[speaker not understood]. >> what are the dimensions? >> what? >> what are the dimensions? >> we have two sizes. let's see. one that's standard size, eight-foot by 11 feet. and the net elevation which is i believe about 7 by 13. >> and how tall? >> let's see. i'd say -- let me get the drawings. i would say between 8 to 10 feet tall. >> and the six -- you have six in process now that that's the first phase. >> that's correct. >> do you know what the total number is that mta will ultimately propose? >> we have currently six more stays. we have 40 that have been approved as part of the general referral that we intend to roll out. that will be the next two phases, phase ii and phase iii. >> so, 36 plus or 30 including

the six? >> 30 plus 6, so 36 total. >> 36 total, thank you. >> our location criteria has been -- basically we need to -- in order to be effective we need to be as close to the bus terminal as possible. 50 to 100 feet [speaker not understood]. bus drivers have 5 to 10 minutes during a break so we want to make it as convenient as possible. as far as following the dpw ordinance regarding serviceman dated facility guidelines, i.e., setbacks from pedestrian zone, six foot minimum clearance if we can get it. let's see. where we have located them on sidewalks we try to provide a build out and locate them close to utilities to minimize cost.

like i said, we've gone to general plan referral. we're going through the mentoring process which involves quite a bit of community outreach. we've gotten art commission approval, c-e-q-a review, [speaker not understood] and also dpw directors. >> now, mta also sometimes uses or works with local merchants. >> um-hm. >> and either for free or pays them to allow operators to use the rest room. >> that's correct. >> that's assuming those rest rooms are a-d-a accessible. >> correct. >> and, so, it seems -- 36 seems like a large number of -- rather large units. mta exhausted having merchants?

we have a merchant in my district [speaker not understood]. he said i let them use my rest room. >> that's our first preference, is to either have access to a free public rest room or to develop a license with a local business owner, assuming that that rest rooms are easily accessible and a-d-a compliant. that was our first choice. barring that, then we start to investigate the potential of installing portables -- i'm sorry, prefab. the 30 right now, the number is developed a few years ago, the list. so, we'll continue to kind of try and winnow it down if possible. depending on how bus lines are currently run when we get to that point. >> i would hope the mta would

winnow it down. this is -- obviously no one begrudges, muni drivers need to use facilities. you're on a bus all day and have no access to a rest room. but these are also large facilities that serve i believe only the bus operator. so, most of the data are items sitting there on the sidewalk and aren't usable by other people. so, i think that presents a challenge. president chiu? >> thank you. this is the first i learned about the operator rest rooms. how much is the mta spending on all of these rest rooms? do you know what the overall budget is for construction and [inaudible]? >> each prefab unit costs around $60,000. the unit installed is 150 to 170,000. >> is that per -- per unit? >> yes, per unit.

>> 170, $230,000 per unit? >> 170 includes 60,000 for the unit. >> okay, $170,000 per unit? >> installed. >> how much is a license that you worked out with small businesses for use? >> couple hundred dollar a month, so, 4 or $5,000 a year. >> 4 to $5,000 a year. so, in other words, $170,000 -- sorry, i'm trying to do quick math on this. this is' 3 to 4 years' worth of bathroom access. i have to ask an obvious question. it seems to me most of these bus routes would have a small business they're going by that would -- probably wouldn't mind 4 or $5,000 i revenue a year if we could pay them as opposed to building a structure. can you talk about the decision process by the sfmta to build

four of these? >> we have a task force that is [speaker not understood] to review this, deal with this issue. we have real estate folks who focus our time walking the pavement, meeting with business people to try to negotiate licenses. there are certain locations where there are no businesses around and certainly i have some examples in the current design like, say, 48th and/oring at the a. there's no local restaurant or business nearby that would be able to help our bus drivers. so, we need to install facilities. and it's in those instances where we go to the length to install an actual structure. >> okay. you know, i certainly like supervisor wiener don't begrudge situationses facing our supervisors. we need to ensure their needs are being met. again, it it strikes me as a lot of money and i wonder if

there are other options we could pay for to deal with the situation. >> i think the other issue is when you look at these business licenses, a lot of businesses close early or close the hours of op ratetionthv. ~ operating. it narrows it down extensively. [speaker not understood]. >> again, i understand 4 to $5,000 to spend for a typical license. $170,000 seems to go a long way. it's hard to imagine the entire route, i'm looking at some of these addresses. i can think off the top of my head nearby, geary and second avenue, i think there are places that one could go, but anyways, i wanted to just ask the question. >> [speaker not understood]. >> so, in other words, the late night aspect of this? has there been a conversation

about whether an operator, even if the business is not open, figuring out some way to give them access to a rest room? >> i did not have the conversation, but [speaker not understood]. there are definitely challenges with that's correct but we could explore that if you were really adamant about looking at that. operating is the biggest challenge for these. [speaker not understood]. >> okay. again, it strikes me as [speaker not understood] given the density of our city and how many bathrooms there are in the city. so, i would love to learn a little more about this. >> i'll walk you through the site. just briefly, [speaker not understood], where, you know,

taking advantage of the traffic island. so, we're not -- sorry? >> [inaudible]. >> oh, okay. [speaker not understood] and third, taking advantage of the traffic island so as not to impede on the sidewalk. hudson and third, we are [speaker not understood] in order to help soften the visual impact as well as provide clearing. 48th, similar, we're planning build outs. maintain clearance of the sidewalk. 25th and potrero, this is a tight location there, therefore we developed a narrower rest room in order to maintain clearance and still meet a-d-a requirements.

geary boulevard, we're actually developing a [speaker not understood] use permit with the school district so we're not impeding on the sidewalk in any way. we're actually on school district property. >> are there any bathrooms on the school district property? >> i'm sorry? >> are there any bathrooms on the school district properties -- >> we have looked into that. i believe not. again, due to the operating hours of the [speaker not understood] line, access to the school campus was not feasible. >> supervisor kim. >> is this presidio middle school or washington high school? >> this is washington high school. >> okay. so, isn't it also an issue to take up space on the school campus for this as well? i know washington is a humongous campus l and i imagine actually goes through

at least two city blocks, i think, the campus ~. so, i imagine right on geary it's where the hill s. >> right. >> i'm just curious. i know space is incredibly important. >> right. well, we are on the slope right adjacent to geary and we're taking up just enough space for the rest rooms. i'm not sure if the slope above that is that developable within the school district. so, i don't imagine that the [speaker not understood] has that great an impact. and they do get revenue from -- we will be paying a license fee for the lease of that property. no sidewalk impacted here. we're working with the presidio trust folks and will be providing additional screening. so that the trailer is less

visible. ~ we do have phase ii and 3. again, once again, licenses and fee option are our priority and we're looking at all the future gaps with that in mind. and that's it. thank you. any further questions? no? >> thank you very much. appreciate it. and then finally from mta benita [speaker not understood] to talk about boxes. after this we'll be going to public comment. so, if you have not submitted a card and would like to speak in public comment you can fill out a blue card in the front. mr. velasquez. >> [speaker not understood]. traffic several controllers that we have at each of the 1200 signalized intersections in the city.

sorry, i have the plan. the controllers are basically the brains of each of the intersections. each of the traffic signal heads and the pedestrian signal heads are wired directly down the pole under the sidewalk, under the street, and go back to the controllers. one controller per intersection. it is at this controller that the [speaker not understood] basically does the work that programs, diagnose problems of the controller. and you can see on the slide the size of the controller. there is also a schematic that shows what the inside looks like. we have a computer there. it's kind of dark, but on the bottom you'll see where the wires are coming out into the control room and back into the computer. there are a number of criteria that we have to follow when we install these controllers. you can see the bullets up on the screen.

top three are basically shall, we shall maintain clearances for fire hydrants and others. we shall maintain traffic and pedestrian sidelines. we shall satisfy a-d-a requirements. the ones on the bottom, the one on the bottom about direct line of sight, placement so that it's less prone to getting hit, those are more should. that's something that we should do, it's not a shall condition. but obviously we want to do all those at the same time as well. the technical placement criteria. other considerations, we can't be near driveways. can't be in driveways either. we try to avoid bus zones. we try to avoid entrances to businesses, doorways, hotels, apartment buildings. and we also try to avoid windows and frontages. and then of course we also try to consider how much volume of pedestrians are going on that particular sidewalk.

and then each hotel is considered an sfm subject to dpw permitting conditions. so, what we've done in every location where we had to install a new controller or relocate one, we follow the smf procedures, posting a public hearing if somebody issues a concern. and then we secure the preliminary permits from dpw. i wanted to address one of the issues about placement of controllers on the near side of intersections. like i said, sometimes it's just really difficult for us to try to place them on the far side. all things being equal, we would want that controller to be on the far side of the intersection so we have maximum visibility for pedestrians. but sometimes with all the constraints that we're faced against with that near side location somehow that only works. and i'd be happy to follow-up with andres where there seems to be an issue [speaker not understood]. there is no parking for the lane, it's right up against the sidewalk. we can take a look at what we can do with that controller.

thank you. >> great, thank you very much. colleagues, no questions? terrific. i want to thank all the city staff for those very informative presentations. and as with most things, i think what this makes clear these are not complicated issues, trying to ballet lot of different needs with some of the important services that street furniture provides and critical needs in the community, but also wanting to just be strategic in how we, how we decide to place things on the sidewalks given limited sidewalk space for pedestrian flow. so, colleagues, if there are no additional comments or questions, we will open it up to public comment. public comment will be two minutes. you'll hear a soft bell when you have 30 seconds left and a louder bell when the two minutes has expired. , and so, i will call the names that i have. and i apologize in advance if i

mispronounce your name. alex popovich. bob hutchinson. kevin wong. drew howard, alex walker. mylo [speaker not understood]. [speaker not understood]. marlene butler. and andrea aiello. you can just line up. you don't have to speak in the order that i called you. let's line up along the wall on the left. supervisors, my name is alex, president of san francisco bay distributors, inc., and publication including 11 [speaker not understood] graffiti, [speaker not understood]. i'm here today to offer your committee information data obtained from 30 years of

distribution street publications abating graffiti from newsracks. [speaker not understood] and been serving there for over one year. graffiti is a team partner with community clean team volunteering to clean newsracks. i'm the senior [speaker not understood] serving since the inception 30 years ago. [speaker not understood]. i'm proud to say that you have my [speaker not understood]. i was the chairman of the foreman's newsrack [speaker not understood]. here are my suggestions. approximately 250 pedestals available for installation, i have identified over 200 location that would totally complete the ad zone jackson street to king street, and commuting corridors [speaker

not understood] within the non-ad zones. i thought i had three minutes. so i'm going to skip. i find it imperative to alert you that the proposal eliminating freestanding newsracks outside of program zones would put most small publishers out of business. it can cost in excess of $250 per unit. this would create a monopoly from the larger publicationses without their respective publishers seeking a course of action. this would negatively impact local small businesses and public at large that depends on the low advertising rates offered by the smaller publications. the solution to proactive maintenance of abatement from the publishers of free standing newsracks lies in [speaker not understood] in order to maintain the newsrack certificates. thank you very much. i have my survey in hard copy i'd like to submit to the supervisors. >> great, thank you very much. next speaker.

good afternoon, supervisors. my name is kevin fong. i'm the circulation manager for the san francisco advertiser paper. i received an e-mail from the city of dpw regarding elimination of the freestanding racks to keep our subway -- sidewalks clean from clutter. i'm very shocked to hear committees consider eliminating newspapers street racks. we have been in business over 43 years and we have held many small business to grow. ~ helped they are like us, they hire local employees, pay city payroll taxes, support local business and pay property tax. we are a weekly newspaper. our readers use our paper to save money, retail, [speaker not understood]. by eliminating freestanding racks on the street, that will negatively impact the larger number of local small business

and [speaker not understood] largely depend on the small advertising rate of these small publications. the suggestion here is even though the creation is not the best choice, but that's probably the best solution today. our street racks look much cleaner than a few years ago. i hope we can continue to go along with the clearchannel and the racks looks much better. thanks. >> thank you very much. next speaker. and i have one additional card, ronald austin. [speaker not understood]. good afternoon, supervisors, chairman, president. chairman, thank you so much for calling this meeting. through the visual wasv that we've seen and walking around the district i'm sure know and face the difficulties of being a pedestrian [speaker not understood] in san francisco. and the key elements that you've called for here prioritizing services, strategic placement, [speaker

not understood] communication and consolidation is really going to be critical and help us move forward. san francisco has tremendous guidelines and goals and standards that we hold ourselves accountable to. accountability is i think something we can work better on. in talking about the interdepartmental communication, i know we're focused on that here and now, but i also want to encourage you to and the process that includes community input. dpw's order around smf is the key memo that then director ed lee signed. really outlines what this process looks like and, supervisor kim, i know you asked or if it was president chiu asked for -- asked for guidelines on how is this working in your districts. two weeks ago we hosted a community meeting around the utility boxes specifically. we had more than 50 paraer advertise pants from all over the city who brought to us their problems and concerns as they're now dealing with that permitting process, how it

affects them in their districts. and there are some improvements and i think we can make to the process. for example, notices are only [speaker not understood] can be really a problem. so, in looking at the permitting process, but also on the outside looking at the enforcement of our own guidelines, how do we enforce those, how can we do a better job of it. right now we're seeing the city failing in its shall, but how are we holding private companies to the same standards? so, thank you for beginning this conversation. i know it's going to be a long one, but san francisco beautiful, we're happy to be a participant and work with the community. thank you. >> thank you very much. next speaker. good afternoon, supervisors. my name is drew howard i'm a native san franciscan and actually formerly a staff member of sfmta but i am now retired and i am speaking to the issue at hand. it is a very important one and it's one that should be looked

at in terms of requirements, needs, and desires. and i know that a lot of times the desires have a tendency of overriding the real requirements. specifically, in terms of our operators and their rest room needs, we run muni service 24 hours a day in a lot of businesses. and indeed speaking to supervisor chiu's comment about businesses, my understanding is they've been trying to look for businesses. but a lot of times the terminals are really on the perimeter of the city and they're not the places where there are the most number of businesses nor businesses that are open all those hours. for our operators, to have to stop mid route foci an inconvenience to the riding public. and if i'm on a bus and all of a sudden we're stopping and i was recently -- the city had

their annual softball tournament over at marina -- at the -- down by the marina. there was a 30 stockton that came along there and stopped specifically at the field house in order to -- the operator use the rest room. that service was interrupted for that period of time. if that operator was able to go to the end of the line of the terminal and have something there, that would be much more appropriate and much more in keeping with the needs of the riding public. i encourage you to do as much as you can, but really look for the real requirements. thank you. >> thank you. congratulations on your retirement. next speaker. good afternoon. i'm elena butler. i live on douglass street in noe valley. can you hear me? >> speak into the microphone so we can hear you better. >> is that better? thank you.

i'm here to speak to the at&t utility box issue. i'd like to speak specifically to the process and actually i want to refer to -- first to an article that was in the newspaper on july 20th, 2011, when the board took the 6 to 5 vote. at&t -- thanks. at&t at that time agreed to conduct robust community outreach and also said that if there were significant community opposition, they could do plans for specific sites. i'd like to point out that the process is not working that way. i was -- i found a notice on the utility pole in front of my house. when i returned from vacation announcing that at&t was planning to locate one of those boxes a few feet from my property line, and i had three days in which to object. i got a few members of my neighborhood to object and the next?

step was at&t calling the meeting for those of us who did object we got e-mail notices saying they would be there tuesday, last thus at 10 o'clock. ~ i learned at that meeting this is how the so-called process works. they originally plan to locate a box at 24th and douglass which is a block and a half away, about 300 feet, a little more than 300 feet away. the neighbors in that case objected to that box being put there. and according to the at&t representatives, they then -- the neighbors and the at&t reps began marching up douglass street and they got to maiello indication and said, why don't you put it there instead and at&t said, okay. ~ my location i'm questioning a process where neighbors are being pitted against neighbors. and neighbors don't know my immediate neighbors. it's like this.

[inaudible] >> thank you. thank you, and if you haven't connected with my office, please do so. we try to track these to see if we can be helpful. it's right around the corner. all right, we'll do it. >> thank you very much. next speaker. good afternoon. my name is thomas sober. i live at 2200 trick ham street. i'm here to represent the sunset residents association. we are here to address the same situation with the at&t utility boxes. unlike bus stops or newsracks, which have a pedestrian purpose, the at&t utility boxes have no pedestrian purpose. this is a very complicated problem. i'm speaking from the perspective that i am a licensed architect for the past

four decades practicing in the city, and i want to reiterate that the process has been just really very difficult on everyone for us. i have volunteered my services of my firm to develop a plan that is based on locating these boxes on private property. we have met with at&t. we have substantiated that they are technically feasible and they are economically feasible from the perspective of at&t affording -- to be able to locate these boxes on private property. however, without my professional experience, we would not have been able to make that argument. so, i want to encourage this group to engage the neighborhoods and also professionals to derive a community-based solution so that we are not kicking the can up the street, as marlene just mentioned, and that we come to a consensus of how this process

will unfold. thank you. >> thank you very much. next speaker. good afternoon, supervisors. alex walker, san francisco beautiful. want to thank first chairman wiener for calling this meeting and thank you all for your time today. i walk 18th and castro all the time and that kiosk is a nightmare with traffic. we at beautiful are happy to be in the community with all these issues and especially when it comes to the permitting and enforcement on having really the eyes and ears on the street [speaker not understood]. we walked down market street from castro, from castro to montgomery which is where our office is located there. we found that 48% of the clearchannel newsracks were empty. we definitely appreciate having thes