no wage, w-a-g-e, within a been a contractor's bid as others nearly double-no way to establish any kind of parity. the way in which an independent contractors paid is not based on wages. if you're trying to establish a prevailing wage, meaning a minimum standard, ordinarily cannot apply it in the context of an independent contractor. by definition, the ways in which and the contractors are paid, it varies all over the map. whereas if you had a wage, it is one set of standards that everybody understands when you talk about it. supervisor chu: supervisor mirkarimi has joined us. for example, you are saying if you are an independent contractor, you're provided a certain amount to complete a job, basically. you do not say necessarily how many hours or you're not required to say i am going to spend 10 hours on it and that is it, to israel to complete a job basically. >> it would generally be piece

rate, but not always that way. witt and to the contractors, it could be based on an hours estimate. but it would not necessarily be that way. if the alternative was to say let's include and the contractors, we would have to have a set of regulations that would be fine with a can put into their contracts so we could read the same level playing field. supervisor chu: ok, thank you. next speaker. >> i am the executive director of the san francisco labor council, representing 150 different unions in town, and i do a lot of work on labor law enforcement. thank you, budget share chu and supervisor kim, and a supervisor weaner for sponsoring this legislation. and supervisor mirkarimi -- and supervisor wiener, some as a

mirkarimi, good to see. we want to move this forward with recommendations. i know that all of you, as supervisors, as well as the mayor's office and the compliance office and everybody in san francisco has scratched their heads over some of the contracts they have had to get out where, ultimately, you have found out that workers are being exploited after these contracts are out because of loopholes. in particular, industries that we're talking about right now, the building construction trades, prevailing wages are firmly embedded in the city charter. that has been the model that these other industries have been trying to replicate as they move forward. i just want to say that -- and again, as we recommend in the labor council that we move forward, that to answer some of the questions about the independent contractors, i have been a labor representative an organizer for over 20 years. probably one of the most

difficult things that i have had to witness and see over the last 20 + years is the increasing use of independent contractors. [bell rings] and the use of and that and contractors has been very strictly that there is exploitation involved. and that is what we are seeing, and that is why we're trying to address this. they get to hide the wages. they get to give people a certain amount of money and let them go off on their own, and wages go down, standard of living goes down, and in many of our campaigns, there to make sure that this type of standard of exploiting our workers moves forward, and that is what independent contractors do. we really urge you to move this forward with recommendations. and we really thank you in sentences go here for seen this type of labor law moving forward. thank you. supervisor chu: thank you. >> good morning.

my name is bob merlis, secretary-treasurer of local 350 peter i am here to ask for your support. i think it is an important message for the board of supervisors to send to the communities that the workers, our garbageman in this city and recycling employees and yard waste employees deserve your support, that you send this ordinance directly to the board of supervisors with your full recommendation so that our members will have peace of mind that you do have a care for the duties as they serve your communities. so i think supervisor wiener for introducing this ordinance, and i hope it goes out of this committee with your full recommendation. see why so much -- thank you so much. supervisor chu: thank you. >> good morning. metzler with teamsters local

665, and we represent workers affected by this legislation as well. the work in the city garages in san francisco. in february, 14 of those garages will be awarded to new operators, and the lack of acrimony and lack of displacement and other disruptions to both the public and to members and our families will be evident by the current legislation and hopefully by the improvements that are going to be brought about when this is moved to the full board. we really appreciate everyone who is supporting this legislation. i also want to echo what was said as far as in the and the contractors, a little bit of history. at one garage some years ago, unbeknownst to us, management had brought in people to do our work. as we were uncovering it, we found out that they actually inc. workers as a business individually amongst themselves in the city garage.

there were in there for a few months. fortunately, we were able to do something. but it gives you an example of what the problem is with these and the contractors. it is an opportunity for people to be exploited in the workplace. in this case, on city property. it was a terrible idea that some management people had. fortunately, we were able to put a stop to it. i hope that you are reviewing all of this, you'll recognize that their people out there that take advantage of others. especially low-wage workers. [bell rings] again, we appreciate you moving this to the full board for approval. thank you. supervisor chu: thank you. next speaker. >> good morning, supervisors. the last time that i was in front of you, we had members from local 261 and 87, janitors, and i am proud to see a lot of the members of the teamsters here today. we have been attending these hearings because this

legislation is for all of our unions. this is monumental. being able to close a lot of the loopholes that contractors have been able to exploit to get a route from being able to pay those wages that are so necessary for a lot of the families that we represent. i want to thank supervisor wiener for presenting this legislation, because for the families we represent, it is absolutely important. i want to ask the supervisors on this committee, supervisor mirkarimi and supervisor chu and supervisor kim, we need your recommendation to keep this going forward. we cannot do it without having supervisors like ourselves being able to make a conscious decision and made a decision that is absolutely fundamental in maintaining the standards of san francisco working families. thank you so much.

>> i am with brightline. we spoke at the last committee hearing on this in support of the legislation, moreover in support of what we heard several speakers talk about, which was an opportunity to go even further in promoting opportunities for workers and standards for city contracts, and that was by adding an amendment to cover landscaping. at the time, that was not going to happen because there was idea to move the before the end of the year. zagat the late. people got excited about seeing an amendment because we make the decisions on how we hire locally, how we expand into tax sectors, which supervisor kim and murdering have worked on with respect to some of the efforts to attract companies. this is a unique opportunity and we strongly encourage the adoption of the amendment to expand this legislation to landscaping.

i got into san francisco last night at midnight and checked-in with supervisor weener's office to find out that the amendment had not yet come together. fortunately, i have fast fingers and a touchdown and amend this morning. i think this will do the trick. i hope that we can circulate this. we are talking about something really exciting, a local hiring plan around landscaping. i would strongly encourage the we consider this simple fix that builds upon the idea is that supervisor kim introduced at treasure island. we can adopt this amendment today, or if you want to take a few more days to get this in before the full board, we will be building this. this is great legislation already. it has a broad amount of support. i think i have enough copies. i hope that we can add this

amendment that will make great legislation even better. thanks. supervisor chu: thank you. next speaker. >> good morning, supervisors. thank you for introducing this legislation. i am supportive of my brothers and sisters in labor who are speaking on behalf of this ordinance. also, all of your support for the landscaping, this came to my attention last night at 5:30. i worked with my lawyers and everything together. i.t. mailed it to the supervisors. i also have a copy here. -- i he mailed it to the supervisors. i appreciate all your support. whenever you can do, i

appreciate it. supervisor chu: thank you. next speaker. >> good morning. i am experienced in this trade. everything that was done was done by hand. that was at a time when economic times were not as effective. i feel the time is more than right for all the workers especially to be given full consideration for a raise in

pay so they can get adequate support to their families. especially older people who do not have the energy to come forward. i stand before you today, and my intellect is just as firm as it was years ago. my trade was being a cabinet maker. there is no type of machinery that i cannot work. however, i am turned away by certain people.

that is the big difference. i was not hear from the beginning of the proposal. whatever it is, i give my wholehearted support. supervisor chu: thank you. are there other members of the public that wish to speak on item 11? seeing none, public comment is closed. colleagues, this item is before us and there is an amendment before us as well. supervisor weener, did you have any closing comments? supervisor kim? supervisor wiener: yes, thank you for those of you came out today, supporting those, i

made earlier, as well as earlier legislation. there is always give and take. i appreciate on all sides, labor, departments, nonprofit, there has been give-and-take on this, and i appreciate that. i think with these amendments, this is strong legislation, and i hope we can move forward with a positive recommendation. i do want to note, with respect to landscaping services, the issue raised by local 261, my office had previously indicated my commitment to work with them, to work on drilling legislation, related to landscaping services. i think there is work to be done there. however, we also agreed we need to do more iresearch to see what

contracts were at issue, what the issues were, etc. we want to make sure, when the talk about prevailing wage legislation, potentially expanding the contracts covered, that we are doing so based on precise information, what is covered, what is not covered, where we want to go, where we do not want to go. i appreciate the work that was done on the city amendments. we will take a look at them. i am sure we will be meeting and talking about trailing legislation. for now, i would request the city adopt the amendments offered at the beginning of the hearing, and i hope, moved forward to the full board with positive recommendation. supervisor chu: thank you. supervisor mirkarimi? supervisor mirkarimi: thank you. sorry i was late. i was at the demolition of our

jail no. 3, which was quite a milestone, since it has taken several decades to get the wrecking ball in place. that was an important event for the city and county of san francisco, and our sheriff's department. my decision remains the same, as i indicated before. it has my full support. i am aware of the amendments proffered by supervisor wiener. i wanted to come back and take part in my last participating role here on the budget committee. more than happy to make a motion to accept the amendments and move forward with recommendations. supervisor chu: thank you, supervisor mirkarimi. supervisor kim? supervisor kim: i want to support the recommendation to move forward. i want to thank supervisor wiener's office for their

work. i also appreciate the cleanup around this law, especially around establishing the prevailing wage, and i appreciate the amendment around ensuring prevailing wage for all the workers here with city contracts, and also providing a logger employment transition period. when these contracts have been, they have huge impact on employees and their families. six months is a more humane amount of time to give to folks in order to find new jobs, even in an economy as difficult as today. i want to thank supervisor wiener;s's office. supervisor chu: thank you for being here. supervisor mirkarimi, thank you

for participating in your last board hearing here. [applause] of course, also the last budget meeting in particular. we want to thank you and wish you the best as sheriff of the city. i do want to articulate a few points. when this item came before us previously, there was a lot of concern in my mind about it because there are a lot of components that conflict with some of the things i believe in. for example, eliminating the small business exemption was something i was concerned with. i have been a purported to make sure we provide opportunities for small businesses. having an exemption seemed to make sense. one of the big concern for me on the small business component was to say, do we have the same level playing field at small businesses would have for participating, bidding in work for the city?

that is why i appreciate the amendment made through the help of ms. kelly and supervisor wiener to make sure we are providing the cost estimates, so that they are more in line of what i have been supportive of. i do appreciate that amendment. the other component that was problematic, not necessarily the concept, but how it would apply. this is the issue of the retention going from 90 to 180 days. while i agree it makes it easier for families to figure out what to do next to be able to survive with a 180-day window, as opposed to 90, i appreciate the fact that there are obstacles with keeping individuals for that long, if there are individual -- issues that come up. i want to thank the labor union

as well as supervisors for having the foresight to include exceptions when there is a layoff of some of the new employees. i think that is a strong provision of it. if there are issues of performance, making sure this does not apply when the contract is supposed be one time in nature. this makes sense and helps to ease my mind with regards to the retention time. i want to thank the labor union for agree to that, supervisor for adding that component. the third area where it was problematic for me, in terms of legislation, the issue about the nonprofit exemption issue. as we start to take a look at our budget and we look at what the impact on our departments will be, it is a potentially large impact, if there were certain nonprofits included in it. as some of the departments have articulated, our largest

contractors departments go out with millions and millions of dollars for lots of services that we sometimes do not think of, but have ancillary services that include janitorial. if this would apply to all those contracts as well, the impact financially on the city would be a much larger one that we would have expected. whenever we ask these departments to cut even a million dollars from their budget, it is painful. to see how these amendments would actually play out, proposals, is something that we would not anticipate just yet. i want to appreciate very much supervisor wiener's two amendments, which would include janitorial services, disabled individuals. i also want to appreciate the clarification language that you are including. the intent of this was never to

include organizations like larkin, homeless shelters, where we are providing residential service, contracting for residential service, whatever service it might be, mental health facilities. but there is an ancillary component that was janitorial. it was never meant to apply to that, but that was the intention of the law. i appreciate the clarification. i know our office will certainly work with you, supervisor, to make sure that the language included is tight, and i hope that the departments will help us make sure there is nothing we have overlooked in that regard. finally, the last component that was not clear in my mind was the issue about the definition of the employees. as i stated, the intent was to make sure individuals who were working were getting paid a prevailing wage. not necessarily which relationship is better, but the

fact that they're getting paid that amount. it sounds like there are many reasons why we do have to indicate it is an employee relationship, as opposed to independent contractor. at this time, i am comfortable moving forward with the legislation as amended, but i do hope that we can work in the ensuing week to clarify the employee-employer relationship, so i can better understand the issue. i think it is incumbent upon us to see whether this is the best approach. many small businesses, minority individuals work through an independent contractor relationship. that is the crux of why i am concerned about it. who gets left out of the employment opportunities and who does not? i really want to understand that component. based on those comments, comments of my colleagues, why don't we go forward with the motion.

there is a motion to accept the amendments that supervisor wiener move forward, recommendation to move to the full board. again, with the caveat that the employer works with the office to make sure that the languages all something that we intend. without objection. [applause] thank you again, supervisor mirkarimi. i wish everyone a happy new year. we have no other items before us. we are adjourned.