of this commission. and item a, tim choy doing business as neck of the woods at 406 clement. we did intend to brief a request by the ap applicant to talk about the neck of the woods previously known as the rocket room. however the applicant and the recommendation have requested a continuance to the fifth of march so that they could have further conversations before coming to an agreement before coming to you with a request of change of conditions. >> first of all, public comment on the continuance of tim choy doing business as neck of the woods 406 clement street? >> seeing none, public comment is closed. could i have a motion to continue. >> motion to continue. >> second. >> we have a motion and a second. >> the same, house, same call? >> thank you. >> next. >> item number b.

atique rehman doing business as naan-n-curry. i am saying that wrong, forgive me. 336 ofarrell street, report on your compliance with conditions of issuing you the extended hours permit. applicant here? >> so, before we hear from the permit holder, as you may remember before you on december fourth, you should find in your binders the motion that was passed and the conditions of that motion relative to this extended hours permit. there were a couple of requests in there. i think that commissioner hyde, in fact, asked them to come

back tonight. and additional out reach was one of those, as well as modifications to the exterior sign, advertising 24-hour service. so that should be requested in addition. i just need to inform the applicant as well as the commission that there are two outstanding approvals from dbi and electrical that i have not received yet. so this permit is not done yet. >> which means that you cannot operate after 2:00 in the morning. >> and until we approve a permit here as a conditional permit. is approved on the condition that you get all of the needed approvals for your final sign-off. once the final sign-off happens, then you actually receive the permit. once you have the permit in your hands, you can then drive the car. you can then operate after hours. so you are operating not in

compliance, because you are operating on a conditional permit. so i just want to make sure that you understand that. >> and let me hand the microphone. >> i did not know about electrical or the building permit that i had to provide it to the applicant information. but i was aware of the reaching out to the community and removing the signs. i did that to be honest with you. and if you could give me some time and i could bring it back. i mean i have no issues with electrical or building, i was not aware, i am sorry. >> so, no one from our staff gave you instructions on the fact that you needed certain sign-offs? did you sign that? >> yes. >> you signed a document that you signed it, if you read it or not, you signed it and you should have read it. you are a businessman. you signed the document saying that you understood that you

needed the sign-offs. >> okay. >> to be honest with you, yes... >> i am glad that you are being honest with us. >> you have time. >> i have signed it and i have not since seen that piece of paper. but what was the back of my head. that was, i mean that was handed out to the other gentleman who was here with me and i am here alone. >> so he is your employee? >> yeah. >> but the buck stops with you, it is your permit. >> if you could please, permit me to give me two weeks, i will go to the city. >> i will give you two weeks. i will give you two months. but you will not operate until you have a finalized permit. >> so if i go to the city hall tomorrow and have them sign-off electrical and building and turn it tomorrow it would be okay. >> if you turn it in and staff issued your final permit you can operate. if you, that means that you cannot operate tonight. >> okay. >> do you understand? >> okay. so you have not got a permit.

not you have a conditional permit and you do not have a final permit. so, i know you understand what i am saying. i see it in your eyes >> okay. but i would like to ask, commissioner hyde who requested that you return to go through the items that he wants to ask you about. and but i just needed to say that you are not permitted to operate after 2:00 in the morning and that i see the officer here from the station and we will ask the tender loin station enforces that. >> okay? >> okay. >> commissioner hyde? >> so and i just want to say that commissioner lee also was interested in bringing you back in as well. it was not just myself. so, when you were here, and we have a condition that the last meal is to be served at 2:30 a.m. with security on hand from

12 to 3:30. could you just explain a little bit about how your security is working and how you are telling those people at 2:30 and controlling the crowd of people coming in? >> well, actually on the weekdays we don't have that much business. we have no problem closing it down at 3:00. you know? and when it comes to the weekend, friday and saturday nights we have the security guards and they are advising people to you know we are going to be closing down at 3:30. >> and the security is only there on the weekends? >> friday and saturday nights. >> i think that is what advised. >> okay. your hours of operation are to be posted clearly and changed to reflect the new hours. has that been done? >> the 24-hour sign is down. >> when did that come down?

>> it was done like last week. >> last week? >> and you know, i have i mean i want to be in compliance honestly, i want to correct, if i was aware of these two other permits, if i had been advised with the gentleman who was with me i would have done it in know time. >> so you were here in december? >> yes. >> and this is february >> we asked you to change a sign in the window so that people would not be confused in trying to get 24 hours. >> you had a big sign on the and that was painted over, it 24 hours right over here and that has been painted over. and you can't see that it is black now. there is no sign that reflects 24. >> and it took you two months to paint over it? >> you know, if i could... >> and then could you also tell me about your neighborhood out reach? >> yes, i have done that. and one of the addresses 140 turk street called the city

impact. and the other organization is called tayam san francisco and that is on... >> city impact? >> yeah. >> what is city impact? >> it is on turk street. 140 turk >> but what kind of community organization is that? >> i think that they have the structure with the homeless. they try to put them off the street and put them into the church and try to clean them up and they need like in during that time they need a feed. so that is where i come in. i offered there is a meal to be served. you are welcome to call me and we will deliver on the day and time that you may want it. you guys need it. >> and who is the other one? >> the other one is ywam. it is on 357 alice street. >> it is what?

>> 357 alice. >> ellis. >> ellis. >> yeah. >> those are from the around the country, and the world and they get together and they walk around in the tender loin area and help the homeless and try to feed them and on the cold and give them blanket and that nature. >> educate the children from under the country. >> there are really not a lot of residents. >> but there may not be a lot of residents right directly there, but there are some residents and the tender loin is full and i mean full of community organizations and i know many of them and i have never heard of city impact or the 357 ellis. so, i will check those out. and they were, i don't see it here, but i had asked for you to get the community

organizations to sign-off after you had done the out reach to them. >> if you want them to sign the form? >> no i have not. but i have the name and number if you like. >> okay. >> and another one is the building, the building that they are trying to build a school in the city, for the third one, this will be the third one, so i got the third one. >> are these people that you went to directly and said, look, i'm operating after hours. and i'm doing this out reach, because this is part of me getting my permit. and i want to talk to you about having this after hours permit. here at our restaurant. or are these just people that you are associated with randomly that you are now going to use as a community out reach? >> i did not say anything about the permit. i just walked in and i said i would like to do something for you guys for your organization. and if you can, let me know if you have some events going on and i would like to provide you

with food, meals or something like that. no, whatever, in terms of... now, no that was not said. >> all right. thank you. >> you are welcome. >> so, the reason why i question and again, it goes by responsibility of owners. since i am industry and we get hit like you say you have a spokesperson but the buck stops with you because you are the owner. and because the sign situation just got rectified only a couple of weeks ago, or last week, i mean that already shows neglect for me. and for you not to even do the electrical inspection or the dbi to go through, which we all do to get permits, to me it sounds like you stick your thumb up to what we are trying to enforce here. i mean we tried to give you an opportunity to comply, and it takes this long for you to do these things and you still are

not in compliance. so, you know, we always want to give the applicant the benefit of the doubt and give the opportunity. but it also reflects on the owner. are you going to be responsible? and this kind of out reach, offering free stuff to your neighbors is not what we are asking for. you should tell them, what you plan to do. i am planning to open until 3:00. so maybe that changes their mind. so, i am just saying, you know, for me, as a responsible owner, we are supposed to be doing the right thing and there is always some leeway or some things that slip through the cracks, but this is pretty big for me. >> i think that... what the commissioners are trying to say is that it is really hard to trick the commission. many of us are in the business, and we kind of have seen it all. so, it is important when you do

community out reach, that you tell them that you are doing it because of the permit. because you are going to be opened after hours. and that you want to know that they are in support of that. and i think what you are doing is very admirable, feeding the homeless and helping people out and sharing your wealth it is a good thing. but, it is also devious to say that you are not letting them know why you are doing that. you know? so, i think the community out reach is definitely lacking. moreover, you signed a piece of paper that said that you need to get all of your sign-offs and you are operating in violation of that. can you not operate until you get all of your sign-offs that is for sure. >> all right. >> anything else? >> yeah, and i just wanted to remind the commission and

everyone that when this applicant came on, he had already had problems with operating after hours, i think that there was some serving after hours ar at least alcohol on tables. and you know, i took a lot of flank from community organizations for voting yes, on this. and one of the reasons that i wanted to check up is to see if my faith in your organization was warranted. and so i am glad that you came back. >> all right. why don't we just hear from tender loin station and see what they have to say. >> could i say a last word? >> sure, you can have a last word. >> i really do apologize for everything else that happened with the inspection and everything. i have never had done that in the business for 17 years. but i am still learning. and thank you for your help and. >> how often are you at your restaurant? >> i am there 24/7. >> you are there every day.

>> it is not your only restaurant? >> no that is the only one now. >> that is the own one now? >> i am always there and i am working in the kitchen and i am doing a lot of things in the kitchen. >> okay. >> and a lot of things. thank you for your help. >> okay. >> good evening, commissioners i'm officer mike torez and i am representing captain garity of the tender loin station. some time around january 16th there was a demonstration in front of the naan and curry restaurant and that was because of a piece of property that the applicant owns at 308 turk street. >> that is the whole different issue in itself. during the demonstration there was approximately over 100 people in front of his restaurant. after this demonstration, some of the participants came to the tender loin station and one of

the complaints in addition to a bunch of other complaints was that the 24-hour sign had not been removed, or changed. i then after sent a notice to nicholas king, asking for the commission to enforce that they take down the sign or paint over it. and then, a few weeks later, it was put on the calendar and you know here we are now. i went by the naan and curry restaurant yesterday. and it appears that they did paint over the 24-hour signs that they had. they had three signs in front of their restaurant. and as far as the calls for service, there has not been any significant calls for service and it seems like they have been pretty much taken care of business and had no problems there.

>> thank you. >> sure. >> okay, thank you, so much officer. >> sure. >> public, comment on naan-n-curry? >> seeing none, public comment is closed. >> direct me, staff, is there some kind of action that we are supposed to take on this? >> you don't necessarily need to take action, i think that we probably schedule it as an action item if you felt the need to. but, as far as what is in front of you now, this, again, the motion and the seconded that was approved, whenever we were here in december would hold and that would be put into the permit, when the permit is finally accomplished. >> i would like one request. i would like to ask the staff to keep in contact with the tender loin station or check on your own to make sure that our permit is being enforced and that they are not operating on

the conditional, that they have the full permit before they operate again. you can't be open until after 2:00, tonight. >> you can raise your hand all that you want. but you can't be opened until after 2:00 tonight, don't do it, we will come and shut you down. >> it is very important that the commission knows that we will check in on them and until the permit is finished which is not hard. i mean they have two last sign-offs to sign-off and it should not be hard to do, and once that permit and the sign-offs are done we will look at it to make sure that the permit is enforced probably. >> until the sign-offs are done, if they are open at 2:05, we will site them. >> okay, thank you. >> moving on, thank you very much. >> i just have a question then, about the three neighborhood out reach done by the end of february, 2013. so, i mean, because we are in the middle of february, and so, now, they have to go back and

do three out reach, by the end of february. and if that does not happen, then that is it and then it does not happen? >> miss king? >> is that a question? >> yeah, that is kind of a question as to what happens, you know, when it is not february any more? >> well, again, i think that we have had this discussion before about the weight we can legally put on neighbor out reach. and whether or not there is any basis in the law for you to take any action against them if they don't comply with the request by this commission relative to out reach. we know how important it is and we know that it is very useful, in advance of and obviously of the things coming forward but, i don't know that we can take punitive action if that is what you are asking me. >> i don't see how we can do that. >> i tend to agree. >> you are done. >> any other questions?

>> are they currently operating after 2:00 >> yeah. >> that is why... >> i get it now. >> not after this moment. >> so, to that end, we have to do something and maybe a larger type face that every time a conditional permit is granted, that it says you may not operate until this permit is finalized. because the people walk out of here and think that they have a permit. >> just for historical, i don't know, value, or whatever. we used to have them sign something and i have to get up after i would do this presentation to the commission and i would run after them out of the door and get them to sign something that says that i understand. none of that is fool proof. for the most part the process that we take the people through, you know, leads them to a point that the only thing

that i can request commission continue to do which used to get done, routinely instead of saying good luck, remind them that they are not permitted until all of the inspections are done. if you want to hold up a sign, i am fine with that too. but, this is a long process for many people and it is not the easyist one to move through. for us it becomes routine, but for them it is still a daunting practice of you know, 8 departments and a million conditions. so, whatever we can all do to help make applicants understand and they are not done until they are done and i would appreciate it. >> so, commissioners? >> whoever has the chair, when they have the chair? >> instead of saying good luck, say it is not a permit until it is finalized. >> item number seven, commissioners questions and comments?

anybody? >> no? >> i just want to announce next tuesday, cmax is having an open house at super club with the warriors and they are going to show the stadium and what they propose and everything, so the public is welcome. >> is that after you attend the 90s? >> that is. >> that is tuesday. sorry. >> i am on the wrong week, forgive me. >> let me check my calendar. >> but it is at 6:00 and it is after work for two hours. and so everybody is welcome to come. >> yeah, i mean i have some questions about the community out reach and what the direction the commission is going to take, where we are going with have this or giving more guidance or having more structure. i know that this is something that commissioner hyde is very interested in. and i mean, like, in this situation, where we have an applicant who says that they are doing out reach, but, that

was further investigation, we have learned that that is not really what is happening. so, do, and i don't see like, a sample script or here is a sign-off, sheet that you must present, that you spoke to so many people and a sample script that would be hi, i'm from so and so and, is this is the application that we are trying to do and open until 3:00, etc. so where are we? is this something that is a long-term goal? >> well, i work for you. so if that is something that would you like, however, i will just say that there is a danger in doing the work for applicants for them. i mean, the same as handing them a security plan and saying here is a sample, why don't you do a security plan like this one and then you are going to get the same-sexty plan back at you. writing a script for somebody implies that they are not cap able as a business person to

actually do their own out reach. and i guess that i am just speaking personally. i have a problem with that. because what i want them to present to you as commissioners is who they actually are, and their capability. if we at the entertainment commission lead them so far down a path that they present to you something that they can't sustain, then you are getting a false sense of what they are going to be doing as a operator going forward. it is really important that you see what we see. so i hear you and maybe there is a middle ground because i have been doing this a long time. we have tried to spoon feed as much as possible to a point where we think that it is important that they, i don't know, how else to say this... >> swallow... >> i tend to agree with her. because, if you are going to start a business, i think that some of the things that you should do is you should research what that business is.

what permits do i need? what are the pitfalls? what is a good business plan? i mean, do i need an employee manual? do i need a security manual? do i have to pay payroll tax? do i have to pay property tax? you should do your due diligence. and the more people that do due diligence and actually operate with care, especially in night life and entertainment which is a public safety issue, can be a public safety issue, are people who become the better operators. the people who care about their patrons and that is kind of tend to say that we point out that you need to fill out every line of the application. and that you need to provide us with sufficient information, not yes, no, you have to explain it. we have modified the application, several times in order for them to do that. but to tell them what they should say, i think is i tend to agree with josoline. >> let me add, not necessarily

for a script, but a for certain permits have you to provide neighbors with a plan. and have them sign a form that says, they have seen the plan, and that they have been given a number that they can call if they have any problems. that is an example. >> but, yeah, like, if there is like a light impact issue that is going to effect the neighbors, i think that noise is definitely something that i would think merits, i don't want to put the applicants into so much burden to put in an application but there should be some minimum structure and guidance around what out reach looks like. that is not necessarily spoon-feeding them the dialogue. they can figure out themselves how to say it but you have to cover concern information in an out reach plan. >> there has been some

neighborhood out reach, i have seen or we have seen that they have actually had some kind of a form letter or something that people signed or even petitions. again, it is up to the applicant to devise whatever they think is necessary to make us believe that they are going to be good operators. so they can't even figure it out, i mean i am all about references and things, you know, giving them the tools. but they should write their own story. you know? not we write the story for them. >> there are certain pieces to the story that are in the application that should be part of the application. and i get them because i am referenced. so i don't know where we can lead with reference. >> what do you tell them, staff? >> what do you tell them with regard to neighborhood out reach? >> we explain to them that it is surely important that they do the neighborhood out reach to move through this hearing process. but not only the reasons, do these questions matter quite a bit and a security plan is a

very big deal with that neighborhood out reach is vital because we have two representatives of neighbors here. hello. and i have not done this in a while since nicholas has been working with applicants but i am pretty sure that he goes through with a lot of specificity about how likely it is that they will not move through the hearing without having done out reach. we do, or we have given them the url for the neighborhood empowerment, network, website, where they list the community groups to the planning department, where they list the community groups. there is no process like commissioner akers was talking about and commissioner hyde and i know that we have done an inquiry around how to impose into our process something more formal that does not exist now.

that it is more like, what? the planning department may do in terms of process. this will add time and money and effort into our practice and that is again, up to you guys, to impose. >> so let me ask you this. >> if someone comes to us, and it is a permitted use, they don't go through a planning process, right? >> if they come to us and it is a conditional use, they have gone through the planning process and they have done the neighborhood out reach? >> so, conditional... right? so conditional use, people come to us with conditional use and people who have to do 312 notifications and stuff like that. they have already gone through the process and the planning department to make them repeat the process here. it seems a little weird. >> i don't think that you would have to, but i don't think that everyone does go through the conditional use process. and i think that we have seen tonight that sometimes out reach does not get done. and i also think that e