we suggest that at&t can apply for permit. it will be administratively denied and that will up to them to appeal the decision of the department. >> so dpw never stated to the appellant that they do not have approval to apply. they've sort of jumped over that stuff and said there's no point in applying because there's going to be administratively deanied. denied. no one has ever stated if you have never applied don't apply. >> no. >> if they appeal the denial of the excavation permit, with that also allows them to -- wait, that would be no site, never mind. okay. >> in case excavation permit or not we will back it from this

commission to go over which is the approval of the site. >> okay. go ahead. >> you have asked for an interpretation from the city attorney representing your department? >> actually, the program manager requested that from the office that was provided. >> i just want to -- just one point. is there a clarification request. there's a public comment and we have a chance. >> i was going to recommend we have public comment but limited to this issue. >> that's correct. >> would you rather do that first? >> let's do it that way. >> is there anyone that would like to speak specifically to

this issue whether these appeals are right at this time? the question is we will take public comment not on the substance of the appeals but whether these appeals are ready for the board to hear, whether they are in a -- it's a procedural issue, technical. this is not on the merits. >> i'm going to try if i'm not addressing -- >> yeah, let me try to restate it. i'll back off. thank you. so the question that we asked the representatives and the parties to address is a very specific question relating to whether our board can even hear this matter based on a procedural

issue. this is been argued -- i don't know if i need to go into this. it's been argued by the departments that it is not properly before us to be heard until another procedural step has been completed within our department. if that's complete edd then it's ready for us to hear. the appellate has argued that whoa weren't even allowed to go to the next step so let's hear it now. that fair? if anyone in the public, we welcome your comments on that specific issue. e weren't even allowed to go to the next step so let's hear it now. that fair? if anyone in the public, we welcome your comments on that specific issue. >> i'm a property owner er at 196 randall street, make sure

that the process worked and make sure the locations were selected. i don't understand how at&t can claim that they were denied a permit when all the dpw did was suggest that they go back and look for an alternative location at which time when they find one that works a permit will be granned granted so i find their argument strange and don't understand why they made the appeal in this manner anyway. that's all i wanted to add. >> thank you. all right. >> you want to allow time now for -- >> we have a public speaker. >> thanks. >> i'm addressing the issue at 620 and the issues are similar to what this previous speaker said. we were in the midst of trying to finds alternative locations

when we were surprised. in fact, mark even instructed his people to work with us and then cut him off and next thing we knew there was an appeal so we -- that's basically the situation and we had some ideas, but those ideas have yet to be vetted. we've never had an opportunity to have secondary conversations. >> thank you. any other public comment? okay. >> i'm mark with at&t. i withdraw the that dpw administers. each one of those sections explicitly states that -- >> can you wait 'til we get to that? it's an exhibit, the dpw order you said? >> yes. >> g in the dpw order.

>> what subsection? >> it's on section 2a on page 3 of 23. also looking at 381. >> i need to get to the first one. >> okay, i'm sorry. >> okay, page three -- >> three of 23 in the dpw order dating august of 2005. >> what section? >> section two, letter a. >> okay.

>> in an analogous context in an appeal to a court from an administrative decision california courts to not require the appellant to exhaust all administrative remedies if doing so would be

futile and administrative agency was clearly declared on a particular case and that's in the city of dana point case where the outcome of this is clear. we cannot apply for an excavation permit and if we do we will be denied because we haven't got the smf approval so i would argue this is ripe for the commission to review it right now. >> understand what at&t is suggesting, however, within an order of denial we have always been consistently stating and informing the at&t that the reason for the denial was we request at&t to identify internal facilities from all indications based upon review

from staff. this is the only location for all three permits. these are solo locations so the suggestion from at&t is in these kinda cases you're required to approve it, there's no alternative, regardless whether it's public comment, objections or not, unlike what has happened previously that was appealed at this board on 22nd avenue where alternative location was identified working with the community. >> in these kind of cases the department suggests that in order for it to be fully effective that the process needs to be followed that there should be this approval of an excavation permit in this case, a denial excavation permit to effectuate this similar process as we did to the previous matter that came in front of this board for surface

facilities which was the appeal of the excavation permit as it relates to the findings of the department of the citing of the surface facility in this case. >> okay. >> are you finish /stph-d >> yes. >> with that logic then should have led to completeing the other steps before there's a denial, shouldn't it? >> that is correct and we had requested at&t to work the community to come up because the order was very specific that would allow for additional 20 days. >> this approval came from you folks. >> excuse me. >> this approval came from you folks. >> yes, it did. >> before those steps were completed. >> i mean, if you -- if they don't move on it then it just sits, nothing gets done, .

>> but you triggered it by your disapproval process; is that correct? however -- >> understand. >> however, had the department choose not to take action of either making final decision, a decision on the citing, we would still be back at this body -- >> i understand that sequence. thank you. >> thank you. all right -- >> can i jump in first? >> of course. >> i'm not sure i'm in agreement with dpw's position for the following reason. permits and license have been in the charter for 80 years and we have on other occasions done

additional things or heard additional appeals for cases that did not involve a permit or a license and so i will give you the following examples. one would be a letter of determination, another would be a major project authorization. none of those involve an actual entitlement. >> right, but there are other code provisions that give the board authority to hear those type of matters. >> you're saying that's specifically stated and allowed. >> by legislation, yes. >> i'll ask our city attorney opinion on this. a: are you? >> yes, into the microphone please. >> my view on it is that on the charter, the board of appeal has jurisdictions over the

decisions regarding permits, the issuance or denial of permits and i understand the frustration that's been expressed on the other side, but until we know what the permit is, then -- and until the permit has been denied, then i don't think it's here yet so there should be an application for a permit. it wouldn't necessarily -- if dpw makes it impossible for at&t to file a formal application for permit then i think at&t should send a letter to dpw that satisfies the requirements for an application for permit requesting that the permit be granted so that we know what the permit at issue truly is that at&t has satisfied all conditions of the permit and dpw has a chance to say we are denying the permit for reasons one, two and three in this letter or this

application, then thosish shies would come before you for /aeu analysis and appeal. >> i think what our city attorney just state d makes sense to me because the permit that will ultimately be denied is the permit which we have jurisdiction to hear and it will be included in that as the matters that you brought today on appeal. so we will get there. i agree, this must be frustrateing, but that is part of the city process. i understand your argument on the law, but i don't want to mess with the city process because i don't want to operate outside our current jurisdiction. >> i heard something a little troubling, and i don't know that this is germane to the particular issue. the represent said that at&t was asked to go out, meet with the neighborhood and identify

alternative sites and it looks like they're trying to circumvent that. it seems like there was an opportunity to find an alternative site and that's being looked over. >> for the process, i think -- i think we are so inclined to take a vote on the question of jurisdiction because i think once -- if it goes away that we're leading here, i think it will determine the outcome on the rest of the appeal on the merits so i'm going to make a motion to deny the permits based on lack of jurisdiction. >> could i suggest maybe instead of denying the permit -- so are

>> sorry, reject the appeals because we have no jurisdiction to them. >> i'm curious also if you want to have us refund their appeal filing fee. >> absolutely. i would as part of the motion. >> so to reject the appeals and refund the fees for basis of lack of jurisdiction? >> yes. >> when you're ready. >> the motion is from the president to reject all three appeals for lack of subject matter jurisdiction and refund all three appeal fees. $900 refund. on that motion to reject for lack of subject matter jurisdiction, commissioner fung. >> i'm going to disagree, no.

>> commissioner tile. >> i. >> lazarus. >> i. >> honda. >> i. >> thank you, the vote is four to one, these appeals are rejected for lack of subject matter jurisdiction. thank you. >> there's no further business. the meeting's adjourned. >> hi, i'm lawrence corn field. welcome to building san francisco. we have a special series, stay safe. we're looking at earthquake issues.

and today we're going to be talking with a residential building owner about what residential building owners and tenants can and should do before earthquakes and after earthquakes. ♪ ♪ >> we're here at this wonderful spur exhibit on mission street in san francisco and i have with me today my good friend george. thanks for joining me, george. and george has for a long time owned residential property here in san francisco. and we want to talk about apartment buildings and what the owner's responsibilities might be and what they expect their tenants to do. and let's start by talking a little bit about what owners can do before an earthquake and then maybe after an earthquake. >> well, the first thing,

lawrence, would be to get together with your tenants and see if they have earthquake insurance or any renters insurance in place because that's going to be key to protecting them in the event of a quake. >> and renters insurance, there are two kinds of insurance. renters insurance coffers damage to goods and content and so forth. earthquake insurance is a separate policy you get after you get renters insurance through the california earthquake authority, very inexpensive. and it helps owners and it helps tenants because it gives relocation costs and it pays their rent. this is a huge impact on building owners. >> it's huge, it really is. you know, a lot of owners don't realize that, you know, when there is an earthquake, their money flow is going to stop. how are they going to pay their mortgages, how are they going to pay their other bills, how are they going to live? >> what else can property owners do in residential rental housing before an earthquake? >> well, the first thing you want to do is get your property assessed. find out what the geology is at

your site. get an expert in to look at structural and nonstructural losses. the structural losses, a lot of times, aren't going to be that bad if you prepare. an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. get in there and get your property assessed and figure it out. >> so, what is a nonstructural issue that might cause losses? >> well, you know, pipes, for instance. pipes will whip around during an earthquake. and if they're anchored in more numerous locations, that whipping won't cause a breakage that will cause a flood. >> i've heard water damage is a major, major problem after earthquakes actually. >> it is. that's one of the big things. a lot of things falling over, ceilings collapsing. but all of this can be prevented by an expert coming in and assessing where those problem areas and often the fixes are really, really cheap. >> who do you call when you want to have that kind of

assessment or evaluation done? >> the structural engineering community is great. we have the structural engineers association of northern california right here in san francisco. they're a wealth of information and resources. >> what kinds of things might you encourage tenants to do besides simply get tenants renters insurance and earthquake insurance, what else do you think tenants should do? >> i think it's really important to know if they happen to be in the building where is the safest place for them to go when the shaking starts. if they're out of the building, whats' their continuity plan for connecting with family? they should give their emergency contact information to their resident manager so that the resident manager knows how to get in touch. and have emergency supplies on hand. the tenants should be responsible to have their extra water and flashlights and bandages and know how to use a toilet when there's no sewage and water flows down.

and the owners of the building should be proactive in that regard as well. >> so, george, thank you so much for joining us. that was really great. and thanks to spur for hosting us here in this wonderful exhibit. and thank you for joining us >> wow, are the beetles here or are we just reoping the playground? i'm not sure which. thanks to the 2008 parks funds, where you're standing is the home and all of you san francisco voters gave a $20 million investment in this

neighborhood. i was born and raised four blocks from where we stand today. i came and played in this park, on the equipment, in the you know what i mean you know jim gym and structure today. >> to make this a park that everybody can enjoy, a diversity that would show the city that this is what san francisco is all about. >> what we got here is 3,000 new square feet of places for people to be healthy and be active and the community to gather. >> if you see /kaelly's mural in the building, there cannot be an imagery that's more related to this place. what people told us about what the importance of the windmills and the green houses and the flowers that used to be grown here and the wind, let's not

forget the wind. >> we have to continue to invest in our city's infrastructure and creating new. this is a recreation center for the 21st century and for the 21st century communities. >> we finally made something after somebody that everybody needs and this is the park. >> when the new california academy of sciences opened in 2008, it quickly became one of the top tourist magnets in the city. part of the cal academies' astronomical success is the weekly nightlife party. >> i am joined by helen, who is here to school me on all the nocturnal activities that are getting ready to take place here. tell us a little about what we can expect to see at nightlife.

>> we open up the doors every thursday night at the california academy of sciences. there are certain things you can see every week you can go to the museum, visit the planetarium, and we bring in bars and a deejay or band. it is a different feel from during the day, something different every week. tonight , we have beer and music. -- tonight we have great beer and music. it is beer week. we have a dozen local brewers in african hall. we have a deejays to set up throughout the museum and a live performance at 9:00 p.m. tonight. >> what has been your favorite part as a participant or as an observer? >> my favorite part is to walk around the aquarium in to see people with a drink in their hands, getting to know maybe somebody new, may be looking for a day, or chatting with friends. there jellyfish. i mean, they are beautiful.

>> the culmination of the animals. >> it is very impressive. we do not have this at home. >> tell us a little about some of the spider's we see here on display. >> at the california academy of sciences, there is a very large collection of preserved and live specimens, which are the evidence about evolution. we have the assassin spiders, which are spiders that exclusively kill and eat other spiders. they are under the microscope here. research done and the california academy's i rhinology lab suggests that the assassin spiders have been doing this for over 150 million years. this glassed in room is a real scientific laboratory, and the people in that room are

preparing specimens of vertebrate, that is mammals and birds. the way they do this is to remove the skin, sew it together in a relatively lifelike pose, and ensure that it does not decompose. >> i am a really big class actress fan, so i am here to see them, and beer week. >> i wanted to learn something and have fun. >> i always enjoy it. i am not all is well -- always working as i am tonight. sometimes i come to enjoy the music and to dance. ♪ >> culturewire covers the arts in san francisco, and one of my favorite culture artists is here tonight. jason, thank you for being on culturewire. tell us about some of your posters that we have here today. >> most of the posters here are

four specific shows or tours. i am hired by the bands or the venue. >> what is the inspiration behind these posters? >> no, disease of the related to the bay and, of course. music -- it is related to the band, of course the musical content or isn't related to the bed. album covers can come from anywhere. ♪ ♪ >> class actress was great.

we have been having so much fun. i did not realize how beautiful the cal academy looks than that. what other events take place here? >> we do corporate events that night on a regular basis. but nightlife is your best bet to come in as a regular person pharmacy the academy at night, and visit with friends. calacademy.org/nightlife. we have details for the next few weeks. you can get tickets online in advance or at the door. >> thank you so much. thank you for watching culturewire on sf gov tv.