>> the police department has some serious concerns about your operation. have you sat down and met with them? >> we made a phone call and made an appointment. we have not had a chance -- >> have you had a meeting with them to go over the issues? >> we had one before which is back on march, i believe. vice chair joseph: would you agree to a continuance of this hearing until you can get a better security plan, because your security plan is one sentence and i would prefer a better security plant? and so you could meet with neighborhood groups and the police with regard to your operation? >> that is why we are here today. we tried to make appointments

with the northern officers, but we have not had a chance to talk to him. vice chair joseph: so would you agree to a continuance until this is all done? >> yes. no problem. president newlin: we also want to see, before you come back, we will hear from the police department before we make our final action, we certainly want to see some proactive outreach to the community and to the residents of the neighborhood. there are a lot of residential community groups in that neighborhood. we have had other licensees come in here with different things that they have established within the japan town center. the have had numerous community groups that they have interacted with. i would say you are really remiss in that, outreach to them as well as the police department. >> you must understand that

until you get a permit for lost, you cannot operate. you cannot operate until you have a permit from us. that is prohibited. >> yes. president newlin: the most important thing is to meet with no. station. and before you come back to us, that they are happy with the security plan. like commissioner joseph said, even though your space is quite intimate, i have been there. i personally do not feel comfortable with just one. again, you have to go back to the police department and deal with that. in the meantime, you cannot do any operation, any karaoke, until you come back to us and we can improve this. maybe we should hear from the police department now.

welcome. >> good evening. i am the commanding officer of northern station. i think you hit on just about everything. he was cited once again for operating without a permit on 5- 12. and adjudication of that will not take place for another couple of weeks. it is another denial under section 5 of 1050.53f. that said, we have enough that are managing the bars properly. i am glad you brought it up. we need to sit and have a real long sitdown with the operators of this establishment and come up with a real good game plan to make sure it is operating properly. do you have any questions for me? president newlin: make sure you

communicate to us that they are receptive to your reasonable requests and i want to make sure that they are not a problem for you. >> great. i am sure i will be appearing in front of you at the next hearing. >> it is always good to see you. >> i have a question. they indicated the challenges to meet with your office. could you make sure you connect with them tonight and may be set an appointment, exchange business cards? thank you. president newlin: providing you have a nice meeting with each other, do you have any reservations? >> when we did go out in may of this year, even going back as far as 9-11-11, there were

operating after-hours. my midnight officers tried to get into the establishment and it would not allow them. moving forward, the officer approached mr. hu and ask if it was a responsible party. he denied any relationship to the bar a initially until another bartender pointed to him and said he is the owner. the officer went back and encountered him. he again denied ownership. finally, he admitted to ownership and there could have been cameras on seeing that we may have been able to use as evidence to find the suspect that got away in a felony. he denied access to that as well. >> that is a good question. is the area zoned for that type of entertainment? >> it is. >> we do not bring anything

before the commission unless planning approves it. >> mr. hu, if you lie on your application, that is an automatic denial. you must never law on the application about who owns the place or anything else. it is not nice to lie to the police. i do not need you to come up here, i am just telling you. this is not open for discussion. president newlin: once you get your permit, you cannot be acting like you are not the owner. i am all about having a club and being responsible. you might as well stand there and say, i am the owner and take responsibility. if you cannot do that at this point, why are you in business? you are endangering other people. we take public safety very

seriously at this commission. i am a club owner and i deal with way more people than you do. you just have to understand, even though you bought this business, you have the responsibility to your neighbors and merchants who did support you who may be later on will not support you. i am letting you know you should work this thing out. did everybody meet the new permit officer? >> the new john gallagher. president newlin: there can only be one john gallagher. all right, i think that is it. public comment. i am sorry. any public comment on this application? seeing none, the item is with the commission. vice chair joseph: i would like to move that this item be continued by the request of the

applicant until the following conditions are met -- there is a new security plan, they have met with neighborhood organizations, they have met with the police and worked out their differences, and then once that is all done, they can come back. that is my motion. is that a proper motion? to the call of the chair. thank you. president newlin: i just want to add, to the applicants -- >> and the citations are adjudicated. vice chair joseph: very good. thank you, captain. president newlin: if you have any questions about outreach, contact staff and they will advise you in the direction you need to go.

we do not want you to come back and have an application that is unacceptable to us. we will have no problem denying your application if it is not done correctly writ -- not done correctly. do we have a motion? >> i wanted to add a friendly amendment that we get some sort of documentation of your community outreach. i just want to make sure that we have letters from these people. if we are running into problems, i want documentation that that work has been done. vice chair joseph: i accept your friendly amendment, but we still need a second. >> and then i will second it. president newlin: all right. commissioner perez: aye. commissioner hyde: aye. vice chair joseph: aye. commissioner lee: aye. commissioner tan: aye. president newlin: aye. the item is continued to the call of the chair. item 5c, tim eicher, the edge,

4149 18th st., place of entertainment permit. >> the edge is a 49-person occupancy bar in the castro. the operator currently holds a limited performance permit, which you may remember granting earlier this year. the operator got that while the conditional use process was pending. on june 14, the planning commission approved the space. it is attached in your packet. staff has received documentation of concerns from the public. we receive letters of support from the market from the castro

and neighborhood valley neighborhood association. sfpd propose 11 additional conditions. >> i am one of the owners. our occupancy is 95, so the aids is three months region -- the edge is very much a community bar. we oppose the number of we did host a number of organizations, -- we hosted a number of organizations. the edge has a history of entertainment, including many years of fund-raisers and contests.

prior to 2004, many venues operated with entertainment, even though many of them did not have permits. at the time supervisor dufty introduce legislation to allow them to get a permit without going through a conditional use. the ege started the process of getting a permanent and realize they would have to fix many code violations before they got a permit, so they did not follow through on their application. it eventually closed briefly in january of 2011. our goal is to restore it to what it used to be, physically restoring it as well as restoring its place in the

community with a lot of fund- raisers and community defenseve. we received a permit for fund raisers here again we received conditional use from the planning department earlier this month, and we are requesting a final step. we have broad community support. we have a petition from over 160 residents in support of letters from many organizations. i have not seen the proposed conditions, but one condition they requested is that we have

sound limits, concerns about noise. we have a sound limiter, and i am quite open to die being a condition of our permit. i do not see any reason why we would not, so if that is not on here and we want to add it, that is fine. to give you an idea of the type of entertainment we will have, raffles, live performances, musicals, and once a month -- it is a gay bar. gsorry. [laughter] once a month we have performers from touring broadway shows coming in, so we haven'd five

performance by an american indian. they will come and do a couple of songs, which the crowd loves. we would like to have these days and go-go dancers on weekends. it is not a club. we do not have a dance floor. it is a neighborhood arbar. >> i have one question. security must wear distinctive clothing. you find it is a deterrent? is that something you have staff saying there is security on the back? would that be negative for you? strikeus we have been wearing js that say security on the black.

when we are trying to watch out for things like cellphone we prefer not to, but outside i prefer a they are identified. as there is a provision the states unless someone has a business there they cannot stand outside. i know people go outside to smoke. how do you control abouthat? vice we have an ash tray for them to use, and that is where our patrons will go, and we do not discourage them from smoking and coming back enin.

>> any other questions? seeing none, we will open it to the police department. >> with regard to the ads, how could we possibly oppose such a great presentation. you covered all the bases. give we appreciate this business in our community. they do a lot of phenomenal work. go the police department has no objection to the issuance of this permit. with regard to the 11 conditions, i think they are reasonable, and if there are any questions with regard to any of these, i would be happy to answer those.

>> could you rephrase condition number nine? right adhere to the policy? >> it would be the entertainment commission. good that is a good catch. >> with regard to the question on loitering -- fax #9 is all but i care about. >> with regards to the question you posed earlier we would never have any concern about control smoking areas inside of a venue. it is about control of the venues to have problems with people loitering with no intent to do business with the business itself, so security is helping us get them moving along when they should have no business being there are triggered >>

thank you curator of >> any other questions? >> are there members of the public who wish to address this item? >> good evening. many of you may recognize me from previous appearances in support of businesses to enhance their presences in san francisco neighborhoods. i have never spoken without approving ongoing efforts. this is a gay bar in the castro neighborhood, a bar that goes beyond drinks and conversations, that serves as a community gathering place, were friends are born, and charitable

causes are supported, memories are made, and the castro is felt stronger. we are not talking about a mechanic shop across from a 711 or a business hotel. we are talking about here historic day bar across from what many consider to be a pivotal hog of the community region -- pivotal hub of the community. i encourage you to approve this ferment and join me any night of the week for a good time at the edge. >> i think that says it all, but if anyone else wants to -- >> good evening, commissioners are reagan that is a tough are to follow the reagan yes, it is

a very welcoming bar. -- that is a tough act to follow. it is a very welcoming are. i do not know of a single bar in san francisco but is more encouraging of supporting our community, a more generous with their staff and time, and it would be such a shame if they did not get their entertainment license, and we cannot raise as much money without live entertainment, so thank you. as i have been following gone on for years. it is not that bad.

commissioners, i worked for the city in another capacity during the day, but in the evenings and during the weekends i helped raise money for a lot of charities, and we know many of the nonprofit budgets have been cut tremendously, affecting people with aids, people with breast cancer, and it is very difficult many times to make ends meet. a lot of times the money they have raised is phenomenal. there will be a fund-raiser for 3000, 5000, $6,000, and that is incredible. if you multiplied by two or three and multiplying it by 52 weeks out of the year, it is an incredible amount of money that goes back to the community, and all of this comes from the people that work there and all the permanencits.

saturday night i were talking saturday, and there were issues at a few of the bars elsewhere in the castro, and there were no issues outside the edge. it is probably one of the more well-governed arson the castro -- well-governed bars in the castro. if anyone steps out of line, they will have to deal with terry. it is a big part of the community, and as many bars of closed, the edge has stepped up instead of stepping back like many bars have, so do what you can to help them continue to help the community. >> thank you very much.

the matter is with the commissioner. >> i move to approve this application. it lacks is second. -- >> i second. good >> and good luck, and thank you garrid. [applause] >> thank you for bringing so much community out. it is nice to see so much support. >> get out there and spend more money if you're a good we did spend more money. i and number six, comments and questions. >> i did not bring it up during when we heard 550, but one condition was about pat-downs.

many times when i have been on the commission we have had different opinions about whether or not to require them as deemed necessary by the venue, so i do not know if there is an actual policy vet says if you look a certain way, if you are a certain type of poverty, they brought up civil liberties issues, and i am a little confused. good >> if you have a club or a bar, and you want to track people down, and that is your policy -- to pat people down, that is your policy. did you have a right to refuse service to anybody, and in my humble opinion, i would rather be safe than sorry, so if people are offended, they can take it

down the street. good i feel like we need to do that. that is my own opinion. goo>> so you have some context,n the beginning of this commission, we did not focus so much on security plans. as we started to see more weapons in the venues and a consequence, it became more apparent and we need to talk about that. i do not think you see a brand new venues with that kind of requirement what you are seeing is revisions to security plans once something triggers the need for us to say it is required now.

did you earn that for the most part. these conditions were negotiated for a number of reasons, so i do not take it is our policy to do it as a matter of course. it comes as our response to the inability on their own to do the right thing based on what they feel is appropriate policy for the night. a good there are clubs and e those the do not. for us, i would love to paint

the picture, but that is not the world we live in currently. the concept of public safety has been pushed into the forefront. there is a history of violence and weapons and so forth. a really comes down to the venue's toys to -- it really comes down to the venue's choice to do that. >> i would direct the commissioner to always read security plans as part of the

permanent. -- the permit. the very careful as you do impose it that certain groups of people do not need to be wantedd and certain groups to do pure eg. just look at the security plan. make sure it remains voluntary