do it within 7 days you'll get it out right or have to pay 50 percent more of the fees that would be more predictable and helpful rather than feeling it out year by year i get the broad authority so is florida this occasion arises i want predictability so if i don't complete it by this date my event is not happening or more costly so i'm opted to giving you that authority candle stick park you have anything. >> so we form a task force or have decision by next week. >> this is required to come to you for this conversation but

there isn't necessarily a timeline i don't believe there is the first one designated here is st. patrick's day unless the pd will tell me mime wrong this is stressful there are typically the same events we know about so no there's - if you'd like to form a task force and be formal that's the only way the pd can get together i mean, i'm on this is just a - >> your first pitch. >> commissioner lee and even a commissioner frost. >> just to follow up the timeframe there has to be a cut off because they get a lot of last minute requests there's a a

dewy sent festival you have to have more planning if the event is last minute the fees will be outrage if the public accepts that or do we set a standard you have to have your event in or subject to a lot more money maybe we can ask the lieutenant his opinion i know in the past they get inundated with last questions and suddenly there's a crazy number for expenses so we should streamline it a little bit. >> it's good to know within the staff and commission what's the threshold not necessarily the number of events but how many people do those events represent so at what point does sfpd

dermatitis capacity has been reached so i mean obviously sfpd staffing levels vary from year to year but what is frustrating maybe being told yes one year and next your costs are going to double because the staffing is not there you don't have that clear delineation for the staffing of the city services so providing guidance to say this is where we tap out this is the number of events and the number of people at those critical times we can afford to cover and beyond that that could be cost recovery kicks in those additional cost permits kick in that will be an easier way to handle this at

least it's more transparent. >> commissioner frost. >> that makes sense but when our talking about year by year this doesn't effect that because we're talking about anyone that is filing within 40 days of event and i know from first hand experience the police department requires our captains to have their plans made a month prior to new years eve depends on about the other ones it's not that big of a hardship on the ones that do it year after year they will know it i'm guessing the lieutenant is a plan explain this i don't think the department has a formula it depends on where the event is being done and all the things that gone i think this is a good thing 40

days out it gives us our staff this guidance and teeth to be able to enforce what's going on i don't think 0 they're going to say no, because of the 40 days and as far as the cost recovery i've heard jocelyn the only way we can charge more for the people if it cost more for the permit there's no cost recovery the police department has to put more officers and muni has to run more whatever they can ask for that money that won't be - but. >> but the folks are the most problematic are the folks that did know what they're doing and haven't planned or are planning within the 40 day period there's

the most problem they'll be the ones at least likely to plan ahead i think you should need something ahead. >> any other thoughts i think we'll hear from the lieutenant from the police department again our authority is with the commissions ability to permit not the police department. >> campaign and others i'm dave from the san francisco police department i want to say this is beyond the scope of what we were working on today what the purpose let me back up first of all, the police department is coming up a lot we have not spoken yet this is not driven by the police department it is coming from our commission and legislation

section 1060 plus states you have this vehicle available if you want to act on that jocelyn was trying to be prudent i thought about identifying the day's not the process i totally get everyone saw 40 days we don't like that number i completely get that you think we've learned about the business every application stands on we can knock out in a week or a day i thought wisp hear to discuss the first displease of this the eight or nine days we identified as the types of dates we could meet the criteria the next step will be the process that's where

clearly we struck a nervous with everyone but just to reiterate jocelyn said we don't get the 40 days i don't recall where that came from it was thrown out there as a possible date i think we all know in the at the end e he said if this is an event this commission and city wants we're going to try i mean one thing about chief suhr i've never known him to hit a threshold it's something the city wants he'll do the best of his ability to get it done i don't want people to think this was a way to stretch things out from my prospective from the police department you thought today was primarily about are those the dates and is that the dial and why not thanksgiving or

commission or whatever kind of discussion but as far as the policies and procedures down the road that's another dialog. >> we're not trying to step on the toes of the police department i think for mow me i saw the dates but the meat we're talking about is the procedure so i think to call the question we could approve the dates and know kind of have our staff come back with a suggestion on procedures i don't think people want to comment or make a motion beyond approving the dates. >> would that be sufficient to the staff? >> sure again. >> and we don't have to act

think it tonight. >> as far as the staff is concerned we'll continue without a problem but i would like some conclude to this some point and if it's for us to outline like a more meaty procedure that you can for the purpose along and is i like this i don't will that fine. >> lieutenant. >> so you're saying 9 or 10 days if you had 20 applications going forward there should be no problems to you know review them and you know yay or nay or this might be a problem a short period of time. >> i'm referring to primarily commissioner frost's comments been the reoccurring events those we're familiar with.

>> the new ones diagonally i like to think those people are engage us like implicating the neighbors or so forth so it is so tricky because of the sis and scope of the event we saw how simple the whole foods thing went it was a some other thing but i think that example as a public event similarly could occur i think maybe this wasn't intended to be a tactic to not approve i don't want to be cynical there's no doubt in my mind 0 people use this as a tactic to get what they president in the city from that prospective i think that's where

the procedure long term could be helpful. >> i'm concerned sometimes nonprofits decide oh, we need to raise a little bit of money like 45 days before halloween and they is well, we better go get a permit they have plenty of time there's going to be a call for that. >> i can tell you commissioner lee that happens all the time we live in this world and anytime a nonprofit wants to do a defined or fund riser or raiser but the revenue stream is the alcohol so they're coming to us for the one day liquor so we certainly don't want to encourage last minute applications we understand that things happen sometimes with the best of intentions and we have to streamline the process and

make it light loaded and avoid a separate i guess that's it. >> that's the spirit we were trying to - >> i don't think anyone is saying you're trying to do that. >> even when i saw the 40 days that is going to land negatively on people and anytime someone sees that state raises concern. >> the questions are one the dates are they right and it also there's a line under the second sentence under the current procedure we're unable to charge more for extra services i think those are actually, the questions for us to consider do we like the dates can we - our staff charge more for the rated

services and can we disapprove a permit being late or lacking the service i think those are the questions we need to figure out as a commission i don't know if there's public comment but if the commissioners wanted to think about a motion to be continued or ask our staff to come back with more information or pick those 3 things apart and approve or disapprove commissioner frost. >> i have a question to the staff what the president said we're unable to charge more for expedited services you said earlier the only way to charge for permits is cost recovery. >> that's mined i do know that the agencies do have ways to

charge more as the date get closer i have to figure out how they have the ability i've asked in the past years about charging more late whatever maybe i called it the wrongs thing we know if this charges more like visibility and requirements for the rec and park permits for outdoor or 60 days in advance so we know there are precedence out there how can i get there so if we have a system like that obviously that motivates we can approve that the approval on time you're going to go up with or not that's a question i will speak on behalf of allowing us

to disapprove of the being late the question of how late is in our hands. >> all right. is that clear to everyone on the commission let's open it up for public comment i don't know if there is any all right. in public comment public comment is closed. >> it commissioner tan you don't have to make a motion it was a discussion. >> we don't. >> only on the agenda not an action agenda no action is required direction is helpful not in the form of a motion. >> thank you for clarifying that. >> commissioner frost. >> couple of things like i said, i like this the 40 days out i trust your judgment on the anti fees i'll have a problem with adding a fee just because

it's a cost recovery we have to send someone out on overtime but i see that that's where my thoughts are. >> i'm also in support of giving you that authority i think predict is upheaval i'm opposed to people it makes people turn things in quicker but as an incentive it helps it would be nice to know maybe if you can look at new year's but when the last application not denied the week before that will help to determine kind of a minimum control. >> we've never denied an application bans like that it's

late i did not think it was something we were allowed to do for lack of a better word i never wanted to do that typically if it's two lastly in our estimation to move the paper we've advise if you submit it there may not be enough time to turn it around so then you can submit or not submit it and so i think you can see where that goes. >> right. >> i think if we set a time you know instead of it's money like a one night permit and suddenly there's no time to do it we've lost revenue you tell them up days to get it in or whatever date we decide like i said if

there's a get for expediting it's only fair they had plenty of time to think about it. >> all right. 0 any other thoughts so we don't have to act on it now if you want us to act on it maybe in the next meeting if you came back with a more specific procedure around it. >> i think the communication so everyone knows there is going to be new recollections or deadlines so maybe this year is two soon to implement that maybe we workout and maybe next year start charging fees i'm not sure 4 or 57 or 67 months is enough maybe we can think about how this communication to get the message out to those

organizations. >> and there may be more information to accommodate kind of research this is a good example of increasing kind of steps the closer you get maybe we'll ask their office how they've managed to do that maybe a percentage it goes up 10 percent every thirty days maybe a formula so spend the next two weeks to get information how to mirror that and way to get more money and dissensitive is vices. >> hopefully with that is enough to work with item 7 commissioner questions or comments general ones. >> i did notice i don't know if it's on the agenda dizzying we

lost a commissioner who happened to be the vice president who we need to - >> we do. >> we need to agenda device an election or how does that work. >> we have to find a new advise chair and. >> we could and show agenda device an election we'll hopefully see a new commissioners anywhere from early february to april i mean we i don't know the rules committee decided to agenda device in a few meetings it didn't hurt given the attention who is absent and not absent have a second person of it's temporary i imagine you have a

vote otherwise we'll have an issue if the president is absent. >> let's have it on the agenda for the next meeting and the commissioners who are here you can think about that as as interim other questions or comments. >> commissioner perez. >> question to the staff do you guys thought about when our next retreat takes place i'm going to plan my schedule. >> as far as the retreat that's for new commissioners, i was hopefully to wait middle we get the last new commissioners some of you are new enough to have a retreat i don't know summertime i mean at the lastly june or july i don't know when a new commissioner will be appointed

but sometime after that. >> okay. thank you okay any other comments. >> i actually had a great meeting with the staff to discuss some issues around public health and what we can do from a commission prospective one of the things we discussed trying to work and reach out to the department of public health seeing if they have data their collecting currently to over lap with treatment to permit holders who had been you know the site of picks up for emergency transport and figuring out if there's that data that exists or a way to over lap our permit holders with that data and then possible see how that data compares relatively to other cities to see how we're doing because we may have you know a

problem a bigger problem than with regards to alcohol and other drugs or no problems at all i'd like to see if we can reach out to dpw and collect that data if possible and see what could come out of that some need for a preventive campaign on drugs collaboratively with the dpw in terms of harm are reduction and getting the word out on alcohol and other drugs effectively our places of entertainment we had a good chat if you can find out who we can get the data and report backs what's available thanks. >> great. >> i don't see any more comments public comment on our comments nope seeing none, public is

closed last item is new business requests and future agenda items we all right. have one for the election of vice chair the vice president anything in in addition, we do it outside the meeting two so any public comment on that i don't see any public comment is closed. and this meeting is adjourned have a good night

week. >> ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ the san francisco. the reporter: has many opportunities to get out and placing play a 4 thousand acres of play rec and park has a place win the high sincerely the place to remove user from the upper life and transform into one of mother nachdz place go into the rec and park camp mather

located one hundred and 80 square miles from the bay bridge past the oakland bridge and on and on camp mather the city owned sierra nevada camping facility is outings outside the gate of yosemite park it dates back before the area became is a popular vacation it i sites it was home to indians who made the camp where the coral now stands up and artifacts are found sometimes arrest this was the tree that the native people calm for the ac accordions that had a high food value the acorns were fatally off the trees in september but they would come up prosecute the foothills and were

recipe the same as the people that came to camp camp is celebrating it's 90th year and the indians were up here for 4 thousand we see every day of them in the grinding rocks around the camp we have about 15 grinding sites in came so it was a major summer report area for the 92 hawks. >> through there are signs that prosperity were in the area it was not until the early part of the century with the 76 began the construction of damn in helpfully a say mill was billed open the left hand of the math for the construction by which

lake was used to float logs needed for the project at the same time the yosemite park and company used the other side of the camp to house tourists interesting in seeing the national park and the constructions of damn when the u son damn was completed many of the facilities were not needed then the city of san francisco donated the property it was named camp mather the first director it was named after him tuesday morning away amongst the pine the giant sequoia is the giants inventories first name if our title is camp means there's going to be dirt and bugs and so long as you can get past that part this place it

pretty awesome i see i see . >> with a little taste of freedom from the city life you can soak up the country life with swimming and volley ball and swimming and horseback riding there you go buddy. >> we do offer and really good amount of programming and give a sample p of san francisco rec and park department has to offer hopefully we've been here 90