know he had, in writing, an agreement with a gentleman. it was told through his construction worker that -- they would be bathing in using my color. it was requested in writing that they have other arrangements. i've believe he made those arrangements.

he never once made arrangements with me verbally and not written. i think i remember now, and hearing him talk about closing the floors and the walls, i believe after i filed the appeal on the eleventh -- and they worked very late in the night to close of the walls before an inspector came. i believe that they did not want to show that they had access to my floor. i would continue aiding and my tub and i did not falter before.

that is i think all i had to say. commissioner garcia: i apologize , is there an accent on the e? greo? he is under the impression that normally for a situation like this, and arrangements and accommodations should be made. >> in no way that would have been unruly and away and i would be given adequate time, -- >> of the as the will of the board or if we have the authority.

president goh: thank you. mr. epstein. >> just to address what he mentioned in regard to the floor, for itself it was unsafe and could not be addressed from below. there were issues, apparently, inside the walls. the complaint to me that they were damp and wanted to get inside the walls to take a look at that issue.

the part of the permit the says remodeled units had to deal with the fact there was done -- there was work done without permits prior. that is why is there. -- he is there. -- it is there. and it's my understanding that subsequent permits would be under this application as was my understanding of the permit for the heaters in 348. it was under this application as an additional permanent. that was the intention to have the application theire as the need arose. we tried to work with her attorney. they demanded that we get a crew in that would work 24 hours a

day and we told her that we could not do that because building can only be done during certain hours. she was unreasonable in her demands, and i am a little upset that the tenant had to go so long, he is a day and a half away from having a bathroom. i want to accommodate her in a way that will work for everyone. there has been no reasonable request that could be granted. does anyone have any questions? >> what kind of time frame are we looking at to complete the work on her bathroom? >> the time estimate appears to be fairly accurate downstairs.

i spoke to a contractor prior to him commencing the job and working around having a to live there as much as possible during that time. when there is no floor, you can't have a toilet. it needs to be the focus of how he did his work. when i say three weeks, that is from start to finish. commissioner garcia: would you -- forgive me. i don't know that i would be using the word reasonable of five offered one day notice and port-a-potty. what would be a reasonable arrangement or accommodation while the work is being done? >> i don't know.

she hasn't paid rent, so she has $3,000 with which to go to a motel. i don't know the answer. i can tell you that allowing the contractor in to remove her shower and then stopping work for months doesn't make any sense to me. i think it is reflective of the attitude i got from her attorney with regard to trying to find an accommodation that would work. i don't have any ideas, but i am open. commissioner garcia: what would you want done if you lived in that unit? what accommodation or arrangement would you ask for if you were the tenth? >> i would ask to be not required to pay rent. i would ask that shower facilities be made available to me, and i would ask that i will

be able to use a restaurant. -- the rest room. i am probably not as sensitive to the environment that she might be. not that i want to make an issue of gender differences. but ellen be perfectly ok if the tenant downstairs with her for the ok using the port-a-potty. commissioner garcia: three weeks? you offered that in writing? >> i offered that in a telephone conversation with her attorney. commissioner garcia: thank you. president goh: anything further? >> i just want to make the point that the permanent -- it has not

received a final inspection yet. they address the notices and violations separately. it is only a $5,300 costs. a r eight notices of violation and remodel of four units. there is another from for the stairs, but it does not cover -- it is not specific to a scope of work. we could easily applies them to get the permit properly. i don't know how these violations not put on the -- is not the right permit. it is certainly nothing else. i just wanted to add that.

>> the appellant is not here, and i am not sure how we will deal with the case here. perhaps based on what you're saying, it will not determine that particular case. >> the other thing, a couple of months ago we had until a unit was vacant and it was the unit the other people would use while the work was happening in their unit. >> so just to be clear, even if we do nothing, your department can revel kitten and start over and fix the issues? >> they could not be done on the sperm that -- on this permit. the cost is too low.

commissioner peterson: i have another question for mr. epstein. was she effected -- she evicted? >> she got a one week stay. >> there is a possibility that her unit may be vacated? >> she would have used of the bathroom without a doubt. commissioner garcia: assuming you get a new permit. commissioner peterson: that was my question. >> on that permit, i agree with

mr. duffy to address the borad -- broad and general things. the completion of the bathroom, i would absolutely past that we be permitted to complete that. i think he plumbing pipe is on there. >> i think you would be better to take that offline with mr. duffy. >> commissioners? >> i will start, but i am not sure i am going anywhere. it is difficult to see the position from both sides. on the one hand, i don't know

why you appeal something that takes you three months alcohol stopping the work that you want. i am not quite sure what to do. commissioner garcia: i am concerned about dealing with things that have to do with code and the authority. i would think that the accommodations thing and all that would have been a rent board issue. someone could come in with -- your alternative would be, and even if weather was awful, walk to take a shower. the loo will be a port-a-potty in front of your house. i would hope that -- i don't

want to say that. mr. eppstein would have said, i think it is clear -- what is being done as proposed to be done. it is a serious inconvenience for tenants. i dunno what the authority is or how we solve this problem. if what was suggested blood certainly be a reasonable accommodation to have the appellate be able to do that bathroom. until that happens, i don't know what to do.

commissioner peterson: this is a difficult case presented to us. there are perspectives from both sides that have compelling points raised. i don't know where i am going at this particular moment. >> >> perhaps the parties can adjourn and we will see if we can come to a conclusion. >> we need mr. duffy for the

next case. >> you have to come to the microphone if you're going to speak. what she is a represented a party in the case that involves premises. i'm not sure if i am permitted to have direct communication with her on substantive matters. >> her council is not here? >> her council is not here. >> she can waive it. >> i still cannot. >> we can continue it for one week. >> it would be two weeks at a minimum. >> we have to bite the bullet somewhere. >> do you understand the discussion now?

i don't mean to suggest that you're not capable. i am not a lawyer. i assume that you are not also. this thing is to be reconciled in terms of some reasonable accommodation. it has been suggested because he is going against you in another matter that he would be barred from speaking with you directly but you can wave that. then you can have this conversation not about your lawsuit or anything else but how you solve the problems before us and that is to get the work done that needs to be done to your unit as quickly as possible and some possible arrangement that could be made that you would find to be reasonable. >> i would be more probable if i could have a day or two. i don't think my attorney would be happy with me doing that. there has been too much

mistrust. maybe -- i don't know what the answer is, a day, two days. >> you would have a minimum of two weeks. >> look, i have made it this far. >> thank you. you responded to the question. we can take it from here. >> we have not even decided that will happen. >> i don't know what we can solve by holding this permit up any further. i am inclined to uphold the permit and all of the work to proceed. >> i feel the same way. i think