cranes and so years ago and so i knew this was coming and i love the idea, also, it is like the slip away two and three are the high line of new york and whatever was there now, is kind of in terms of the plant life is encouraged to propagate there as well. >> and the only comment that i have is that you had in the slip way four and in the keel park the skateboarding and the picnic area and it was skateboarding slash picnic and i thought, number one i am going to picnic and skateboard at the same time. >> if they are there i will not want to be picnicking there, it does not seem like a realistic thing and the idea that all of the blocks are there and they can be moved around and which of course will be the most attractive thing to skateboarders i would imagine. it could just be problematic in terms of the conflicts of the use guide and over all the traces and all of those things, are just beautifully done and i

think that it is going to be incredible addition to san francisco and the water front, thank you. >> and i just wanted to thank mark and david and the staff that we have been working on all of these pro-jeblgts and we have been working on the water front and all of the projects and we have been taking a larger look at it and i made a presentation to the port commission and the planning commission about a history of the water front planning and how all of these projects are really implementing not only the city's and the port's water front land use plan but also implementing the plans that we did which are much and many of what has touched the water and really we are about how to bring the water and the neighborhoods together and so all of these projects the public spaces that the development and the orton development site as well and the city site are all about bringing the neighborhoods to the water and vice versa and i want you to know that we are

working closely with the port on all of these projects to make sure that the plans are implemented the way that they were intended ethank you. >> yeah, i wanted to second some of the other comments that were made and to say that a lot of park designers have a fear of kind of industrial sites that they want to make them all pretty and not erase the investor heritage and i appreciate that that heritage is being kept and that but i would also encourage you to get rid of that wharf that might be gone and i don't think that you need it and will help as well with the budget. and i would encourage you to simplify that perk >> i have a couple of comments as well. it is just stunning and there has got to be one of the only shipyards that you have turned into a park i don't know. obviously this will be an example for the nation as well as honestly probably anywhere in the world. and one thing that i already have the port folks here is that i would love to make my

pitch and i made it to ram before and it is not just in seattle, they have a pocket park and a beach. and you get away from the traffic and you hear the water on the beach and it is fantastic and so i love seeing the water meeting this park. but i would love to promote it in more spots along the wharf downtown and stuff so you can drop in and where that new park is down at brannen and i would love if we had a pork ket beach, otherwise, i would agree, anything interrupting your access to the water i would love to see not there. slip way two and three and that would be great if it that was open. >> anyone else. >> no. >> and fantastic, thank you guys very much. and any public comment on this? to be official? >> no. and great. we are done. and we are adjourning in the memory of alice kerri and all of the work that she has done

in the buildings and also for the movement in preservation, and again to alice kerri. >> bryant, i want to start off by thanking sf gov tv and media

services and every media of the commission and making it available to the public online as well as channel 26 to the public and the audience, please silence all your cell phones and electronic devices. if you are to participate in public comment, please fill out a public comment speaker card, there's some at the very front right there, i think they're yellow, and have it completed, put on the podium and the clerk will collect them. we're going to start with the call to order, and roll call. >> roll call. >> commissioner cavellini. >> present. can commission near lee, commissioner joseph, commissioner hyde, commissioner tan. >> here. >> we have a quorum, commissioner perez and akers

aren't present this evening. >> i would like to make a couple of amendments before we go on with the agenda. we'd like to move item number 5, the hearing and possible action regarding -- sorry, no, i'm number 6, review and possible action to review the conditions for brick and mortar, i would like to move that to item 3 above the report for executive director and also to move item 5, the hearing and possible action for permits right below that, so we'll have brick and mortar first and then the new permits and then the executive director report. alright? our first business is public comment, so this is for items -- >> so, excuse me, sorry, i think you might need to get a motion to make these changes to

the agenda. >> okay, -- >> so moved. >> second. >> okay. here we go. commissioner cavellini. >> aye. >> commissioner lee? >> commissioner joseph. >> aye. >> commissioner tan? >> aye. >> alright, thank you,. now on to public comment. members of the public may address the commission on items of interest to the public that are within the subject matter jurisdiction of the commission. wpt to the agenda items, members the public may address the commission for up to three minutes at the time such item is called, seeing no public comment, we'll move on to item 2, review and approval of the minutes of june 18th and july 16, 2013. are there any comments? >> i move to approve. >> i second. >> we have a motion and a

second. >> and may i have a call? >> absolutely. >> aye. >> moving on to item number 3, so this is now the review and possible action to review and change the conditions on the place of entertainment permit ec1052 for brick and mortar located at 1710 mission street. what we have today is a request by the permit holder to amend some of the conditions on their permit. commissioners, in your packet, there is a recap of a series of e vents since the last time we saw brick and mortar here on may 21, as you can see on that, there are 7 conditions on top of the good neighbor policy that we have that we placed on brick and mortar. subsequent to that on may 30,

it looks like there was an appeal file to the board of appeals which suspended the conditions and transferred the authority of these from the entertainment commission to the board of permit appeals. we were waiting for the decision. we also were waiting for the unpaid citations during the morning of the board of permit appeals hearing, it says later at that hear, the board denied the appeal leading the ec brick and mortar permits in place, and that was june 13. on june 27, the ec did receive -- sorry, they requested to come back to the commission as they had completed their soundproofing, the ec offered two dates, they requested august 6, which is today, so we will be hearing them today. on july 3, the entertainment commission received notice that the brick and mortar check, there was a bounced check, the

ec notified mr. o'connor and mr. jenkins and the fees were still outstanding. on july 25, july 27 and july 28, there was noise complaints to the entertainment commission by the neighbors about brick and mortar. >> can you please repeat those dates. >> july 25, july 27, and july 28th. on july 31, there was a second check received from brick and mortar to cover the citations for the returned check fees which did not bounce. that brings us to august 3 where sound inspections were made by both the entertainment commission and the department of public health to take sound measurements at brick and mortar. on august 3, that same day, there were no noise complaints filed by neighbors and august 4, the next day. so, that's just what we have before us, but it looks like we have the permit holder here to

make their case, so -- >> okay. i'm here to request that the closing limits be lifted or the closing time limits. we have done quite a bit of sound reinforcement, i have worked very closely with the neighbor, have been in fairly consistent contact with them, i was not aware of those complaints and -- but for the most part, we have not had a lot of complaints, so we soundproofed the entire shell ceiling of the building and then we went ahead and created a shell, an inner shell around the stage to try to control and tame the sounds of the band's actual amps that we can't control at our sound board.

i have established a good working relationship with the neighbors and i think we're definitely moving in the right direction. there are some other sound reinforcement strategies i want to use, but we have definitely gone fairly -- taken in a good direction for now, so that's where we're at. i'm wondering if you've received any communication from neighbors regarding the hearing tonight, one neighbor said they were going to submit ao letter saying that they were for the most part satisfied with the club's efforts and thought we had stepped up and been a good neighbor which i will continue to be now that there is positive communication going on between everybody as opposed to in the past when there were multiple parties that were at

fault for there being poor communication including us and to a certain degree, the staff, the commission, which i think is now taken care of and we're fine and we just want to solve the problem and work with the neighbors. >> so, i see all the staff nodding, we got an e-mail today from the neighbor. >> there's two in our packet. >> so, can i just -- >> go ahead. >> so, on your ongoing sound strategies, are you -- do you have any plans to implement them in the near future? >> yes, yes, we do. i mean, what we just did since the initial hearing has been very, very, very extensive. it wasn't -- i mean, and there was efforts before that. this is the fourth and fifth different strategy that was taken and it's definitely has worked and we can do more. >> okay, so as far as the

communication, is the communication i see on august 6 -- >> audrey, we can't hear you. >> sorry, there's a communication on august 6 from someone named crystal zimmerman who lives at 1760 mission, and she says that you have beener responsive and receptive to their complaints by lowering the sound levels but you have not yet provided a direct line, i guess she means a phone line, to the venue, nor have you complied with the conditions of closing -- stopping live sound at 11:30 on weeknights and 12:30 on weekends, is that the person you were talking about? >> no, i have not been in direct communication with her. >> okay. >> i don't think she's on the

e-mail chain with the neighbors that are primarily on the rear where she's on the side, and i will fix that and get a hold of her e-mail so that she does -- the neighbors in the back have been contacting me directly. i would assume that my guess, i wouldn't assume it but i would guess that these complaints the commission got were on the 25, 26, 27th might have been from here because if there's been a problem with the sound in the last two months, neighbors are e-mailing me directly and then i'm communicating right to the sound person as soon as i get the e-mail on my iphone, and i will continue to maintain that. i'm also going to just go ahead and forward the phone numbers of the -- i mean, we have a house line at the desk which is on the website and that i've communicated that to the back neighbors, however, sometimes the guy can't hear it, but they do check their phones and i just made this discussion with

one of the people that sent the letter, and we just talked about this yesterday, that she could just have the door guy and the sound guy's direct cell phone so she can text me or me simultaneously to get the quickest response and i will relay that information to our neighbor, ms. zimmerman. >> okay, so then we also have -- just so you know, this is for your information, lex wrote that they don't have a phone line information, what is the date on this? august 6th, i'm sorry, yeah, august 6, so you put your phone line out there to people because they don't have it. >> okay, yes. >> and is it possible that you can complete whatever other sound work you need to do in

the next two weeks? is it possible? in reality? >> i mean, like i said, the work we've done since the initial hearing has been very, very extensive. i will continue in the next two week, i will add another strategy to soundproof another area which is already soundproofed but to reinforce the soundproofing. and, you know, as we know, it's not scientific, i can't say, this is going to work, but we are definitely putting the effort in and i will continue to put the effort in, in the next two weeks. >> i have one last question, so some of the e-mails that i've read is that for the most part, the sound has been corrected but there are times when it goes back to what it used to be, can you tell me if you attribute that to volume, someone is increasing the

volume or what do you attribute that to, do you think? >> in my experience, when i have called in a complaint, i've been firm about saying get the volume down, the answer is, it's the amps on the stage that aren't being -- can't be altered by the sound guy, so we can communicate with the bands, hey, this is the limit, but you're also interacting with, you know, a 23 year-old kid who's on tour and he's like, okay, i'll keep my amp at this level, and then, you know, three hours later when the show starts, boom, so we have to keep riding them and working with the bands. >> thank you. >> commissioners, any other -- >> yeah, so this extensive soundproofing as you have no documentation, i think the last time i was asking about

documentation, again, i was saying that you would have a better chance of proving your case at least to me exactly to see what you have done because for me, i can always say that i've done extensive work and maybe extensive to you is something else, you know, i'm looking at these numbers and i'm going to talk to the inspector and ask him a few questions but i see some spikes that go up to above your set levels, i mean, it goes to 76, it goes to 102, i mean, there's certain things and i think it contributes a lot to the volume, i mean, if you get a complaint, i'm sure you turn it down and take the reading and the volume would go down, the thing is when you -- well, at least in a nightclub, you know, we want to play it as loud as possible without having to turn it up and down when neighbors

complain, so a true soundproofing is you have everything done and as long as you keep the level at the proper thing, it wouldn't be spiking because you wouldn't be turning it up and down and these readings that they're taking, you know, then it goes by the average, but then when it does peak, you're still -- the neighbor's going to complain because the soundproofing hasn't been finished. so, if we decide to move forward, and audrey wants two more waoex of soundproofing, i would like to have a summary of what you've done, okay, i mean, whether it's extra sheet rock, whether it's done already, and even photographs would be even nice because obviously this is impacting your business and you want us to make a call, but i don't have any visual information or anything to read, so other than you are responsive to the neighbors, that's good but it's not going to solve the problem, so i'm kind of at that point with that

and i don't know if anybody else wants to talk about -- >> so, can you provide us photos and just a written documentation of what you've done in terms of soundproofing? >> yes. >> you know, i would like to continue that conversation. i was reading in writings that you guys posted after the meeting that you had no idea that -- when you came to the meeting, you got blind sided by the entertainment commission but you came two weeks after you were supposed to be here, correct? originally? >> it was continued. >> it was continued for two weeks at your request and when you did come, you didn't provide any information or any numbers or any photos and the neighbors provided all of that, and then i keep hearing different numbers about how much is being spent on soundproofing, and then there's like a shell here and a shell there and i happen to ask a

couple of people, let me call it up here, about what they did when they opened up a little barn with a permit, and they put spray insulation on the roof six feet thick, the walls were pumped with cell you loes, all exterior walls also were insulated, these people knew that right off the top of their head like what was done and they were able to quote me prices and what they did, and i was wondering if you could quote me some prices and what you did and what you used. >> first of all, keep in mind that this building has been a club 7 to 8, 9 years. >> this place has also been a club, i just want to know what you did. >> there's a lot of hostility in your tone.

>> it's not hostility, i just want to have that information if i could. >> like i said, there had been multiple clubs there prior to us, we did not know a history of sound complaints, so it's an 80 year-old building that -- of reinforced brick that i can't go in and build new walls and this and that, and if i was going in from scratch to a building and creating a club, as i currently am again at another site, i am aware of those strategies and realize that that's a great way to approach the problem. in this particular case when we opened, i was attracted to the deal and the project because it had been a club and i've done this long enough to know that

you need to do your due diligence on potential sound complaint issues. currently the project i'm working on right now is a building that i went after specifically because it was right next to the freeway, and -- >> so, can i redirect you, i think the question that commissioner hyde had -- >> i'm answering the question. >> can i just finish my question, we're asking what have you done, whether it's quoting prices or the actual material was used to soundproof, it's a simple question. >> the entire roof, the shell of the structure was covered with two sheets of sheet rock and a layer of sound board which is approximately 4 thousand square feet and was -- i can come up with a ballpark price of 10 thousand dollars but it was more or less around that price, in addition, then we framed out a shell and a lowered ceiling below the

actual ceiling that had been soundproofed, a lower ceiling above the stage to contain the amplified amps on the stage at a cost of about 5 grand. >> go ahead, commissioner. >> can i just ask if the shell is attached, is it a total box? is it like sealed on all sides? >> except the front, so you can see the band. >> okay, gotcha. >> commissioner hyde? >> yeah, and if you hear hostility, i'm going to tell you why i feel hostile. you said that multiple parties are responsible for the problems that were being had and you also said that sometimes the phone for neighbors can't be heard in the front and in the good neighbor policy, it states specifically that a venue must provide a cell phone number to all interested neighbors that will

be answered at all times by a manager and/or responsible person who has the authority to adjust the volume and respond to complaints whenever entertainment is provided, and then you also said that you can't control the sound of the bands because of a 23 year-old who is on tour, and quite frankly, like the 23 year-old doesn't care whether you keep this permit or not because they're just there for the night. it is up to you to be responsible for that noise and the noise that is being emitted from your organization, and if i sound hostile, it's because i think instead of accepting responsibility, i continue to hear excuses, and also i think you knew that you should probably come here with some figures and some photographs and prove to us that you have done what you've done because this is very serious and it's probably impacting your business a lot and it's not

something we wanted to do, it's something that we were -- had to do because the neighbors could not live in this environment. so, i think, you know, if you hear me sounding a little egregious, it is because i don't feel like responsibility is being taken and that the problem seriousness is also being accepted as your responsibility. >> do any other commissioners have questions or comments? >> not at this time? >> i just have a rebuttal i mean to your -- when you take on an old building, like i've taken over the truck der row in the day, we had sound complaints everywhere and i'm still there after 12 years, and i've spept a lot of money on soundproofing and i'm probably able to raise my decibel to at least 98. >> i can do the same at the

independent. i had the same problem with the justice league and we fixed it. >> so, just as brick and mortar, you know how to fix it, can't say it's an old building, it's a club, yes, truck der rho is a club, i took it on, it could be fixed, monitors on the stage, in live music, they have their own music and have their own amp, i remember when barbara was on the commission and the police department, they would tell me all my pr gear would have to go through the system and we haven't gone there yet, so i'm saying there are ways to mitigate sound, so -- >> and it appears that you know what to do, so i think the question here is really why don't you just bring that proof to us instead of just verbalizing it, show it to us on paper and do that due diligence, i think that's all we're really asking, i don't

think we're questioning your ability to do that, i think you said you can and you have, and i think you said if we give you two more week, can you show us that on paper and you said yes. >> i have one question, inspector edwards, i can't read the name of the health department inspector that took some readings at 8/3 at brick and mortar, but i want you to confirm if this is real or not, it says with front door closed, noise from live band did not exceed 8dba over ambient. >> that is correct. >> that is correct, and ms. kane, as far as the code goes, is it not true that it says 8dba over ambient? >> it does say that, this is the reading at the front door. >> okay. so, in other words, from the health department's inspection,

they are in compliance, is that right? >> that is correct. >> okay, that's all i want to know. >> great, so is there any other discussion fwr the commissioners or questions? so, the question at hand is whether we can go back into the closing time. yeah, we should take public comment. can i just ask what your request is, what time? >> to lift the closing times that the commission -- >> what closing time would you like? >> i don't know, i suppose midnight on the weekends and 1:00 -- midnight on the weekdays and regular 2:00 on the weekends, although most times we're over earlier because live shows are generally not that late. >> i ju