as well as geographically with regards to a particular nightclub venue or a commercial corridor i think that would be helpful at helping us address the problems. i know that our police chief has monthly comstat meetings where you really drill into where crimes are happening and to the extent at which that same data analysis can be used to help us here would be really helpful. >> and i think that it would be helpful to hear from the police department and unless you have anything else to add? >> no. >> but i do want to know something, i think that we have to be very careful before we start putting out these numbers in terms of percentage increase and of incidents, i think that we have to be very careful to make sure that we are accurate about what we are talking about. because i do know that an issue that we have had in the past in the police department is, you know, the tracking of this kind of data and information. so, i think that we have to be very careful before we make general statements about

increase in violence, because maybe, it may be true in one district, but that may not be the case in other parts of the city. and so i think that that getting that information and making sure that we are careful about comparing year to year, i think, it is really important because i think that a lot of steps have been taken to address issues around the public safety inside of these venues and outside of the venues and we want to make sure that we have the correct data. in analyzing that. >> supervisor weiner, >> thank you. and it is a perspective here is important in terms of increases and decreases by percentage, it is more helpful for look at the raw numbers, if something goes from ten to 15 incidents just to give an example it is a 50 percent increase and it is helpful to look at raw numbers and also keeping in mind that the entertainment commission regulates the place of entertainment permit holders,

not bars and other night life establishments that don't need a place of entertainment permit. and so it is also a pretty small subsection of night life in general. i do want to stress and president chiu mentioned the importance of making sure that we do not set the entertainment commission up for failure, and i think that when the commission was created and for a number of years, we put all of these more and more enforcement obligations on the commission, while starving the agency of resources. and so, as president chiu mentioned he and i teamed up last year, as part of the advac process to provide an additional enforcement officer so that there was not one for the whole city and now there are two for the whole city and you know, frankly that should not have had to happen. through the advac process, that should have been in the budget that came to us and sometimes we see this with the very small departments that even small requests don't get accommodated whereas the larger departments

fare better in the budget process, i don't understand why that happens but it is something that is not a positive dynamic in our budget process. and so, thank you. >> >> thank you. >> so, now we could hear from our police department? >> and i want to thank the deputy chief loftus for being here. >> rich for the san francisco police department and behind the memo should be my memo on the state of the union address. and so, what i am going to talk about today is address the increased in the numbers as well as some of the other questions that you had. what districts you see problems in. so, the alcohol liaison unit is fairly new, we are created back in may of 2010. and that was the reason in which it was created in an effort to bring the continuity to not only the abc but to the

entertainment licensing. as you know there are probably 4100 applicants for or actually for abc license in about 1,000 places of entertainment and so, we are the ten cals that we use are the different stations and the permit officers and they reach out and they handle not only the alcohol, but the permits as far as entertainment goes as well. the increase, so, you see an increase as josyln, mentioned in 2010 and there was no reporting from police department because there was no alu unit. so you are going to see an increase in the years because we actively ask people that have abc license or have a license for permits to make reports. and now, we have a different avenue to make reports. they can make reports on-line, and then go in person to the police department, and they can call the police officer out or mail in reports. so i see, i believe that is the increase that you are going to see, we actively, ask people to do that, so that we can identify the problem places.

and we review as supervisor weiner said before, just because there is a call for certain, we review those police reports to see if there is a problem with the people with the management personnel, or a lot of cases the nexus of all of the problems that we have with the entertainment part is over service. >> so, since i have been there, about 14 months, i have had a really outstanding relationship with the director as well as vaj, he and myself and, my colleague inspector kelley go out almost every weekend. and first thing that we hear from a lot of the venues out there that have place of entertainment, why are the police out here? they have never seen the police officers come out and ask them, how can we help you? what do you need from the police department? >> well we do corrective action, i think that our corrective action, being out there in the presence alone and mainly you ask supervisor chiu what districts we are having problems in and i am not single out the district and it is because it has the most volume

in the last two weeks there was an article on polk street, we are out there every week and we give a good hour every saturday night, myself and my partner as well as inspector granelli we go out at various times on saturday and friday evenings and we walk the streets and we talk to all of the venues and we ensure that the guards all have active guard cards. that they do not exceed their occupantcy and we called the fire department out. personally i think that they have done a great job on polk street it is the new genderfided it is and it is the new chest nut street and i think that the establishments have been doing a great job and actually reach out to the permit officers and ask for lead training, we will take them in and the guards and talk to them about what we want the conditions and what we want and meet with them on a regular basis. and one of the problem venue and on that i will name two weeks ago to give you an

example was the place that if you her the name and the branding name you think that they would be jazz they had an incident where they had a problem with gangster and rap music and stuff like that, that was on the saturday evening it was 70,000 people in the street and embellished by the police report, by monday morning, we met with josyln, the inspector and the captain at northern station and actual management of that club and we had reconditioned them and we put together a template that they are going to use in the future and it seems to be working. as you would said that you are going to see an increase in sites next year because they did budget for another inspector to go out there. and inspector granelli goes out there and hits these, and these are businessmen and we hit them best in the pocket book, so when we are sighting them from the 1066 section that allows it and it is great. i am encouraged by that.

and we do have weekly, meetings with the permit officers on a monthly basis, myself and inspector keller and the chief and we meet monthly and we discuss the issues in every district with the permit officers and what the problem venues are and we come up with a game plan to rectify. looking at her memo and my memo i and apologize it is gratuituys we are trying to present ourself with the best case of scenario we have a great collaboration with the entertainment commission, and he are in the process under the tutalige of supervisor weiner to modify 1060 to accommodate the issues, we discussed it like any partnership we have disagreements. probably the main disagreement is not the staff as with the

commissioners themselves on the entertainment commission. we are trying to rectify it in the 1060 session and they feel compelled to grant the permits after the police department gets up there and explains the different issues and the supporting documentation and it seems to be a disservice to the public. and so we are working on that. and so that point, i will have our deputy chief loftus discuss that more. but all in all, i am, i have a regular daily conference with either vaj or josyln and i believe that we are on top of all of the issues that come up. broad way, as you know has been an issue, in the last three or four months, and because we took immediate action from director cain and we shut down one of the places on an emergency 72-hour suspension that place never reopened and i believe that reduced our problems significantly. and so we are mainly when we go out, we are concentrating on

polk street corridor and the union street and the broad way street geary street and 16th street corridor. >> could i ask you a question. >> what exactly, you said something about a disservice to the public, what did you mean by that? >> well, for instance, if you go back and look at a tape tuesday night, last commission hearing, there is an issue with one club which has been an ongoing problem for sound proofing they had agreed to continue it and get the sound proofing done. the police department denied the permit based on the fact that the sound proofing was not completed we asked for a continuance and we put out conditions and however, we understand at the end of the meeting that they allowed the entertainment to continue which essentially the property or the condos that are above this location are worth nothing based on the fact that there is an issue. we feel if there is an issue we

will resolve and move on. >> they claimed that they had booked events two years in advance and so i felt it was a disservice and i may be speaking out of line but i may be speaking more for the tenants there. but, i felt if i lived in that particular area that i would be upset. and there was no reason for the commission not, the staff, but the commissioners to continue and allow them to have the conditional use permit until the sound proofing was rectifieed. >> a couple of things, i certainly would like to i know that my office and supervisor kim's office would like to meet with the unit to talk about the process and the things that you are working on, i appreciate your perspective, i don't think that it is helpful, whether it is a difference of between the commission on a specific item to talk about the difference of opinion, you

know, constituting a disservice to the public, i don't think that is necessarily the kind of relationship that i hope that we have between the police department and the entertainment commission. i think that you know each side has a perspective and each side has a role to play. and to the extent that there is a difference of opinion, i think that we can agree to disagree without you know, labeling the actions of the other disservice, because i do think that you have people here who are trying to do the right thing that is mine. >> and i agree with you and i apologize for my particular opinion. i think that the chief can expound it, there are many insurance incidents but the point that i want to make is that we work very well with the personnel that is here today. and we are and that was the point, we do have ab open dialogue, and we are not stone walling each other, and we agree to meet on the issues that we disagree with and that

is the process that we are going with and in the end it will be a valuable service for the residents and the owners of the clubs, and the patrons that visit the venues. >> i know that if i were a member of the commission i would be surprised by your comments. >> supervisor chiu? >> i want to try to clarify what i think inspector was getting at which is from what i can see my perspective, i think that the staff of the entertainment commission and the officers and the leadership of the san francisco police department are working very well together. which is frankly different from what i experienced four years ago, or three years ago and i want to thank the staff for their work. what we did hear though, three or four years ago was that there were many clubs, or i should say that there were many more clubs where the public would be telling us that there had been numerous incidents of public safety issues. such as the example that the inspector just laid out.

clubs that had a history of public safety issues and a history of violence for which the entertainment commissioners and that is just different from the entertainment commission staff, the entertainment commissioners were being told about but there wasn't action. and i think that what we have seen in the last two years is that the entertainment commission has been taking more actions for some of these clubs but there are still examples as was just cited where that does not always happen. and i think that that was something that i had heard in recent months, there are still issues that are the case on broad way and in the non-hill area and polk street and in my district i don't know if that is the case in others but that is something that i continue to hear and i think that it just means that we have come a long way and a significant way to go. >> we agree on that president chiu. >> supervisor weiner? >> yes. >> i think that one other challenge that the commission

has had that i think that we are fixing in the legislation that i have pending is that right now, there is the commission can impose a very short suspension on a venue that is violating and the next step beyond that is revocation there is not a lot of in between and so the legislation that is pending will give the commission the authority to impose, or at least the director to impose a longer suspension and i think that the more flexibility that we give to the director and to the commission, to address some of the problem causing, the better that it is going to be because it is not flexible enough right now and so i think that that will be an improvement as well. >> okay. >> having to jump right to it, sort of a death penalty, it is not, if it can put the commission in an awkward position. >> great. >> i wanted to see if deputy chief if you wanted to add anything? >> again, thank you for being

here. >> it is my pleasure. i would agree with a lot of the issues and a lot of the statements from the inspector van coal. specifically, the relationship with the entertainment commission. between the entertainment commission and the san francisco police department right now. it is the best that i have ever seen it. this constant communication and constant give and take. we do have issues on occasion, as inspector van coal mentioned, in a real responsible to the public as is commission as is this body here. we get the noise complaints for the clubs and so, when the noise complaints come in, and you know, we have seen a lot of instances where the people are explaining about the noise of a particular club and you know we feel although they have come an awful long way and they have made vast improvements on what they have done in the past and

you know, it is our opinion that they could do a little better and quite frankly the police department could do better and that is the nature of the beast. we are continuing to push forward, and we are continuing to address the commission and make our concerns heard. and i think that it will continue to improve over time. one of the issues that supervisor weiner brought up with regard to folks on the street at night, how they could or how it could mostly, neighborhood better, you know, the police department was dedicated to the gregt and the vibrantcy of this city. and you know, sometimes that is true, but sometimes it is not. often times on the broad way corridor, like the incident that we had a couple of weeks ago we had a huge fight out there. you know, a lot of people on the street is not necessarily good late at night, especially a lot of folks that have not been drinking. i know from my days as a

robbery inspector people on the street late at night, the robbery suspects will look upon them as victims. and so, you know, it, the... the permitting and policing and regulating entertainment clubs is a very, challenging process. it is a challenging process for both the police department and obviously for the entertainment commission. we look at the middle of the road where we can act, you know, and keep the public safe and you know, keep the neighbors of these clubs at least allow them to get sleep at night and make sure that the regulations are being followed. >> thank you, chief. >> and i want to again, thank you and your staff, as well as the entertainment commission staff for the fact that the staff level that you are working you know, really well, i think that is very important. i have a question, you know, i think that it might be helpful since any time that you are talking about two agencies

working with one another, it is not just the people who are at those agencies the staff but also the bodis that over see the agencies. has there ever been a meeting or a discussion that involves both the entertainment commission and the police commission? >> not lately. no, i don't believe so, i don't believe so. we have had meetings, myself and the chief and josyln, and met two months ago, we do have continual contact, we do have, you know, as stated by both the inspector and josyln, we have a good working relationship. we are trying to make the city as safe as possible around entertainment venues, as and that is our common goal. they are in a little bit of a bind, they advocate for entertainment and regulate it's same time. our job is easier, we regulate

and enforce law and regulate and so we don't have to necessarily, they have the advocacy program and part of the equation in that kind of makes their job even more difficult. >> i would suggest and i would appreciate your comments, and i would suggest that there be in the near future a joint meeting of the police commission and the entertainment commission. i think that having that discussion and that level of discussion by the policy-making bodies of both entities is useful and helpful. i know as a police commissioner i found discussions at that level with agencies useful and i think that it is only something that can lead to a positive thing. and i would encourage and in fact, i will be asking those bodies to at least look into that, i think that discussion

will be helpful. >> i think that it is a great idea and i think that it could happen. >> supervisor weiner? >> just to be clear, in my statement, having people in the street at night increases public safety, i was not suggesting that having thousands of people unload from clubs down broad way all at the same time is always the best thing, i know that we in california, have unlike a lot of other areas in the world have this incredibly rigid system where everything has to close at two and everyone piles out on the street at the same time and sometimes chaos can ensue and so i know that senator leno, has attempted in the past to give more flexibility so that not everything has to close at the same time because the state law is restrictive right now and i think i hope that we can take a look at that and i think that it is one of the problems that everything empties out on the street at the same time. >> we agree to closing clubs at

midnight to two clock. >> i think that i may have had something else in mind. >> i am glad that you raised the issue of the two a.m. situation. and i wanted to ask you, specifically about some of the neighborhoods in my district as you know. broad way, polk street, and union square, get a bit intense acouple of weeks ago, colleagues, i don't know if you saw the you tube footage, but there was a maly that happened when the clubs closed. 100 folks got into a fight, it was a very intense situation and a number of folks got arrested there have been articles in the last couple of weeks around polk street and the fact that many believe that we have hit a saturation point. and while, we have not seen the same violence on polk street that we have seen on broad way, there are concerns that we are almost at that place. a lot of my constituents have been worried given the staffing levels at the police department

with attention in some of the higher crime areas that involve non-entertainment violence. that that has meant that in those neighborhood that i just described, the attention of friday and saturday night by definition they have not seen the same level of staffing that they want to see and i know that part of this is a function of budget and i am wondering if you could talk about specific things that you are doing along polk street or along broad way to make sure that we are tamping down the potential issues. >> sure. >> the police department is down about 300 officers right now staffing-wise. and currently, there is a directive that all of the district stations staff 25 percent of the patrol force on the midnight watch and that specifically to deal with the problems that occur, you know they come on at 9:00 and get off at 6:00 a.m. and so specifically that is to deal with these types of problems and problems that we are having in the night life and the clubs

after. and having an adequate number of officers to police the rest of the districts. on the broad way corridor, you know, broad way has been a difficult place to police for the last for as long as i have been in there have been problems on broad way. so, what we do generally, is we all of central station out there and we generally have a number of our violence reduction teams out there and this motorized units are out there. and it is friday and saturday nights. and doing traffic stops and a lot of times sobriety check points in the area. just to keep a lid on the potential problems. you know, broad way seems to attract a difficult group of regulars from around the bay area. like much like the crowd that was the other night we had some tough folks down there

obviously, the fights brought out and then we had to call the police officers from around the city to come and deal with the issues. so, preventing a problem for the most part we are doing pretty good. are we at a saturation point for clubs? you know, i don't know if we are there, or we are probably close because a lot of these areas, polk street and broad way we have residents theres too, we have people living above these areas, you know san francisco is a very densely populated city as you all know and there is a lot of folks who call san francisco home and they live in a lot of these areas or a lot of these clubs are appearing. and so, once again, we are back to the balance, you know? do we put more clubs in to increase the night life or do we need to try to quiet it down at least at 2:00 in the morning so people can get some rest at night. >> thank you. >> and i just want to mention for my colleagues right now on polk street there are about 60

liquor licenses within a 6-block area and 100 on polk street as well. and the neighborhood associations have asked me for a number of years to move forward legislation to deal with the situation. and that legislation is sitting in front of the planning commission. i have proposed not that we cut back in those areas, but that we simply say at this point we feel that is an appropriate level and so we are trying to taylor the legislation to say that the current exuberance is right and we are concerned that a little bit more might create a tipping point that could be detrimental. >> i certainly appreciate that and i think that we want to be helpful to the extent that there are district specific things that need to happen. i also do want to be careful to make sure that we don't you know, shoot ourselves in the foot, the reality is that the night life and entertainment

has been an important part of our history in san francisco in the culture and for many of us it is more than just entertainment. i think that for many of us in the lgbtcommunity for instance, the ability to go to these places was a provided a place where we could be ourselves and so it has a special significance for some communities because of that. and so i think that it really is about striking a balance. and i think that we can do that. supervisor weiner? >> thank you, mr. chairman. i want to a point cha the chief made about the department being down 300 officers, sometimes we put obligations on the entertainment commission and then neglected to give them the resources to do their jobs, we have done the same thing with the police department, and fundamentally it is the

responsibility of theed supervisor and mayor to provide with resources. we worked together two years ago to give it one academy class to the department where there have been years with no academy class and at trophy in the side of the department making your job harder and now the mayor and the board work together and we have made a commitment to fund three academy classes every year and it is going to take time to rebuild the ranks of the department given how many people are available to retirement but we need to stay committed to the three academy classes per year. and i also you know, i represent the castro which is not, quite on the same level as broad way in terms of the sheer number of people but it is a pretty intensive night life situation in terms of clubs and bars, and we have although, there are certainly issues and challenges for sure, we have worked wither hard to have a collaborativive relationship between the bar and club owners

on the one hand and the neighbors and it is actually been quite positive and we had our one particular establishment that was causing some problems, that establishment is no longer there, but a lot of other bars have been very helpful in working collaborativively to make sure that we address these situation befores they get out of hand. and including crime and also drunken behavior. and so, you know, i think that there are ways that we can improve public safety while also having a great night life. >> president chiu? >> i just want to respond to something supervisor campos had said about the importance of night life in the lgbt community. i would broader that, i think that and agree with all of the colleagues that night life has a central place for all of us, any of us who moved here, i came here in my 20s and enjoyed going out to broad way and north beach almost every weekend during much of my 20s. the challenge that we have gh