westwood park has been good stewards of the trees they're seeking removals every year too when needed but we don't offer services or resources unfortunately similar to the way street trees are maintained by the adjacent property owners my sense when the area was developed if the medium was create they would be maintained by westwood park. >> does westwood assume the liability. >> the liability is with westwood park. >> does something shall happen if the roots fail. >> yes. dpw to a certain decree or the city has some other responsibility to maintain a safe public roughly u right of way but the most current

responsible party is westwood park. >> thank you. >> okay. we'll take public comment can i see a show of hands how many people want to speak first person please come up to the podium. >> good evening commissioner. >> speak into the microphone. >> good evening, commissioners my name is a. >> hold on one second the mike is not on. >> try that again. >> go ahead. >> good evening, commissioners i'm miles lou my wife and i reside near the pine tree on the 6 hundred block of miramar and san francisco we feel strongly that the city should permit the

removal of the subject trees but the dispute between the westwood system and the city arborist differs if the trees is good beverage forum i have a photo that shows a cable so the branch may fail meantime i think it's important to protect the residents and owners in our neighborhood thank you. >> thank you. next speaker. >> thank you. next speaker, please. >> hi, i'm donna china i've been a retina resident in westwood park and live on the 5 hundred block of miramar i live close to the 5 hundred block of miramar i live next to the tree

and my fear has always been during the storms it's a huge tree it's going to fall fortunately, we have not had big storms in the last few years i've seen the herosic way that westwood park has tried to preserve trees they do everything they can but at some point i think we need to recognize that a tree that is older and mature may become very dangerous and i saw pg&e a few years ago they were pitting in sir, lines and they cut the roots of these trees so therefore there's no huge base that is going to stabilize lists this huge tree.

so i fear that it will topple one day not only branches but h and limbs but the whole tree that will hit a house because it's so big my fear it will hit my house i know that the city contends 38 they said they don't know when the tree will fail seem like if you don't know when it could tail it could fail tomorrow that's a huge safety risk especially for the people that live near the tree. i've seen my 24 years i've seen the trees fall fortunately they were smaller trees that hit cars but when the tree that's in front of my house fails it's going to hit a house. so, anyway my feeling is that in this case, the risk indefinitely out weigh the benefits of

keeping a tree that is behalf but perhaps it is out lived it's day thank you >> thank you. next speaker, please. >> good evening. my name is john, i noticed in the first slide show that 5 slides were labeled 574 miramar that's my address i live oppose this tree i live next door to dpon in a i agree with her i've lived here 27 years itself trees compliment the architecture but in recent years i've become more and more afraid of them or at least afraid of that one in front of my house i've nolsz

trees up and down the medium collapsing without warning. and in the case of this tree with it goes it is indefinitely going to cause damage no matter what direction it's going to hit something unfortunately my house is in easy striking distance i was struck been one thing the arresting above the said he said he can't say those trees are safe i like the tree but i fear it's time for the tree to go for the safety of those living around it and those on miramar thank you >> thank you is there any further public comment seeing none, we'll have rebuttal 3 minutes.

>> yes. anita harris again. many of the 506 trees i'd say in the last few years have not been permitted to be remembered they fell down and the city came on an emergency basis to get an emergency vehicle permit mr. buck first of all, thank you that mri westwood takes good care of our tree i realize any tree can fall, however, those trees are deemed unsafe by two arborists we've challenged the kabldz and got flexible cables we've been taking care of those trees i applied and got a grant in san francisco beautiful to help save our san francisco

trees we love the trees and like the trees we really would be more grateful if you allow us to replace those drawers trees >> arborist nicholas crawford again, i agree with what chris buck chaired or starved his analysis t is much the same as mine we've come to different conclusions and the first thing i'd like to mention is the limitation of the cables a lot of time we look at that and that we santa clara, engineer the solution but you're limited in what you can do to protect and hold the trees together so the specification felt trees is really light compared to what it

it would be in a windstorm and his comments but the defects looking at those in a tree from a staff level from the reason we shared it has a lot of risk factors they're looking for more but we are meeting that career already and the considerations of the vigor of the trees is working against us in the tree were in declining health it would not make it heavier at the end you would have less wealthy at the ends if it were less stable we don't cail trees safe or dangerous but look at it from a scale of risk those trees moves up the scale to the higher level of risk. >> i have a question i like it

when tree experts agree amicably but from my prospective our opinions are the most important thing i certainly respect the concerns of the neighbors but there is a certain level of concern because they live by virtue of living there i take full account of their opinions by what is per consecutive how do you say we resolve 9 two different opinions you agree on many things how would you suggest we resolve this. >> sure i think as the caregivers of those trees we've gone to the limits of maintenance and what we can do for prevent care i'd be happy to

suggest something but in terms of pruning and cabling we hesitate to reach this point it is much easier we wouldn't have to go through the effort of applying for removal if there were somebody else to do but the condition of the trees the recess luxury is to replace them and one of your slides showed the maturity and there was a gap and a wimpy tree i i believe it was new. >> what size. >> i believe they went in with a 15 gallon trees and 24 inch boxes so the next step up. >> any idea when this was

planted? my poker richard hill was overseeing the planting but you can expect those trees to put on 18 to 24 inches of growth a year because of the supplemental water and so my question is similar in that i have friends that live on the block i'm there frequently so specifically what will you be replacing it with the concern from the city departments it could take decades for the canopy to be darker so if i startle smaller can you go a box size up >> sure. the size is reflected of the age of the tree and the time the in youry is velocity in those trees

we could do very well planting them 24 inch boxes within a couple of years can capture up with the 311 you can put many a larger trees they have a large shock period before they start to to reestablish and take off but you get a head start with the larger tree it's a cost factor as you go from a 15 tree 6 hundred and next is 15 hundred two guys to mrantd a tree to a medium crane truck >> that's subsequential. >> it's a lot of work to put in a 36. >> are you saying you wouldn't be open to doing that.

>> i can't speak for them. >> maybe you can address that down the line. >> but the criteria they would be willing to follow the larger trees is a head start in terms of the trees growth. >> sure. >> anonymity several trees we've replant really grow quickly and we we're happy to do anything to address the safety issues but i would respectfully request you consider the cost we're so happy to spend hearsay of thousands of dollars on our trees over the years but our assessments are a $85 a year we get grants and do nation's from residents that love the trees so there's a cost factor involved and we have found the 24 inch

boxes have been successfully replanted. >> okay. thank you. >> just ask you consider that thank you. >> thank you. okay. thank you so we can hear the rebuttal from the department >> good evening chris buck with the department of public works urban forestry i don't have rebuttal but can remain here for question. >> what's the difference between a 36 and 348 box. >> the truck diameter it's roughly 24 by 24 inch box and the 36 inch by 311 finish my question is the size of the box it comes down in the trunk

diameter is different dpw planted 24 inch boxes tyler larger than a 15 inch their planted by the urban forestry and can be prone to vandalism and 24 is less vandalism and there's often i probably should answer the question. >> i appreciate the lesson arrest the smaller the transplant size the fastest is establishes if i have 20 people here saying we want something now in terms of replacement go with the 36 inch box, you know, lacking that in a couple of years the 24 inch box will catch up to a 36 inch box that's honest. >> giving is a head start.

>> 36 will give it a head start exactly. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> okay commissioners the matter is submitted. >> i have an opinion but who am i. >> madam president. >> would you like to start. >> i will start. >> i'm not comfortable asking the neighborhood to continue to assume the risk. i think it's unusual they're willing to give up what is more aesthetically, please by asking to remove the trees and replace them and i'm inclined to grant the appeal >> i'm of the similar opinion it's appropriate for renewal and it's reached that time. >> okay. >> and well go ahead. >> i agree. >> i agree i find the expert

testimony appreciative i believe that the expert for the neighborhood association is probably for familiar with the trees that's the best way to resolve the conflict i appreciate the neighbors coming out here it is a close net community and thank you for being here to explain the situation so i'll be inclined to grant the appeal. >> move to grant the appeal overrule the department and grant the permit and since they're not a developer i won't make them do a 36 inch box. >> it will be at department standard 24 inch.

>> and do you care to state a basis. >> a what. >> a basis for the motion. >> i believe the trees have reached their normal life therefore request replacement. >> and one last thing commissioner would you like the department to specific the species. >> well, the department should work with the neighborhood but usually they'll come to a mature agreement. >> okay. >> okay. >> the motion is 0 overrule the denial on conditions that the replacement trees be of a 24 inch box one for one or two? two replacements correct? >> on the condition that the

two replacement trees be of a 24 inch size and this is on the basis that the trees have reached their normal lifespan and require removal with the species to be determined by the dpw. >> and the neighborhood. >> in communication. >> on that motion with those conditions and that basis commissioner hurtado. commissioner president lazarus. and commissioner honda >> thank you. the vote is 4 to zero the denial is over ruled a permit should be issued with those conditions >> thank you. >> so move on to item 5 this is at 363420th street homeowners association vs. the urban

forestry appealing the denial on july 23rd of a tree removal permit to remove two trees await replacement we'll start with the appellant. >> again, you have 7 minutes. >> do i put inhabits on the surface show. >> yes. facing up. >> i'm greg a purchasing and resident of 8 years on 20th street first thank you to the board to show why we're asking for that will you will respond to the briefs and materials i've witnessed the slow decline of the trespassed you may be hearing from people today that

are tree hugers but those trees don't provide good things that's not true the hoa has talked about planting trees in the grouped and replacing the trees and containers we've doeftsd ample time to pros and cons in at least 5 meetings i lost count after that i want to she was we've considered outline possibilities and didn't make the decision lightly the department of public works brief stated many of problems have ground plant trees i need to respond because a complete discussion of those two trees is not possible without giving consideration to the containers if so bone of the major areas we didn't get on a address from the public works, in fact, the documents stated the trees and

container quote require high maintenance and are short lived first due to the architecture of building we're the only 3r0789 on the block with is set back door my own partner picks up feces that is a problem with the boxes placed in close proximity next to each other upon interand exiting the building sewe see people loitering around the containers using drugs or urinating this is a safety concern for the residents trees planted in the ground don't offer the shelter for skoob

those activities second on our block there are three trees 21 planted in the right-of-way and 3 are container bound the dumping of trash in the containers is a daily problem about a year ago the department of public works saw the trash containers now for the entire length including all four directions those are the only 3 containers in the public right-of-way lacking receptive california's it is fair to allow the homeowners to share the burden of containers third i've never witnessing anyone watering those trees this is not necessary for established trees those must be water and fourth the containers are targets for graffiti he getting tagged in

eight years i've not seen a ground tree get tagged and fifth the containers many of the community residents discard large boxes and furniture between or adjacent to them other trees planned in the ground don't offer the sheltering space those trees offer this activity in the block the majority of other trees for staishd trees they've long ago exceeded those robust trees i was shocked to hear according to the resident those boxes are confined for 27 years perhaps you can let us know the average life for the palm see trees and the estimated years of the trees in xharpz vs. the ground on one

side you have the trees healthy and sustainable on the other side the homeowners without the benefit of the arresting both the but the conclusions stating the trees are not healthy we hope the board has looked at over the report and given it die consideration we were not acknowledged in the second denial letter into are an extreme bias we've received letters from several members of the public 8 letters supporting the containers without replacement we hope the consideration has been given to all the letters and paint a broader prospective of the few weeks that live within the property what is in dispute we say replacing the trees with new

containers are will not solve the problems as homeowners we're invested in this neighborhood it's the hoa sincere position removing the containers will reduce the problems their set is with this will improve the better neighborhood we say the hoa permitted us to remove the trees without replacement we can do national those trees to other members the hoa is listing to work with the department of public works to facilitate this process to insure the trees will enhance the streetscape elsewhere it will help to keep the trees including the two gentlemen those have been bounded in containers in 27

years hopefully, they, be put into a ground or planted in bigger containers. thank you for your time >> just to clear one point up when you say containers that mean that the roots of those trees don't go bloef blow the sidewalk. >> their bound in wooden box. >> so at the sidewalk level they're there. >> there's sidewalks the pavement excuse me. directly underneath those wooden boxes their indefinitely removeable no contact with the architecture. >> okay. we'll hear from the

department. >> good evening chris buck with the department of public works urban forestry. we received an application to remove the two windmill pine trees to be consistent with how we handle other property removal the ordinance receives to where whether it's planted in the ground or a container that's a street tree there's not a lot of trees complained in containers but a number of sites that have which one to plant the trees a couple examples on a sub sidewalk basement in this particular case the site the

sidewalk space adjacent to the property does not provide adequate room for trees to be plant in the ground this is a photo i've seen on google earlier this year and another view of the subject trees adjacent to the property the adjacent tree is adjacent to the neighboring property. this is the condition of the two containers and or planter sometime we use the word interchangely sometimes they're essentially resting on top of the sidewalk the roots don't go into the ground this particular tree is too close to the water meter to be planted into the ground this palm tree it is to close to the