>> please notice the stabilization amount. this is a number that we adjust the projected rate by policy which you and i to amortize over 3 years. i don't know the best way to do this but there is another document that i need to review that tells me how i got the $7 million. >> all right. if you call out the tab and be patient with us. >> let's go to tab 8 of your booklet. it is actually --

it's actually tab 8 in your booklet. it's a city plan uac rate stabilization. i think that this is incredible what's happened. the way we generally present this is i know we have the answer on page 1, but the math of how we get to the answer is actually on page 2. so i would like to, can you go to page 2? there you go. can everybody see that okay? this is pretty amazing. we at this point in time thought that this thing needed $38,000 put into it for this period of time. when we built the rates for 2013, not 14. we looked at it and put $38,000 of prior

money into rates because that's where we were. we were actually draining cash out of the system in the last year, they flat increased for the retirees. all the others exploded in a positive direction. at the end of the day, if you notice that number there, can everybody hear me okay? it's $17 million. so this thing generated $17 million. so i think the net difference of that amount of money, this is as expected. i take that number and carry that amount over to page 1. so on page one last year we were carrying for $4 million. it was doing so well. this year we are carrying a total of $17 million. we add those two numbers together. this is a 3-year policy which i inherited which is a

fantastic policy. you have this from my prior consultant. when i read it, i thought it was really smart. this money goes back to the people. it's all about bringing the money back to the plan and adjusting where needed. the rule is you take a third of this new surplus prior surplus in $7 million $431,000 will be put against the rates. let's remember that number. $7431, 000. is there another way to make that bigger? i guess that. if you see that, and your paper says that, if we run our stabilization down at 15, at

the bottom it says $7431, we took the rate by $7 million. point of interest. i want to point out one rate to you. it's the adjusted with stabilization reserve. our mapd rate from kaiser is 24. these medicare rates are on the -- medicaid cob. we are less than $100. that's an amazing number comparing your two other vendors. it's like wow, this is something else.

maybe there is an opportunity here. i don't know, i'm happy for the city plan that this has happened. on we go, we looked at this and applied $7 million and the decrease is fantastic. on the back i have three rate cards. i won't go on and on about this. we'll be here all day. the point is to show you that some still have the zero, that's the status quo and some of the 90/10 and then the 93, 83. to take away from this is this in 2015 we subsidized hsf for those people who decided to go to 9383. those people will no longer be subsidized. those people would have to pay now what is a tentative rate of

$320 for singles. that's not great. and so because it's capped at the second highest plate. it's a complicated formula. there will be people who i think is in the best interest to educate them that your rate is going up so they don't say, i just got a bill for $320 that i just got taken out of my paycheck. where the other people who it doesn't apply, that is a zero. this is a discussion item. i have shared this. i think it is incredibly good news. i'm not thrilled about the 10-piece. are there any questions because that's basically my discussion about the rate status at this point? >> are there questions by members of the board? >> i would like to go back to page one. the number of the members, is that as of 2013? >> yes. >> with the new enrollment as

of 2014, are there big changes from december 2013 and the new calendar year? >> can i have lisa? >> is it similar? >> thank you, the question is regarding the city plan enrollment for 2014. for the active -- really across all of the plans there is protection against those members in terms of significant financial exposure in 2014 so we did not see a lot of movement. we are continuing to see that decline. where we'll see the major reduction in participation for both active and early retiree will be in 2015 where we have the hetch hetchy people who have the stipend for supporting in that plan. otherwise it's going to be difficult to have anyone who are going to be able to afford the rates in 15 which

would be preliminary for an e only, $411 and $300 a month for the 9093 people. >> it's close to the same? >> it's very little movement in 2014. keep everything stable both blue shield and city plan stable and try to get the mou agreements fixed for 2015 to at least save blue shield. that was our intent. we were successful in that. the demographic report will come to the board at the march meeting. >> one more question for lisa? you are presenting a status quo 910 and 9310, are we expecting almost all unions

to move to 9310 in 2015? >> there is no one left on the status quo. no unions left on the hundred percent. there are about half of our membership because one of our largest union is on a plan that would be the 9010 as of july. so i would say that we have at least half of our membership in the 9010. we have done some projections if those unions don't adjust their contributions, we will see what we have models for this board previously if we have enough influence for the over all population that we have migration in families and continue migration and continue adverse selection and we are doing everything we can do to help support the understanding of the

importance of coming up with the contribution model that allows competition and fair pricing. all we can do at this point is cross our fingers and hope we have been heard. >> thank you. >> are there other questions? is there public comment on this item? hearing no public comment, we'll move to item 5. >> okay. >> item 5. action item review dental plan and approve retiree plan. committee chair scott? >> yes, this is a continuing direct response by the staff to the public comments and letters and other input about the dental plan as it currently stands. it needs to be noted here very clearly that the concerns have been

heard and considered a wide range of alternatives and we are coming forthwith this report today, our actuary. >> okay hold on. we have some late breaking updates. >> that is true. >> i'm on my game today. >> as was clearly stated this is an on going discussion about the approved retirees

for dental coverage. we have a document that is fairly long, but the substance is in the first 11 pages and there is a whole bunch of additional permutations of plan configurations because as this plan is on going, people have asked many questions. what if it was half way up? because it's a thousand dollars cap. not that we personally or hsf believe that it's financially doable. that information has been provided so that everybody is fully aware and we have what they call a well-rounded consideration decision about what we have. so that being the case i would like to walk you through what we are excited about and you go through your leisure and decide whether or not you want to bring forth some of the questions of some of these options in the opinion. with

that i will turn to page two, what we would like are three designs. one of the important aspects of these three designs is what we want to -- first i can turn you over to say this is what you currently have on page three, it's a thousand dollars cap. it's 100 percent for the p po's and has been discussed previously. ppo's are 25 percent of the dentist available. they are cheaper and cheaper discounts. in a perfect world everybody would be a ppo and would get all of this coverage for $30. that's not the case. a lot of the dentist with delta dental are premier dental. they have a 5-7 percent discount over what they charge. they have by far the largest network. so the non-participating a very small section of the entire dental

provider matrix in california. this is what you have and it says the only first two cleanings which include under that's the cleaning statement. i'm sorry. what we want to talk about are three plans and what we have in these three plans are what they call d and p, diagnostic and preventative. we can increase maximum or have it waived. when you waive it means all the benefits apply to diagnostic which is what you need to have done every year, your cleaning, etc, x-rays, you need to get this done to know what's going on in your teeth. so delta dental says we need to create programs where we wave that and the max --

applies to your dental hygiene. then if we allow this, we can apply the full amount to the thousand dollars max. we have a grid produced by delta dental for us and gives you some understanding as to what the cost is on average for the d and p piece of this. it generally runs between $250-300. we put it out here in this grid. what the point of this table is on 5 to show you how many people hit their max minimums and 19 percent hit their maximums. of those people 85 use d and p. to give you a rough consideration. if 85 percent of those people were categorized as primary

enrollees. 85 percent would have additional $200 that could apply for more benefits because of the waiver. i think that's great because they go in and they go, you've used up a bunch of stuff and now it's manageable and now they go in and say i have my waiver and i have my basics. i'm being a good person taking care of my teeth and now i have $200 to take care of this. now i'm really good to go. the price on this is pretty good. that being said, we look at this and say, are there any questions about the beefk -- basic flow of what we are suggesting? >> i just want to get my head around this a little bit. i like to use cases as way to understand this. you went through a couple quickly, but just to understand, if you do what you are supposed to do, is that like a factor baked

into this waiver, meaning you have to get your diagnostic and prevention stuff and if you do there is a bonus for you? >> it's not applied to your maximum. yeah, you have a thousand dollars max. if you get your teeth cleaned and all listed as part of the d and p course of action, none of those are applied to the max. if you need a crown or whatever the case may be, you have a thousand dollars versus you chewed off $200 and you have $800 left. >> what if you get a crown and it cost $2,000 max, then you get your d and p also? >> yes. you are good to go on that category of benefit. depending on where you go it's 100 percent ppo and 80 percent at premier dentist. any other

questions? >> what does this cost? hopefully everybody, i want everybody to be aware there has been a change of some of these numbers. initially when we quoted one which says we get the waiver, nothing else changes. all the structure of the benefits that occurred are the same except we have the d and p aware of which generally runs you about $200-300. under this, when we initially got the pricing, it was $45. there has been a correction by delta dental. that should have been $47.72. if you don't have that; it should be in there.

it's 47.72, $92, $94. what happened was there was some confusion and they publiced a rate at 7.29 percent higher than the existing rates and when they went back and said since we have made the offer, we will honor the offer for 1 year, but we want everybody to know and this is a transparent board that the true number was 11.76 percent increase. so for everybody's clarity of knowledge that is the offer and, but delta said we'll give you that number because they are being straight forward honoring our offer commitment. so is there any questions about those two numbers because that can get confusing? >> not so much a question but if it's an effort by this board at this point to be very transparent about this. so if we decide to act on the 7.29,

we need to understand that there is consequence to that. pay me now or pay me later. so we did this and review and discussion with the acting director. i said we needed to put this number out there now so that we are making an informed decision. and it's not like we are going to get a discount and then it's never going to come back again, it will come back at some level. we can't predict the future. i just wanted everyone to be clear. >> yes, i honor this as very straight forward and very fiduciary and accountable by saying it's really 11.6. that is our initial alternative one. >> yes, sir? >> so the rates that you have includes 11 percent that it

was the $47.72? >> yes, sir. that was monthly. yeah. >> if it's monthly, you gain a premium of d and p is $250 but the inclusive rates amounts to $60 so you gain $190? >> yeah. if you get your teeth cleaned. yeah because it's the percentage of people using d and p as retiree, the point is $5. >> because of the dollar amount because some of the reimbursed might not know how much they gain. so in terms of the yearly increase in the premium is about $60 but your d and p from $250-300. you

get $300 in terms of benefits? >> well-spoken. any comments on that one? >> we have two more that we would like to run by you. on page 7, what we did is we went through this and they have the waiver, but they also and structure it like our existing active plan where we have the non-part at 50 percent. so it's a thousand, a thousand, a thousand, and this particular product, because some of the people get left -- less for about 5 percent. this number is 10.8 percent and we have a third one. where we go on the third one, this is more of an increased plan maximum and we go $1500 for the ppo, $1200 for the premier dentist and leave it at a thousand. since

you raise it so much, there is no real need to wave the d and p or that would allow more to it. this particular one in crisis rates by 12 percent. so i think these are all three very fantastic alternatives and where we are now is that what we think we want to do on a go forward basis, excuse me, because we want to clearly say that alternative one to us is by far very promising, but we need to survey the members. am i saying that correctly, lisa? and get their opinion as to whether they are willing to have a stay at -- yes, sir? >> president had a comment or question? >> on alternative 3, e