the meeting of the board of appeals. the presiding officer is chris fonda -- fuong. we have one seat that is currently vacant, and the board may hold a meeting when there is a vacancy. in such instances the board may overrule an action by a vote of three members. four votes are not required to overrule an action. to my left is francesca. she will provide legal advice this evening. we're also joined by representatives who have cases. the zoning administrator is also representing the planning commission. the act in chief inspector.

and someone with urban forestry. if you could go over meeting guidelines and conduct swearing in process. >> the board request you turn off all cellphone and a pager so it does not disrupt proceedings. the board rules are as follows. representatives have seven minutes to present cases and three minutes for rebuttals. people affiliated must conclude with seven minutes or three minutes. member is not affiliated with parties have up to three minutes each to address the board but snow rebuttals. to assist in accurate minutes, members of the public are asked but not required to submit of speaker card or a business card when you come to the podium.

the board also

of him.

placing the 24 with 34 trees. >> another unique challenge to answer your question about the staging area is that this building is blt out to the lot line. so on other buildings, a

staging area there, but consistent with the zoning that's built out to the lot line. >> is there a staging area on each side and only for purposes of this appeal, did you show us the staging area for the one side? that's my question. because -- if you have to hoist these, unitized wall or window systems, on other parts of the building -- >> yep. >> not just the one where those particular trees are, wouldn't you have a staging area in front of those other -- >> yes. that's correct. >> ok. >> so there are seven trees that are creating this conflict on folsom. one tree on fifth street. the only other frontage where this is an issue is along clemontina street. and the trees that were there were approved for removal. the fourth frontage, there's a park that we're building. so we can stage there directly and go up. >> ok. so five on the side, one on the -- and i don't know. >> on fifth street. >> where's that tree? is that going to be removed also? >> that tree has been -- yeah,

it's requested to be removed for the same issue. >> and been approved for removal? >> no. that's the subject of this appeal. those eight trees. >> the one on the right. on the fifth street. i see. thank you. for clarifying. can you also help me understand better the pedestrian causeway that interferes with an alternate possibility? you mentioned -- >> right. >> some issues with the pedestrian causeway. i don't know what that is on your -- >> right now the site is under construction. this pink causeway area, the parking lane has been turned into a pedestrian causeway. >> ok. >> now, if we can't stage along the sidewalk where the trees are, we'll have to stage from the street. certain -- not the whole building. just certain sections right in front. and then we'll have to hoist over the pedestrian causeway and install onto the -- >> would they even have that

pedestrian causeway? if you're going -- if you were to have to accommodate existing trees and not -- >> well, the trees interest r there. most of the sidewalk has been dem jod already. we're doing mass excavation. >> what i'm saying is that pedestrian causeway would not be there. it's not like you're going to be hoisting materials above humans while they're walking on the public street, right? >> part of the reason for this appeal is that was our -- originally our plan, not to ever to be to the outside of the causeway but staging everything within the boundaries of our site, construction. these trees are allowed to be removed as the others were. we would never be hoisting over a pedestrian causeway. >> there would be no pedestrian causeway if you weren't allowed to remove those trees. >> correct. >> i just wanted to be clear about that point. thank you. >> thank you. >> we can hear from the department now. ms. short.

>> good evening, commissioners. carla short, department of public works, foresty. we were just not convinced that they needed to remove these trees in order to construct the project. i think their brief really focused on how we're preventing the project from happening. we have no intention to prevent or frustrate the project from happening. our intention is to preserve these trees. these were planted by d.p.w. as part of the mayor's trees for tomorrow campaign. so we've invested in them. they're now established. so they don't need the intensive watering of a truck going once a week for three years. and so -- and these trees are all in good condition. the trees that were not in good condition were approved for removal. and just to clarify, the trees on the other side of the frontage that were approved for removal, it wasn't because of their staging installation, it was because the condition of the trees themselves. so, you know, we know web corps is a great builder and we think they can figure out another way to stage this that can keep

pedestrians safe and still preserve these trees that are healthy and established. i know there are times when sidewalks get closed. and people have to cross at the crosswalk and use the other side of the street. and that would prevent them from having to hoist large panels over pedestrians. it just seems to us that there should be an alternative. and i understand it would be easier for them to not have to work around the existing trees. but these are an investment that we've made in our city's green infrastructure. and if there's not a really compelling reason, and obviously worker safety is important. but we think that it can be achieved and still preserve the trees. so they were denied by the department. and we request that you uphold our denial. >> thank you. is there any public comment on this item? ok. seeing none, then we will start with rebuttal. you have three minutes. >> we fully appreciate the

department's position. and if we weren't replacing the eight trees with 11 new trees of equal or better value, we would -- we would be in a much different place. and i guess with all due respect to the department's opinion, we've asked web corps, and they've given us their opinion that there isn't a feasible alternative method. so frankly, i think unless the department can find their own expert to testify to refute our expert's testimony on declaration on this subject, we hope the appeal board will trust web corps' opinion that the feasible method, the only feasible method for this unique system is for the removal of these trees. in order to avoid -- in order to avoid hazard as defined in the code. thank you.

>> ms. short. >> carla short, department of public works. i think the responsibility is on the project to identify the alternatives. the responsibility of my division of public works is to protect trees in the public right of way. i don't know if they've explored closing the sidewalk. i know it's possible. it happens. we see it happening. and we know that you have to do it and sometimes make pedestrians cross the other side and happening on 10th street right near our office at stevenson right now. they're saying that they will replace with 11 trees of equal or better value. these trees have a d.b.h. of six inches and at least 15 feet tall in some cases. 12 to 15. i could figure out exact dimensions for each tree. they're replacing with 11 trees of six and seven inch d.b.h. that's pretty hefty. box sizes we're talking 48 or 60 inch box trees. then i think it's argueable that the city won't lose any

canopy or environmental benefits as long as those trees get established. but just replacing 11 trees doesn't necessarily replicate the equal value that these trees are now providing in terms of their environmental benefits to the city. thank you. >> ms. short, what do you think about the species? proposed? >> i'm sorry? >> the species they propose. >> that they proposed? i'm not sure what the final species is on folsom. is it elm? >> it is chinese elm. >> that's the same species that we've got out there. >> they listed two species, i believe. >> the chinese elm is what we have on folsom so we think it's a great species for folsom and that's why we chose it. >> they had a second species somewhere. >> on fifth street, brisbane, a nice tree, we like it. >> can i get some clarification. you said the replacement tree

is six inches? >> no. our existing trees have a diameter, measured at 4 1/2 feet above grade. ranging from i was just looking at my notes. 12 to 15 feet tall. and six to seven inches of trunk diameter. >> right. that's the replacement tree, too? >> well, they are asserting that they'll replace with equal or greater value. and i think they're going to have hard time. those are very expensive trees. maybe they're prepared to invest in them. but six inch d.b.h., that's a good sized tree. 15 feet. to replace a tree that size is going to be an investment. but i'm all for it. >> is that what is being proposed? a replication of what exists? >> speak to the mic, please. >> that is -- that is what's been proposed in our landscaping plan. and we've done it once before. we built this at 1160 mission street and brought in these big trees. i don't know if you remember,

carla. they're about the same size. they're big trees. >> ok. before -- well, actually, i have a question of ms. short. i think you mentioned in your earlier remarks that the trees that are the subject here were part of the mayor's project. and weekly watering of these trees for -- the last three years, has taken place? >> yeah. >> and at what cost to the city? >> our average cost is $1,641 per tree. >> per tree. ok. >> so we invested roughly $14,000 in these trees. >> and is that cost a consideration when determining whether or not a tree should be or should not be removed? from your department's perspective? >> well, i think in this case, it was -- it was particularly

fresh in our mind because we just got these trees off the watering list. so our big investment was complete. in general, we're looking at the health and the structural stability of the tree when we look at whether or not a tree should be removed. >> ok. thank you. >> thank you. >> can you just say specifically what size box tree would you be comfortable with? if we were going to grant the appeal? >> well, i would prefer to see the size requirements be matched. and i can provide them with our evaluations of these trees. we took diameter measurements and height measurements on each tree. depending on the species, you can get variation in how large the tree is. i would expect it would be a minimum of a 60 inch box tree. that's a five foot by five foot square box of root area. that's several thousand dollars per tree. without labor costs. but if they could find one that matches in a smaller box size, i think our goal would be to

have no net canopy and diameter lost. >> can the trees be saved and replanted? >> it would be very difficult. because they are now established. requiring special tree root ball digger. it could be possible. and if they were to attempt to hire a real professional tree mover, we would obviously want to make sure that the trees were in good condition before they were replanted. but that might be feasible. it woul huge excavation but i think they're taking up the whole sidewalk anyway so that might be possible. >> thank you. >> i would be curious from the -- from the project sponsor if that's something that you would be open to attempting. with obviously -- in consultation with -- >> i think it's better -- realistically, we would just buy them eight new trees and

have them planted. because the work and labor and destruction to go and do what they just suggested is really not worth it. not feasible. but our plan is to again replace the existing tree experience with new ones and more. so our 11 trees should equal what's happening with the eight trees now. and there's no loss of enjoyment now. because there is lots of construction going on there. and by the time we're done, the trees will be up. so to the daily neighborhood pedestrian, there should be no impact at all if we remove these trees right now. >> are you comfortable agreeing to the specifications of the department? >> i believe what we have in our site permit is approved by the planning department is a 48-inch box tree. but i concur with carla that those 48 inch box trees should be able to achieve the same diameter and canopy as currently existing.

>> ok. thanks. >> i'm not sure that's quite what she said. commissioners, two things first. one is it's interesting that they took the language out of the code about hazardous quite out of context with respect to what they're intending. one, and secondly, i'm not sure i'm in total agreement with them that that is the only staging process possible. those things said, however, i am supportive of a coherent and comprehensive statement made for the design and should they want to have a particular pattern of trees, a particular species, and the way it looks, i would support that.

and i think that -- should we condition it that they match the existing trees, then i would be acceptive of taking this appeal and overturning the department. >> i would concur with those sentiments. and unless other commissioners wish to speak. i would make that motion. >> you want to clarify, is that a change from the 48 inch box that is on the site permit? >> yes. to match what is currently existing with the specifications as described by ms. short. >> so that would be -- to replace the eight trees with 11 trees of the same diameter and canopy of the existing trees and do you want that to be at ms. short's approval or by the department's approval? or just -- >> i think -- yes, i would.

>> ok. >> i think that the department will require a permit with that anyway. >> yes. so a motion to grant the appeal and overturn the department and issue the permit on the condition that the eight trees be replaced by 11 trees of the same diameter and canopy of the existing trees. call the roll -- mr. pacheco will call the roll when he's ready. >> again, to grant this appeal, motion by the president overrule the denial, issue this permit on condition that these eight trees be replaced with 11