be more spooedz are. the effects of mta has been working on the interacts where the streets have bumps and humbles and other types of things that you probably deal with in your work as supervisors but when were you looking at kind of redesigning streets fresh we try to consider what we've learned in the past to make those kind of positions >> you mentioned sort of accepted urban transportation design standards for streets. and so again not talking about aerials or major streets but side streets is 80 feet clear of clearance park car to park cars is that what you did expert would consider to be the

appropriate >> yes. a that's pretty standard in the 20 feet clear follows the fire skoed code and there recent proponents of having even narrower streets there's a possibility ever having streets that have narrower profiles depending on the parking so you can get around on a narrower profile we succumb in san francisco the parking lane will be a constant obstruction but if you have a street you can have narrower profiles but the standard kind of narrow residential street where volumes are low below 5 thousand vehicles a day that's pretty standard. >> you mentioned before the request that i constituents for traffic calming i know first of all, my hat off to you and your

colleague i know we forward those how many requests for traveling calming do you receive a week. >> i don't have the exact numbers some of them take the form of stop signs and more former traffic cadging questions we have a program for 189 that handles safety containments and operational issues handles over a thousand a year. >> i can speak from my experience a significant number of those requests are requests to show you make the traffic go slower because people don't want the speeding on their streets. >> yes. right in front of where we live. >> when you have the sort of

the wide lanes that you distrusted of 26 clear you described that will tend to lead to faster car speeds. >> yes. that's where we end up doing the speed humbles. >> thank you just in connecting the dots this is a technical exercise but not. we know that people in this city, you know, do not want lots of speeding through their neighborhoods and one of the ways you insure that there's going to be a lot of speeding having wide streets >> yes. there are measures that can be done when streets are that wide but measures through actively devices and corner bubbles and try to get at

that. >> (speaking foreign language.) >> >> is that ideal. >> the ideal is also to have the street so to speak that's the narrow profile us putting paint on the ground is added to the street but to have the street have the design be what invites the users to on behalf of appropriately. >> supervisor cowen. >> question for you, sir. clarifying question you mentioned 20 foot clearance is this for one or two way streets >> the 80 foot is from the fire code it doesn't matter so it did i understand as 20 feet is two-way for us as being two, 10 foot lanes in each direction you can imagine how to have that but

typically in residential streets we would like to have two-way it's beneficial for the speeding issue we're talking about. so if you had a one-way street and only needed one lane you'll talking about a street that is every narrower >> would that be the street our describing. >> that's the streets that are all right. built in a different era and an alleyway you'll have a one way. sometimes, we get a request some people want to turn them into one way streets by a because it's hard for two-way traffic to in fact the streets and sometimes, the residents don't like the two-way friction kooets keeps the traffic down once you take a 2-way lane and turn it into a one way people feel they

can speed down that. implicit not what we're talking about but only 1 lib lane in two-way traffic >> that's problematic? >> that can be problematic people feel like there's not enough room to safely in fact, it so sometimes they making maybe coming a a different way a that's a different issue but i was mentioning there are streets in san francisco had e that have the profile and only one lane and two-way traffic. >> thank you. appreciate that. next i'm going to ask our planning department to come up john ram. and followed by the fire department and the department of public works >> thank you, supervisors i'm

going to step back and talk about the holistic look at streets. and why this issue is important to creating great neighborhoods one pharynx in creating good neighborhoods. we'll get the slide show up. just to set the stage a little bit. while we're often considered to be a built out city we have a number of big projects that are in the approval stage that will - are essentially being built on new lands. so the results of that is that there are besides candle stick and hunters point shipyard there are susan vail and ca temporary and treasure island you all those projects require no infrastructure and new streets being built on repurchased land

so this totals in terms of housing 27 thousand housing units. all those projects have been approved with the specification of susan very vail projects. the shipyard site has a fair amount of commercial space as treasure island but most of the projects are residential projects. that's important to take a step back and recognition what we're talking about here is that pedestrian plays we note in the better street plans the street right of ways are 25 percent of the city land area they represent more los angeles police department than the parks so this was to look at how we do our streets and address the needs of vehicles and all modes of transportation and comforts

in our area we look at the of principles for our streets. there are streets that are comparable for safe for all ages and social and promote sustainable transportation and provide come municipal spaces. those these facts and circumstances combined with the land use make a great neighborhood everyone from the traffic lanes to what types of design treatments to the parking and it provides a buffer on street parking between moving vehicles and has to do with the terms that we slow down traffic as well as other features with the sidewalk and the native and all those things contribute to

make a great street. those quickly obviously, the streets have been be comfortable and the sidewalks a place to stop and rest and lighting and ways to temper down noise and making them safe for all ages we live in an aging population and odor population insure availability at crosswalks ate an important factor we sometimes forget and provide visible areas for drivers. we recognize in the 50s and 60s we remember sdrooin areas for cars we anticipated that every city would be a suburban city. so we're going to refix that >> the third factor is social

sections that the street is a place to hang out in providing community space and including transition spaces in front of the of residence there are great streets it is dark but in the a street that has 20 feet clear. >> director ram. >> yes. >> back on i guess two slides ago slide number 2 safe for all ages is the heading where is this picture taken. >> neil is going to have to help me out. >> there's a new residential street in stockholm swede the home of vision zero so we're all starting in this city we're

trying to address those concerns. >> thank you. okay human scale streets in san francisco >> so those are some of the things this happens to be coal street. this is coal and this is 28 street as well >> those are photos have showing they all look at they're about 20 feet or clearance. >> there's 20 feet between the parked cars that's correct. >> are those some of the large buildings we're seeing. >> a mix you're seeing on 28th mixed mostly 2 to 3 tall buildings. can i go back?

there's some taller building here's on that street >> i'm sorry that is 20 feet. >> yes. i believe that's about 20 feet between the cars it varies increase no destined parking lanes per say so the cars take up 7 or 8 foot in width. >> do you have any images or anything you can voibl show us that represents more of the development that's planned for i mean we are talking candle stick and hunters point shipyard. >> right we were taking samples of existing neighborhood streets and admittedly there are deficiency in many of the streets as well it's a question of we're trying to use examples of the better streets of the city and there are students that

aren't mentioned that are narrower. this happens to be on the overhead here. this happens to be bat out of hell dear street it loophole depends on the total numbers of factors in this discussion. the idea of promoting sustainable transportation as we move to a city that's more and more reliable b upon transportation transit relies on people walking everyone that takes public transportation at some point is a pedestrian so perfect comfort is important in terms of crossing the streets and waiting areas and so on. that, of course, includes the safe bicycling fates and connecting to nature and recreation is an important parts one of the things about candle stick and this hunters point shipyard the 3 hundred acres of

open space on the waterfront that's important and the streets play a (roll call.) and finally the community streets provide the gathering for communities and the informal gatherings and must be and it's important their educational to everyone both that physical disabled and without. those were a comprehensive look at the streets we had to look at all the modes of transportation but look at streets as community space and that's why the plan took a comprehensive look at how we design our streets and come up with a toolbox to design our

streets differently for all pedestrian spaces and bikes and community gathering places. we're about completing complete neighborhoods in those streets. i will say that i think it's important to recognition that all the departments have been working together on this effort and we're in a very robust substitution with the fire department and mta and ocii on this issue. we've come to an agreement in candle stick point but we recognize there is more work to do there's a citywide standard to apply to all the sites i've mentions. it's important i think we agree we move forward open developing clear standards f that works for all the sites and work to be

consistent with all the goals for all modes of transportation and pedestrian safety we're willing to do that and moved on that. appreciate that >> thank you and i know after the fire department and dpw announced they wanted to street clearance to be 26 feet instead of 20 feet i think that planning and mta got together i appreciate the departments working together. but under the accumulation or compromises, however, you describe it my understanding is that the bulk the side streets will have 26 feet cleaners >> my understanding is there will be 26 feet clear on most the streets the non alley streets within park cars. >> so that will mean at times

reducing the width of the sidewalks or reducing venerable lands or open space. >> that's my understanding. >> a question is 26 feet now the new baseline my understanding is a lot of people share this the baseline for not aerials but residential size it's 26 foot clear if you're going to go widower or narrower there has to be discussion. is 26 feet now the new baseline presumption >> i think i don't know the answer to that question. >> you know i think that given the city's department came forward we wanted 26 clear and now it looks like the other departments there's whatever the

compromises is being worked out goes with the 26 clear and reduce the sidewalks and so on and so forth it's hard to see why that won't become the baseline for other prongs now that the get departments have agreed with the fire department and dpw's request to have the roads 26 feet. >> i think we agree there's a compromises on candle stick point we'll still like to work together for other solutions. >> supervisor cowen. >> i wanted to make sure i heard one of your last comments correctly that the street plan is a guide not codified and necessarily as the law. >> no. you do adapt it by

legislation several years ago about 3 years ago now. >> thank you, mr. ram appreciate it. right now i'd like to ask our fire chief chief joanne haynes-white. chief thank you for your work. our little disagreement thank you to all you and your department for your incredible work and keeping our city safe >> thank you supervisor wiener and supervisor cowen and others chief joanne haynes-white with the fire department. i would echo some of the previous remarks under mayor ed lee as well as our elective branch of government all the city agrees are working together collaboratively. i'll make some opening statement and we'll worked with our departments to put together a presentation both mta were there

to humane our slides. some opening remarks related to overlay pedestrian safety. certainly the as fire chief we're to save lgsz. notwithstanding anything related to pedestrian safety we feel an integral part of the safety but as evidenced over my 24 years my 10 years as chief we make it work and certainly we've had challenges in your district supervisor wiener and obviously we want to anytime misses vision zero we're totally behind there recent pedestrian deaths if not for our aggressive program we think there would be more deaths we're challenged everyday by

windy conditions and our geography in general the national fire association has ranked us the most combustible city in the top 3 in america. we've learned a lot if you are our history only the 1906 but the fires that raged for 3 days and having widower streets from a fire safety is important they provide firebreaks in a indulging populated city and most parts of the city had wood construction in 1989 tyson years ago we've been looked at the loma linda earthquake and more recently in mission bay. in early march we were very, very fortunately of fortunate to

be able to contain that fire to the building but within 7 minutes that fire took off and didn't have fire damage about 75 feet across the way it was an 8 story building but the building activated the fire sprinklers and the main street we're dealing with is curb to curb 52 feet across we're the ultimate team players i feel that's my roll when we have the opportunity to get it right with with all due respect when we have the opportunity to get it right we think from our operational needs we need more stays can we make it work in the infrastructure yes, but with all

respect which i saw geary that was wider and now one hundred and 20 it's comparing apples and oranges i believe the 1906 picture was 18 feet across and now one hundred and 20 it's like a freeway midway through our student >> i'm glad you brought the mission bay fire 52 feet of curb to curb. >> correct. >> there were no cars there were there. >> there was one car parked. >> but generally it was. >> in general about 52 feet of clarence. i have a picture here as well >> there were generally not cars parked there. >> that's 52 feet across i'm talking about a building that's non-not on the picture it was

sybil sdanldz. >> you said publicly that the vice president had challenges at the fire in terms of the trucks. >> well, you, see we were able to get 4 apparatus across. >> well, maybe i miss heard. >> we were absolutely changed that day. >> i ask that because 52 feet is a very, very wide roadway. >> we're not advocating that. >> but it seems like even at 52 feet with a fire that was causing a problem we're xael e defeating between 80 and 26 feet even then you're seeing challenges with 52 the challenges go beyond the 20 and 26. >> there's a significant

difference in 20 feet if you're putting our aerial lard some of the photos you've seen with the planning department was to supervisor cowen's points those were with two to three 17 we are talking over 10 thousand new units thirty thousand new residence into our city we want to make sure we get to any emergency so totally is an apples and oranges presentation. >> i think i was on i think polk street yesterday or sutter downtown. >> both one way students. >> their 20 foot clearance was not more than 20 or 21 feet that's discount u downtown san francisco obviously an enormous amount of people with high-rises we have plenty of neighborhoods

with tall building that doesn't have more than 80 feet cleaners. >> our position when we have the opportunity to place our rigs not only in mission bay but in houston we had one this was simple we're talking about a project in supervisor cowen's district from 15 to a high of 25 years you may have developed areas but 20 years of vulnerable construction who we really feel like it's it would be erroneously as a fire chief if we have the opportunity to get it right and have the collaboration with the department of public works and the developer hydrathat has been a very good partner we didn't

bully them but educate them on the importance of 26 photo while it's important there will be over 3 million square feet of retailed and commercial space there's going to be a lot of new people it's resident and commercial dollars they're going going to be busy. i understand speed we've worked collaboratively with planning for the obnoxiously. we think that's important if you're a pedestrian that legally crossing the street we will be putting up museums makes sense we which the of feel again, while we have the opportunity it's a dense community and heights there's nothing less than 40 feet and others we're

concerned it's a windy area in the city this is what we want to have in your future and invest in our infrastructure totally respecting the pedestrians and motorists rights that widens our sector in mission bay we had six or seven >> i think we understand this is going to be in terms of the construction there's more vulnerable and it's important to keep in mind that residents are going to be living in the community for 71 or one hundred and 50 years, however, those buildings will last and deal with the speeding cars. i i know it's a hard issue but we're also trying to get it right >> i appreciate is and

understand we've met with 90 minutes with walk sf and we've on board with vision zero we're the first responders that show up to any medical emergency and we feel as operational experts in the fire department we need to kind of hold our ground i think i need to address before i ask the city engineer to come up those 2010 and the inner agency cooperation agreement i signed it there was nothing to drizzling on 20 or 26 feet it didn't take away the authority when the plan develops. >> and you see the development it needs to come back to the fire department for review. >> it speaks for itself i know that ocii